Natural Immunity Stronger than Vax CDC study reveals [MERGED]

[MrockStar]

The CDC just released a new study stating that natural immunity is 6X stronger than vaccines: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/me...rmed-vaccines-against-delta-strain/ar-AASWPCZ

 

["Roger"]

From the article that you link to ...

The highest case rates were among those who had neither been vaccinated or previously infected. The most protection against infection and hospitalization was in those who had both been vaccinated and survived an earlier bout with the virus. (Italics added)

 

[Old Hickory]

Natural immunity has been around as long as pathogens have been infecting humans. But I guess that this pathogen was (somehow) different? So tell me again, who follows the science?

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

From the article that you link to ...

The highest case rates were among those who had neither been vaccinated or previously infected. The most protection against infection and hospitalization was in those who had both been vaccinated and survived an earlier bout with the virus. (Italics added)

Four possibilities.
1. Unvaxxed and uninfected.
2. Unvaxxed and previously infected.
3. Vaxxed and uninfected.
4. Vaxxed and previously infected.

The question is not between 1 and 4. It's about which is better, 2 or 3? CDC now says that 2 is more protective than 3. The CDC had been saying that 2 was not particularly effective, now they've changed their tune to say that 2 is more effective than 3. A major change.

 

[MrockStar]

Four possibilities.
1. Unvaxxed and uninfected.
2. Unvaxxed and previously infected.
3. Vaxxed and uninfected.
4. Vaxxed and previously infected.

The question is not between 1 and 4. It's about which is better, 2 or 3? CDC now says that 2 is more protective than 3. The CDC had been saying that 2 was not particularly effective, now they've changed their tune to say that 2 is more effective than 3. A major change.

Thanks for pointing that out! That is quite a turnaround from just 6 months ago!

 

[emeryjre]

Of course, being a number 1 (unvaxed and uninfected) and moving to number 2 (unvaxed and previously infected) carried a higher mortality risk than being a number 3 (vaxed and uninfected).

That is something we shouldn't forget.

 

[tschwa2]

Natural immunity has been around as long as pathogens have been infecting humans. But I guess that this pathogen was (somehow) different? So tell me again, who follows the science?

Chicken Pox natural immunity is great but that doesn't mean I didn't give the vaccine to my children and wouldn't have rather had the vaccine than the bad case of chicken pox that I had. And now I can get shingles which luckily there is another vaccine but it's one my children won't have to worry about because they never had chicken pox.

Natural immunity has been around for a long time and now a lot fewer people die thanks to vaccines that in the past the only protection was natural immunity.

 

[PigsDad]

Of course, being a number 1 (unvaxed and uninfected) and moving to number 2 (unvaxed and previously infected) carried a higher mortality risk than being a number 3 (vaxed and uninfected).

That is something we shouldn't forget.

Exactly! I find that those who spout off about how wonderful "natural immunity" is rarely admit the fact that being vaccinated is orders of magnitude safer than getting the disease.

Kurt

 

[MrockStar]

Exactly! I find that those who spout off about how wonderful "natural immunity" is rarely admit the fact that being vaccinated is orders of magnitude safer than getting the disease.

Kurt

Except, alot of had alpha covid BEFORE the vaccines where out, some a year before! So a non starter argument for alot of us. Then we had natural immunity which has been proved alot better at reducing infectons and deaths. We just had to be patient for the database to catch up and the truth to come out!

 

[emeryjre]

Except, alot of had alpha covid BEFORE the vaccines where out, some a year before! So a non starter argument for alot of us. Then we had natural immunity which has been proved alot better at reducing infectons and deaths. We just had to be patient for the database to catch up and the truth to come out!

Glad you beat the odds.

 

[MrockStar]

Glad you beat the odds.

Thanks, me too.

 

[PigsDad]

Except, alot of had alpha covid BEFORE the vaccines where out, some a year before! So a non starter argument for alot of us.

Laughable. The percentage of the general population that had the disease before the vaccines were out was tiny compared to the misguided "natural immunity" anti-vaxxers. And BTW, I never have denied that natural immunity is effective; just that it is much more risky than the vaccine (which is a common belief among anti-vaxxers).

Kurt

 

[tschwa2]

I think the data may eventually catch up but it could take another 5-10 years. Natural immunity does work but it too seems to wain and then would require you to get covid again or get vaccinated and for people who are anti vax that would mean purposely trying to get covid which in my understanding of the current data is still more dangerous (both from an individual stand point and the danger of spreading it to others, and the strain on the health care system) than getting vaccinated.

 

["Roger"]

With regard to posts #4 and #5, I was reacting to a history on this board of posters claiming that if you have had Covid (natural immunity), you do not need to get vaccinated. Am I wrong for emphasizing that the CDC is still strongly recommending to get vaxxed even if you had had Covid? (The actual report repeatedly makes this point.) I think that should have been made more apparent in the original posting. That was my point.

I should also note that the study looked at individuals who were vaxxed, but before a booster vaccination was widely available. In other words, natural immunity was being compared with those who had received two shots, not three as now recommended.

