Ritz Carlton St Thomas - Update - No Longer Disappointed

[TravelTime]

I did not edit my original post. It is still as I wrote it the first time. I just added some compliments for the excellent service here.

 

[Superchief]

Reading the first post before it was edited reminded me of the one time that I was extremely disappointed with a unit placement - it was our last stay at Barony Beach and true to their rotational system they placed us in a high-floor unit after being in a low-floor unit the previous year. But that stay was to be our last at Barony (because we'd bought our home on HHI that year) and it coincided with a major refurb that was completed in only one of the oceanfront buildings. I explained how much we'd loved owning Barony, that even though we now owned a home just a few miles away we weren't planning on selling because we'd be using it to generate DC Points, and asked if they couldn't find a way to let us enjoy a refurbed unit, any refurbed unit high- or low-floor, while effectively saying "goodbye" to the resort. No dice - they didn't even attempt to make it look as though they were considering my request, they just flat-out said no and asked the next person in line to step forward. Honestly, it was one of the rudest encounters we'd ever had at an MVC resort, maybe surpassed only by the sales vultures at Timber Lodge who were bound and determined to get us to commit to a sales presentation before letting us leave the check-in area. (We won that one.)

That last stay at Barony they were keeping to their stated policy, though, so I walked away without blasting them negatively (and knowing that with Day Pass usage we'd at least continue to enjoy the resort's amenities for years.) Learning that others who do blast Marriott for their policies get routinely rewarded just aggravates me to no end.

In a way, VC point users have an advantage over home resort owners in this type of situation since I doubt they enforce a rotation for points stays. I've had similar experience at Mountainside where owners must rotate between pool, city, and 'mud' views. I'm staying there on a points reservation in August and am curious if my stay will be impacted by the rotation policy.

 

[Superchief]

What about resale DP owners that paid $6 all in? Are they classified separately?

Or peeps who bought developer in the 1990/2000's which in today's $ would be pennies on the dollar and received free grandfathered DP enrollment.

Where do you draw the line?

I wouldn't put too much emphasis on the upfront costs. MVC is making it up on higher MF for these premium resorts and via requals and other junk fees.

As you can see on the discussions on TUG many resale buyers turn into enrolled. Many resale buyers would never pay developer but they are open to requalifying their property. They are probably paying more than many of the developer purchased grandfathered deeds at older resorts have paid in years. Resale is another door into more customer upgrades while keeping their resorts solvent.

With all of the problems MVC has with IT, I highly doubt that they could ever keep these owner/purchaser types separate. I wouldn't be surprised that at some point home resort ownership is no longer identified.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

People buy for different reasons:

1) Some buy a deed at a resort because they bought where they want to go e.g. OF MOC or ski week.
2) Others like to trade resorts with points.

I could envision lawsuits emerging if #1 is not getting prioritized at their own deeded resort. The deed provides a solid case to access to the ownership rights. Trust points not so much.

 

[SueDonJ]

I did not edit my original post. It is still as I wrote it the first time. I just added some compliments for the excellent service here.

Except the thread title, though, which IMO set the tone and put the resort into the worst light without even reading the post. The title is much less inflammatory since your edit.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I didn't read the post as anything but a disappointment after staying in a great unit before and kind of expecting the same experience. I think you ask nicely for a different room before moving in, and if they cannot give you a different unit and view, you just accept it. I think that is what happened here.

I did see a very recent negative review on TripAdvisor that wasn't written well. It couldn't be TravelTime because she writes better than that.

 

[TravelTime]

The way I look at it is when people pay to book the best room at a hotel and they pay more, they get the better room with the better location and view. I see it the same way for people who bought retail from MVC who paid the most so shouldn’t they get better room assignments? I do not see this as elitist or unfair.

Folks are right that MVC may not have the IT systems to determine that. However, they might be able to track this in the future. From what I read from another Tugger recently, MVC has already created accounts for Vistana owners and entered a lot of their data.

