College woes

[AKE]

Little does she realize that her `friends` who are influencing her in the choice of a collegewill disappear over the next four years, probably rarely to be seen or heard from again. If you are not contributing financially to her going to college then she will have to learn and live by her mistakes; if you are assisting then withdraw the assistance and let her make the mistakes on her own. She will learn soon enough (they all do).

 

[puppymommo]

I guess what bugs me is she is not even applying to any other schools. I think if she got accepted into Northwestern she would get a good financial aid package that might even turn out better than what the state school can offer. I would just like to see what they have to offer.

I do think a state university can offer a good, even excellent education. DD does plan to go to graduate school (psychology). She is a senior. We did do the college visit thing last year, so she has visited the school where she has been accepted. One of the things that sold her is that they have a good honors college to challenge the top students.

The school she is planning to attend is large, 17 thousand undergrads. The honors college is the top 9%.

The other advantage of the state school over Northwestern is they will give credit for more of her AP/IB (International Baccalaurate) classes. She will get at least a full semester's worth of credit. This is some of the flack she is getting from friends: why did you take the IB (extremely rigorous hs curriculum) just to go to a state university?

Another reason she gave for wanting to go to the state university is that her high school experience has been so intense she would like to go somewhere that is challening but isn't such a pressure cooker environment.

To me what it all boils down to is whatever school she attends, her college experience will be what she makes of it. And knowing her, I think she will make the most of wherever she goes.

 

[klpca]

I guess what bugs me is she is not even applying to any other schools. I think if she got accepted into Northwestern she would get a good financial aid package that might even turn out better than what the state school can offer. I would just like to see what they have to offer.

I do think a state university can offer a good, even excellent education. DD does plan to go to graduate school (psychology). She is a senior. We did do the college visit thing last year, so she has visited the school where she has been accepted. One of the things that sold her is that they have a good honors college to challenge the top students.

The school she is planning to attend is large, 17 thousand undergrads. The honors college is the top 9%.

The other advantage of the state school over Northwestern is they will give credit for more of her AP/IB (International Baccalaurate) classes. She will get at least a full semester's worth of credit. This is some of the flack she is getting from friends: why did you take the IB (extremely rigorous hs curriculum) just to go to a state university?

Another reason she gave for wanting to go to the state university is that her high school experience has been so intense she would like to go somewhere that is challening but isn't such a pressure cooker environment.

To me what it all boils down to is whatever school she attends, her college experience will be what she makes of it. And knowing her, I think she will make the most of wherever she goes.

Actually, I think your daughter sounds like a pretty smart cookie.

Getting a semester of credit for her IB classes is golden and probably saves $8-10k between tuition and living expenses. And since she is planning on grad school, the money saved by attending a state university instead of a private university will go a long way towards grad school tuition. Of course if Northwestern (after financial aid) would cost less than a state school, it would clearly be a viable option that she should consider.

My middle kid was the one that had a lot of opportunities due to her academic and athletic success. I strongly encouraged her to apply to many schools, she was accepted by all but one, and still wound up at school about 10 miles from home. In retrospect, all I did was waste about $500 in application fees, and of course the time that she spent writing essays and gathering letters of recommendation.

 

[vacationhopeful]

My oldest nephew had 44 college credits when he started college this Fall. AP tests, AP courses and cooperative courses between his HS and the local college.

His 2 roommates had 8AM classes every morning. His first class of the day was noon - after all, he is NOT a Freshman, but a sophmore. PS. These boys all live in the Scholars Dorm at College Park, U of Maryland.

 

[puppymommo]

PS. These boys all live in the Scholars Dorm at College Park, U of Maryland.

I had to smile at this. DD is eligible to live in the Scholars Dorm but she doesn't want to! She said, "I'll be taking classes with those people, I don't have to live with them." She may change her mind after a semester on a "regular" dorm.

PS: She is a pretty smart cookie!

 

[DebBrown]

What state school? Are you in Illinois? University of Illinois is a terrific school and I think its a good choice for anyone except those who do better at a small college environment.

I have a little experience with sending four kids to college. My oldest spent two years at Washington University in St. Louis before dropping out. He still had to pay the student loans back. Right now he is working as a bartender but will quit at the end of the year to focus on finishing his book. Hope he is successful!

My other three kids went to state schools and actual graduated (the youngest this year). None of them are disappointed with their education or experience.

My nephew is at Northwestern right now. He did get a financial aid package but the family is struggling. Instead of becoming a rocket scientist, he is majoring in German. I'm not sure if a Northwestern degree in German is worth the price tag.

