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Hilton Grand Vacations strikes deal to acquire Diamond Resorts

That's true, but you also need to consider what you are paying in points to book at that affiliate.

We are members in Raintree Vacation Club, which is also a DRI affiliate. So I can see what it costs me in Raintree to book at one of their resorts (say Club Regina Puerto Vallarta) vs. making the same booking using DRI points.

Converting the DRI and Raintree points required to $ based on maintenance fees - I would pay more for a one-bedroom unit booking it through DRI than I would pay for a 2-bedroom unit for the same period booking through my Raintree account.

Just for fun one time, I used a similar comparison to compare what it would cost me to stay at a Great Wolf Lodge using DRI points as compared with just booking it as an ordinary guest. It was significantly more expensive to burn my DRI points as Great Wolf than to just book directly with Great Wolf.

So when I've mucked around, I've concluded that the affiliate resorts don't really offer value. As I've posted elsewhere, the primary reason they exist is so that DRI can put more dots on the map. The only time I would seriously consider staying at an affiliate resort is if I had points that were going to expire at the end of the year and I couldn't roll them over, so I was faced with salvaging whatever value I could before they became worthless.

It depends on the affiliate. Yes, there are some affiliates I would never book with my Diamond points as the cost of the points spent (in maint fees) is astronomical. But not all affiliates are that way. I have stayed at some night affiliates through Diamond that cost no more than booking a normal Diamond resort (Gatling Town Square and Coconut Palms II in New Smyrna Beach come to mind).
 
I guess my biggest gripe with this whole thing is the lack of information. Who makes a purchase without a plan of what's going to happen with the purchase and if they have a plan, why hasn't it been communicated? The less I hear, the more that is speculated and not in a good way. For you, you know what you bought into and you know your system isn't changing. Diamond owners know what we bought into and are afraid it will change.

I absolutely understand your feelings on this. When the merger was looking like it was going the other way, I felt very uncertain as well. Give it time. The merger between Marriott and Vistana took how long to get things put in place and communicated?
 
Can you get platinum status as a resale owner or did you have purchase from Diamond directly?

I hope you get to keep your status and booking privileges.

Status only comes with purchasing from the developer. They are what we call "clean" points. Dirty points are resale points and have no status or benefits with them. We used to (maybe still do) have the ability to clean up dirty points by making a purchase of clean points the equaled at least 50% of the dirty points (clean 10,000 dirty points by purchasing 5,000 clean points and ending up with 15,000 clean points).

I truly hope that we get to keep our status and booking privileges as well. Personally, I don't care who takes my maint fees each year as long as I get to continue enjoying what I bought. If we lose our status or force us into HGVC's rules though, that isn't what we, as Diamond owners, bought and I believe HGVC will see a large exodus of Diamond owners.
 
I absolutely understand your feelings on this. When the merger was looking like it was going the other way, I felt very uncertain as well. Give it time. The merger between Marriott and Vistana took how long to get things put in place and communicated?

Thank you.
 
I don't know to what extent you are counting on DRI for that statement, but the DRI only operates resorts in the US, Mexico, and Europe. Dots on their map in other continents are not DRI resorts - they are simply affiliates with whom DRI swaps a little bit of inventory.

Diamond owns 2 resorts in the Caribbean in St Marteen. Granted they have been closed for 3 years due to Irma but one just opened back up on 10 March and the other should open soon.
 
Maybe HGVC will overhaul its Elite program. While I am entry Level Elite, by accidental circumstance, I think the perks are pretty paltry. The only one I use and like is the 7 night free booking, during club season, at any resort.

Compared to Wyndham and what it sound like with DRI perks, there are a lot more and are way more flexible.
 
This is helpful but we need translation. For Diamond, what would one week in a 2 BDRM Ocean view in Hawaii cost per year?

Well, I don't think that can really translate well. In Maui, the KBC only has 4 2bdrm units and I don't think any of them are ocean front. For Point @ Poipu, all units are 2 bdrm and I believe the ocean front units go for about 12,000 points for a week. At a Platinum rate of 18.4 cent per point (2021) in maint fees, that would work out to about $2,208 for the week. Hopefully that helps.
 
I give @dougp26364 credit for the smartest post on this thread. I do not expect it, but I would also like to have the flexibility to use my HGVC points to affordably exchange into Diamond.

I have my first exchange (RCI Points) into a Diamond resort coming up this June. It is to the the Beachwoods at Kitty Hawk NC for a long weekend after the kids finish school for the year. It is not a horrible exchange value, but comes with the $29.95 daily resort fee (on top of the short stay $65 cleaning fee for a 2BR). I get people complaining about the resort fee for HGVC trades on RCI, but in this case it involves a Silver Crown RCI resort with 3 & 1/2 circles on TripAdvisor. We don't mind paying extra this time because we want to get away from people (Outer Banks versus Virginia Beach) more during COVID and there is a novelty to trying the place. Moving forward, I do not see many exchanges into Diamond for me unless it becomes a better value for our family to trade in through HGVC.

And while I complain about the fees, my June trip is still an affordable trip compared to paying for a hotel or resort there in cash, but there are certainly better trades to be made on RCI ... just not one I could execute for that exact area at that time.

The Beachwoods is a nice resort. I have stayed there several times. Large indoor swimming complex, nice size units, private parking at the beach (the resort itself is not on the beach), and it's right behind a Walmart for easy shopping (no, you cannot see the Walmart from the resort). Easy drive to Currituck Lighthouse, Wright Brothers Memorial, Duck, NC (home of Duck Donuts), and about an hour away from Cape Hatteras Lighthouse. Hope you enjoy your stay.
 
