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Access to Abound is up!

You are completely missing the point. It does not matter if Marriott owns any inventory, it is just another owner like everyone else. How did they book these Christmas weeks that are currently not available to the Vistana resort owners? The VSN rules mention that during the Home Resort Reservation Period the owners the exclusive right to book without competition from non-owners. If this is true, it is clearly against the rules.

Maybe I am missing your point. The way I see it is that Marritott owns the inventory and they chose to deposit into Abound just like any other owner. I am agreeing with you. So why is this against the rules?
 
You are completely missing the point. It does not matter if Marriott owns any inventory, it is just another owner like everyone else. How did they book these Christmas weeks that are currently not available to the Vistana resort owners? The VSN rules mention that during the Home Resort Reservation Period the owners the exclusive right to book without competition from non-owners. If this is true, it is clearly against the rules.
Someone booked WLR in abound for 5 nights. Interesting….
 
Maybe I am missing your point. The way I see it is that Marritott owns the inventory and they chose to deposit into Abound just like any other owner. I am agreeing with you. So why is this against the rules?
It was also said that Marriott would seek to dry up the VSN. We were right
 
You are completely missing the point. It does not matter if Marriott owns any inventory, it is just another owner like everyone else. How did they book these Christmas weeks that are currently not available to the Vistana resort owners? The VSN rules mention that during the Home Resort Reservation Period the owners the exclusive right to book without competition from non-owners. If this is true, it is clearly against the rules.
I do agree with @timsi on this. If owners at the resort can't even book yet due to being more than 12 months out, it definitely is wrong that non-owners can. I still don't like the idea of non-owners booking more than 8 months out. The only way I'd say that's okay is if it's fixed-week inventory owned by MVC or elected into Abound by a fixed-week owner. Floating inventory should definitely not be available that far out.
 
It worked perfectly for me. I deposited my WKOVRN week and got 8325 points. Then I booked 3 nights using about 3000 of those points back into WKOVRN to match up with my 9N at MOC. To me, even though those 3N are expensive, it fit my vacation plans perfectly.

This is 5 months in so it would follow the rules people are complaining about. I do not want to debate the rules or that Marriott is evil. I really do not care how it works. I just do what I can to get what fits my vacation plans.
 
Houston, I think we have a problem....

You are completely missing the point. It does not matter if Marriott owns any inventory, it is just another owner like everyone else. How did they book these Christmas weeks that are currently not available to the Vistana resort owners? The VSN rules mention that during the Home Resort Reservation Period the owners the exclusive right to book without competition from non-owners. If this is true, it is clearly against the rules.
So, I think from past points it's obvious I don't agree with timsi's interpretation of the Home Resort Reservation Rules. I believe that for any inventory that Marriott (or the DP trust) owns or for inventory that other owners "elect" into Abound, MVC can get away with providing availability at 12 months out.
@travelhacker Apparently people on Facebook are reporting vistana inventory already in abound using club points…. Someone reported Christmas at Westin St John….. ummmm what happened to vistana owners electing for club points first?! It looks like the best weeks are showing up in abound and not VSN. It looks like y’all will owe @timsi the biggest apology ever if this is the case
I also think that the Westin St. John is a bit of a unique situation as many fixed week / fixed units were sold here that are reserved more than 12 months out....and as such if Marriott (or the DP trust) owns or an owner of such a week "elects" into Abound, this could also technically make these weeks available.

HOWEVER, what I see is problematic as even with my (what some may say is liberal) interpretation of the rules, I don't understand how some inventory is currently available in Abound. Not only are there Westin St. John 2023 Christmas weeks available, but I basically see ALL of December 2023 at Westin Kaanapali (south) (and several weeks at north) available in Abound in various unit sizes. I have no idea how this would be possible as even owners cannot book more than 12 months out. I even went right through the last step of booking (but did not finally confirm) to make sure it "held" the inventory to let me finalize.

Definitely not good news, unless this is a launch day quirk/problem.
 
Houston, I think we have a problem....


So, I think from past points it's obvious I don't agree with timsi's interpretation of the Home Resort Reservation Rules. I believe that for any inventory that Marriott (or the DP trust) owns or for inventory that other owners "elect" into Abound, MVC can get away with providing availability at 12 months out.

