[2008] Festiva is now managing my resort, how bad is it going to get?

[tombo]

Nothing has been said here that can't be refuted by a company rep if we are mistaken and posting erroneous statements or half truths. I was hoping some pertinent facts would be presented to make me feel better about them managing our resort, but so far no relevant facts have been presented that make me feel better. I was told that the wait times for customer service were down to 4 minutes. I called Festiva's 800 number Thursday to ask about my account and I was on hold for 30 minutes. I was hoping she would say that we will have a vote or input as to whether we want to refurbish OUR resort by being ASSESSED rather than having Festiva decide to refurbish and assess for us. No response yet but I am waiting. I was hoping she would tell us that MF increases weren't coming, but once again no response. I was hoping she would answer about possibly changing their proposed outdoor pool at their new planned development at BRV to an indoor pool because of the short season at 4100 ft altitude. I was hoping she might answer why Festiva puts so many employees on the HOA's, because I don't own at another resort (out of over 20) that has a single developer/mgt co employee on a single HOA. Myself and others have these and more pertinent questions we want to ask her in a civil, professional manner. I look forward to her continued interaction with us, Festiva owners, about our concerns and hopes for the future of our resorts.

Just wondering, what kind of reception should we have given her? After she showed up should we have started saying we love Festiva? Should we lie and say we only have a very few minor problems with their mgt, but overall it is great? If a Westgate rep shows up on a Westgate thread, should everyone quit posting their true (negative) feelings about how they feel they are treated as owners? No one was rude to the rep. Everyone (including myself) said we welcomed her input but that we wanted answers to questions about how they were running our resorts and what (if any) rights we were going to have as owners. She said herself that she expected to be asked hard pertinent questions and that she didn't take our grievances personally. She also said that if we didn't hear responses from her for a while it would be because she was researching our questions to give us the right answers. If she doesn't return I don't think it will be because of the way she was treated, I think it will be because after researching her facts she will have nothing to say that we want to hear, or even worse nothing Festiva wants to put in writing.

I started this thread because I wanted to hear from people who had been Festiva owners for several years how bad it was going to get at my resort because I hadn't read a single positive response about Festiva anywhere on TUG. The annual meeting at BRV where an officer of Festiva stood and said we can do whatever we want in Phase 2 because we control 80% of the vote did not give me the feeling that they cared about the owner's wishes at all. I still haven't read a positive response about Festiva other than from the rep. Festiva Rep has a chance through diclosure and candor on this forum to change that perception. I welcome her responses with facts that will show that they are actually commited to their owners rather than totally looking for ways to make money at the owner's expense.

 

[dmbrand]

Currently at the Tamarack in the Dells...

We purchased this unit sight unseen during the Wyndham to Festiva transition in 2007. I have watched threads concerning Festiva over the past 6 months, anticipating the worst, as our vacation got closer. So far, so good for our situation. This resort is a very pleasant surprise; well kept unit and grounds. The sales office is not in operation as of this time, so I don't think we will be contacted during this week. We are off for a day of activities, but if anyone has any questions, I will check back here at night.
Dawn

 

[JLB]

Same here, m/l. In my comments about them I am just the messenger, delivering the feelings/experiences of others I have contact with. Pretty much what the Internet is all about, gossip/inuendo/repeating other reports, etc.

Sort of. I've never had to deal with them or stay in one of their resorts. So I'm neutral about the good or bad they represent. They are not on my list to try so my opinion should remain as is. I don't know if thats really positive but at least it isn't negative.

 

[JLB]

I believe she will be back.

Unless, like other official representatives who have tried using the Internet to further their cause, the legal department puts an end to it, after weighing the pros and cons.

Given the things MsFestiva has said so far, acknowledging the need to do some repair work and improve image, things in this threads indicate that that is correct, that Festiva understand they have a problem they need to work on.

That's a first step most in the industry have not taken.

There is a lot of this in the timeshare world . . . we really need to improve our image . . . but the problem is in how to do that.

JMHO, but I believe it is in the way each and every rep conducts themselves with each and every consumer contact, not by letting that go on as always and then try to put a spin on it. Electronic communication being so prolific and immediate, each account of abuse in daily operations goes a long way to undo PR efforts.

Until the character and nature of the timeshare industry makes that change, and an amount of time passes so that that change is apparent, nothing will really change.

The rub I see is that the type of people it would take to do that are so repulsed by the industry that it will never happen. In a casual social setting with another TUGger couple and their neighbor last night, discussing another (unsavory) neighbor who sells timeshares here, someone said, why don't you sell them? The other TUGger and I, both with sales backgrounds, both agreed that we could never do that . . . go to work to try to get $25K out of people, so we could put $5K or so of it in our pockets, knowing that folks who already own can't even get a buck for the same thing on the Internet.

There are some serious, deep-seated problems with the industry that time and exposure will only make worse.

