At Barony - What would you have done?

[jme]

We own at SurfWatch. What's this I'm reading about Day Passes? Something I've been missing out on?

Owners at Hilton Head Marriott resorts are able to get Day Passes from the front desk or entrance gate attendant (now they're more like "season" passes for a few months at a time). This allows use of a parking spot & facilities, including pools, workout rooms, and most everything else anytime the owner is on the island.

These passes are ONLY good for usage at the resort owned, not for any other resort.

Owner must be present physically at the resort to use them----that is, a guest or "friend of owner" can't be there unless owner is present. Several owners who live in Sun City (or elsewhere) make great use of this feature---it provides an outlet for pool/beach/amenities usage.

My advice is to never abuse the privilege or the resort might take it away.

Each resort independently reserves the right to limit or suspend the use of Day Passes during peak times in order to reduce potential crowding for the benefit of occupying owners, such as July 4th week (+ a week before or after) for example.

Elsewhere, Myrtle Beach's Marriott Oceanwatch will not allow Day Passes during the fixed Platinum Plus week and one week on either side of calendar, and maybe more.
They seem to be more restrictive there.

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[SueDonJ]

Owners at Hilton Head Marriott resorts are able to get Day Passes from the front desk or entrance gate attendant (now they're more like "season" passes for a few months at a time). This allows use of a parking spot & facilities, including pools, workout rooms, and most everything else anytime the owner is on the island.

These passes are ONLY good for usage at the resort owned, not for any other resort.

Owner must be present physically at the resort to use them----that is, a guest or "friend of owner" can't be there unless owner is present. Several owners who live in Sun City (or elsewhere) make great use of this feature---it provides an outlet for pool/beach/amenities usage.

My advice is to never abuse the privilege or the resort might take it away.

Each resort independently reserves the right to limit or suspend the use of Day Passes during peak times in order to reduce potential crowding for the benefit of occupying owners, such as July 4th week (+ a week before or after) for example.

Elsewhere, Myrtle Beach's Marriott Oceanwatch will not allow Day Passes during the fixed Platinum Plus week and one week on either side of calendar, and maybe more.
They seem to be more restrictive there.

.

I'll add that if Day Pass usage by owners is allowed at a resort - which it's not at all resorts - there will be language in the governing docs to support it (as well as any capacity-related or other limitations that the onsite GM can enforce) and the resort BOD will be aware of it. Probably the best way to verify if/when you might be eligible is to call the resort and ask to speak with the GM if the Front Desk personnel sound at all uninformed.

 

[OutAndAbout]

According to the Barony legal docs, the Oceanside and Oceanfront units are 1111 square feet each. The Gardenview units are 1195 square feet each. This is from the "Description of Units" in the Exhibits to the "Master Deed of Barony Beach Club Horizontal Property Regime."

So yes, the Gardenview units are about 84 square feet larger than the other four buildings.

The Marriott.com website says all three villa types are all 1300sqft/117sqm.

 

[JIMinNC]

According to the Barony legal docs, the Oceanside and Oceanfront units are 1111 square feet each. The Gardenview units are 1195 square feet each. This is from the "Description of Units" in the Exhibits to the "Master Deed of Barony Beach Club Horizontal Property Regime."

So yes, the Gardenview units are about 84 square feet larger than the other four buildings.

The Marriott.com website says all three villa types are all 1300sqft/117sqm.

The descriptions/square footage shown on the web site are not legal documents. Those are for marketing purposes.

The square footages shown in the Descriptions of Units are the legally recorded sizes as shown as part of the Master Deed to the development. These are also the "heated square footage" so they do not include the balcony. It looks like the balcony sizes vary by unit/floor, and seem to range between 106 sqft and 189 sqft. So including the balcony, total unit sizes can range from 1217 square feet to 1377 square feet.

I suspect the 1300 square feet number used on the web site includes the balcony (because it's a larger number, sounds bigger for marketing purposes, and is truly the amount of space each guest has available to them). Since the unit sizes vary because balcony sizes vary, they probably just averaged everything to 1300 square feet for simplicity.

