Tuesday Timeshare Recap - Live! a new TUG series!

[pedro47]

TUGBRIAN, The closed caption was not highlighted/turned on, on this video segment.

 

[TUGBrian]

the captions are only available in the pre-recorded videos I do not the live streams unfortunately.

they are added in after the fact by the video editing software I use.

the "built in" captions for youtube may take some time (if ever) to show up on a video like that!

 

[pedro47]

Thanks for your reply.

 

[TUGBrian]

the google generated subtitles now show up for the most recent video! I take no credit for however google auto-generated the text =D

 

[Double U]

Incredibly boring (joking ). Unless you're a timeshare nerd like me!!! Wow! That was awesome! So educational!

So much research. So much data. Backed by facts. It gave me a broader understanding of the industry as a whole. Never got bored, watched it to the end. Thank you for sharing this!!!

 

[TUGBrian]

talking about timeshares for an hour is certainly more challenging than youd imagine! I was spoiled making 3 to 5 minute videos thats for sure!

Thank you for watching!

 

[TUGBrian]

sadly had a meeting that ran WAY long this evening, bit late to kick things off now so ill be live tomorrow night for this weeks recap!! will post a link tomorrow afternoon!

 

[TUGBrian]

tune in live tonight at 9pm eastern!

 

[TUGBrian]

5minutes away! lets see if the streaming software will work this time so i can share the screen and comments etc.

 

[TUGBrian]

thanks to all who tuned in, will PROMISE to be at the regular time next tuesday at 9pm!

I love the ability to share my screen so everyone can follow along with my ramblings now! gotta be better than just staring at my beard!

for anyone who missed it, you can watch all the livestream recaps using the same links above! (and I add chapter markers so you can scroll to the topic you want to hear!)

 

[TUGBrian]

still good for tomorrow night at 9pm! will post a link later today but if you subscribe to the channel it should alert you!

Timeshare Users Group

This is the official YouTube page of the Timeshare Users Group http://www.tug2.net. This is for hosting videos by TUG to help educate Timeshare owners and anyone interested in the Timesharing Concept. TUG is a veteran founded, family owned/run consumer advocacy organization that has been...

www.youtube.com

 

[Dilarm]

Would you provide a link to get the newsletter?

 

[TUGBrian]

livestream in about an hour!

 

[TUGBrian]

Would you provide a link to get the newsletter?

https://us10.campaign-archive.com/home/?u=48c98492f283c46c419a8babb&id=9b7d949871

 

[TUGBrian]

edit, moved back to 1030, apparently my neighbors house is on fire! (not joking)

 

[TUGBrian]

well, didnt have that on my bingo card this evening, but im back and ready to go for 1030!

 

[TUGBrian]

thanks for all those who tuned in, even if it was 90min late! most viewers to date!

fingers crossed for no lightning strikes next tuesday! recap is available on the link above, I will add the chapters later this evening!

 

[TUGBrian]

added chapters, sorry for the delay! thanks for all who have watched, liked, subscribed!

recap

 

[TUGBrian]

one interesting factoid that came out of the livestream last night.

reported numbers for Interval International membership in 2025 is 1.5 million
only reported number I coudl find for RCI was during their 50th anniversary celebration touting 3.5 million members.

with these numbers, i want to say there were approximately 10 million households (in the us anyway) that own timeshares, this would mean that roughly half of all timeshare owners are members of either rci or ii?

 

[jp10558]

livestream in about an hour!

On the RCI / II question - I personally hope the competition would bring some of the fees down. I think there's a lot of benefit to independent resort access in RCI, mostly for those "in the know" but unless we think all the smaller systems and independents are going away in the next 10 years, I think there's still a draw. I'm in 2 of the "Big" systems, though only as resale. HGVC and Wyndham. There's limited locations for both, and I think both actually shrunk a bit or are shrinking. For a lot of locations, RCI or II is the only way other than owning or renting there. In terms of the "integrating systems" neither HGVC or Wyndham integrated the purchased systems, they have a mini exchange on a mini exchange, and with only 6 or 7 month booking. RCI doesn't have this limitation, heck sometimes in RCI you can book HGVC further out than I can as an owner. Then there's internationally - many of the mini systems don't really have a lot of international inventory whereas RCI certainly does. Maybe the US companies can cut themselves off from the rest of the world, but there's still a lot of stuff out there that's not ever going to be in a conglomerate.

If I had to guess, I think they're going to keep on keeping on for the next 10 years too. They have a number of different revenue streams and my main concern is the exchange fees are already too high. Here's an counter question - if RCI starts feeling like they're in trouble do they figure out how to lower the exchange fee? Or do they just shut down? And if they do lower the exchange fee, does that drive more deposits from any/all systems?

 

[TUGBrian]

good point, wonder what the stats are between exchanges....and the rentals/getaways/bonus weeks they offer instead over the last 10 years.

 

[dougp26364]

As to the membership numbers. There are some households that will have more than 1 membership depending upon the systems they own and the number of corporate memberships. We, for instance, have two II memberships. One corporate thru Marriott and one personal. We use to have both a personal RCI membership as well as a corporate membership thru HGVC. We dropped our personal RCI membership many years ago.

