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BSU #1 in BCS?

ok, I am befuddled by this. As a HUGE Ohio State fan, (I did say HUGE, right?) I am not convinced we are the best team in the land. However, that being said, if the powers that be ranked us #2 to start the season (which I questioned, but not too loudly:p ), then how do we go from #2 to #5 when #1 lost and we are still undefeated??? Is this, like, new math or something?:wall:
 
I'm a VA Tech Hokie fan. However, if Ohio State, Boise State and Oregon should win this weekend. I feel there should be a three way tie for first place in the BCS ranking.
 
ok, I am befuddled by this. As a HUGE Ohio State fan, (I did say HUGE, right?) I am not convinced we are the best team in the land. However, that being said, if the powers that be ranked us #2 to start the season (which I questioned, but not too loudly:p ), then how do we go from #2 to #5 when #1 lost and we are still undefeated??? Is this, like, new math or something?:wall:

The AP and USA Today Poll both have Ohio State number one

AP Top 25
RK TEAM RECORD PTS
1 Ohio State (34) 6-0 1453
2 Oregon (15) 6-0 1427
3 Boise State (8) 5-0 1395
4 TCU (1) 6-0 1304
5 Nebraska 5-0 1236
6 Oklahoma (2) 5-0 1225
7 Auburn 6-0 1104
8 Alabama 5-1 1021
9 LSU 6-0 999
10 South Carolina 4-1 978

USA Today Poll
RK TEAM RECORD PTS
1 Ohio State (49) 6-0 1455
2 Oregon (6) 6-0 1388
3 Boise State (1) 5-0 1335
4 Nebraska (2) 5-0 1272
5 TCU (1) 6-0 1213
6 Oklahoma 5-0 1193
7 Auburn 6-0 1060
8 Alabama 5-1 1029
9 LSU 6-0 1021
10 Utah 5-0 940
 
If you read the headlines, it says.....Boise could be No. 1 in initial BcS rankings

Please note that is says could be. Boise is looking good this year, but if you watched the ESPN BcS watch on Sunday, their computer program that is suppose to be identical to the BcS program did not put Boise as number 1. Also, they had three experts on the show give their opinion and none of them put Boise as #1. Maybe it will happen later, but I think it is too early to celebrate.

This reminds me of U OF Hawaii a couple years ago when all the Hawaii fans thought that UH should be number 1 and they went to the Sugar Bowl and got their doors blown off by GA. I am glad that Boise is changing to a difference conference next year.
 
Face it...without a true playoff system, the true #1 will always be a question.

Honestly, we're not asking for the moon here...16 teams settles the issue in just four games...32 takes you to 5 games.

Shoot, every state in the union runs a decent High School playoff system for football. In Ohio, you start after a ten game season. 8-2 pretty much gets you in, 7-3 or 6-4 and the issue goes to points. None of it is based on "Votes". Beat good teams and you get more points...beat scrubs and you get fewer points. Good teams are defined by their won/lost record. The arguments about team selection pretty much dropped to zero once the system was installed some 20 years ago. Everyone knows what it takes to get in. BTW, there are 5 or 6 divisions in Ohio based on school size so the play is pretty level. You don't have a 150 kid high school playing a 1500 student giant in the playoffs. Seems to work and several champions are crowned every year.

So, aside from "That will never work here", why isn't there a playoff system in place for College football? Please don't say "Money"...can you just imagine the amount of cash a "Final Four" would pull?
 
Face it...without a true playoff system, the true #1 will always be a question.

Honestly, we're not asking for the moon here...16 teams settles the issue in just four games...32 takes you to 5 games.

Absolutely!

The FCS has a fantastic 16 team playoff. It's far more exciting than the myriad of FBS bowl games. Take the 11 conference champions and 5 at large teams and have at it. Anyone outside the playoffs can populate the remaining bowls.
 
Absolutely!

The FCS has a fantastic 16 team playoff. It's far more exciting than the myriad of FBS bowl games. Take the 11 conference champions and 5 at large teams and have at it. Anyone outside the playoffs can populate the remaining bowls.