 

[RLS50]

The descriptions/square footage shown on the web site are not legal documents. Those are for marketing purposes.

The square footages shown in the Descriptions of Units are the legally recorded sizes as shown as part of the Master Deed to the development. These are also the "heated square footage" so they do not include the balcony. It looks like the balcony sizes vary by unit/floor, and seem to range between 106 sqft and 189 sqft. So including the balcony, total unit sizes can range from 1217 square feet to 1377 square feet.

I suspect the 1300 square feet number used on the web site includes the balcony (because it's a larger number, sounds bigger for marketing purposes, and is truly the amount of space each guest has available to them). Since the unit sizes vary because balcony sizes vary, they probably just averaged everything to 1300 square feet for simplicity.

Jim,

Your answer makes total sense.

But now you have me wondering how does one know what balcony size is what? Do certain units or view types comes with different balcony sizes? 106 vs 189 is a pretty significant variance in size don't you think?

 

[JIMinNC]

Jim,

Your answer makes total sense.

But now you have me wondering how does one know what balcony size is what? Do certain units or view types comes with different balcony sizes? 106 vs 189 is a pretty significant variance in size don't you think?

It varies by unit. It's listed in the Exhibits to the Master Deed for each building which units have which sizes. In Building F, which is one of the two Gardenview buildings, they list individual unit numbers and there are 6 units with 189 square ft balconies and 21 units with 106 square ft balconies.

For Building G (also Gardenview) it's expressed a little differently, all units on level 1 are 189, then on the other floors, units ending in a 3 or 6 are 189 and all other units are 106.

The other four buildings which contain the Oceanside and Oceanfront units all have similar language that specifies which units have balconies of which size - in those it's 182, 178, and 102. So I guess the real range is 102 - 189 (not 106 - 189 as I stated in the post above) for what it's worth.

It's all too extensive and complex to repeat in detail here, but it appears to vary between floor and unit. Some floors have all one size; some floors are a mix of sizes. Since you never know your exact unit until check-in, I guess it's all an academic question anyway.

 

[OutAndAbout]

I suspect the 1300 square feet number used on the web site includes the balcony (because it's a larger number, sounds bigger for marketing purposes, and is truly the amount of space each guest has available to them). Since the unit sizes vary because balcony sizes vary, they probably just averaged everything to 1300 square feet for simplicity.

Great info, including that the balcony sizes vary as well.

Interesting hypothesis, if true a few things surprise me:

(a) Unfinished space (balcony) would be included in villa size as it is not livable space (Exterior porches or attached decks are not included in a home's square footage)

(b) Marketing materials may not be legal documents, but advertising 1,111 or 1,213 sq ft villas as 1,300 sq ft villas (17% or 7% exaggeration) seems like a potential legal liability.​

 

[JIMinNC]

Great info, including that the balcony sizes vary as well.

Interesting hypothesis, if true a few things surprise me:

(a) Unfinished space (balcony) would be included in villa size as it is not livable space (Exterior porches or attached decks are not included in a home's square footage)

(b) Marketing materials may not be legal documents, but advertising 1,111 or 1,213 sq ft villas as 1,300 sq ft villas (17% or 7% exaggeration) seems like a potential legal liability.​

If they were selling the units based on inflated sq ft, that could be a problem, but since the legal docs are required to state the exact numbers, and do, I would think that complies with real estate law. I would think approximations would be considered fine for a for rent hotel/condo ad. Since a rental is not a sale, the expectation that only "livable" space be promoted might not apply.

Even with for sale ads, I know from the last time we bought a house, the ads placed by realtors are not required to be exact. Many realtors measure the house and estimate the square footage and that's what goes in the ad. I've seen houses that I know are basically identical listed with not insignificant square footage differences. I recall a realtor telling me once that, at least in NC, the rules around that are a bit loose.

 

[RLS50]

Elsewhere, Myrtle Beach's Marriott Oceanwatch will not allow Day Passes during the fixed Platinum Plus week and one week on either side of calendar, and maybe more.

They seem to be more restrictive there.

