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Buying "New" or on Resale better?

reedl

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I am sure something like this has been asked a few times, and I could not find an answer doing a quick search so here goes..

1) I very recently purchased a platinum week at Horizons Marriott in Orlando for around X amount of dollars. Got a whole bunch of bonus Marriott Rewards points (around 350,000) for signing up,etc. This unit will be a lockoff unit that can be split into two weeks in the A and B sides if I want. I just signed everything Last Friday, and am still within the 10 day "Forget it" period...

2) I also have the chance to purchase a resale at Horizon's for around half the amount of the new purchase in a Platinum full week also. This of course has no bonus points at all of course. This one is not a lock-off unit at all, BTW.


Given these conditions, what would everybody here do? Would you keep the full price purchase, or purchase the re-sale one for half the price? From a monetary perspective, the re-sale looks much better, but am I missing something here? Also can I use the non-lockoff of the re-sale to trade for a lockoff unit somewhere to get two weeks worth of vacation somewhere else?

Since I know very little about timeshare, I need to defer to the experts here.

Thanks in advance,

Reed
 

ondeadlin

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You can get a Horizons Orlando every year platinum week for $5,000 to $7,000 resale. The only benefit you lose is the ability to trade it for points.

Most folks here would tell you to rescind as soon as possible and buy resale.
 

AwayWeGo

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There Is No Such Thing As A New Timeshare. (Timeshares Are All Used-Used-Used.)

Buying "New" or on Resale better?
By the time you show up & check in, other people will already have stayed there ahead of you -- just like a hotel room.

That means it's not new.

That means it's used-used-used.

So therefore, why pay a timeshare company the "new" price for an item that's no such thing ?

Buy resale. Save $10,000

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax Count), Virginia, USA.​
 

reedl

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If that is the case, then I shall cancel the first purchase and go with the re-sale market.

Now, does it matter for which week I purchase at a place like Horizons? Since all weeks are floating, it should not matter as long as it is platinum correct?

Will I have any problems with exchanges at other Marriott resorts getting a place? Or will I be only staying in Orlando for the rest of my life? :doh:

Will the fact that the two bedroom unit on resale is not lockup-off able (I love inventing new words!) change what I can get at other resorts? Will I still be able to "split" the week into two seperate weeks in a lock-off place at other resorts?

Again, Thank you in advance.

Reed
 
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TheTimeTraveler

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STOP. Rescind right now.

Think seriously about it, and first find out what it would cost you to buy a Horizons lockoff week from a private party.

If the price alone doesn't convince you then you can always go back to Marriott and buy it all over again whenever you want to.

Always keep in mind that if "points" are your thing then you and a spouse may buy 100,000 points per year for $1,250 at any time directly thru Marriott.
 
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reedl

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Most folks here would tell you to rescind as soon as possible and buy resale.
So therefore, why pay a timeshare company the "new" price for an item that's no such thing ?

Buy resale. Save $10,000

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax Count), Virginia, USA.​
STOP. Rescind right now.

Think seriously about it, and first find out what it would cost you to buy a Horizons lockoff week from a private party.

If the price alone doesn't convince you then you can always go back to Marriott and buy it all over again whenever you want to.

Always keep in mind that if "points" are your thing then you and a spouse may buy 100,000 points per year for $1,250 at any time directly thru Marriott.
Wow! I am impressed with the quickness of responses here! With the computer and Video forums I use responses sometimes take weeks to get. I am truely impressed with the knowledge and help I am getting.

I will cancel the purchase as soon as possible (tonight or tomorrow). Just need to figure out how to do that.

But my other question about whether I should even buy something there, or somewhere else is still open. Does it even matter what week I purchase for there, or as long as it is platinum is all that matters?

Also can I get good exchanges for this place to visit other places?

Reed
 
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kjd

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resale vs direct buy

Whoever said that everything is used is correct in almost all cases. The correct terms in my opinion are either resale or a direct buy from Marriott. Resale vs a direct purchase has been discussed here ad nausea on several other threads.