Try not to stress too much. Definitely encourage your daughter to apply to a few schools. Sometimes there are unexpected disappointments and sometimes kids change their minds. It's good to have options.

Deb

 

[vacationhopeful]

Dorm space at U of Maryland - College Park is very limited. Residents who live in the Scholar's dorm are promised 2 years in those dorms. If he had higher test scores and better grades, the Presidential Scholars get 4 years of their dorm space.

But he dislikes the food, the long walk to the cafeteria and sharing a room with 2 others - he has lost a lot of weight and goes home most weekends to sleep. But his dorm is real close to the football stadium.

Sounds like a normal first year of college. :hysterical:

 

[AKE]

I think that too much is made as to what school one attends. As long as she graduates then there will be many opportunities, regardless of whether she attends a no-name school or Ivy League. Too many parents think that the name of the school will be the key to the future. A name-brand school may open doors but it will also close as many as a good portion of employers don't want the whiz-kid who had the money (or scholarships) to attend a top-tier school as these kids are not necessarily the best-rounded from a life experience perspective. As well, once you have a job then it is your performance on the job that will determine your future. You may have a degree from an Ivy League school but this is no guarantee to success anymore than a degree from a regular, run-of-the-mill school.

 

[Mosca]

the value in the "higher" schools is in the connections made. They connect with people with money and influence.

 

[pjrose]

the value in the "higher" schools is in the connections made. They connect with people with money and influence.

And especially for graduate work, I think it makes a difference.

 

[wauhob3]

Just think of the money that she will be saving you/herself.

Often private schools offer more financial aid. My daughter had a hard time choosing in between a good private school and the large state school rated well and in the end even though the full price tuition is double at the private it was less expensive for her to go to the private school due to the larger scholarship and financial award given to her. She had her choice in between either and chose the private school. She chose the private as a better fit for her after agonizing for a while since many of her friends were going to a state school. She can apply for many now and then visit her top choices within affordable means.

She needs to go visit a lot of campuses. She should get a fair amount of scholarships with her stats and advise her not to limit her opportunities and give herself choices before all the scholarships are given away. She can always decline. My daughter was accepted to 14 schools and in the end three were within two thousand of each other, all good schools very different each other. It then took her a couple of months to finally decide.

 

[csalter2]

Don't Worry!

Ivy or state is not going to make a difference. It's what you learn in either institution. I have seen kids go to state universities here in California and private schools and both can have great success. There is nothing wrong here in California if kids go to our state schools like UCLA, UC Berkeley/Cal, Cal Poly San Luis Obispo or several of the other schools.

I find that mostly parents want to have bragging rights so they can say, "My child whose at Harvard blah, blah, blah, blah. This is certainly not in the best interest of the kid. I work in education. Believe me, I see this very often.

 

[pianodinosaur]

I went to Northwestern as an undergraduate. I went to Creighton University for Medical School and did my residency at The University of Chicago.

The being said, there is more than one person can possibly learn at any major university. The educational opportunities at any of the Texas state universities or colleges are amazing. My niece graduated from The University of Chicago and is now at The University of Virginia working on her Ph.D.

The main issue, the way I see it, is if your daughter is going to think for herself or listen to her friends. I have had nothing to do with the people with whom I attended high school in over 40 years. This is a very difficult concept for a 17 year old to grasp. However, I have seen numerous young people listen to their screwball friends and never complete college. This is also a very difficult concept for a 17 year old to grasp. Fortunately, your daughter has a mother with some wisdom.

When I was 15 years old my father told me that the most mental exercise I got was jumping to conclusions. He was quite correct. I hope that I have outgrown that.

 

[Mel]

You really need to find out why she doesn't want to apply to any other schools. If it is the money, she needs to understand that she may in fact be better off at one of the private schools. I don't have a link, but I recently read an article listing the top 10 schools in terms of meeting aid. Princeton was the top school, with the average graduate leaving with an average of less than $10,000 of debt.

If it's because of pressure from her peers, you may need to turn her own words back to her. She is the one going to college - not her friends (they are, but her experience will not be theirs). At a big state school, she is less likely to have any classes with them, and they are likely to grow apart. My DD is a junior, as we have been visiting the local college open houses, to get a feel for different types of schools (though she already has her own short list). She has already decided she will apply to one of the state schools as a safety school, but will only attend if she gets into the honors program, and can live in the honors dorm. Yes, she will already be spending her days with those same students, but she knows a regular dorm could be a distraction to her.