I would support any playoff system with 4 or more teams. 16 would be ideal. I can't see any team outside of the top 16 winning 4 games in a 16 team playoff. So, even though we would have crying for those who didn't make it, at least we would have a true national champion.

As a side note, I would also be in favor of athletes receiving up to $200k per year in scholarship money. If they had that, more athletes would probably stay for 4-5 years.

Since we are at it, we should abolish the NCAA, too.
 
There are many reasons why it has not happened.

-it would take away from the regular season. The way it is now every week is a playoff
-Money
-who would decide who gets in. Larely the SEC would deserve 3 of the 8 spots
-a 16 or 32 team tournament would include too many underserving teams and take too long
-the athletes are still students and need to go to class, more games means more injuries
-would not be fair to send Maimi, Florida, USC to go play in Madison, AA, Boise, and other places to the chance to play for the NC in a dome.
-too hard for teams and fans to not know where they are travelling to a week before the game. (Schools are located farther apart then they are in Ohio)
-would take away from the bowl games. This year there will be 35? bowl games which people will watch. Who would want to see 2 teams that already lost in the playoffs meet up in a bowl game.
-controversy is good. Before the season starts till after it ends everyone is talking about who is number 1
-current system encourages teams to schedule ooc games that will get them to the National Championship
-Conference Championship is more in college then high school football.
maybe have the non AQ schools play each other for a spot in the BCS. This could include the Little East.

As far as Boise being #1 I do not see it. But it does not matter what they are in October. A #1 is usually not passed without losing but in this case they will be by a bunch of teams.

I can see Nebraska, Auburn/LSU, Alabama, Ohio State, Oregon, Oklahoma, Michigan State, USC and even TCU getting ahead of them before they start elimating each other.
 
Realistically, in any given year, there's probably only about 8-10 teams that have a legitimate chance to win it all. But with 11 conferences, I'd rather include a few "dark horses" from the lesser name conferences, and allow for the bigger name conferences to have multiple teams included via at large berths. Much like March Madness, in that respect.

Who wouldn't like to see the MAC champion upset the SEC champion? Or the Sun Belt champion knock off the Pac-10 champion? I think it would be very compelling.

In general, there's only two things I care about on this topic. Give every team access, and settle it on the field.
 
Realistically, in any given year, there's probably only about 8-10 teams that have a legitimate chance to win it all. But with 11 conferences, I'd rather include a few "dark horses" from the lesser name conferences, and allow for the bigger name conferences to have multiple teams included via at large berths. Much like March Madness, in that respect.

Who wouldn't like to see the MAC champion upset the SEC champion? Or the Sun Belt champion knock off the Pac-10 champion? I think it would be very compelling.

In general, there's only two things I care about on this topic. Give every team access, and settle it on the field.

That would just be cruel.

The "dark horses" have the choice to schedule better teams during the season if they want a chance and not lose other games. I doubt the kids, coaches, AD and fans of those schools would want to go up against Alabama one week and if they had a miracle and won they would have to face LSU and then if they won they would have to face Ohio State and if they won they could play for the NC.

That tournment would just give us a tournament winner and not neccessarily the best team in the country. 13 or 14 games is a better indicator of who the best team in the country is.
 
There are many reasons why it has not happened.

-it would take away from the regular season. The way it is now every week is a playoff
-Money
-who would decide who gets in. Larely the SEC would deserve 3 of the 8 spots
-a 16 or 32 team tournament would include too many underserving teams and take too long
-the athletes are still students and need to go to class, more games means more injuries
-would not be fair to send Maimi, Florida, USC to go play in Madison, AA, Boise, and other places to the chance to play for the NC in a dome.
-too hard for teams and fans to not know where they are travelling to a week before the game. (Schools are located farther apart then they are in Ohio)
-would take away from the bowl games. This year there will be 35? bowl games which people will watch. Who would want to see 2 teams that already lost in the playoffs meet up in a bowl game.
-controversy is good. Before the season starts till after it ends everyone is talking about who is number 1
-current system encourages teams to schedule ooc games that will get them to the National Championship
-Conference Championship is more in college then high school football.
maybe have the non AQ schools play each other for a spot in the BCS. This could include the Little East.