I suggest you ask one of the moderators like DaveM or Steamboat Bill to direct you to these previous threads in order to get the whole story. What you'll find is that buying resale works for some, buying direct works for some and others don't particularly care one way or another. Do your due dilligence and don't blindly act on anyone elses opinion.
 

justinbrenda

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I did this over a year ago. We went down there expecting a high pressure sale, and got nothing of the sort. So naturally, we got curious, after spending 5 days in the resort. We bought "new", but quickly found out it wasn't a good idea after seeing resales online. There should be instructions in the packet on how to recind. Just send the letter by mail (some delivery confirmation would be beneficial). They aren't shady about it. You will get a very nice letter in a few weeks thanking you for visiting and refuding your down payment. In the mean time, look around, get a good price (50% off may be a little high in this market).

We bought gold, it was almost 75% off gold retail. The ONLY benefit you lose is the points, which are not worth the premium not to mention you have to pay to convert those. As far as the lockoff goes, and I may be mistaken, there are a limited number of units at Horizons that are lockoffs. Anyone can lock off, but there is limited availability. Just because your unit says lockoff, doesn't mean you can lock if off.
 

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Will the fact that the two bedroom unit on resale is not lockup-off able (I love inventing new words!) change what I can get at other resorts?
All platinum 2br units at Horizon's Orlando are lock-offs whether bought resale or new. Every owner has the ability to lock-off their unit at the time of reservation, as long as it is available. buying a "lock off" does not guarantee a lock off. So, you're buying the same product NEW as you would a resale. Except, you don't get the Marriott points.
 

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Addressing a number of your questions....

My understanding is that all Orlando Horizons units - lockoff and non-lockoff - are identical for purposes of making reservations. When calling to make a reservation, just ask for a lockoff unit and, if one is available, pay the $75 fee to lock off. See this thread for more info.

As for rescinding, my guess is that many of the Marriott Rewards points you got with your purchase were far from being free. Although 150k-200k were likely pure incentive points, the rest had an expensive price tag. They were likely for (1) financing your unit at an extremely high and very costly 13.99% or so and/or (2) foregoing the use of your week for this year, which would still require that you pay this year's maintenance fees.

Incidentally, you can buy Marriott points for $.0125 each. You and your spouse together can buy up to 100,000 points per year ($1,250) and combine them when you want to redeem them. That should give you a measuring stick for determining if the difference between paying Marriott's price and a low resale price is worthwhile.

Assuming you follow through and rescind, slow down and take your time to determine which timeshare is right for you and your family. It might be in Orlando or it might be elsewhere. Eventually, you'll pick the perfect timeshare and use your best timeshare purchase negotiating skills to buy at a price that's likely significantly lower than the resale asking price.

If you choose not to rescind, there’s nothing wrong with that, as long as you understand the difference in cost for the relative values, including the points. There are those who are willing to pay more for almost anything to simplify matters.

Yes, when you reserve the master unit and the studio side as separate reservations, you can trade each of them for a separate timeshare experience. However, II won't let you put in an ongoing request for a 2BR or 3BR (“trade up”) for your 1BR or studio, unless the resort you seek a trade to has only 2BR and larger units.

Exchanges are never a sure thing. Supply and demand, how far ahead you make your exchange request (preferably at least a year), the trading power of your own week and the time of year (school vacation?) and particular resort (beach?) you want to trade into are all factors that enter into whether you'll get the exchange of your dreams. Spend a couple of months here reading this Marriott forum and you'll develop a pretty good feel as to what exchanges are likely, possible and remote.

You can lock off at your own resort, but any exchange you get will be what you get to use. You can't then lock that exchanged week off, as you suggested and, for example, exchange again or use it for two separate vacations. Exchanges are one week for one week.
 

KathyPet

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I am not sure that "Most folks on this board will tell you to buy resale". I do think that those of us who bought directly from Marriott and are VERY HAPPY that we did so have been put in a position where our intelligence level has been so severely questioned that we tend to be very very quiet
 

littlestar

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Take a look at this nice tuggers data base on ROFR (right of first refusal) for Marriott properties. It will give you an idea of what to pay resale for a platinum Marriott Horizons Orlando week:

http://dioxide45.tripod.com/rofr.html
 

Dave M

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I am not sure that "Most folks on this board will tell you to buy resale". I do think that those of us who bought directly from Marriott and are VERY HAPPY that we did so have been put in a position where our intelligence level has been so severely questioned that we tend to be very very quiet
I agree with your first point, Kathy, but I don't feel like my intelligence has been questioned ( :) ) and I have purchased three times from Marriott! Like you, I am very happy with all three purchases.

