Buying Grande Vista and Call to Marriott Agent

[dougp26364]

Hi,
newbe here trying to get into Marriott system. I am in the process of buying Grande Vista platinum 2 Br with lockoff option. As part of verifying the estoppel, I called Marriott. Started chatting with the rep and she asked me the purpose of buying this. I told her that am a Worldmark owner but I want better trade with Marriott via II and thus the purchase. Here is what is she told me

1) Marriott stopped depositing inventory into II like before, instead owners trade via Destination Club. Only limited leftover inventory is deposited to II.
2) When a DC club owner deposits points to II, Marriott will chose which resort / what week goes to II
3) The other place where II get Marriott inventory is from Marriott owners who are not part of MDC , but there is no 29 day window advantage here
4) Bottomline is even if I buy MGV, I will not get any benefit for exchange via II and the inventory is very limited with no 29 day advantage

Could anybody please confirm this is true ? Or the marriott agent was trying to stop me from buying MGV and get me to buy MDC instead.

appreciate any help ..

i would consider most of this a grey area and not 100% accurate on the part of the salesman.

Having said that, all points based reservations systems are set up so that the developer can control inventory and offer the best selection of available dates to their owners/members. I would expect to see internal Marriott exchanges to be easier and getting into Marriott through external exchanges more difficult. I work mostly in the weeks exchange system but, I am also a member of the DC. The DC trades through I.I. if you're using weeks so, the salesman isn't being completely honest when he says Marriott no longer deposits into I.I.

Marriott doesn't deposit weeks into I.I. Owners deposit their weeks into I.I. Marriott only has complete control over legacy weeks exchanged for DC points and trust inventory. Trust inventory likely includes all developer owned inventory. As mentioned, a grey area is how easily Marriott can poach deposited weeks from Internval in exchange for another week(s) of "equal" value. That might mean two off season weeks = one prime season week or, it could mean one prime season week for another prime season week. Right now it's to early to tell.

Keeping in mind everyone did not join the DC, there should still be plenty of non-DC weeks deposited with I.I. for exchange. Any reduction in availability through I.I. I'm almost certain comes from the lack of developer deposited excess inventory. Marriott can't sit on excess inventory forever. They'll have to do something with it somewhere down the line. That might mean buld deposits at certain dates (6 months prior to check in seems to be popular), rent them out, use them for promotional stays or find some other use for them. But they can't sit on them and let them waste away. They'll either want cash or to put potential prospects for a tour in them, be it through exchangers or promotional stays by renting them out.

From what I've seen written about I.I., the Marriott 29 preference is still alive and good with them. I don't believe this is guarenteed and could end for all Marriott owners should Marriott decide not to renew that aspect of their contract with I.I. Since Marriott just signed a new contract with I.I., it's possible it has or is about to end.

As for buying a resort to exchange and with the idea the resort you buy today has low MF's, keep in mind things change. Ask any owner of a Sunterra week who purchased into that system to own low and trade high how it's working out for them today. Sunterra went bankrupt, they were bought by DRI and MF's shot through the roof. Just because MGV has lower MF's today doesn't mean they'll always be that way.

If you're buying strictly to trade and based on MF's, have an exit strategy. Know how to sell that unit when the time comes. You need to be aware of potential negative changes before they happen (special assessments, higher taxes/insurance/utilities) that could negatively affect your MF. You've got to know when to get out before the roof collapses and you're stuck. It's a tricky thing to know but, you'd better be good at reading tea leaves of just be plain lucky.

IMHO, it's best to own something you can use and enjoy. Even when things go wrong you'll have something of value. Otherwise, you may find yourself with a useless week (for you at least) that you can't get rid of, can't exchange for what you want and is costing you an arm and a leg, even though it looked like it was going to be inexpensive when you first bought it.

 

[slum808]

3-bed lockoffs

Great now you guys got me doubting myself again. From previous post on grande Vista, I thought both Grande Vista and Grand Chateau 3 bedrooms locked off into a 1 bed and 2 bed. I found the floor plan for grand Chateau that shows the lock off and it does indead lock off into a 1 bed and 2 bed. I can't find a floor plan for the Grande Vista. I know we have some regulars that own 3 Bedrooms at Grande Vista, perhaps they can clear this up for me.

 

[dioxide45]

Great now you guys got me doubting myself again. From previous post on grande Vista, I thought both Grande Vista and Grand Chateau 3 bedrooms locked off into a 1 bed and 2 bed. I found the floor plan for grand Chateau that shows the lock off and it does indead lock off into a 1 bed and 2 bed. I can't find a floor plan for the Grande Vista. I know we have some regulars that own 3 Bedrooms at Grande Vista, perhaps they can clear this up for me.

The 3BR Grande Vista units lock off in to a 2BR and a studio unit.

 

[dioxide45]

The Marriott preference is written in to the II buyers guide. The preference is indicated in the II resort directory we received also. It doesn't indicate the length of the preference period, but I always thought it was 24 days not 29.