I also think that the Westin St. John is a bit of a unique situation as many fixed week / fixed units were sold here that are reserved more than 12 months out....and as such if Marriott (or the DP trust) owns or an owner of such a week "elects" into Abound, this could also technically make these weeks available.

HOWEVER, what I see is problematic as even with my (what some may say is liberal) interpretation of the rules, I don't understand how some inventory is currently available in Abound. Not only are there Westin St. John 2023 Christmas weeks available, but I basically see ALL of December 2023 at Westin Kaanapali (south) (and several weeks at north) available in Abound in various unit sizes. I have no idea how this would be possible as even owners cannot book more than 12 months out. I even went right through the last step of booking (but did not finally confirm) to make sure it "held" the inventory to let me finalize.

Definitely not good news, unless this is a launch day quirk/problem.
I don’t think it’s a quirk/problem. Many suspected Marriott of filtering the best weeks of vistana for Marriott owners and it seems that those who had that concern were correct. Most owners dont trust Marriott. Not that it’s that big of deal. Vistana owners still have the upper hand, we have the VSN AND Abound.
 
Can someone check if Westin Kierland Feb-March is available in Abound? All inventory for Feb-Mar completely disappeared in Vistana around the 9 month mark, even random days here and there. It was around the time Vistana remove the "calendar availability" feature from their website.
I've been a Kierland owner for 18 years, and never once have seen absolutely no availability in Feb-March until this year, so my bet is that Marriott scooped it up for Abound months ago.
 
So does this mean that VSN will see less inventory is true?

If a resort has 100 units and Vistana gives 35 Christmas weeks to Abound, only 65 will be available to the resort owners.
 
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Can someone check if Westin Kierland Feb-March is available in Abound? All inventory for Feb-Mar completely disappeared in Vistana around the 9 month mark, even random days here and there. It was around the time Vistana remove the "calendar availability" feature from their website.
I've been a Kierland owner for 18 years, and never once have seen absolutely no availability in Feb-March until this year, so my bet is that Marriott scooped it up for Abound months ago.
Nothing available in Abound, not even a single night.
 
How does Westin St. John inventory end up in II for exchanging more than 8 months out? Whatever the answer is, the same should apply to WSJ inventory that ends up in the Abound Exchange Company.

Two things:

1. One source of the available WSJ inventory could be II. From the DC/Abound start Marriott has been able to pull inventory from II to satisfy requests using DC/Abound Points. Below is copied from the TUG FAQ (that's linked below in my signature:

>>MVCI Weeks and MVCD Points inventory is kept separate according to the terms of each system's governing documents in order to protect Owners/Members ownership and usage rights. Inventory available through the DC Exchange Company is sourced from Marriott-controlled deposits as well as (according to a no-longer-available FAQ that had been posted to the owners' website during the early DC years,) "... other Marriott Vacation Club Owners who enroll their weeks and elect Vacation Club Points, and non-enrolled Owners who trade their usage for Marriott Rewards points or exchange their week through membership in Interval International."

Technically, in compliance with the governing documents, DC Trust Members have direct access to inventory in the DC Trust as well as inventory available through the DC Exchange Company; and, DC Exchange Members have direct access to only the inventory that's available through the DC Exchange Company. Functionally, it appears that Marriott is managing inventory such that a few select high-demand intervals are available only from the Trust at the 13-months Reservation Window, then at the 12-months Reservation Window most intervals are made available through the Exchange Company. Effectively, it appears that inventory is currently being managed by Marriott such that the technical v. functional legal aspects are practically nullified with respect to the overwhelming majority of available intervals.<<


2. We've never been told the machinations that Marriott uses to manipulate inventory through the Weeks, Points, II, and Other sources. It's not a given that Marriott pre-books inventory that's made available via the Abound Exchange Company. Not that my opinion is worth more than anybody else's but I don't believe that they pre-book anything. I think available intervals are coded into the system as to their origin and how they can be used/by whom, then in realtime as a request is made the system searches across all sources of inventory to fulfill the request. So basically, instead of picturing separate buckets I picture a single bucket from which inventory can be pulled depending on both the requestor's eligibility AND the source of the inventory, with built-in stops that prevent an interval being used in such a way that either owners' or Marriott's rights are violated. Using the example above, if a resort has 100 sold like intervals and 35 owners select other-than-home usage, a stopgap exists that prevents more than 35 intervals from being pulled away from owners, and, stopgaps exist to prevent the DC/Abound from pulling unfair multiples of the highest-demand intervals across a floating season.