The same way MVC does not allow post-2010 resale owners to enroll their week without buying more points or an enrolled week, couldn’t they decide the best room assignments will go to retail purchasers who paid a fortune via direct retail purchases of DPs? If I paid over $15 pp for DPs (possibly $100K to $200K), I would not like it if a resale owner who paid $5000 or $10,000 or maybe ever 1 penny got priority over me (hypothetically but not me bc I purchased resale and then enrolled my weeks/trust points so I would be lower on the totem pole).

Again, this is just my opinion.

 

[TravelTime]

Except the thread title, though, which IMO set the tone and put the resort into the worst light without even reading the post. The title is much less inflammatory since your edit.

I did edit the title but before it said “Disappointment.” Now it says “Update - No Longer Disappointed.” The original title, IMO, was not overly negative. But I understand if you read it that way.

 

[TravelTime]

I didn't read the post as anything but a disappointment after staying in a great unit before and kind of expecting the same experience. I think you ask nicely for a different room before moving in, and if they cannot give you a different unit and view, you just accept it. I think that is what happened here.

I did see a very recent negative review on TripAdvisor that wasn't written well. It couldn't be TravelTime because she writes better than that.

No it was not me! I do not write TripAdvisor reviews.

BTW, TUG posts so not show up in Google searches. I googled Ritz Carlton St Thomas yesterday and nothing showed up from TUG. I really thought I was sharing an experience with my TUG buddies and that it was mostly private.

 

[SueDonJ]

I didn't read the post as anything but a disappointment after staying in a great unit before and kind of expecting the same experience. I think you ask nicely for a different room before moving in, and if they cannot give you a different unit and view, you just accept it. I think that is what happened here.

I did see a very recent negative review on TripAdvisor that wasn't written well. It couldn't be TravelTime because she writes better than that.

Sometimes it's like I'm living in a different world!

After the OP's request for a different room wasn't immediately satisfied, she jumped onto TUG and said in a number of different posts that the unit placement - which conformed to the unit size/type she booked - was "horrible," that the resort personnel were treating her as a "second class" owner, that she didn't think she'd "ever stay here again," that her trip was "ruined," that the experience has "put on hold any future plans to buy more destination points or anything related to timeshares," etc ... Then she continued in the thread to tell all of us timeshare owners how and why she prioritizes her ownership status over 95% of the rest of Marriott owners! That's not what I call asking nicely and then accepting it, but again, maybe I'm in a different world.

 

[Superchief]

From what I've observed recently, I think MVC is assigning the best villas to those on a sales package. They now put a priority on selling a new 'victim' over keeping current owners happy.

 

[SueDonJ]

No it was not me! I do not write TripAdvisor reviews.

BTW, TUG posts so not show up in Google searches. I googled Ritz Carlton St Thomas yesterday and nothing showed up from TUG. I really thought I was sharing an experience with my TUG buddies and that it was mostly private.

I just googled "ritz carlton st thomas disappointment" and this thread is the second hit, after a TripAdvisor review that I assume is the one Cindy found.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

The way I look at it is when people pay to book the best room at a hotel and they pay more, they get the better room with the better location and view. I see it the same way for people who bought retail from MVC who paid the most so shouldn’t they get better room assignments? I do not see this as elitist or unfair.

Isn't that what's Elite status is for? Those who paid the most retail get Elite. However if you don't own at a particular resort then 1) Owner Elites 2) Owners then I would surmise that Elites should be the next in line for upgrades/changes/better room placement. The fact your were Elite DP is probably why they accommodated your change so readily. (plus having a room available).

 

[Mlvnsmly]

The way I look at it is when people pay to book the best room at a hotel and they pay more, they get the better room with the better location and view. I see it the same way for people who bought retail from MVC who paid the most so shouldn’t they get better room assignments? I do not see this as elitist or unfair.

Folks are right that MVC may not have the IT systems to determine that. However, they might be able to track this in the future. From what I read from another Tugger recently, MVC has already created accounts for Vistana owners and entered a lot of their data.

The same way MVC does not allow post-2010 resale owners to enroll their week without buying more points or an enrolled week, couldn’t they decide the best room assignments will go to retail purchasers who paid a fortune via direct retail purchases of DPs? If I paid over $15 pp for DPs (possibly $100K to $200K), I would not like it if a resale owner who paid $5000 or $10,000 or maybe ever 1 penny got priority over me (hypothetically but not me bc I purchased resale and then enrolled my weeks/trust points so I would be lower on the totem pole).