 

[dougp26364]

Great now you guys got me doubting myself again. From previous post on grande Vista, I thought both Grande Vista and Grand Chateau 3 bedrooms locked off into a 1 bed and 2 bed. I found the floor plan for grand Chateau that shows the lock off and it does indead lock off into a 1 bed and 2 bed. I can't find a floor plan for the Grande Vista. I know we have some regulars that own 3 Bedrooms at Grande Vista, perhaps they can clear this up for me.

I found this list of kitchen features for the 3 bedroom Grand Vista unit on Marriott.com

Kitchen features
Fully equipped kitchen
Refrigerator
Mini-refrigerator
Microwave
Dish cleaning supplies
Silverware
Pots, pans, and serving dishes
Dishes and glasses

I've highlighted the mini-fridge. In my experience, when a unit lists a mini-fridge, then the lock-out is a studio unit and not a full one bedroom. I'm wanting to say the other full one bedroom lock-out was in the caribbean. I know the salesman told me buyers of those units were buying the 3 bedroom units at MGC because the one bedroom unit was larger and the layout was unique. Of course, that was a salesman talking so who knows.

 

[dougp26364]

I found the Grand Vista 3 bedroom floor plan here http://www.marriottvacationclub.com/vacation-resorts/marriott-grande-vista/amenities.shtml#tabTour2 . The lock-out is a studio unit on this floor plan.

And this description:

*Select 2- and 3-bedroom villas offer a Lock-Off option, enabling you to create separate units; one with full kitchen, living and dining areas, and the other with a kitchenette.

 

[NWL]

Yep,

Do any Shadow Ridge Enclaves lock off like this? I do know there are a few resorts where the 2BRs lock off in to two 1BR units (sort of).

The Shadow Ridge Enclaves Deluxe 2 bedroom units (it's a mouth full!) are just that. 2 - 1 bedroom units that are supposed to trade equally in II (I haven't tested that yet. I used the Master bedroom side for my Grande Vista 3 bedroom trade). The differences are: master suite a bit larger, full kitchen, and better seating area; Deluxe lock off has a smaller kitchen (apartment size fridge and dishwasher, 2 burner cooktop,convection/microwave oven), but still has a separate bedroom, sitting area, and washer/dryer. Both have nice size balconys. IMO, both sides work great for a couple. A couple with 2 small kids works, too. The only drawback I see is a family with young kids getting the Deluxe lock offs. They would do better with the regular Enclaves lock off or the non-lock off.

I have photos and a floor plan of both types of units if anyone is interested. Just send me a PM.

 

[NWL]

I found the Grand Vista 3 bedroom floor plan here http://www.marriottvacationclub.com/vacation-resorts/marriott-grande-vista/amenities.shtml#tabTour2 . The lock-out is a studio unit on this floor plan.

And this description:

*Select 2- and 3-bedroom villas offer a Lock-Off option, enabling you to create separate units; one with full kitchen, living and dining areas, and the other with a kitchenette.

We just stayed in the Grande Vista 3 bedroom lock off. It was perfect for our group. The lock off portion may be considered a studio, but it was very spacious (has a sleeper sofa and table area, too) kitchenette was big and provided more amenities than I expected, and it has a balcony. Our 3 - 20 year olds loved it!

 

[slum808]

Well, thanks all for clarifying that. Guess its back to the drawing board for my plan.

 

[rahulgopi]

i would consider most of this a grey area and not 100% accurate on the part of the salesman.

Having said that, all points based reservations systems are set up so that the developer can control inventory and offer the best selection of available dates to their owners/members. I would expect to see internal Marriott exchanges to be easier and getting into Marriott through external exchanges more difficult. I work mostly in the weeks exchange system but, I am also a member of the DC. The DC trades through I.I. if you're using weeks so, the salesman isn't being completely honest when he says Marriott no longer deposits into I.I.

Marriott doesn't deposit weeks into I.I. Owners deposit their weeks into I.I. Marriott only has complete control over legacy weeks exchanged for DC points and trust inventory. Trust inventory likely includes all developer owned inventory. As mentioned, a grey area is how easily Marriott can poach deposited weeks from Internval in exchange for another week(s) of "equal" value. That might mean two off season weeks = one prime season week or, it could mean one prime season week for another prime season week. Right now it's to early to tell.

Keeping in mind everyone did not join the DC, there should still be plenty of non-DC weeks deposited with I.I. for exchange. Any reduction in availability through I.I. I'm almost certain comes from the lack of developer deposited excess inventory. Marriott can't sit on excess inventory forever. They'll have to do something with it somewhere down the line. That might mean buld deposits at certain dates (6 months prior to check in seems to be popular), rent them out, use them for promotional stays or find some other use for them. But they can't sit on them and let them waste away. They'll either want cash or to put potential prospects for a tour in them, be it through exchangers or promotional stays by renting them out.

From what I've seen written about I.I., the Marriott 29 preference is still alive and good with them. I don't believe this is guarenteed and could end for all Marriott owners should Marriott decide not to renew that aspect of their contract with I.I. Since Marriott just signed a new contract with I.I., it's possible it has or is about to end.

