Beware of Vallarta Gardens (2014)

[kenmurphey]

They are nice. the 2 bedrooms that is?

 

[Karen G]

Thanks Karen for pointing this out. How do you find an IP address and then know where it is from? VG said they had my IP address and wondered how that worked. Thanks for this site and pointing out what I somehow knew.

You can Google "IP Locator" and if you have the IP address (which Moderators can see on TUG) you just paste it into the IP Locator and it tells you where it's coming from. I'm not tech savvy enough to know how to get it otherwise.

 

[kenmurphey]

Hi Karen:

Looks like we will hire an attorney to help us with this. Profecto is helping but they are very slow. I have looked and spoken to a couple that charge a minimal fee after the deposit is returned. One even puts them on a blacklist on their website once confirmed. Do you have any experience or recommendations on attorneys that are reputable? Don't want to get duped twice. Thanks Ken

 

[Karen G]

Hi Karen:

Looks like we will hire an attorney to help us with this. Profecto is helping but they are very slow.

Sorry, I don't have any experience with reputable Mexican attorneys. I think I'd wait a bit longer for Profeco. I believe their office was closed for the Christmas holidays and won't reopen until January 7 or so, based on another post someone had made.

You have your proof from the post office that you rescinded within the legal time period. Be adamant with the credit card company that you have rescinded and file whatever claim you need to.

 

[Tristagal]

We filed with Profeco today and with Chase a few weeks ago. We kept hoping it wasn't a scam. But they are never going to build the "ocean garden" 2BR units that they promised would be delivered in August 2014. They now say they will build one bedroom units in those buildings. Of course, they haven't broken ground on either of the ocean front buildings. We had a miserable experience in January in the "reef" units which I posted on trip advisor. They have refused to settle this amicably. We decided to escalate the situation after they refused to honor their "buyback" clause. We tried to meet with Michael Gordon about the situation but he dodged us and dumped us on "Ian" who told us that he would get back to us and never did (surprise, surprise.) None of the amenities promised were delivered and they are still advertising their affiliation with REMAX. An affiliation which does not exist according to multiple sources. They also threatened legal action if I communicated our story online. I guess that they don't believe in freedom of speech.

 

[easyrider]

Vallarta Gardens is located north of Bucerias. It is an older fractional condo complex that was built maybe 25 years ago. The buildings are built so that very few of them have a view. The developer is selling pre-construction units in two towers. Neither of these buildings have been started. The sales team has been offering 6000 pesos to qualified prospects to attend a presentation. Some prospects are disqualified during the presentation.

The main reason for disqualification are misrepresenting your timeshare ownership. If you own any resale timeshares you are disqualified. Many people unknowingly reveal too much information and are subsequently disqualified. These people will sit in the waiting area with no word on their promised 6000 pesos for hours and will eventually leave empty handed.

Bill

 

[1950panda]

I am in trouble and need help fast

I spoke with an informed person who says THEY GET SO MANY COMPLAINTS ABOUT VALLARTA. GARDENS THAT THEY MAY CONSIDER A LATE FILED COMPLAINT.
WE FILED FINAL COMPLAINT FORMS IN SPANISH requesting a letter from V.G. saying they canceled our contract. We had received a form from PROFECO.. AND ALSO HAD TO PROVIDE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION TO THEM BY EMAIL.

We bought at Vallarta Gardens on March 10, 2015. I am sooo stupid and should have known better. I checked on Trip Advisor and they seemed to have a good rating but I should have done more research. And I am a former member of TUG. What was I thinking.
I would be happy with the purchase if I believed it was going to happen as in the contract. However part of the agreement is that they will buy our timeshare. Now after being on the internet almost all day I understand that could be a problem.

We own at Star Island and are no longer interested in Florida. We wanted more time in Puerto Vallarta and this seemed a good solution for us. I got a strange email from them beginning "Next April 2015, our Financial Department will begin to implement collection policies for delinquent Clients". I asked why I got this email and they said for information purposes. I was a bit perturbed but was busy with some friends visiting us for a few weeks.