I wonder how much more dilute those numbers become when duplicate accounts are taken into consideration.

 

[jp10558]

As to the membership numbers. There are some households that will have more than 1 membership depending upon the systems they own and the number of corporate memberships. We, for instance, have two II memberships. One corporate thru Marriott and one personal. We use to have both a personal RCI membership as well as a corporate membership thru HGVC. We dropped our personal RCI membership many years ago.

I wonder how much more dilute those numbers become when duplicate accounts are taken into consideration.

Though from RCI/IIs POV, do they care if you've got 3 accounts or whatever as long as they get paid for each one? So far I also don't know all the logistics, but presumably the bulk exchange deposits from the mini systems are because someone in their systems are exchanging... or else wouldn't they be deposited as cash stays?

I also think there's some flimflamery going on with that 80% occupancy for TSs. It's certainly not owner occupancy - many people are renting from owners on AirB&B etc, many more are booking via the company websites, and plenty are booking via RCI/II cash deals. If the minisystems were filling everything then they wouldn't have inventory (or need) to deposit into the exchanges for cash. I wonder if they are doing more cash bookings than straight exchanges, and I also think at least some of that is driven by the extreme exchange fees.

I know via Trading Places Legacy that RCI apparently can offer $179 exchange fees vs $299 - unless Capital is subsidizing that for some reason. I know the mini systems manage exchanges for at most $80 (HGVC Legacy booking fee). Seems to me that the exchanges are so greedy that they're pricing themselves into a different market, primarily cash deals.

I don't think it's "safe" for RCI/II to become mostly cash deals though, because I think they could lose all access to the mini-systems that way - they'd just as soon rent out on Hilton.com as get an RCI Extra Vacation. But the "bundle" of exchange value and a more likely to book audience and just tradition might keep it going for a long time, as long as people still exchange OUT of HGVC etc.

I just figure RCI ought to realize that while an exchange might work for in the know people, for HGVC for instance the 2BR 7200 pts - averages around $1190 in MFs, plus $300 exchange fee, plus ~$100 resort fees - means they are only getting people desperate to use up points so they don't expire OR exchanges into places that you can't rent for less than ~$1,800 (I'll include a $200 convenience fee vs dealing with renting with a potential unknown - you can adjust as you want to). I guess that might be easy vs retail website, but I think it's hard for a lot of RCI places if comparing just RCI Extra Vacations, forget about person to person rentals. For independents, the exchange fee is potentially 30% of the MF or worse - I bet plenty of people if they do person to person (IDK about redweek fees etc, that may make exchanging look good again) would love to rent a week at $250 net or so... less than the RCI fee before resort fees etc.

 

[dougp26364]

Though from RCI/IIs POV, do they care if you've got 3 accounts or whatever as long as they get paid for each one? So far I also don't know all the logistics, but presumably the bulk exchange deposits from the mini systems are because someone in their systems are exchanging... or else wouldn't they be deposited as cash stays?

I also think there's some flimflamery going on with that 80% occupancy for TSs. It's certainly not owner occupancy - many people are renting from owners on AirB&B etc, many more are booking via the company websites, and plenty are booking via RCI/II cash deals. If the minisystems were filling everything then they wouldn't have inventory (or need) to deposit into the exchanges for cash. I wonder if they are doing more cash bookings than straight exchanges, and I also think at least some of that is driven by the extreme exchange fees.

I know via Trading Places Legacy that RCI apparently can offer $179 exchange fees vs $299 - unless Capital is subsidizing that for some reason. I know the mini systems manage exchanges for at most $80 (HGVC Legacy booking fee). Seems to me that the exchanges are so greedy that they're pricing themselves into a different market, primarily cash deals.

I don't think it's "safe" for RCI/II to become mostly cash deals though, because I think they could lose all access to the mini-systems that way - they'd just as soon rent out on Hilton.com as get an RCI Extra Vacation. But the "bundle" of exchange value and a more likely to book audience and just tradition might keep it going for a long time, as long as people still exchange OUT of HGVC etc.

I just figure RCI ought to realize that while an exchange might work for in the know people, for HGVC for instance the 2BR 7200 pts - averages around $1190 in MFs, plus $300 exchange fee, plus ~$100 resort fees - means they are only getting people desperate to use up points so they don't expire OR exchanges into places that you can't rent for less than ~$1,800 (I'll include a $200 convenience fee vs dealing with renting with a potential unknown - you can adjust as you want to). I guess that might be easy vs retail website, but I think it's hard for a lot of RCI places if comparing just RCI Extra Vacations, forget about person to person rentals. For independents, the exchange fee is potentially 30% of the MF or worse - I bet plenty of people if they do person to person (IDK about redweek fees etc, that may make exchanging look good again) would love to rent a week at $250 net or so... less than the RCI fee before resort fees etc.

My comment was in relation to the number of accounts verse the number of households that own timeshare. 5 million members between the two big companies but 10 million households that own timeshare. That’s 50% unless you factor in the households like mine that have two accounts.