 

[MrockStar]

I think the data may eventually catch up but it could take another 5-10 years. Natural immunity does work but it too seems to wain and then would require you to get covid again or get vaccinated and for people who are anti vax that would mean purposely trying to get covid which in my understanding of the current data is still more dangerous (both from an individual stand point and the danger of spreading it to others, and the strain on the health care system) than getting vaccinated.

You dont have to try to get covid Omicron is highly contagious.

 

[echino]

A real life example:

- Someone was fully vaccinated with two doses of Pfizer
- Then five months later (before being eligible for a booster), gets Omicron and recovers

Should that person get a booster?

Asking for a friend...

 

[travelhacker]

A real life example:

- Someone was fully vaccinated with two doses of Pfizer
- Then five months later (before being eligible for a booster), gets Omicron and recovers

Should that person get a booster?

Asking for a friend...

I'm in this same scenario.

From everything that I read, we effectively were boosted from our infection.

I may still get a booster in case they decide to change the definition of fully vaccinated (which I don't agree with) or if it makes my life easier in some way (i.e. going to Hawaii).

I will probably get a booster a year from now, but I'm hoping it'll be more specific to whatever version is running amok. I think the Pfizer Omicron specific version will be available in March and that's probably closer to whatever version will be spreading a year or so from now.

 

[Chrispee]

I'm also in a similar situation and am delaying my booster. The guidance I've read is anywhere from 1-6 months after infection and that makes sense to me, but like @travelhacker I'd like to see where the development of variant-specific boosters goes in the next month or two.

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

With regard to posts #4 and #5, I was reacting to a history on this board of posters claiming that if you have had Covid (natural immunity), you do not need to get vaccinated. Am I wrong for emphasizing that the CDC is still strongly recommending to get vaxxed even if you had had Covid? (The actual report repeatedly makes this point.) I think that should have been made more apparent in the original posting. That was my point.

I should also note that the study looked at individuals who were vaxxed, but before a booster vaccination was widely available. In other words, natural immunity was being compared with those who had received two shots, not three as now recommended.

Turn it around. Should a person who is vaxxed up try to get infected to get that "double" immunity. If not, why not?

to get to #4, you have to do both. . .

 

[tschwa2]

A real life example:

- Someone was fully vaccinated with two doses of Pfizer
- Then five months later (before being eligible for a booster), gets Omicron and recovers

Should that person get a booster?

Asking for a friend...

Personally (and there isn't enough research data)so more a gut feeling, is that even as a pro vaccine person there is immunity boost from natural immunity. I probably don't give natural immunity enough credit but if I had a mild case (as a fairly healthy 50ish adult) at 5 months I would delay the booster 1-2 months. If I had a moderate case I would delay the booster 2-4 months and probably 2-4 for a more severe case only because if I had 2 severe bouts (my first case pre vaccine was moderate plus) I would consider myself immunocompromised in relation to covid and would want as much protection as possible.
If I was doing something that I consider higher risk after getting covid, like spending several hours in an airport and on planes or a cruise or regularly visited a nursing home or someone with many risk factors I probably wouldn't delay more than a month regardless of how bad I had covid.

 

[MrockStar]

No.

 

[MrockStar]

This back and forth critical thinking/questions gives me hope going forward. This is exactly what is needed.

 

[PigsDad]

A real life example:

- Someone was fully vaccinated with two doses of Pfizer
- Then five months later (before being eligible for a booster), gets Omicron and recovers

Should that person get a booster?

Asking for a friend...

I was in a similar situation: two-shot vaccination in April, and then at the end of September I had a breakthrough case. Since that was before Omicron was widely out there, I believe I had the Delta variant. In October I was eligible for the booster, but I put it off until December, a couple weeks before we were to spend time with family. So far, no Omicron (or if I have had it, I was asymptomatic)!

Kurt

 

[echino]

No.

I would think NO too, but public health advice is YES:

"I've already had COVID-19
Even if you've already had COVID-19 and recovered, you should still get your booster dose.
If you were recently infected, you can get your booster once your symptoms have passed."

Get your COVID-19 and flu immunizations

Help protect yourself and your community this respiratory illness season by getting your updated flu and COVID-19 immunizations.

www2.gov.bc.ca

Public health advice gives ZERO credit to natural immunity. Looks like "natural immunity" is an unscientific, anti-vaxx term, and anyone talking about it should be labelled an "anti-vaxxer".

 

[MrockStar]

I would think NO too, but public health advice is YES:

"I've already had COVID-19
Even if you've already had COVID-19 and recovered, you should still get your booster dose.
If you were recently infected, you can get your booster once your symptoms have passed."

Get your COVID-19 and flu immunizations

Help protect yourself and your community this respiratory illness season by getting your updated flu and COVID-19 immunizations.

www2.gov.bc.ca

Public health advice gives ZERO credit to natural immunity. Looks like "natural immunity" is an unscientific, anti-vaxx term, and anyone talking about xshould be labelled an "anti-vaxxer".

So your calling the CDC anti vaxxer. Funny that.