1st Post: Interested in buying 2 Elara units

[emoneybug]

Hi all,
I'm interested in buying 2 Elara units:

1) 7000 or 7800 HGVC Points with the under $900 MFs to use to most likely trade and stay at other HGVC Resorts.

2) There is currently on ebay a 2bedroom platinum with $1246 MFs (Even Years). Use to split stay 3 days and the 4 days. Or if we can't go try to rent it out to recoup the MFs for the year. It's listed for $1

Questions:
1) I think I've seen some posts that a good price for the 7000points is $6,300 and $7,800points is $7K. Is that correct? Also, assuming closing and transfer type costs are around $1K. Typically on these purchases for HGVC points, who is paying (buyer or seller) ?

2) For the giveaway Elara units: a) if you own platinum, can you book a gold week? b) Typically who is paying the closing & transfer type costs (buyer or seller) ? c) Any pitfalls that I don't know about to this Elara giveaway unit? --I'm basically "renting" a 2 bedroom for $1,246 every other year ...right?

I've been a DVC Owner since 2012 so looking to try out Hilton then maybe Marriott down the road. For us DVC folks, welcome home

 

[PigsDad]

2) For the giveaway Elara units:

Be very careful here -- Elara was originally built by Westgate, and there a few Westgate deeds out there. Those deeds are completely separate from HGVC cannot be enrolled in / converted to HGVC and are usually given away for free. I wouldn't touch those with a 10-foot pole. Almost all HGVC deeds at Elara will be sold for some amount (not free), except some small-point, lower season deeds. Again, I wouldn't recommend those since the MF will be too high for the points you get.

Kurt

 

[Sandy VDH]

Not all Elara units are HGVC. Make sure that you don't end up with a Westgate Unit. HGVC will not let Westgate units convert to HGVC.

 

[ocdb8r]

Also be careful grabbing EoY units (that you can actually enroll in HGVC) as you will pay HGVC dues every year (even in the off years you don't get points).

 

[DK3]

Other Las Vegas resorts may give you lower MF if your primary goal is just to have points.

 

[dayooper]

Hi all,
I'm interested in buying 2 Elara units:

1) 7000 or 7800 HGVC Points with the under $900 MFs to use to most likely trade and stay at other HGVC Resorts.

2) There is currently on ebay a 2bedroom platinum with $1246 MFs (Even Years). Use to split stay 3 days and the 4 days. Or if we can't go try to rent it out to recoup the MFs for the year. It's listed for $1

Questions:
1) I think I've seen some posts that a good price for the 7000points is $6,300 and $7,800points is $7K. Is that correct? Also, assuming closing and transfer type costs are around $1K. Typically on these purchases for HGVC points, who is paying (buyer or seller) ?

2) For the giveaway Elara units: a) if you own platinum, can you book a gold week? b) Typically who is paying the closing & transfer type costs (buyer or seller) ? c) Any pitfalls that I don't know about to this Elara giveaway unit? --I'm basically "renting" a 2 bedroom for $1,246 every other year ...right?

I've been a DVC Owner since 2012 so looking to try out Hilton then maybe Marriott down the road. For us DVC folks, welcome home

1) Is there a reason you are looking to buy Elara? The Boulevard standard platinum 2 bedroom has very similar MF’s (falls in between the 2 you list above) and is easier to find than the Elara Grand and Grand Plus units. The closing costs and Hilton Fees are more than $1000 (depending on the resort). The Hilton fees alone are $1018, though $609, along with the $176 club dues are billed later. You can negotiate with the seller on the fees. I paid for all of the fees on my purchase, but my purchase proving was fairly low. I also purchased title insurance on my purchase as well and that increased my costs too.

2) I would stay away from that unit. If it’s the one I’m thinking of, it’s a Westgate unit and you will not be happy with that. You will still pay HGVC club dues, but have no access to the system. You can only book what you own and renting for MF’s in Vegas is very difficult. So many cheap places to stay gives way too much competition. When you decide to get rid of it, Wastegate makes it very difficult to sell and you will be stuck with it. Any time you purchase a timeshare, make sure it’s one that you can get rid of if you have to. Your option 1 is pretty to. Option 2? Not so much.