There are a variety of reasons for buying directly from Marriott. Some examples include buying at preconstruction prices, buying to get mega Marriott Rewards points as incentives, buying from Marriott because it's easier and buying because the buyer isn't aware that there is a resale market.

That's why I posted above, "If you choose not to rescind, there’s nothing wrong with that...."

However, when someone comes here with a choice to make - keep it or rescind, I think we have a responsibility to point out the differences and similarities between developer and resale purchases.
 

jimf41

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I am not sure that "Most folks on this board will tell you to buy resale". I do think that those of us who bought directly from Marriott and are VERY HAPPY that we did so have been put in a position where our intelligence level has been so severely questioned that we tend to be very very quiet
UH, I guess I'm another dumb one like you Kathy. I'll be in Paris (5 days) and Rome (6 days) in September on points. Flying BC on points. Then MPB for two weeks in November and MFC for the month of February. Bought all from the developer with point incentives. Not opposed to buying resale but I'll wait till after the first of the year to see what Marriott does with the reservation system, if anything
 

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Dave, I absolutely agree with you that "one size does not fit all" when it comes to buying direct from Marriott or a resale unit. However I have found that many of those who follow the "resale or not at all" path are extremely strident in their viewpoint and attempt to convert all potential purchasers to follow them to the "true path" of timeshare ownership by performing long and often impossible to follow complex calculations in order to justify their stance. I think that the "true resale believers" are so convinced that they are right that intentionally or not they make those of us who purchased direct feel that we must be idiots without a whit of financial sense in our heads. Maybe I am being too sensitive about this but I do not even attempt to present a opposite point of view on this subject any more because I know that I will be shouted down and most certainly out talked. So i just stay quiet and continue to collect my Marriott points and take wonderful vacations in London and Rome and other cities that do not have timeshares. JMHO my friend.
 

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Here's the bottom line: The only reason to pay double (at least) from Marriott is to get the points option, and a smart resale buyer can get the low resale price AND the points option by buying 50k a year from Marriott.

I've banked 2 million points from Marriott, almost all through business travel. I know the system inside and out. I know how valuable a travel package can be in Europe or Japan, etc.

But I also know math.

And to pay Marriott 16k for a Horizons week you can buy resale for 5k, then to pay $800 a year in MF for 100,000 points - when you can buy 50k points for $650 - doesn't make much economic sense to me.
 

dioxide45

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Dave, I absolutely agree with you that "one size does not fit all" when it comes to buying direct from Marriott or a resale unit. However I have found that many of those who follow the "resale or not at all" path are extremely strident in their viewpoint and attempt to convert all potential purchasers to follow them to the "true path" of timeshare ownership by performing long and often impossible to follow complex calculations in order to justify their stance. I think that the "true resale believers" are so convinced that they are right that intentionally or not they make those of us who purchased direct feel that we must be idiots without a whit of financial sense in our heads. Maybe I am being too sensitive about this but I do not even attempt to present a opposite point of view on this subject any more because I know that I will be shouted down and most certainly out talked. So i just stay quiet and continue to collect my Marriott points and take wonderful vacations in London and Rome and other cities that do not have timeshares. JMHO my friend.
I think however the advice here is good. In general we should always tell the buyer to rescind. Especially a buyer who purchased on impulse while on vacation. The option is always there to go back to Marriott and buy from them incentives and all. However the option to buy resale only lasts for the rescission period. This is the best option for the uninformed buyer to take the time to do the research needed to make the best decision for them.
 

AwayWeGo

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[triennial - points]
Educated Consumers.

IThe option is always there to go back to Marriott and buy from them incentives and all. However the option to buy resale only lasts for the rescission period. This is the best option for the uninformed buyer to take the time to do the research needed to make the best decision for them.
Then, after research, if they go back to the timeshare company with eyes wide open & overpay by $10,000 or so as compared with resale, at least they will have done so as Educated Consumers.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​
 

gmarine

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Very simply, rescind. Then take your time and learn what timeshares are about and the ways they can be used. Then make an informed decision whether to buy or not.
 

kjd

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Kathy: Stick to your guns. You are absolutely right. Many of us feel the same way but maybe we don't express it as well as you do. The timeshare world is a jungle. All of us know that. Therefore, Newbie's asking for our help shouldn't be given unequivical absolute advice eminating from a slanted and often distorted perspective.