Again, this is just my opinion.

But what were the terms when those lowly people paid a penny for deeded real estate vs paying another seller (the developer) an inflated premium for the same property? They were the same either way, right? If a developer purchase had come with certain perks (better view, etc), that may have swayed some of these unscrupulous people to pony up the premium to buy direct. I also paid $2 pp with no junk fees and lower maintenance fees for AP points because I researched and found that they work exactly the same for bookings as DP points. If they said, hey, you can only reserve at 9 months with AP points, or you get a worse view, I would have maybe made a different decision. It's literally the entire purpose of this forum, to help people from being ripped off on timeshares.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I was disappointed at first when Westin North moved us to a different unit for a second week (same unit type) as exchangers. This was in March during spring break for many school districts. I thought we would be in the same unit for both weeks. They made the move really easy for us. Their reasoning was that our placement was a category they needed for owners coming in. Okay, well, I accept that. I have just never been asked to move like that in any Marriott or Westin before this. I wish they would have assigned us a lesser view room in the first place to not move, but super easy to move because they readied the other room early.

 

[rickandcindy23]

But what were the terms when those lowly people paid a penny for deeded real estate vs paying another seller (the developer) an inflated premium for the same property? They were the same either way, right? If a developer purchase had come with certain perks (better view, etc), that may have swayed some of these unscrupulous people to pony up the premium to buy direct. I also paid $2 pp with no junk fees and lower maintenance fees for AP points because I researched and found that they work exactly the same for bookings as DP points. If they said, hey, you can only reserve at 9 months with AP points, or you get a worse view, I would have maybe made a different decision. It's literally the entire purpose of this forum, to help people from being ripped off on timeshares.

Well, I have gotten some good oceanfront and ocean views via exchange over owners who own island view. I don't think that's right. I think if an owner is staying at MOC, for example, owners should get the week another owner deposited to II with a better view. I don't mind an island view on exchange. I figure I am getting the week for $1,000, while an owner is paying upwards of $2,200 for an island view. Give that unit to an owner and label all views as island view for exchange purposes. But that is me.

What are AP points?

 

[byeloe]

I see it the same way for people who bought retail from MVC who paid the most so shouldn’t they get better room assignments? I do not see this as elitist or unfair.

just because resale buyers made a more savvy purchase doesn't mean that they should get lesser rooms. The ongoing MF are equal.

 

[Mlvnsmly]

Well, I have gotten some good oceanfront and ocean views via exchange over owners who own island view. I don't think that's right. I think if an owner is staying at MOC, for example, owners should get the week another owner deposited to II with a better view. I don't mind an island view on exchange. I figure I am getting the week for $1,000, while an owner is paying upwards of $2,200 for an island view. Give that unit to an owner and label all views as island view for exchange purposes. But that is me.

What are AP points?

Asia Pacific.

My point is more about changing the terms of a sale after the fact and that many people made their decisions based on that. Me being one of them. I see your point, but I think it's more apples vs oranges compared to buying resale vs direct. For me, I make my request and I take what I'm given. These people have an impossible, thankless job and I would never dream of making it any harder or more stressful for them than it already is.

 

[Steve Fatula]

What are AP points?

They are Asia Pacific destinations points. They mostly work the same.

 

[SueDonJ]

Well, I have gotten some good oceanfront and ocean views via exchange over owners who own island view. I don't think that's right. I think if an owner is staying at MOC, for example, owners should get the week another owner deposited to II with a better view. I don't mind an island view on exchange. I figure I am getting the week for $1,000, while an owner is paying upwards of $2,200 for an island view. Give that unit to an owner and label all views as island view for exchange purposes. But that is me.

I completely disagree with this. Owners using their deeded resort/season/unit size/unit view-type are supposed to be placed into units that conform to that particular ownership, no more and no less. The only exceptions are when a unit is uninhabitable due to damage or health concerns. In that case if no like units are available then the owner should be upgraded, and if no upgraded units are available then downgraded but with some type of compensation.