 

[terces]

Hi emoneybug - first of all if you join TUG for a few dollars you will get access to lots of good info.
Your first point of MF's under $900 conflicts with your point number 2 where MF's are $1,246 and probably more accurate.
I highly doubt HGVC would ever let a true 7000 point platinum go for $1, no way.
What you have at the Elara is it is partially under a different ownership by Westgate and it is not a legitimate HGVC. Some brokers try to sell it as HGVC and you should get more information and clarity on this before going down that road. For me, and I have a deep background in commercial real estate, the waters at Elara were too murky so I opted for ownership at Las Vegas Boulevard. Even at other HGVC resorts there are the ones developed by HGVC and then there are affiliates. As you will be able to see from many different posts, the affiliates are much less secure of a risk - some of them just up and leave the system. It would be advisable to slow down and only jump in after doing lots of research. There are many units for sale and a continuous supply of resale, so you are not going to miss out on a "deal". These 7000 point units sell at about $44,000 at full retail. For a low MF unit you will probably spend in the $7000 range if you buy at an HGVC developed resort. If you buy at an affiliate you can get it for less, but you assume much more risk in my opinion. At $7k for a $44k unit you will pay about $0.16 on the dollar. Not a bad deal. The best part is that if you buy the very best you will be able to get rid of it when the time comes.

 

[RX8]

To add a bit more. With HGVC you are really only allowed to rent out your home week. There is no way you are going to rent a Vegas week anywhere close to almost $1,300 so don’t count on that option.
That said, have other Vegas owners made a club reservation elsewhere (like Hawaii) and rented that out? Probably...but it is written in the rules that you cannot do that so there is some risk in doing so.

 

[SmithOp]

HGVC doesnt have split 3/4 stays for home weeks so that is a dead giveaway this is an orphan Westgate deed.

If you want to exchange within Westgate system they limit resale owners to 60 day window.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

Hi all,
I'm interested in buying 2 Elara units:

1) 7000 or 7800 HGVC Points with the under $900 MFs to use to most likely trade and stay at other HGVC Resorts.

2) There is currently on ebay a 2bedroom platinum with $1246 MFs (Even Years). Use to split stay 3 days and the 4 days. Or if we can't go try to rent it out to recoup the MFs for the year. It's listed for $1

Questions:
1) I think I've seen some posts that a good price for the 7000points is $6,300 and $7,800points is $7K. Is that correct? Also, assuming closing and transfer type costs are around $1K. Typically on these purchases for HGVC points, who is paying (buyer or seller) ?

2) For the giveaway Elara units: a) if you own platinum, can you book a gold week? b) Typically who is paying the closing & transfer type costs (buyer or seller) ? c) Any pitfalls that I don't know about to this Elara giveaway unit? --I'm basically "renting" a 2 bedroom for $1,246 every other year ...right?

I've been a DVC Owner since 2012 so looking to try out Hilton then maybe Marriott down the road. For us DVC folks, welcome home

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

You definitely want to avoid any Westgate unit at Elara as others have advised.

With that said, maybe you should take a look at Marriott's Grand Chateau.

Welcome to TUG.






.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

If the OP is only interested in points to go elsewhere, then Flamingo and Paradise 7k point units should also be considered as those are wholly owned by HGVC.

Although Marriott Grand Chateau is across the street from Elara, the MF is about $300 - $400 more per year and doesn't come with points to trade. Only option is trading in II for weeks. Enrolling in the MVC DC system to trade points would cost thousands if not ten thousand or more.

 

[emoneybug]

Thanks to all for the Feedback so far. Sounds like a major red flag/thumbsdown to the Westgate Elara Timeshares, thanks in advance for saving me on that.

2 HGVC I see for low entry right now. 4800point Flamingo $943 MFs and buyer pays closing, not sure if it well get bid up but if it doesn't, sounds like a solid deal to me. If I was cash poor today but wanted to get into HGVC, this seems like a good 1st purchase. Feedback?

The other is a 5000point Seaworld $1101 MFs and buyer is paying closing, also not sure if it well get bid up but if it doesn't this sounds really good in terms of not much upfront cash. Feedback?

 

[dayooper]

Thanks to all for the Feedback so far. Sounds like a major red flag/thumbsdown to the Westgate Elara Timeshares, thanks in advance for saving me on that.

2 HGVC I see for low entry right now. 4800point Flamingo $943 MFs and buyer pays closing, not sure if it well get bid up but if it doesn't, sounds like a solid deal to me. If I was cash poor today but wanted to get into HGVC, this seems like a good 1st purchase. Feedback?

The other is a 5000point Seaworld $1101 MFs and buyer is paying closing, also not sure if it well get bid up but if it doesn't this sounds really good in terms of not much upfront cash. Feedback?

Not a fan of the 1 bedroom units at the Flamingo. The MF per point ratio is very high, almost $0.20 per point. My Flamingo 2 bedroom MF’s are $0.15 per point (and that’s on the high side of acceptable). Be patient. As people get antsy about next years MF’s, the prices, and potentially the ROFR prices will start to drop. It’s a perpetual buyers market so you can afford to be picky.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Check with the brokers listings too. I just saw a listing for 7K Paradise for $8000 with Carl Thoms at Paradise Resale www.timeshare-resale.com He is a reputable broker.

 

[GT75]

Be patient. As people get antsy about next years MF’s, the prices, and potentially the ROFR prices will start to drop. It’s a perpetual buyers market so you can afford to be picky.