I believe most in the industry believe that trying to address those problems puts a focus on it, making it worse, drawing even more attention to the bad that is being done, so that their PR efforts wind up doing more harm than good.

JMHO.

Given the her reception so far, I wouldn't think so.

And, that's too bad. It can be useful to have someone like that willing to participate, but we tend to run them off with torches lit.

 

[JLB]

In line with that last post, as a practical example, what is Festiva doing about resales? What efforts are being made to assist owners who wish to sell, so that they will get something approaching what thay paid when they bought?

 

[bnoble]

There is a difference between reasoned discussion and attack. To be fair, most of the posts here have been pretty tame compred to some of the stuff we threw Madge's way.

You have to understand that a company rep is not going to do anything beyond, let alone contradicting, the company line. Despite that, it is useful to have a conduit for our concerns, as well as some insight behind the curtain. So, if you want to keep such reps around, you do have to be a bit more circumspect in your posts. If you don't, then don't worry about it. She may stay anyway, but few others have.

Asking this:

what is Festiva doing about resales? What efforts are being made to assist owners who wish to sell, so that they will get something approaching what thay paid when they bought?

is going to only raise the issue, but you sure as heck aren't going to get a response that we haven't already heard rumblings of on streettalk, etc.

 

[bnoble]

Here's another way of saying what I'm trying to get across:

We all have lots of frustrations---large and small---with the way the timeshare industry operates, and particularly how developers operate. A company rep is not going to change any of these in the short run, and it's worth distinguishing asking for information/insight and raising awareness of issues from a much less productive venting now that we finally have "one of them" here.

Not drawing that distinction reduces value for all of us. For example, I'm of the opinion that no longer having Madge here is to our detriment.

 

[tombo]

Festiva announced at the annual meeting that they will take back owner's weeks for free. That means the developer on one hand is saying that the units are worth little or nothing, but when they own the same week they got for free it will magically become worth $15000 to $20,000. I don't think that qualifies as helping the owners sell their weeks.

In the past you were able to tell the office you wanted to sell your week and they would try to help you sell your week. My first week purchased here was from the office telling me that Joe Doe wanted to sell week xyz, and here is his phone number( I was staying on RCI trade and asked if they had any resales). Recently I called the office and said if things get too bad I might see if ya'll can help me sell my weeks. I was told that Festiva heard that they had been doing that in the past and told them that they were not allowed to do that anymore. They said if an owner wanted to sell his week his name should be given to Festiva and no one else. I feel sure from the annual meeting that means they will offer to take the week for free.

JLB I think this will answer your question about what they are doing to help the owner's sell their weeks, nothing. I n fact they aren't only not helping owners sell weeks, they are preventing them from selling weeks in a manner which has been done at BRV for years.

 

[somerville]

Given the her reception so far, I wouldn't think so.

And, that's too bad. It can be useful to have someone like that willing to participate, but we tend to run them off with torches lit.

Not necessarily too bad. The only Festiva owners on this forum do not have a lot of positive things to say about Festiva at this time. If her purpose is to spin a favorable impression of Festiva, without acknowledging problems or attempting to resolve them, then she is just using the forum for the purpose of marketing Festiva. If that is the case, we are better off without her participation. JMHO

 

[JLB]

I ask the resale question because it is a good litmus test. If there is nothing in the offing for that inherenet weakness in the industry, there is really nothing new being offeredl.

Owners are still on their own, once their money is taken. Perhaps that is why those who have timeshares are called owners.

I am still waiting for a timeshare company to come up with a real solution, like when an exisiting owner notifies us that they wish to sell, we will add that week into our retail inventory, and sell it for them for full retail, taking just a small administrative fee, because we have already made our commissions and profit on it once.

Don't hold your breath.

 

[gravityrules]

...

Owners are still on their own, once their money is taken. Perhaps that is why those who have timeshares are called owners.
...

For the sake of discussion, are you really an 'owner' if you've bought into a points program where you have no deeded property? Aren't you really just a 'member'? Is that part of the explanation of why the 'members' have no say in assessments, etc? Diamond seems to be set up that way with the 'trust' actually holding title (and presumably voting rights) to the property. Is Festiva's points program structured similarly?

 

[somerville]

For the sake of discussion, are you really an 'owner' if you've bought into a points program where you have no deeded property? Aren't you really just a 'member'? Is that part of the explanation of why the 'members' have no say in assessments, etc? Diamond seems to be set up that way with the 'trust' actually holding title (and presumably voting rights) to the property. Is Festiva's points program structured similarly?

You have to understand that Festiva has both points and deeded weeks owners, plus all of the orphaned Equivest Vacation and Travel Club members. So if you want to distinguish between owners and members, Festiva has both. I am a member and Tombo is an owner. Tombo's problem is that he owns a deeded week in a phase of Blue Ridge Village that has a majority of intervals in the points program (Festiva Adventure Club), and Festiva management told him at an annual owners meeting that Festiva had total say in that phase of the resort. The other deeded weeks owners were out of luck.