I would encourage her to apply to at least one of the "reach" schools, and hold off on the final decision. She has her acceptance at the state school, and that option will remain open, unless she participated in an early decision program. It's better to keep her options open, and let her know that the final decision is hers - just make sure it is a truly informed decision. The only way I would allow my DD to apply to just one school is if she fell in love with that school and was accepted early.

I found the article, or one like it: 10 top colleges with lowest graduating debt
http://portal.kiplinger.com/slideshow/lowest-debt-private-colleges/7.html#top

 

[Clemson Fan]

When I applied to college, my parents could only afford a state school. So, I had the choice of going to a state school or a more expensive private school only if I received significant scholarship money or joined ROTC. I didn't care because I wanted to go to a state school (Clemson) anyway and I actually got a scholarship that paid for most of it.

When I went to medical school (University of Chicago), I had the choice of joining the military and having them pay for it or being up to my eyeballs in student loans. I chose the Army and didn't owe any money, but instead paid back my debt with 8 years of active service.

I don't think my choice of going to a state school impacted my chances of getting into medical school at all. In fact, I think it probably helped me. There are a lot of great state schools.

 

[Clemson Fan]

You really need to find out why she doesn't want to apply to any other schools. If it is the money, she needs to understand that she may in fact be better off at one of the private schools. I don't have a link, but I recently read an article listing the top 10 schools in terms of meeting aid. Princeton was the top school, with the average graduate leaving with an average of less than $10,000 of debt.

If it's because of pressure from her peers, you may need to turn her own words back to her. She is the one going to college - not her friends (they are, but her experience will not be theirs). At a big state school, she is less likely to have any classes with them, and they are likely to grow apart. My DD is a junior, as we have been visiting the local college open houses, to get a feel for different types of schools (though she already has her own short list). She has already decided she will apply to one of the state schools as a safety school, but will only attend if she gets into the honors program, and can live in the honors dorm. Yes, she will already be spending her days with those same students, but she knows a regular dorm could be a distraction to her.

I would encourage her to apply to at least one of the "reach" schools, and hold off on the final decision. She has her acceptance at the state school, and that option will remain open, unless she participated in an early decision program. It's better to keep her options open, and let her know that the final decision is hers - just make sure it is a truly informed decision. The only way I would allow my DD to apply to just one school is if she fell in love with that school and was accepted early.

I found the article, or one like it: 10 top colleges with lowest graduating debt
http://portal.kiplinger.com/slideshow/lowest-debt-private-colleges/7.html#top

In the article you quote only about 30% of the students borrow, yet the average debt at graduation is only around 10k for a 50k a year school. That just tells me that a lot of the kids who go to those schools have parents that can afford to pay for it.

So, if money is a concern, this article wouldn't alleviate those concerns and if it were me it would just heighten them.

 

[tompalm]

Have you talked to her guidance counselor? Sometimes I believe kids will listen to anyone but the parents. They do change eventually though.

100 percent correct on this. I think some will listen to a stranger on the street before their parents.

Don't push your kids too hard. Someone we know, sent their son to Washington State and he didn't want to go. He kept calling and said that he wanted to come home, but they said no. About the end of the fist semester, the parents got a phone call that their son jumped off a tall building. He lived, but spent the next three months in the hospital. He got to come home after that.

 

[3kids4me]

Dorm space at U of Maryland - College Park is very limited. Residents who live in the Scholar's dorm are promised 2 years in those dorms. If he had higher test scores and better grades, the Presidential Scholars get 4 years of their dorm space.

But he dislikes the food, the long walk to the cafeteria and sharing a room with 2 others - he has lost a lot of weight and goes home most weekends to sleep. But his dorm is real close to the football stadium.

Sounds like a normal first year of college. :hysterical:

Actually, current UMD students are guaranteed housing through junior year. Next year, some seniors will also get housing. Dorm space used to be much tighter there but they recently built a new, beautiful high rise dorm in North Campus which made more space.

BTW, a lot of people don't actually want to live in the Scholars' dorms because they are in the Cambridge Community, which is far from many of the buildings on campus (although as you say, close to the stadium!).

P.S. I was in an honors program at a state school and my husband went to Northwestern. We both ended up in the same (very good) MBA program.

 

[squeeze]

Almost anyone who has parented - or tried to parent - a teen girl is with you - I know I am! Gotta wonder why they were invented and how the species has survived.

{HUGS} {HUGS} {HUGS} {HUGS} {HUGS} {HUGS}

good one PJ. :hysterical:
Love IT!.