It is a little early but yes I agree. I also think that it is a great time to start looking and be ready to purchase a TS. I use next year MFs to my advantage.

 

[pianodinosaur]

We stayed in a 2 bedroom unit at The Elara in 2015. It was very nice. However, we avoided the Westgate black tower of doom prior to the HGVC conversion. We really miss the Las Vegas Hilton. When we stayed at The KAREN Avenue property we could use all the Las Vegas Hilton facilitates and bill the meals an shows to our room. We could really earn a lot of HHonors points while timesharing. Too bad it is now a Westgate property.

 

[topdog]

Hilton Bay Club Waikoloa is cheap. PM me about mine if you like.

 

[PigsDad]

Hilton Bay Club Waikoloa is cheap. PM me about mine if you like.

Bay Club may be cheap to buy, but it is certainly not cheap to own. MFs are pretty high compared to most HGVC properties.

Kurt

 

[SabresFan]

Hi emoneybug - first of all if you join TUG for a few dollars you will get access to lots of good info.
Your first point of MF's under $900 conflicts with your point number 2 where MF's are $1,246 and probably more accurate.
I highly doubt HGVC would ever let a true 7000 point platinum go for $1, no way.
What you have at the Elara is it is partially under a different ownership by Westgate and it is not a legitimate HGVC. Some brokers try to sell it as HGVC and you should get more information and clarity on this before going down that road. For me, and I have a deep background in commercial real estate, the waters at Elara were too murky so I opted for ownership at Las Vegas Boulevard. Even at other HGVC resorts there are the ones developed by HGVC and then there are affiliates. As you will be able to see from many different posts, the affiliates are much less secure of a risk - some of them just up and leave the system. It would be advisable to slow down and only jump in after doing lots of research. There are many units for sale and a continuous supply of resale, so you are not going to miss out on a "deal". These 7000 point units sell at about $44,000 at full retail. For a low MF unit you will probably spend in the $7000 range if you buy at an HGVC developed resort. If you buy at an affiliate you can get it for less, but you assume much more risk in my opinion. At $7k for a $44k unit you will pay about $0.16 on the dollar. Not a bad deal. The best part is that if you buy the very best you will be able to get rid of it when the time comes.

Is there any listing some place that indicates which resorts are Affiliates and which are HGVC developed resorts?

 

[dayooper]

Is there any listing some place that indicates which resorts are Affiliates and which are HGVC developed resorts?

Its a little more complicated than that. There are resorts that HGVC (or Hilton before the spin off) developed themselves, there’s resorts that were built in conjunction with a third party, there are those that were built before HGVC started managing them and there’s some that were built before and now HGVC has added on to them, sort of like a hybrid.

Here’s a list of the properties and their designation by HGVC: link

A developed property, I believe, are ones resorts HGVC owns outright. They may have been built by Hilton/HGVC or they were built before and HGVC/Hilton purchased them. Fee-for-Service are properties that were joint ventures, mostly funded by a third party (Blackstone Capitol and Strand Capitol have worked with HGVC on numerous resorts). Collection properties are resorts that are managed and intervals sold by HGVC. A true affiliate is a resort that isn’t owned or managed by HGVC but still can be booked with in the system.

 

[terces]

Is there any listing some place that indicates which resorts are Affiliates and which are HGVC developed resorts?

Yes there is. The best place is the horses mouth so to speak. Go to the HGV corporate website, you can find a bunch of good information on the "Investor" Tab. The latest news is good as is the most recent 10Q (quarterly report) or 10K annual report. I can't remember exactly where I saw the list but it is definitely there and definitive.

 

[SabresFan]

Its a little more complicated than that. There are resorts that HGVC (or Hilton before the spin off) developed themselves, there’s resorts that were built in conjunction with a third party, there are those that were built before HGVC started managing them and there’s some that were built before and now HGVC has added on to them, sort of like a hybrid.

Here’s a list of the properties and their designation by HGVC: link

A developed property, I believe, are ones resorts HGVC owns outright. They may have been built by Hilton/HGVC or they were built before and HGVC/Hilton purchased them. Fee-for-Service are properties that were joint ventures, mostly funded by a third party (Blackstone Capitol and Strand Capitol have worked with HGVC on numerous resorts). Collection properties are resorts that are managed and intervals sold by HGVC. A true affiliate is a resort that isn’t owned or managed by HGVC but still can be booked with in the system.

Thanks - unfortunately that link is not working for me.

 

[PigsDad]

Thanks - unfortunately that link is not working for me.

Here is the link that I think Daylooper was trying to point to.

Kurt

 

[dayooper]

Thanks - unfortunately that link is not working for me.

Its now pulling it to the correct page. Scroll down and you will find the list. FYI - That list was taken from the investor section of the HGVC site.