Yes, Festiva Adventure Club intervals are supposed to be held in a trust for the benefit of "members". However, members have no voting rights in the club to elect officers or directors, so Festiva management has total control. Since Festiva controls the voting rights of all those intervals, where it has a majority of votes at an annual HOA meeting, it can elect all of the board members and control the resort.

 

[gravityrules]

It seems to me that a developer could pool all un-sold inventory in the 'club' (newly developed, defaulted, and owner give-backs) with whatever is already 'club' or points inventory from sales and retain control of the development indefinitely. That's quite a clever way to never have to deal with those annoying HOAs. If you also have a management arm, how convenient that you never have to account to the 'owners' or 'members'. The existing 'members' can be the cash cow to fund the 'enhancements' and 'expansions' necessary to fuel the ongoing developer sales. There's an inherent assumption in this business model, i.e. 'the developer knows best'. Perhaps companies that excel in customer support and satisfaction can convince 'member's of this; for companies that are not so customer focused, it's not much of a stretch to see that this business model can lead to an utter disdain for members or owners once the sale is made.

 

[abdibile]

I bought a Atlantic Beach Villas week that is now managed by Festiva.

They where fast charging the $ 75 resort transfer fee from my credit card after receiving a copy of the deed an told me that I am not in their accounting system as an owner.

But I could not prepay 2009 maintenance fees to deposit with II because I was not in their reservation system as an owner.

This is the situation since more than 5 weeks.

Does that feel right?

Any experience in this regards?

Thanks!

 

[tombo]

Gravity Rules description is exactly how I see Festiva operating. The current owners pay to upgrade the resort and it's amenities so Festiva has more valuable points to sell. Festiva wants granite countertops because it will help them sell more points, so they assess the owners. Festiva wants new furniture, new paint, repaved roads, or any other thing they think will help it sell more points and they assess again. The owners can pay the assessments, sell their weeks/points, or give them back to the developer. Unfortunately, there is no vote taken to see if the owners (who actually pay for the improvements) want to refurbish or not. I wouldn't mind if there was a vote and the majority of owners said let's refurbish. I would vote against refurbishing personally, but I would have no problem paying the assessment that was voted for and passed by the people paying for the renovations. If owners had a vote it would be based on estimated costs presented by the home OWNERS association, allowing an informed decision after weighing the costs versus the benefits.

With the developer in charge of the resort they will want the best of everything (landscaping, amenities, furnishing, etc) to make their points sell easier. The upside is the resort will be maintained well. The huge downside is that there is no one in charge who is looking out for the owners rights or expenses. Assessments can be levied at will and at any amount the developer chooses with the owners not having any choice in the matter. If the mgt company at your resort is not keeping costs under control, you can't change companies because the developer is the Mgt company. If the staff is unfriendly or unresponsive to owners needs, too bad because the HOA is controlled by the developer, and the developer is the Mgt company.

I am not sure if the "owners" of Festiva points even own their weeks. Someone said earlier that many points organizations are right to use. I can't imagine why anyone would buy at a resort like this if they were in possession of the facts that they would have no votes on how their resort is managed, no votes on the budget or management company at their resort, and if they knew that they will end up as a member with a right to use week (no ownership in the resort) that they have no control over whatsoever. If you aren't going to own or have any rights as an owner, why not rent and save the outlay required to purchase? Neither a renter or "owner" will have any say so in the operation of the resort, but at least the renter can just stop renting if expenses get too high, and a renter will never be assessed.

 

[bnoble]

This is the situation since more than 5 weeks.

Does that feel right?

Any experience in this regards?

They can be very slow in getting a transfer done. To speed things along, I found it helpful to find out who in legal handled my resort, and called them approximately once a week until the transfer went through. It took about 2-3 calls.

 

[FestivaRep]

back on the board

Just an update since there's been some speculation...

I've been out of the office for the last five days, and I'm catching up on the threads, as well as a few hundred e-mails and my other job responsibilities. I have not disappeared from the board, but I may not be on actively again until later in the week.

Thanks...

Also, just an FYI RE: getting in touch with Owner Services / hold time- If you call at noon or near lunchtime, the hold time will inevitably be longer than it is earlier in the morning or later in the afternoon as there are more people trying to get through during this time. Different times of day are busier than others, and sometimes it's a game of chance just as it is when you call your cable company, electric company, etc. Their hold time has improved greatly since January, but as with any call center or customer service department, the call volume varies depending on the day of the week as well as the time of day.