They had said they would take us out for dinner at the Marina to a restaurant for a follow up meeting. We never got contacted so I contacted them. This changed to a brunch or lunch at the resort. They were really pressuring me to pay off the contract to avoid the interest charges and I said I wanted to wait for the escrow to complete. I got a little concerned. So yesterday I had some time and started doing some research and was appalled by what I saw on line.

I went into the website www.pvservices.info/about.html which is the company that is supposed to sell the timeshare. There are a few links and pictures but each one opens and asks for your contact info for someone to contact you. While the contract with the property management company says it guarantees selling and our contract with Vallarta Gardens shows that there is credit coming from the sale of the unit, I am now concerned that they will come back in 180 days and tell me I owe the whole amount.

I have a follow up meeting with them on Tuesday. I do not want to have a confrontation face to face. Is there anything I should be asking to get information if I have to make a complaint about fraud? If I am over the 5 day cooling period do I have any options. I am in Puerto Vallarta for another week. I do have your draft letter. I will report to Profeco. The down payment is already on my card.

There is a payment due on Apr. 15. Now I know why I got the letter.

They were anticipating this.

Is there any chance that they would sell my timeshare? Is there anything else I can do? Is there anyone specific at Profeco that we should talk to.

Any guidance as soon as possible would be most appreciated. You can see how much this is bothering me by the time in this post.

 

[Karen G]

I have a follow up meeting with them on Tuesday. I do not want to have a confrontation face to face. Is there anything I should be asking to get information if I have to make a complaint about fraud? If I am over the 5 day cooling period do I have any options. I am in Puerto Vallarta for another week. I do have your draft letter. I will report to Profeco. The down payment is already on my card.

According to this website there is a Profeco office in Puerto Vallarta. It might be worth going to their office and talking with someone there about what you can do.

Best wishes for a successful outcome--do let us know what you find out.

 

[arby58]

I'm a bit skeptical of your post since your IP address shows you are posting from Puerto Vallarta. You wouldn't be a timeshare salesman who is trying to trick us, would you?

They are still actively marketing their property, that is for sure . . .

We were alerted by many of the posts on this Forum (and others), and I am hopeful that it helped us 'see the light' just in time. On 3/17/15, we purchased a 2BR 1 week with an option for an additional 3 weeks in perpetuity for around $51,000. As what was later termed a 'side agreement - but not their agent' with another company, Berkshire Financial Group of Oklahoma City, OK was to liquidate our two existing timeshares for a total of $57,000. Upon reviewing the terms and conditions, my wife and I became concerned about the agreement to liquidate our existing timeshares, since those were to happen within 180 days, while our $51,000 was due within 60 days. It was helpful to learn here (and on other forums) that many people had the re-sale fall through, at which point they are stuck holding more property than they wished - and I mentioned that to the VG sales people as a major concern.

I had also researched Berkshire and could find little about them - they are not registered as a corporation with the Oklahoma Secretary of State, the address they use on their website (with an obious misspelling of the word their on one of their front pages) shows up in Google maps as a vacant lot, their CEO doesn't show up in a Google search, etc. Of course, the VG salesman talked all that away (not convincingly).

We returned today (3/20/15) and expressed our concerns and suggested rescinding the contract (as provided within 5 days in clause 11 of the contract). At that point, the original salesman 'Jeff' (and his brother 'Chris') started getting very 'assertive' that we could exercise our right but would be on the hook for 'liquidated damages.' I pointed out that clause 11 allows us to cancel with no penalty. Then the tune changed to 'the liquidator has already disposed of the property and there are damages as a result.' I pointed out that they couldn't dispose of the property as we still held title to it, but if they wanted to liquidate at the agreed upon price, it was fine with us. Then the tune switched to the fact that we had signed an agreement waiving our 5 day right to rescind - but when we pushed them to show us where, that claim went away.