As far as Boise being #1 I do not see it. But it does not matter what they are in October. A #1 is usually not passed without losing but in this case they will be by a bunch of teams.

I can see Nebraska, Auburn/LSU, Alabama, Ohio State, Oregon, Oklahoma, Michigan State, USC and even TCU getting ahead of them before they start elimating each other.

One answer to all of your points: It works in the FCS. Perfectly, I might add.
 
Maybe BSU will win back to back national championships. After all, weren't they the Idaho Falls Online News National Champion last year?

Until we have a playoff system, IMO all these national champion polls really mean about the same.

Even though I'm a huge Clemson fan, I love routing for the little guys and I love seeing them show up on the road (because the big schools will never go to their stadium/home to play them) and kicking a big school in the mouth.
 
That tournment would just give us a tournament winner and not neccessarily the best team in the country. 13 or 14 games is a better indicator of who the best team in the country is.

Which, of course, explains perfectly why the NFL, NBA, NHL, MLB, etc, etc, etc have post-season playoffs to determine their respective champions. Then again, who watches the Super Bowl????? :rolleyes:
 
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Which, of course, explains perfectly why the NFL, NBA, NHL MLB, etc, etc, etc have post season playoffs to determine their respective champions. Then again, who watches the Super Bowl????? :rolleyes:

NFL playoffs are home games for one team, and all NFL teams have large stadiums and large numbers of season ticket holders. To have a big playoff system in college at neutral sites would be tough on fans as AM1 said. To have them at home stadiums would require the stadiums to be on notice from week to week whether they were hosting a game the following week depending on the final score, and depending on which team won in each game. Bowl games are set in December and plans can easily be made for the ONE big post season game your team will play in.

For post season away games fans have to make room reservations, plane flights, take off work, and yet if you lose the reservations for the next game are worthless and many flights and rooms are non refundable. If you win a game you didn't think you would win then you can't get reservations and/or off of work.

Pro teams can fill the stands with the home ticket season holders who get the majority of the playoff tickets and fill in remaining seats with a few opposing fans that can make the trip. College teams could fill their home stadiums too, but how to decide which team gets to have the game at their home stadium? Where will the first 16 games be played? Who gets home field advantage? After 16 teams become 8, which of the 8 get to play at their home field, get the home revenue, the home field advantage? Biggest stadium? Biggest average attendance? Top ranking based on votes?

Imagine trying to get Boise State versus Utah if the regional playoff game was at the Rose bowl and filling the stadium. There is no way that 90,000 fans would make plans to be there for game 2 of 4 hoping their team wins game one. how many would make game one hoping to see game 3 or 4? At home Utah only gets 46,000 to attend and Boise's all time attendance record was 30,900. People will not fly to games in larger numbers than they can drive to. Many fans who drive to all of the home games NEVER attend an away game. Perhaps the majority will make the trip to their one and only post season bowl game, with a month to make plans, but how many will be packed and ready to cross the country 4 times if their teams makes it to the national championship. The winning teams will have 3 games added to their seasn. The top 8 will have 2 games added.


You can not compare basketball with top 63 teams included where a regional is played in a weekend and where teams can physically play a game every day for 3 days, and even 2 games in the same day if need be to football where one game a week is all the players can possibly play. Football is too physical. playing top teams week after week in the playoffs will wear the winning two teams out leaving many injured. College football having a big playoff after a long 12 (13 counting conference championship games) game season would be unfair to the players. The winning and losing championship teams would have played 17 games in a year. Too many games for amateur athletes, and it would extend the seasn far into january if not February.

If they take the top 4 teams and add one game to the winners season, that would be great. The top 8 teams would add 2 games to the final 2 team's season and an additional game to the top 4, and that might work. To have a 16 team playoff after 12 regular season games and a division championship game would be bad for players and fans.
 
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NFL playoffs are home games for one team, and all NFL teams have large stadiums and large numbers of season ticket holders. To have a big playoff system in college at neutral sites would be tough on fans as AM1 said. To have them at home stadiums would require the stadiums to be on notice from week to week whether they were hosting a game the following week depending on the final score, and depending on which team won in each game. Bowl games are set in December and plans can easily be made for the ONE big post season game your team will play in.