As for buying a resort to exchange and with the idea the resort you buy today has low MF's, keep in mind things change. Ask any owner of a Sunterra week who purchased into that system to own low and trade high how it's working out for them today. Sunterra went bankrupt, they were bought by DRI and MF's shot through the roof. Just because MGV has lower MF's today doesn't mean they'll always be that way.

If you're buying strictly to trade and based on MF's, have an exit strategy. Know how to sell that unit when the time comes. You need to be aware of potential negative changes before they happen (special assessments, higher taxes/insurance/utilities) that could negatively affect your MF. You've got to know when to get out before the roof collapses and you're stuck. It's a tricky thing to know but, you'd better be good at reading tea leaves of just be plain lucky.

IMHO, it's best to own something you can use and enjoy. Even when things go wrong you'll have something of value. Otherwise, you may find yourself with a useless week (for you at least) that you can't get rid of, can't exchange for what you want and is costing you an arm and a leg, even though it looked like it was going to be inexpensive when you first bought it.

Thank you for the great piece of advice, I will stay away from buying for trade. The only timeshare suited for Northern California is Worldmark ( Marriott has 1 in Tahoe and Hayatt has 1 in Carmel ). Palm Desert and Newport is a 500 mile drive for me, not something I can do every year. I think the best option for me at this point is to stay put with Worldmark and buy something if and when I move or get into another point system like Marriott DC.

 

[BocaBoy]

Lakeshore and Grand Chateau have the 1BR/1BR 2BR lockoff type units.

Actually, the 2BR units at Grand Chateau lock off into a 1BR and a studio. The 3BR units are the only ones at Grand Chateau that lock off without one side of the lockoff being a studio.

 

[dougp26364]

The Shadow Ridge Enclaves Deluxe 2 bedroom units (it's a mouth full!) are just that. 2 - 1 bedroom units that are supposed to trade equally in II (I haven't tested that yet. I used the Master bedroom side for my Grande Vista 3 bedroom trade). The differences are: master suite a bit larger, full kitchen, and better seating area; Deluxe lock off has a smaller kitchen (apartment size fridge and dishwasher, 2 burner cooktop,convection/microwave oven), but still has a separate bedroom, sitting area, and washer/dryer. Both have nice size balconys. IMO, both sides work great for a couple. A couple with 2 small kids works, too. The only drawback I see is a family with young kids getting the Deluxe lock offs. They would do better with the regular Enclaves lock off or the non-lock off.

I have photos and a floor plan of both types of units if anyone is interested. Just send me a PM.

The Westin Kierland in Scottsdale has a similar set up as does Grand Lodge on Peak 7 in Breckenridge. In 2000 we stayed at Westgate Town Center in Orlando and it had a similar set up. I believe French Quarter Resort in Branson does as well. All are essentially studio units with a door between the bed and the small living area. The Westin's and Westgates came closer to being a one bedroom than the others.

I typcally refer to these style units as super studio's more than a one bedroom. What attracted us to the three bedroom at Grand Chateau was the lock-off was a true one bedroom with a full kitchen, large living room and seperate master bedroom. It is smaller than most Marriott one bedroom units. For instance, there is no soaker tub with seperate shower in the bathroom and the kitchen lacks a breakfast bar. Other than that it has everything a normal one bedroom unit would have.

 

[yumdrey]

The only timeshare suited for Northern California is Worldmark ( Marriott has 1 in Tahoe and Hayatt has 1 in Carmel ). Palm Desert and Newport is a 500 mile drive for me, not something I can do every year. I think the best option for me at this point is to stay put with Worldmark and buy something if and when I move or get into another point system like Marriott DC.

Actually, Hyatt has 1 in camel and 1 in tahoe (High sierra lodge).
I own three grande vista weeks, and it is just right resort because I can use Florida Club and reserve weeks at Beach Place and Ocean Pointe during winter/spring. I live in East coast, and going south during winter is my future retire plan.
If you live in NW, buy somewhere you can visit regularly, at least every other year. Grande Vista is too far from you.

 

[NWL]

The Westin Kierlan in Scottsdale has a similar set up as does Grand Lodge on Peak 7 in Breckenridge. In 2000 we stayed at Westgate Town Center in Orlando and it had a similar set up. I believe French Quarter Resort in Branson does as well. All are essentially studio units with a door between the bed and the small living area. The Westin's and Westgates came closer to being a one bedroom than the others.

I typcally refer to these style units as super studio's more than a one bedroom. What attracted us to the three bedroom at Grand Chateau was the lock-off was a true one bedroom with a full kitchen, large living room and seperate master bedroom. It is smaller than most Marriott one bedroom units. For instance, there is no soaker tub with seperate shower in the bathroom and the kitchen lacks a breakfast bar. Other than that it has everything a normal one bedroom unit would have.

The deluxe lock-off at Shadow Ridge is more than a big studio. It does have a separate bedroom, as well as a living room, balcony and washer dryer. It has a square footage of just over 700 sq. ft. The only downside to it is there is limited counter space in the kitchen. I've attached a photo.