Koala warns Wyndham is cancelling reservations based on Wyndham's "updated policy" Anyone know what's up?

[WManning]

I want the rules enforced for the benefit of the vast majority of owners. You think that’s wrong?

It depends on if he was running a commercial rental business.

 

[Eric B]

The definition is included within the underlying trust documents. It’s also replicated in the T&Cs for points protection, which is the easiest place to screenshot from:

If the definition in the terms & conditions for points protection and the underlying trust documents (for CWA?) actually applied to the use of CWS points for rent, wouldn’t it make sense to actually enforce it as written? Don’t get me wrong, I do believe it would be odd for Wyndham to allow folks to buy points protection for commercial use of the points, though they haven’t written the restriction all that well. That would be on the level of a lot of the other things they have done, though, like the cancel and rebook thing to subsidize VIPs. Part of the problem is that they have conflicting incentives—if they crack down on all rentals in a visible way it could impact sales that are driven by the ability to rent excess points at the urging of the salesmen.

It also seems odd and self-serving of them to sell points protection that is only good if Extra Holidays fails to rent an entire stay that is deposited. What would stop them from consciously renting out partial stays that had points protection when an alternative was available that would have resulted in a need to pay? They make the rules—do they rent developer owned points before owner deposited ones or after?

 

[dioxide45]

Can't we all just get along

 

[chapjim]

Can't we all just get a long

A long what?

 

[Eric B]

A long what?

Little dogie

 

[chapjim]

Little dogie

But you edited your post!! Put it back the way it was!

 

[dioxide45]

But you edited your post!! Put it back the way it was!

What post did @Eric B edit?

 

[comicbookman]

I know you’re trying but you’re just not that dumb. Extra Holidays is part of Wyndham/Travel & Leisure. I suggest you read your contract. Maybe pay special attention to what rights Wyndham has in using it’s units as opposed to what rights you have in using/renting those same units. And, please, don’t bring up “the salesman said”. It doesn’t matter. The contract matters and Wyndham has a pretty good record in court when it comes to that. Remember, even Ron Parise, who all the renters look up to as Superman, didn’t fight Wyndham in court because, as he stated on this forum, he knew he was eventually going to be caught. He cheated as long as he could get away with it, then he made a deal and ran. He still talks big on occasion, but when confronted with the facts, and the law, he quit. So, stop with the Extra Holidays bs. Wyndham uses it because they can. Wyndham is, once again, cracking down on owner renters because, legally, they can’t.

Ron did not cheat, nor was he confronted with " the law" Wyndham cut off his ability to use his account and then they bought him out. If they had " the law" on there side they simply would have blocked him and told him tough. Owners can in fact rent. Get your facts straight and you might be more convincing.

 

[bnoble]

Does every single Wyndham thread have to devolve to the same thing?

 

[dioxide45]

Does every single Wyndham thread have to devolve to the same thing?

Apparently only the ones that reference renting in some way...

 

[Rolltydr]

Ron did not cheat, nor was he confronted with " the law" Wyndham cut off his ability to use his account and then they bought him out. If they had " the law" on there side they simply would have blocked him and told him tough. Owners can in fact rent. Get your facts straight and you might be more convincing.

The idol worship of Ron is just sad. Ron settled out of court because he knew he couldn’t win in court. If he had the facts and the law on his side, why didn’t he fight Wyndham? Yes, owners can rent, occasionally. They can’t run a commercial enterprise (a fact as spelled out in the documentation copied in post #97) as Ron was clearly doing. That is a fact. That is why he settled without a fight.

 

[Jan M.]

The definition is included within the underlying trust documents. It’s also replicated in the T&Cs for points protection, which is the easiest place to screenshot from:

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I've never read points protection terms and conditions nor have I seen anyone post this before. Is points protection only applying to reservations in an owners name or their immediate family something new? Also is this definition of "Commercial Use" new?

For those who don't know Wyndham defines immediate family as the owners spouse, domestic partner, children, grandchildren, parents and siblings..

Well owners can stop saying that Wyndham has never defined commercial use! It clearly states that if an owner seeks a renter or other "non-Permitted User (meaning anyone other than immediate family) by advertising or an online website that is commercial use. That would include Last Minute Rentals and the Marketplace here on TUG, the Wyndham Facebook group that welcomes rentals, eBay, Redweek, Koala, Craigslist, VRBO, airbnb, etc. And yes by rights it should also include rentals done through Extra Holidays too but I have no interest in going up against Wyndham to try to argue that.

I'm editing this post to add the following. 1 renter or 100 renters is still renting. Just recouping your maintenance fees and the guest certificate cost on one or a few rentals is still renting. It's like saying you're not really pregnant because you're only a month along.

 

[comicbookman]

The idol worship of Ron is just sad. Ron settled out of court because he knew he couldn’t win in court. If he had the facts and the law on his side, why didn’t he fight Wyndham? Yes, owners can rent, occasionally. They can’t run a commercial enterprise (a fact as spelled out in the documentation copied in post #97) as Ron was clearly doing. That is a fact. That is why he settled without a fight.

Because they met his price. Rather than fight a multi billion dollar corporation, he negotiate a comfortable settlement. Why fight when the other side is willing to meet your price. No one worships Ron. He was a smart guy who shared many of his techniques with the rest of us. The bigger question is why do you hate Ron? All Wyndham could really do is prevent him from renting. What they did was prevent him from using ot transferring his points at all. There is no rule against selling your contract, yet thy prevented him from doing so. He could have beaten that ban in court, but again, why fight when Wyndham was happy to buy him out at a tidy profit? Just because you are right doesn't mean the fight is worthwhile So now you agree owners can rent. Good to see that at least you do corrext when wrong.