 

[FestivaRep]

RE: Annual Report

I did not receive the annual report. Several Equivest owners mentioned the annual report on the Yahoo group. I assumed that it was something just sent out to Equivest Vacation and Travel Club members, and since I converted to Festiva Adventure Club last year and didn't get one, I was not surprised. The group comments I read about the report were that it provided very little financial information. Is there a reason that Festiva cannot provide detailed financial statement to members, so that they can understand how their maintenance/membership fees are being spent?

If you did not receive an Annual Report, you can contact the Owner Services department and they will send you one, or you can send an e-mail to myemail@festivaresorts.com to request one.

The reason we do not provide financial information in our annual report is because we are a privately held company and are not required to publish such information. Also, each year the maintenance fee invoice for each resort and/or club details how said fees are being spent.

 

[FestivaRep]

Given many timeshare owners experiences with timeshare salesmen, outlandish statements appear to be the norm, not the exception. So statements that you consider outlandish may in fact be true.

Actually, those that he attacked were not our salespeople, they were employees of the corporate office that this member never actually met personally.

 

[FestivaRep]

Not necessarily too bad. The only Festiva owners on this forum do not have a lot of positive things to say about Festiva at this time. If her purpose is to spin a favorable impression of Festiva, without acknowledging problems or attempting to resolve them, then she is just using the forum for the purpose of marketing Festiva. If that is the case, we are better off without her participation. JMHO

I will copy/paste below from a previous post about why I am here. I do not work for our sales and/or marketing division and am not here to promote Festiva. We do hope to acknowledge problems and attempt to resolve them on this forum; however, keep in mind that this is not something that can happen overnight. It will take time for me to organize your concerns, address them to the appropriate people and/or departments and provide a response and/or solution. In all honesty, you may not like the response or solution to every single issue, but I will do my best to provide as many facts as I can so that you can have a better understanding of the reason(s) why certain things happen.

The reason I am here is because (1) we are looking for ways to expand and improve our customer service and (2) our executives believe that it's important for us to become more involved in Online discussions about Festiva and timesharing in general, and we are looking for ways to utilize different Web media that are available today. Me joining this forum is one of our first steps in this endeavor. The goals we hope to achieve through this forum include listening to your concerns and providing factual information to help you better understand where we are coming from as well as dispelling any rumors or 'gossip' that may surface.

 

[somerville]

Actually, those that he attacked were not our salespeople, they were employees of the corporate office that this member never actually met personally.

I never said they were timeshare salespeople You have misquoted me. I said that many timeshare salesmen make outrageous statements, so that what was alleged could have in fact had an element of truth. Can you assure me that Festiva salesmen or contractors NEVER misrepresent the facts?

 

[somerville]

Also, just an FYI RE: getting in touch with Owner Services / hold time- If you call at noon or near lunchtime, the hold time will inevitably be longer than it is earlier in the morning or later in the afternoon as there are more people trying to get through during this time. Different times of day are busier than others, and sometimes it's a game of chance just as it is when you call your cable company, electric company, etc. Their hold time has improved greatly since January, but as with any call center or customer service department, the call volume varies depending on the day of the week as well as the time of day.

Since there are 5 time zones in the US, which Noon or lunch hour are you referring to?

Why don't you tell us what times of day are the best to call, since you appear to have the statistics?

 

[somerville]

The reason we do not provide financial information in our annual report is because we are a privately held company and are not required to publish such information. Also, each year the maintenance fee invoice for each resort and/or club details how said fees are being spent.

No one asked for your financial information. Members want to see how THEIR funds are collected and spent (in detail). I am told that basic information was lacking from your report.

 

[somerville]

I will copy/paste below from a previous post about why I am here. I do not work for our sales and/or marketing division and am not here to promote Festiva. We do hope to acknowledge problems and attempt to resolve them on this forum; however, keep in mind that this is not something that can happen overnight. It will take time for me to organize your concerns, address them to the appropriate people and/or departments and provide a response and/or solution. In all honesty, you may not like the response or solution to every single issue, but I will do my best to provide as many facts as I can so that you can have a better understanding of the reason(s) why certain things happen.

The reason I am here is because (1) we are looking for ways to expand and improve our customer service and (2) our executives believe that it's important for us to become more involved in Online discussions about Festiva and timesharing in general, and we are looking for ways to utilize different Web media that are available today. Me joining this forum is one of our first steps in this endeavor. The goals we hope to achieve through this forum include listening to your concerns and providing factual information to help you better understand where we are coming from as well as dispelling any rumors or 'gossip' that may surface.

So far we haven't seen many facts come from Festiva. There are a number of questions/comments on this thread that remain unanswered. I will reserve judment on whether Festiva's participation in this forum is beneficial until you have been given a resonable time to address these issues.

 

[jercal10]

Guys: like it or not, Festiva is managing your resort. Why not give the rep a chance , and be civil??? We are certainly not going to gain anything by not being civil. But maybe blowing off steam is what makes you tick. If so, good luck!!!!