Around and around and around we went. They finally agreed (probably because we might disrupt other possible sales) to cancel the contract in return for 'reasonable damages' on their part. They brought in their 'legal representative' who told us she would settle for 6 percent of the downpayment - $900 (an absurd amount for a couple of sales pitches, some excursion tickets and two breakfasts - and what customer pays for this 'cost of doing business' with prospective clients?). I said 'put an agreement in front of me to consider.' It arrived with a confidentiality clause, at which point I told her we would exercise the right to cancel by noticing them there and sending a certified letter with a return receipt.

At that point, they signed an acknowledgement of our exercising our first requirement to cancel the requirement, security escorted us to the door of the property, and we took (and paid for) a cab back to PV.

We then went directly to the Prefeco office in Puerto Vallarta and met with a very helpful woman. She pointed out some useful points for those who may find themselves in our situation:

1. It is not possible to waive the right to the 5 day contract recission - it is also notable that it is five business days.

2. There is no right to withhold a portion of the downpayment on a rescinded contract for 'damages.' If they have your money and you execute a valid rescission, they have 15 days to return the funds to you.

The discussion also made clear some other false claims by 'Jeff' and 'Chris.' We indicated that our current timeshares were a purchase of property (and have title/deed to it). We asked if that was the case here, and they said it was; however, it appears that under Mexican law, the contract is only (and given its proximity to the water can only be) for a right to use the property, which provides far less recourse should things fall apart. They also claimed that there was an active secondary market for resale but failed to mention that resale would require a title transfer fee of 5 times the annual maintenance fee (nearly $5,000). And on and on.

The good news is the Prefeco representative walked us through the remaining steps to cancel the contract and also provided us contact information to follow up should there be any additional 'issues.' Needless to say, we have alerted our bank and our credit card company to the fact that we have done a valid recission of this contract and that we do not authorize any payments to Vallarta Gardens. I am hopeful this will be the end of it - but I'm maybe only 80 percent confident of that.

 

[Karen G]

They are still actively marketing their property, that is for sure . . .

We were alerted by many of the posts on this Forum (and others), and I am hopeful that it helped us 'see the light' just in time. .

Thanks so much for your post, and I'm so happy you found TUG in time to be helpful. Welcome to TUG!

 

[Karen G]

We then went directly to the Profeco office in Puerto Vallarta and met with a very helpful woman. She pointed out some useful points for those who may find themselves in our situation:

1. It is not possible to waive the right to the 5 day contract recission - it is also notable that it is five business days.

2. There is no right to withhold a portion of the downpayment on a rescinded contract for 'damages.' If they have your money and you execute a valid rescission, they have 15 days to return the funds to you.

These two points are so important for people to be aware of because unscrupulous sellers often try to make buyers think otherwise.

 

[PeteL]

We had a very bad experience at the beginning, the original promoter was a bit aggressive and we didn´t actually want to buy anything from him, fortunately for us, they switched after a while, we had a bad experience with the original one, so we asked for something in return. They gave it to us, grundgingly however, they agreed to let us stay for another day for free. We had some issues with the contracts too, the fine letter is deceitful, indeed, so we chose to ask for a lawyer for a revision, we complained with them about those things they didn´t mention in the presentation. We somewhat forced them to actually do what the contract stated, we are currently happy, althought not too much, because the fees are indeed high.

 

[LannyPC]

...we didn´t actually want to buy anything from him... we are currently happy, althought not too much, because the fees are indeed high.

If you are not too happy, why spend thousands of dollars on such a product, especially if "the fees are indeed high"?

If you have a chance to rescind, I strongly recommend you do so. Make sure you follow the instructions very carefully including how to send you letter.

 

[PeteL]

If you are not too happy, why spend thousands of dollars on such a product, especially if "the fees are indeed high"?

If you have a chance to rescind, I strongly recommend you do so. Make sure you follow the instructions very carefully including how to send you letter.

My daughter loved the place, so did we, we are currently happy with everyhting but the price(that's why I said not too happy), we will take your advice into consideration, however.