Thanks for that info. These specific comments are of interest to me because Oceanwatch was obviously sold out during July 4th week and at the last minute we decided we wanted to go down to Myrtle Beach area. We found availability using our Marriott points at the Marriott hotel next door.

When I called Oceanwatch a week ago and asked about day passes (for the 3 days before July 4 and the 3 days after) while we were staying next door, I was told it was possible they would black out that holiday weekend, but those decisions weren't made until a few days before at the daily staff meetings, so he couldn't tell me now if day passes would be available or what days might be blacked out.

If what you are stating is true, it sounds like they have a routine they follow every year? So I am guessing the person I spoke with at the front desk may not have been the right person to verify that with?

 

[SueDonJ]

Thanks for that info. These specific comments are of interest to me because Oceanwatch was obviously sold out during July 4th week and at the last minute we decided we wanted to go down to Myrtle Beach area. We found availability using our Marriott points at the Marriott hotel next door.

When I called Oceanwatch a week ago and asked about day passes (for the 3 days before July 4 and the 3 days after) while we were staying next door, I was told it was possible they would black out that holiday weekend, but those decisions weren't made until a few days before at the daily staff meetings, so he couldn't tell me now if day passes would be available or what days might be blacked out.

If what you are stating is true, it sounds like they have a routine they follow every year? So I am guessing the person I spoke with at the front desk may not have been the right person to verify that with?

I think it's more likely that regardless of how strictly (or not) the governing docs are written, there's enough leeway in them that the onsite staff makes the decision at the time based on capacity. Based on what they said to you I'd wait to ask until you get there and check in next door. It may help for you to go over to MOW in person to ask, rather than call - a friendly face won't hurt. Good luck!

 

[jme]

Thanks for that info. These specific comments are of interest to me because Oceanwatch was obviously sold out during July 4th week and at the last minute we decided we wanted to go down to Myrtle Beach area. We found availability using our Marriott points at the Marriott hotel next door.

When I called Oceanwatch a week ago and asked about day passes (for the 3 days before July 4 and the 3 days after) while we were staying next door, I was told it was possible they would black out that holiday weekend, but those decisions weren't made until a few days before at the daily staff meetings, so he couldn't tell me now if day passes would be available or what days might be blacked out.

If what you are stating is true, it sounds like they have a routine they follow every year? So I am guessing the person I spoke with at the front desk may not have been the right person to verify that with?

Unfortunately, I suspect they will not allow day passes for you because it's the Platinum Plus week. Understandable, since the possibility for issuance of many day passes is high for that time (lots of Marriott owners in the area even if not staying at OW).

If I were a Platinum Plus owner and paid that ridiculously high price for the week, I'd be quite upset at "extra" (even if owners) non-occupying guests sitting around the already small/crowded main pool. (Given the size of the resort, i.e., number of units, that pool is proportionately small.) Not to mention longer lines at the concessions, bars, delis, etc. and more lounge chairs around the pool being filled. At 100% occupancy already, it would almost be unthinkable that passes would be allowed.

I don't think it unreasonable to disallow day pass guests at the resort's discretion. Nothing is guaranteed for any owner except full privileges during their occupancy week. This policy is ultimately fair for all, though, and has negatively influenced me too for visits during peak times.

And yes, you're correct, the front desk people rely on the resort manager for all instructions such as allowing day passes, and probably don't speculate or even comment until they have a definitive directive regarding specific days.

Once, we got day passes for a different non-holiday week in June---they were allowed then------but they only gave us single-day passes and we had to return each subsequent day to inquire about further passes.

**** Also, I agree with what Susan said in previous post. Each resort has independent authority to do as they see fit (regarding that resort's capacity) for the beneficial interests of each week's occupying guests, as it should be.


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[RLS50]

Sue / JME,

Thanks for the feedback.

JME, I agree with your position as outlined. If I owned Platinum Plus at Oceanwatch, which is 100% occupied for that week, I would not want a bunch of other owners coming in on day passes and detracting from my vacation experience if that is what is would result in. I do consider day passes a privilege, not an implicit right.

I think the takeaway for most Marriott owners in HHI and Myrtle Beach is that day passes will probably be available during most times of the year, but not always guaranteed during peak holiday periods.