For post season away games fans have to make room reservations, plane flights, take off work, and yet if you lose the reservations for the next game are worthless and many flights and rooms are non refundable. If you win a game you didn't think you would win then you can't get reservations and/or off of work.

Pro teams can fill the stands with the home ticket season holders who get the majority of the playoff tickets and fill in remaining seats with a few opposing fans that can make the trip. College teams could fill their home stadiums too, but how to decide which team gets to have the game at their home stadium? Where will the first 16 games be played? Who gets home field advantage? After 16 teams become 8, which of the 8 get to play at their home field, get the home revenue, the home field advantage? Biggest stadium? Biggest average attendance? Top ranking based on votes?

Imagine trying to get Boise State versus Utah if the regional playoff game was at the Rose bowl and filling the stadium. There is no way that 90,000 fans would make plans to be there for game 2 of 4 hoping their team wins game one. how many would make game one hoping to see game 3 or 4? At home Utah only gets 46,000 to attend and Boise's all time attendance record was 30,900. People will not fly to games in larger numbers than they can drive to. Many fans who drive to all of the home games NEVER attend an away game. Perhaps the majority will make the trip to their ne and only post season bowl game, with a month to make plans, but how many will be packed and ready to cross the country 4 times if their teams makes it to the national championship. The winning teams will have 3 games added to their seasn. The top 8 will have 2 games added.


You can not compare basketball where a regional is played in a weekend and where teams can physically play a game a day for 3 days, and even 2 games in the same day if need be. Football is too physical. playing top teams week after week will wear the winning two teams out leaving many injured. College football having a big playoff after a long 12 (13 counting conference championship games) game season would be unfair to the players.

If they take the top 4 teams and add one game to the winners season, that would be great. The top 8 teams would add 2 games to the final 2 team's season and an additional game to the top 4, and that might work. To have a 16 team playoff after 12 regular season games and a division championship game would be bad for players and fans.

Everything you mention is a factor in the FCS playoffs. Been there, done that. The FCS makes it work. Yes, fans travel on a week's notice. It's the nature of the beast.

In the FCS playoffs, typically the higher seed hosts. If that means 31,000 BSU fans in Bronco stadium or 101,000 Tide fans in Bryant-Denny to watch a BSU/Alabama quarter-final game, so be it. I'm positive Bronco stadium would sell out for such an event. Are you suggesting there wouldn't be a full house in Tuscaloosa for a playoff game?????

The semi-final games and championship can be held in regional destinations, if that's deemed to be more desirable. There can even be an off week between the quarter-final and semi-final games and another off week between the semi-final and championship games if need be. The playoffs would just need to start at the conclusion of the regular season. It already takes about 5 weeks from the conclusion of the regular season til the BCS championship game as it is. Do away with 1 regular season game, if need be. There's not a logistics issue that can't be solved if college football ever truly wants to decide a national champion. It's not rocket science. The FCS has proven that for many years running.
 
Even though I'm a huge Clemson fan, I love routing for the little guys and I love seeing them show up on the road (because the big schools will never go to their stadium/home to play them) and kicking a big school in the mouth.

Is it that the big schools WON'T go to the little stadiums, or that the little schools make more money going to the big school's home turf? Ohio State pays big bucks to the little schools for them to come to their turf and get their butt kicked. And every once in awhile the little guys DO win. It is probably a win/win for both, OSU makes way more money at their house than they do at someone else's, and the little schools probably get PAID way more money than they ever would make on their home turf.
 
For those of you unsure of how a playoff might work, here's a brief description of the FCS playoffs (from wikipedia):

When Division I-AA was formed for football in 1978, the playoffs included just four teams, doubling to eight teams in its fourth season of 1981. In 1982 the I-AA playoffs were expanded to 12 teams, with each of the top four seeds receiving a first-round bye and a home game in the quarterfinals. In its ninth season of 1986, the I-AA playoffs were expanded again to a 16-team format, requiring four post-season victories to win the title. Eight conference champions received automatic bids, with the remaining eight bids available on an at-large basis. The field is traditionally set the Sunday before Thanksgiving and play begins that weekend. The top four teams are seeded, however, the matchups are not strictly set up by these seedings as geographic considerations are also taken into account to minimize travel. In April 2008 the NCAA announced that the playoff field would again expand to include 20 teams beginning in 2010. At the same time, it announced that the number of conferences receiving automatic bids would increase to 10.[3]

The tournament has historically been played in November and December; with the latest expansion to a 20-team field, the championship game will move from December to January.
 