 

[Kyah]

Vallarta Gardens

I, too, fell for the Vallarta Gardens scam. I should know better! I am past the five day cancelation period. They have my deposit and the remainder is due mid-April. I won't give them any more money, but I would like to re-coup some of my losses, if possible. I have notified my credit card company that I believe this is a fraud and I have contacted Profeco (but haven't heard back from them). I have not yet told Vallarta Gardens that I cannot afford to pay any further fees to them and I want to cancel my membership.

Does anyone have any advice? Thanks so much!

In a future post I will tell more of the story so others can learn from my mistake.

 

[LannyPC]

I won't give them any more money, but I would like to re-coup some of my losses, if possible. I have notified my credit card company that I believe this is a fraud and I have contacted Profeco (but haven't heard back from them). I have not yet told Vallarta Gardens that I cannot afford to pay any further fees to them and I want to cancel my membership.

Does anyone have any advice?
In a future post I will tell more of the story so others can learn from my mistake.

I highly doubt you will be able to "re-coup some of [your] losses". That being said, do not fall for any scams out there that claim they can "re-coup some of [your] losses" if you pay an upfront fee. They also may make great-sounding promises such as "Cancel your mortgage; end your TS agreement; sue the sales person and/or developer", etc. But they will charge you an upfront fee and make off with your money.

Also, when you say you "want to cancel [your] membership", this raises the question Did you buy a timeshare or a travel membership?

You can follow the suggestions in previous posts about contacting Profeco or Customer Service at the resort.

As for "[telling] more of the story so others can learn from [your] mistake", you're certainly welcome to do so but practically everyone on these boards know exactly how these slimy salespeople work and somehow get unsuspecting people to plop down thousands of dollars (that they probably don't even have) for a product that can be found resale for pennies.

 

[Passepartout]

Does anyone have any advice? Thanks so much!

Yes. In the future, READ WHAT YOU SIGN! It's probably too late to get back anything you've already paid them. DO NOT sign up for any of the 'We'll get you out of your timeshare' scams. They will ask for money for any number of worthwhile reasons, taxes, fees, appraisal, you name it.

I'm going to guess that if you don't pay them any more, about the only thing that will happen is you won't get back what you've paid and won't be able to go back to the resort. Do you really want to go there anyway? They can't hold foreclosure over you, you don't own anything. Just the 'Right To Use' a certain number of weeks.

I'm not all that familiar with credit reporting between Mexico and Canadian citizens, but it may not be all that big a deal if you default on a travel club type deal. Or, for that matter if you get to answer a bad credit report with explanation. Even a bad credit report will eventually go away.

Either way, I wouldn't pay them anything. Mexican timeshares sell for next to nothing every day, and sometimes people will pay you to take them.

Best wishes, and Welcome to TUG. I wish you'd found us before those 5 days had passed. We would have had much better news to give you.

Jim

 

[arby58]

Thanks so much for your post, and I'm so happy you found TUG in time to be helpful. Welcome to TUG!

As a follow-up to my prior story: American Express has informed us that they are reversing all charges. While there is a protest period for Vallarta Gardens, I suspect they will not protest - I've now raised my confidence level that this is behind us from 80 to 95 percent.

For those who are in a similar situation, we were told by the person at Amex that a detailed recitation of the facts is important, the complaint confirmation through Profeco is helpful, but most important is to rescind the contract (and document that recission) within the 5 day period.

 

[Karen G]

As a follow-up to my prior story: American Express has informed us that they are reversing all charges. While there is a protest period for Vallarta Gardens, I suspect they will not protest - I've now raised my confidence level that this is behind us from 80 to 95 percent.

Great news!