I know I would be VERY unhappy if at Barony Beach a Gardenview owner were to be randomly upgraded and placed equal to me as an Oceanfront owner, and I wouldn't blame any OceanVista owners at SurfWatch for thinking the same if my Oceanside placement is randomly upgraded. If Owners could be shuffled based on how many incoming exchanges there are, who decides which owners get the upgrades and how are the resorts supposed to keep track of those upgrades so that they're fairly distributed among all owners on subsequent stays? That's a whole next level of nightmare scenarios that Rooms Controllers would have to deal with and they already have more than enough to do with pacifying the unruly masses.

Nope. In order of "best" to "worst" they first place Weeks Owners using their ownerships favoring multiple week stays over single week stays (with some of the resorts using a stated rotational system,) then DC Points Members according to DC status levels into the particular unit size/view they've booked, then cash guests into the particular unit sizes/views they booked, then all the rest however the inventory shakes out. Sometimes as an exchanger that means you'll get lucky and be placed into the oceanfront unit given up by an owner exchanging out, but sometimes it means that you'll get a placement in the back gardenview section because Marriott took that owner exchange and monetized it.

What are AP points?

Asia-Pacific Points. Long before the DC there was a subset of the resorts that comprise the Asia-Pacific segment which allows for AP Points-based ownerships and stays.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

The way I look at it is when people pay to book the best room at a hotel and they pay more, they get the better room with the better location and view. I see it the same way for people who bought retail from MVC who paid the most so shouldn’t they get better room assignments? I do not see this as elitist or unfair.

The travel industry is rife with inconsistencies. Just look at airline seats. Why should those who paid for a first class seat have to sit next to someone that paid for economy fare with points and received a lucky upgrade?

 

[TravelTime]

I just googled "ritz carlton st thomas disappointment" and this thread is the second hit, after a TripAdvisor review that I assume is the one Cindy found.

Wow, you are correct. It has the old title. It is interesting that the person who did the TripAdvisor review also used the word “disappointment.” I doubt anyone is going to google the word ”disappointment.” You need to add the word “disappointment” for my thread to show up.

The other person’s thread is old:
Ritz Carlton Disappointment on Many Levels
Review of The Ritz-Carlton, St. Thomas
Reviewed August 16, 2020

This reminds me of when people google their name and they pop up on page 1. Yet no one knows who they are so no one searches for their name. Then they wonder why no one is calling them. Then they say the internet does not generate leads. I am not going to get into these details but I know so many people in my field who have this problem.

 

[TravelTime]

@SueDonJ @CalGalTraveler

BTW, after all this drama, we decided not to switch rooms. They said we would need to pack and we are too exhausted to pack. It saves them time too. Whoever would have gotten our room will now be a level higher than us. Lucky them!

 

[TravelTime]

The travel industry is rife with inconsistencies. Just look at airline seats. Why should those who paid for a first class seat have to sit next to someone that paid for economy fare with points and received a lucky upgrade? Why shouldn't someone who paid cash for an economy refundable fare seat but less savvy about upgrades get preference?

I agree that there are inconsistencies but there are some basic guidelines as to how soon you need to book in order to get the best price. Some travel is just a commodity. When you book makes a difference. How the economy is doing. Many factors.

Some places are special and you must more or less pay full price to get it and book in advance. I am having this experience now with a non-timeshare trip I am planning for next summer. (I won’t say any details or get accused of being elitist.)

If someone has enough FF points to travel first class, I think they deserve that seat. It is not easy to use FF points anymore to get first class seats. It used to be easier but they have raised the miles needed and many other factors. Maybe you are having more luck than me lately.

 

[TravelTime]

just because resale buyers made a more savvy purchase doesn't mean that they should get lesser rooms. The ongoing MF are equal.
Your continued insistence that who ever paid more should get more, definitely comes across as elitist.

Okay I am elitist! I will take the title. It does not bother me at all.

This thread has become really exhausting. It seems like there is a lot of group think on TUG and personal attacks going on just for expressing an opinion. I am not going to share any of my experiences on TUG anymore. It is not valued at all. I will just read and ask advice going forward. I will not talk about my travels. If you really want to know what’s elitist, don’t ask me about a trip I am planning for next year.