Of course I could be wrong about all of this but it's what makes the most sense to me considering that once the back-end coding program is written it basically runs itself, and over the years we haven't seen anything to suggest that Marriott manipulates inventory for its own benefit to the detriment of Weeks/Points owners.
 
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Doesn’t WSJ have some fixed week/unit ownerships? At what point do those get reserved? Does it happen at 18 months, 13 months or 12? I am not sure, but perhaps that is a way for them to get into Abound prior to 12 months?
 
I just deposited my WKOVRN 2BR OF. So that is great inventory now available for some one else.
 
@travelhacker Apparently people on Facebook are reporting vistana inventory already in abound using club points…. Someone reported Christmas at Westin St John….. ummmm what happened to vistana owners electing for club points first?! It looks like the best weeks are showing up in abound and not VSN. It looks like y’all will owe @timsi the biggest apology ever if this is the case
Christmas 2022 or 2023?
 
I don't think it's as simple as saying Marriott is grabbing up the best weeks to give them to Abound. There is definitely some sort of inventory management going on. My (pure speculation) based on about an hour of searching in Abound is that immediate availability is clearly tied to inventory MVC owns/controls and perhaps even the inventory that has been directly added to the DP points trust.

What leads me to think there's something like this going on? There is not a single Westin Nanea or Westin Los Cabos week available at any time that is currently searchable in Abound. Yet there is a TON of availability at Los Cabos in VSN (and keep in mind, this is a destination MVC has no resort in so I would imagine they would want to try to make some availability here) and there is even sporadic availability in VSN for Nanea.

What do these resorts have in common? They were never sold as weeks and as such MVC has had no opportunity to scoop up resales and dump them in the DP trust for direct Abound usage. Everything for these two resorts is in a committed points trust (which likely makes it more difficult (maybe not possible) for Marriott to shift actual ownership into the DP trust).
 
Well if this is the number of Abound points my WSJ VGV 2 Bedroom week will receive if I deposit it, there is no way I am going to do that as it much more valuable using it in the Vistana network! The number does correspond to around the number of points to book the same week (Wk 20) with points, but I can certainly get better use out of the 148,100 options to book in the Vistana network at this rate (especially given the very high maintenance fee at WSJ). The 2024 usage is not showing as Vistana has that week is booked for my fixed week and I haven't released it yet.


2022-11-30_09-34-08.png
 
Christmas 2022 or 2023?
I did a quick search for WSJ / DEC2023 / 3 nights / 2 guests; three check-in days of the month were available with one of them covering 12/24/23.
 
Doesn’t WSJ have some fixed week/unit ownerships? At what point do those get reserved? Does it happen at 18 months, 13 months or 12? I am not sure, but perhaps that is a way for them to get into Abound prior to 12 months?
Yep - this is what I posted above....it doesn't answer all the questions though.

 
I see quite a bit of availability DEC-2023 within Abound for some Westin's.

1669830520498.png
 
Nothing available in Abound, not even a single night.

interesting, because someone just posted on the Marriott board that they just booked 7 nights at Kierland in February.
Agreed - I am seeing every single week at Kierland available in February and March.
 
Can also book Kierland for Superbowl-2023 even though there is ZERO availability Feb/Mar-2023 via Vsitana.

1669830967959.png
 
Agreed - I am seeing every single week at Kierland available in February and March.
Now we know Marriott took all this inventory for Abound. back in June, still in the Home Resort reservation period for most owners.
I posted this back in June (see post link below).
I highly doubt Marriott owns enough Platinum Kierland weeks to scoop up all the Feb/March inventory. So how was this allowed?

 
If I cancel a 2023 home resort reservation, can I then deposit those points to abound?
 
I am having a different issue. I go into the election option, select 2023, use the two SFlex contracts I have that are eligible and show max club point values that match what I was told at my last update, and then get to the final review page where it lists both contracts as about to be elected but shows a zero value for club points being received. Of course I didn't click the final button to do the election. Anyone else have this issue?
 
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