I'm with ya. Wow! what its like to be an 18 year old these days. :ignore:

 

[wauhob3]

In the article you quote only about 30% of the students borrow, yet the average debt at graduation is only around 10k for a 50k a year school. That just tells me that a lot of the kids who go to those schools have parents that can afford to pay for it.

So, if money is a concern, this article wouldn't alleviate those concerns and if it were me it would just heighten them.

Not necessarily if they meet 100% of need that would result in a much lower need to take out large students loans. As I stated we have personal experience in this even though my daughter's college cost twice as much as Purdue it was less expensive then Purdue after scholarships and grants were factored in for both schools. It depends on test scores and high school records with SAT or ACT scores being the primary factor we found. My daughter was offered more scholarships then her friends that had higher GPA's due to having higher test scores I believe. The thing is unless she applies she will not know. My daughter applied to 14 schools and at her reach school she was rejected. I'm glad she applied because I knew it was a school that is not known for giving significant financial aid but we took away the question of what if and a little rejection never hurts anyone. The 13 other schools accepted her and they all offered different amounts. Some she applied to as part of College Go week for free and didn't know much about. Others she thought she'd like and after visiting didn't "feel it".

OP as a mother I would be concerned if you daughter is limiting herself due to social reasons that doesn't bode well for academics in college. As far as rooming one of the common threads in campus visits is high school friends who room together often don't end up being friends at the end. Probably because boundaries get crossed due to familarity. My daughter took Indiana University off her list early on because she believed from talking to others it develops into mini high school communities. She had a good high school experience but wanted new adventures. Its turned out well for her so far. However it was her choice in the end at least in between the three schools she liked that offered her packages making net cost to be a $2000 fluctuation. She chose the onFe in the middle. Try to sell your daughter on giving herself choices instead of locking herself out by waiting to long to apply to get the maximum scholarships that come with acceptance letters. Needs based comes after filing FAFSA.

 

[Mel]

In the article you quote only about 30% of the students borrow, yet the average debt at graduation is only around 10k for a 50k a year school. That just tells me that a lot of the kids who go to those schools have parents that can afford to pay for it.

So, if money is a concern, this article wouldn't alleviate those concerns and if it were me it would just heighten them.

No, 30% borrowing doesn't mean that 70% could fully afford the school. Some schools like Princeton don't include loans as part of the aid package. As a result, those 30% who borrow are doing so to cover the "family contribution" as determined by their FAFSA, or for other expenses (like that new computer). They would still need to come up with that same money at the state school, unless they get merit based aid, and their aid package isn't reduced due to the merit aid. In fact, most state schools include loans as part of their aid package, so would end up costing more.

Again, the best option is to keep doors open, and compare the aid offered by each school. If she really wants to go to the state school, and it isn't about the money, that's great. But you can't assume that a private college is going to be more expensive.

 

[bogey21]

I think that too much is made as to what school one attends.

I tend to agree with this. Because of transfers while working and tours in both the Army and Air Force I ended up attending 8 colleges before graduating. Some of the schools were top tier and some nowhere near top tier. I found both good and bad professors in all of the schools I attended. I feel that where you graduate doesn't matter as much as having a degree in the field in which you intend to work.

George

 

[Rob&Carol Q]

My deal with my kids is that I have the room and board...you figure out tuition. That cures a lot of the out of state/private issues. Nothing like a good cold dose of reality to cure some of the "I want to go to the University of Hawaii" cleverness my daughter had at one time. She's now graduated from Ohio State, married, and employed.

Three kids into that college issue, three different solutions...go figure. One more to go...

Personally, without the ROTC scholarship that I earned an eon ago, I'm not all that certain I would have attended college and met my eventual Bride. Funny how those things work out...the oddest decision will have the most lasting impact on your life.

 

[bogey21]

I had a similar situation when my Daughter decided to go to grad school. She decided on Tufts University, high cost, high cost of living and lots of travel expenses to and from Texas. I figure it would cost me well over $150,000 for the full two years. So I cut a deal with my Daughter. I agreed to put $50,000 into her Education Bank Account. She would pick the school and would cover everything over the $50,000. If she could work it out where any money was left after she graduated, it was hers to keep. Guess what. She got herself a full ride to the University of Missouri. The $50,000 more than covered living and travel expenses. She ended up with her grad degree, money in the bank, and I saved myself mucho bucks!

George

 

[e.bram]

Bogey21:
Suppose it was Harvard or MIT, would you feel the same way?