Everything you mention is a factor in the FCS playoffs. Been there, done that. The FCS makes it work. Yes, fans travel on a week's notice. It's the nature of the beast.

In the FCS playoffs, typically the higher seed hosts. If that means 31,000 BSU fans in Bronco stadium or 101,000 Tide fans in Bryant-Denny to watch a BSU/Alabama quarter-final game, so be it. I'm positive Bronco stadium would sell out for such an event. Are you suggesting there wouldn't be a full house in Tuscaloosa for a playoff game?????

The semi-final games and championship can be held in regional destinations, if that's deemed to be more desirable. There can even be an off week between the quarter-final and semi-final games and another off week between the semi-final and championship games if need be. The playoffs would just need to start at the conclusion of the regular season. It already takes about 5 weeks from the conclusion of the regular season til the BCS championship game as it is. Do away with 1 regular season game, if need be. There's not a logistics issue that can't be solved if college football ever truly wants to decide a national champion. It's not rocket science. The FCS has proven that for many years running.

16 teams in a playoff means that 15 of 16 teams end their season and possibly college career on a loss. With 35 bowl games, 35 teams end their seasons with a victory including 8 of the top 16 teams. That is nice for the fans and the amateur athletes to end on a winning game.

So if boise State has zero losses and Bama has one and is the lowest seed, the game will be played at at Boise and I guess Bama will only get 5000 of 30,000 total available tickets? That is not counting the 5000 or more tickets the sponsors and TV stations will get. Perhaps Boise fans get 20,000, bama 5000, and sponsors 5000 tickets? The total number of tickets to a playoff game would be less than the attendance of the lowest attended SEC regular season game, and that is good? No way is that fair to the fans who can't attend or the players who don't get to play a huge game in front of 80,000 to 100,000 screaming fans. Some hgh school games in Texas have attendance approaching or exceeding 30,000.

Of course they could do it, but would it be better? Not 16 or even 8teams in my opinion would be good for college football. I say take the top 4 and that is it. Play one quarter final game in the Sugar Bowl and one in the Orange Bowl. Let the winners play for it all in the Rose Bowl. That only adds one game to the top 2 teams and keeps the current bowl system in effect for the other 32 bowls.

If after 13 games you can't be ranked one of the top 4, you don't deserve a shot at the national championship. There will always be an argument that 5th place was cheated just like 8 teams will have the 9th place team feeling they deserved a shot, and just like the 17th placed team in a 16 tournament would feel slighted. Be good enough to make top 4 or enjoy your bowl game and don't worry about the national championship.


One big game or 2 will draw the fans. Having to travel all over the US to watch your team play week after week in post season action will dilute the fan base. I went to the Sugar Bowl and SEC game in 2008-2009. I went to the National Championship game in 2010. I might go to a bowl this year depending on where it is. It is not worth the expense or time off work to personally go to Miami or Pasadena after making 2 bowl games in a row. I will go to the SEC Championship if we make it. If we go to Arizona for the national championship game I will be there. Other than that I have made 7 home games and 2 away games this year already, and 2 bowls and one SEC Championship in the last 2 years. I am done. If we were undefeated and there was a playoff of 16 teams I would not try to make all 4 playoff games unless they were all in Tuscaloosa, in fact if I made one playoff game it would of course be the finals. Unless your kid plays on the team few would attend all 4 playoff games spread all around the country.

Too many games reduces the importance of each game. Make it top 4 and you get the excitement of the NCAA final 4 without wearing the fans and players out with too many additional games and too much travel and exense.