 

[Rolltydr]

Because they met his price. Rather than fight a multi billion dollar corporation, he negotiate a comfortable settlement. Why fight when the other side is willing to meet your price. No one worships Ron. He was a smart guy who shared many of his techniques with the rest of us. The bigger question is why do you hate Ron? All Wyndham could really do is prevent him from renting. What they did was prevent him from using ot transferring his points at all. There is no rule against selling your contract, yet thy prevented him from doing so. He could have beaten that ban in court, but again, why fight when Wyndham was happy to buy him out at a tidy profit? Just because you are right doesn't mean the fight is worthwhile So now you agree owners can rent. Good to see that at least you do corrext when wrong.

Corrext? Sure, if it makes you feel better.

 

[comicbookman]

Corrext? Sure, if it makes you feel better.

Thanks for pointing out my typo. Typing on a phone is not my forte

 

[Rolltydr]

Thanks for pointing out my typo. Typing on a phone is not my forte

Now, that’s something we have in common.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Wyndham is kind of creepy. They get everyone riled up against renters. Sleazy snakes. They want you to be mad at your fellow owners, and then they will rent everything they want and you will turn a blind eye because it's them doing it.

Gee, what other company has done this?

 

[chapjim]

What post did @Eric B edit?

#104

The original post said, "Can't we all get a long." So, I said, "A long what?"

 

[Rolltydr]

Wyndham is kind of creepy. They get everyone riled up against renters. Sleazy snakes. They want you to be mad at your fellow owners, and then they will rent everything they want and you will turn a blind eye because it's them doing it.

Gee, what other company has done this?

Owners got riled up at renters when they continued to see other owners running ads and renting multiple units at multiple locations but there weren’t any reservations available to them. Wyndham told us about Extra Holidays before we ever bought. We knew they had the right to take unreserved units at various times and that we could also use EH to rent weeks/points that we couldn’t use. There are a lot of Wyndham sales tactics to complain about, but at least for us, they were honest about Extra Holidays.

 

[dioxide45]

#104

The original post said, "Can't we all get a long." So, I said, "A long what?"

Since you were pointing out my bad grammar, I was simply pointing out your mistake too. I edited the mistake in my post but you quoted Eric B. You should have been quoting my post. You still didn't answer the question though.

 

[chapjim]

Since you were pointing out my bad grammar, I was simply pointing out your mistake too. I edited the mistake in my post but you quoted Eric B. You should have been quoting my post. You still didn't answer the question though.

What??

Eric B asked a question. I answered it with a quote from your post #104. I make a lot of mistakes but I don't see one in this exchange.

It is becoming apparent that we can't all get along. Too many self-righteous know-it-alls and too many thin skins.

 

[Rolltydr]

What??

Eric B asked a question. I answered it with a quote from your post #104. I make a lot of mistakes but I don't see one in this exchange.

It is becoming apparent that we can't all get along. Too many self-righteous know-it-alls and too many thin skins.

I assume you’re definition of a “self-righteous know-it-all” is someone who knows the rules and abides by them. What do you call someone who knows the rules and refuses to abide by them?

I think we can disagree and get along fine as along as everybody is honest about what the rules are, or even that there are rules governing what someone is allowed to do with their timeshare. Some owners seem to have the opinion that ”I bought it. It’s mine. I can do whatever I want”. As pointed out numerous times on this board, just because you got away with doing something in the past, that doesn’t mean you have the right to do it. Running a commercial enterprise is not allowed. Period.

 

[Eric B]

Since you were pointing out my bad grammar, I was simply pointing out your mistake too. I edited the mistake in my post but you quoted Eric B. You should have been quoting my post. You still didn't answer the question though.

What??

Eric B asked a question. I answered it with a quote from your post #104. I make a lot of mistakes but I don't see one in this exchange.

It is becoming apparent that we can't all get along. Too many self-righteous know-it-alls and too many thin skins.

Well, I'm just going to stay out of this one....

 

[dioxide45]

What??

Eric B asked a question. I answered it with a quote from your post #104. I make a lot of mistakes but I don't see one in this exchange.

It is becoming apparent that we can't all get along. Too many self-righteous know-it-alls and too many thin skins.

I asked what post was edited, you said #104. #104 was MY post but you asked Eric why he edited his post. Did he edit his post? If he did, it wasn't #104. I don't understand why you asked Eric to put his post back since it was #104 that was edited.

What I get from all of this is, when one can't argue on the merits of the issue they devolve to calling out grammar and typos.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Owners got riled up at renters when they continued to see other owners running ads and renting multiple units at multiple locations but there weren’t any reservations available to them. Wyndham told us about Extra Holidays before we ever bought. We knew they had the right to take unreserved units at various times and that we could also use EH to rent weeks/points that we couldn’t use. There are a lot of Wyndham sales tactics to complain about, but at least for us, they were honest about Extra Holidays.

Look under some of the Marriott and Westin resorts under Redweek. When do you see anyone complaining about the dozens of ads on Redweek for Marriott and Westin resorts that owners are renting.

Low-class Wyndham is the only company targeting "mega renters." And you are all going along with it. It's mob mentality. Reserve what you need way ahead of time and stop expecting inventory to be there when you want it. No one who owns Staroptions or DP is complaining that nothing is available to them within 60 days.

Wyndham has major IT issues and it's reflecting on my WorldMark and Shell ownerships because they are managing those as well. Why is Wyndham not the target of your ire, when they are the ones that created this animosity by selling more points as a rental product.