 

[1950panda]

VISA has 14 day cooling off period for timeshare purchases

As you may note from previous post I too got sucked in and purchased March 10. I was past the 5 day Mexican law cooling off period when I happened to google Vallarta Gardens to check out their website and noticed the links with scam and read the TUG posts as well as other websites.
While we were in Mexico I contacted the bank and the advised me to request to rescind the contract within 14 days and if the money was not returned 15 days after the request, they would initiate a dispute investigation with VISA.
The are NOT treating this as fraud as I willingly gave them my credit card. I was thinking I needed to prove fraud as there was misleading information to entice me to sign the contract.
I did not fully understand this but apparently VISA has a 14 day cooling off period and all I had to do was get the request to cancel the contract within the 14 days, which I did. So, I may have another window here. apparently this process could take two months. VISA does the investigation, allows Vallarta Gardens to respond and then I get a chance to respond to their response. But, the key factor appears to be that I gave the request to cancel within the 14 days.
Keep your fingers crossed that it goes in my favour.
Actually, if the banks started reversing these charges on a regular basis it would smarten up these scammers!
Will keep you posted as to the outcome.

 

[alvinblake]

Hi - we also purchased in March and think we are getting a "bait & switch" from the companies that are alledgedly selling our Grand Luxxe time share. Our second payment is due tomorrow and I have told Vallarta Gardens that we will not pay until sale goes thru but have not gotten response

Any suggestions

 

[Passepartout]

Hi - we also purchased in March and think we are getting a "bait & switch" from the companies that are alledgedly selling our Grand Luxxe time share. Our second payment is due tomorrow and I have told Vallarta Gardens that we will not pay until sale goes thru but have not gotten response

Any suggestions

Are you saying that you bought a TS contingent on their either buying (trading in) a TS you own, or them selling it for you? I can't ever remember any of these deals ending successfully for the new buyer. They end up with two timeshares and two maintenance bills.

If you have paperwork that says they will buy or sell your Vida property, don't make that next payment unless their end of the deal is fulfilled. If it was a verbal agreement, you probably own two timeshares.

Good luck. I wish we'd met before- or within 5 days of- your purchase.

Jim

 

[easyrider]

The deal at Vallarta Garden is that they will purchase your contracts using an outside vendor. They then assess your timeshare contracts in a different room. So my best guess is that Vallarta Gardens facilitates the sale of your contracts and doesn't actually buy them. I was surprised that my VDP's were worth more than what VDP sells these for. I was offered $47,000 for 3 contracts. They claim they sell these weeks to outside vendors like expedia and then show the client a program of luxury hotels and condos you can reserve.

What you are buying at Vallarta Gardens is an old condo complex that is not built to International Building Code and a promised development on the beach that if or when built will totally block the view of the few view condos that are there now.

At the end of the presentation when you say no thanks they try to talk you into purchasing a piece of the imaginary action. What this means is that you buy in for a little and they rent out your share so that you will profit from your imaginary investment.

The entire dealio stinks like scam. The old property is not that nice and the opulent towers are only conceptual. Most of the old condos have no ocean view.

I asked for a piece of the action up front using their resources. They then said adios Bill. We didn't go for the 6000 pesos but did receive huicol art originally priced at $900 usd and a very nice meal with an ocean view.

It was an interesting and enjoyable presentation for us.

Bill

 

[Helene4]

This is the reason it always amazes me that people actively seek out timeshare presentations to attend for a "free" ticket or some cash My time is worth too much to spend sitting in one of these offices for hours on end while I am on vacation.

....and what ever happened to walking out? Are North Americans too afraid of looking rude?

 

[easyrider]

Hi - we also purchased in March and think we are getting a "bait & switch" from the companies that are alledgedly selling our Grand Luxxe time share. Our second payment is due tomorrow and I have told Vallarta Gardens that we will not pay until sale goes thru but have not gotten response

Any suggestions

Its not really a bait and switch. They are selling time in the old condos and also selling time in the imaginary beach towers.

I really don't know if your Lux will sell as there is a huge ownership transfer fee involved and your dealing with "who really knows in Mexico".

In Las Vegas a friend of mine sold his Jocky Club TS for Diamond Points. Diamond actually was involved with this deal and they are very happy with their deal.

It might be best to contact Vida and nix the transfer and then really read your Vallarta Gardens contract for a possible misrepresentation.

Bill