I know you think the FCS has been great but the facts are the facts. the attendance at the FCS games has been in a steady decline for the last several years. In 1992 there were 31,304 in attendance, in 1993 there were 29,200, in 1994 there were 27,674, in 1995 there were 32,000, in 1996 there were 30,053, in 1997 there were 14,771. there were a couple of years where the attendance reached 20,000 in the 2000's, but most were less than 20,000 with the 2001 and 2002 games having a whopping 12,000 fans in attendance.


The attendance for the 2009 FCS championship game was only 14,328 and it was played in Chatanooga which is a short drive for Appalachian State who were defending champs. the top 10 highs school attendance records in Texas are 36,000 to 50,000 (http://www.txprepsfootball.com/history.html ) Alabama had 90,000 show up for the spring game which is a glorified practice. I don't think many true football fans would consider attendance of 14,328 for the FCS national championship game a success.
 
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*shrug....nearly every bowl game is a traveling game for each of the teams playing.

I see no reason for it to have 16 teams, its not like the 16th place team is likely more deserving to be in the playoffs vs the 8th ranked team.

top 8, 2 extra games...both of which would be happily participated in by the schools.

the remaining top 25 (from 9 to 25) can enjoy their bowl games for their fans.
 
One answer to all of your points: It works in the FCS. Perfectly, I might add.

If playing an afterthought championship in front of 22 000 people is considered perfect then I guess you are right. 1AA teams with any ambition would do anything to move up so they can play with the big boys.


Which, of course, explains perfectly why the NFL, NBA, NHL, MLB, etc, etc, etc have post-season playoffs to determine their respective champions. Then again, who watches the Super Bowl????? :rolleyes:

The NBA, NHL, MLB all have best of series to determine who moves on. That is not practical in college football.

If a playoff was such a good idea then it would already been implemened. As it is really all about money.

We can agree to disagree and I will enjoy watching the bowl games.
 
*shrug....nearly every bowl game is a traveling game for each of the teams playing.

Traveling to an away bowl game is not a problem. Traveling to 2, 3, or 4 away playoff games after attending 7 to 12 regular season home and away games and an away conference championship is draining both physically and financially. It will deter all but the most diehard fans from attending, especially if the distances require air travel.

The National Championship game in Pasadensa with room, air fare, car rental, tickets, meals, etc was over $3500 for myself and my wife. I don't have 2, 3, or 4 of those expensive trips in my budget each year. Plus it took 3 vacation days for me to attend the game. I couldn't take 2 or 3 days off work a week for 2, 3, or 4 straight weeks, much less last minute after I find out if we win or not. If it was a rare occassion perhaps, but for Florida, Ohio State, Bama, Texas, Boise State, Oklahoma, USC, etc who would qualify for a 16 team tourney most years it would quickly lose it's value. Going to one of the 4 BCS bowls is a rare event for most teams, so when it happens spend the money and go. If it became an annual event I would simply watch it on TV rather than spend 1000's to attend because it would no longer be a big deal.
 
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Traveling to an away bowl game is not a problem. Traveling to 2, 3, or 4 away playoff games after attending 7 to 12 regular season home and away games and an away conference championship is draining both physically and financially. It will deter all but the most diehard fans from attending, especially if the distances require air travel.

The National Championship game in Pasadensa with room, air fare, car rental, tickets, meals, etc was over $3500 for myself and my wife. I don't have 2, 3, or 4 of those expensive trips in my budget each year. If it was a rare occassion perhaps, but for Florida, Ohio State, Bama, Texas, Boise State, Oklahoma, USC, etc who would qualify for a 16 team tourney most years it would quickly lose it's value. Going to one of the 4 BCS bowls is not an annual event for most teams, so when it happens spend the money and go. If it became an annual event I would simply watch it on TV because it would no longer be a big deal.

I don't think anyone expects you to travel to 4 games. Realistically, if your team makes it to the championship, they're likely going to be hosting one or more of the games. Regardless, nobody is counting on "away" fans to fill the stadiums. I feel very confident (from experience) that the home fans will come out to see their team in a national championship playoff game.

BTW, almost every away game out west implies air travel.
 
With the BCS championship game now almost alway about a week after most of the Jan 1 games. ( which I hate!!) I'd love to see the NCAA have a two game playoff. the top 4 teams pay on Jan 1 then the Championship game 1 week later.
 
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