Many of us have purchased both direct and resale. We know the differences. As Dave M points out, it depends upon someone's circumstances as to which purchase model is the best for them. Personally, I think purchasing MR points is foolish. Look at the devaluations going on in point systems all over the travel industry. However, I also believe that purchasing points can be a good idea under certain circumstances.

Much has been previously written about the subject of resale vs direct purchase. Rather than respond to every new inquiry on the subject maybe the moderators could either respond to these questions or direct people to read previous threads. It's already been done on several other topics. I think that we've had enough of these opinions already to be able to help prospective buyers do their due dilligence.
 

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Here's the bottom line: The only reason to pay double (at least) from Marriott is to get the points option, and a smart resale buyer can get the low resale price AND the points option by buying 50k a year from Marriott.

I've banked 2 million points from Marriott, almost all through business travel. I know the system inside and out. I know how valuable a travel package can be in Europe or Japan, etc.

But I also know math.

And to pay Marriott 16k for a Horizons week you can buy resale for 5k, then to pay $800 a year in MF for 100,000 points - when you can buy 50k points for $650 - doesn't make much economic sense to me.
This is very good advice.
 

KathyPet

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I also feel that the comment that you can buy 100,000 points a year from Marriott is slightly mis-leading as it would lead a new potential purchaser to think that you can actually get a wonderful vacation for 100,000 points. For those of us who do not travel for business our potential for substantial accumulation of MR points via alternate paths (MR VISA card e.g.) are also limited. A nice vacation in a European city or even a large city here in the US is going to take 250,000 points (7 nite in a 6-7 category hotel and airfare miles) or more if you want to fly business class or take more than 2 people on the flight. Purchasing points will allow you to take that sort of trip once every three years. When we purchased our first MVCI we had two middle school aged children and we loved all the extra space we got with our time share and loved taking them to the beach and Disney for a week. We also loved the free 7 night vacation we got as a incentive for buying from MVCI (we all went to San Francisco). That lasted through their HS years. They are on their own now and we are traveling as "empty nesters". While we still go to the beach for a week and still love HH we are no longer interested in trips to Disney World or constant weeks at the beach. We have discovered crusises and have gone on several 2 week cruises using our MR points for business class air and additional nights in our port cities (Copenhagen, Athens, London and Rome). We have gone to Italy for 2 weeks and England for 2 weeks using our MR points for hotels and BC airfare. You don't do that on 100,000 points a year. Being able to trade in our MVCI units for points plus purchase points has allowed us to take these trips and more (a weeks at the St. Kitts Marriott when our trade did not come through, a week at the JW Marriott in Cancun) . These trips have all been taken in the last 6 years because I intend to do these things before I either die or get to old and feeble to do them. We would not, in most cases, have been able to "trade" our weeks for these trips as most European timeshares are in the boonies in these countries and not in the cities which is where we want to be. My husband is self employed and thus feels like he has to limit his vacation time since when he is on vacation he is not earning income. If we had not traded for points because we purchased resale i can guarantee that we would not have taken these trips because we would have not used our timeshares and would have felt guilty about banking all these weeks that we would never use. Potential purchasers need to think about not just how they are going to travel and use their timeshares now but how they are going to travel in the future when the kids are gone. If you want to spend your older years still going to Disney or sitting on the beach then fine but if you really expect to be able to go to wonderful places than purchasing 100,000 points a year is not going to enable you to do that.
 

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Kathypet-great post, exactly what I was thinking - long term after kids out of the house. Just need to save up so I don't buy and then finance....
 

gmarine

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Opinions vary on whether paying the enormous extra cost to be able to trade a unit in for points is worth it.

Regardless of the opinion on resale or developer, a person who admittedly knows little about timeshares should always be given the advice to rescind.
 

Dave M

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Thanks, Kathy. Your post and your previous ones demonstrate exceptionally well that whether to buy from Marriott or on the resale market is a very personal decision. The stock "buy resale" suggestion doesn't fit for everyone.

gmarine:
Regardless of the opinion on resale or developer, a person who admittedly knows little about timeshares should always be given the advice to rescind.
I agree. One who rescinds can later go back and get the same (or almost the same) deal from Marriott. One who doesn't is stuck if it turns out later that price was the most important factor in the buying decision.
 
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