A question for @dougp26364 @T_R_Oglodyte and anybody else that might want to take a wild guess: How hard would it be to pull certain resorts out of the DRI Trust? If HGVC wanted to rebrand a few of the Diamond properties into HGVC resorts, could they just pull them out? I'm not familiar enough with a trust product to know if there are restrictions to what HGVC/Diamond can and can't do.

IMO, it would be illegal to do so. It might be possible to pull a resort out if a different resort would be put in it's place but I know of no way to rip a trust apart and then pick over the pieces. That was the reason the trust was created to begin with.
 
The complaint about the res fees appear to be irrelevant. The total cost is what matters. From what I have seen thus far, the costs for HGVC in Hawaii for a 2bdrm run in the $1800 - $2000 range similar to Point at Poipu. I believe the Big Island properties for HGVC maint are less - around $1400 - $1770 depending on the unit. The HGVC unit quality is higher for about the same total cost as DRI.

For the points system. How many DRI points are needed to get a 2 bdrm in Hawaii and how much does that cost overall per week?

FWIW...I am delighted that we will be getting options in Kauai, Sedona, Cabo and Lake Tahoe. I hope they make it cost effective to trade otherwise we'll just live with what we've got. We have properties in both Vistana and HGVC so we are getting the best of both worlds. :cool:

Reservation fees are hardly irrelevant. One of the biggest reasons I converted from my fixed/floating weeks to points was due to the rising costs of reservations fees with RCI/II. Also, most Diamond members don't book a week stay. Many (including myself) book many, many weekends (due to still working and being close enough to drive to multiple Diamond resorts). Multiply 15 weekends a year plus a few week or longer stays times $59 a booking and you're looking at some serious money in reservation fees. Just because reservation fees are irrelevant to you doesn't make them irrelevant to everyone else.
 
@Fried_shrimp Does Diamond charge cleaning fees for short stays? That can get expensive some places with RCI.

Reservation fees are hardly irrelevant. One of the biggest reasons I converted from my fixed/floating weeks to points was due to the rising costs of reservations fees with RCI/II. Also, most Diamond members don't book a week stay. Many (including myself) book many, many weekends (due to still working and being close enough to drive to multiple Diamond resorts). Multiply 15 weekends a year plus a few week or longer stays times $59 a booking and you're looking at some serious money in reservation fees. Just because reservation fees are irrelevant to you doesn't make them irrelevant to everyone else.
 
I Generally like HGVC management, but seems like a bit too much elitism from the CEO, "It'll allow us to attract customers, higher-quality customers than Diamond was able to attract."

Any of you Diamond owners thinking about the transition to HGV offended? Wonder how they talk about us resale buyers behind our back?

Are we offended? No, business is business. We are just hoping we can still utilize what we have the way we have been doing so. I can say, on the site I run for Diamond owners on FB that not a single member has talked about the joys of being able to go to an HGVC resort or paying more to become a full blown HGVC member so it's not like we're falling in love with y'all but we aren't offended either. Stunned would be more correct.
 
Diamond owns 2 resorts in the Caribbean in St Marteen. Granted they have been closed for 3 years due to Irma but one just opened back up on 10 March and the other should open soon.
Correct. I overlooked the two Sint Maarten resorts.
 
Reservation fees are hardly irrelevant. One of the biggest reasons I converted from my fixed/floating weeks to points was due to the rising costs of reservations fees with RCI/II. Also, most Diamond members don't book a week stay. Many (including myself) book many, many weekends (due to still working and being close enough to drive to multiple Diamond resorts). Multiply 15 weekends a year plus a few week or longer stays times $59 a booking and you're looking at some serious money in reservation fees. Just because reservation fees are irrelevant to you doesn't make them irrelevant to everyone else.
People should also be aware that in the Diamond system, a 7-day stay with check-in/-out on Friday or Saturday will require fewer points than a 7-day with check-in any other day of the week. The "week" rate in the charts only applies to those check-in days.
 
This is the thing I don’t get about Diamond’s Destination Exchange, It says at this time you must have a Diamond managed resort to enroll? So it does not seem like as much of a marketing opportunity as it could be.

Yet, the destinations you can exchange into looks a fair amount like RCI. I see Wyndham properties and Vacation Village. How do they truly “exchange” for these if it is just Diamond customers/resorts doing all the trading? [Maybe they are exchanging for you through another exchange company?]

@CalGalTraveler, their exchange rates look quite competitive versus RCI. Less so for short stay exchanges compared to RCI Points.


I am sure Diamond (now HGVC) is early in building this out and will have grander plans.

I definitely think people exchanging in is a big marketing thing. Club Wyndham really wants to market to me every time I stay there. I assume they know something abt me from their owning RCI. They probably view having HGVC in their network as a big marketing opportunity for them and a selling point to attract other resorts to affiliate with RCI.

I have to think HGVC also sees people exchanging in as a marketing opportunity. If not, why the 1 in three rule? Fresh meat for sales.

I don’t doubt the big boys have a much better marketing program that the smaller ones and that smaller ones are likely more dependent on exchangers coming in.

DEX (Destination Exchange) was not meant for outside timeshares to utilize. When it was created about 6-8 years ago, it was for the legacy week owners at Diamond resorts to use instead of RCI/II. Only 2.5 months ago did it open up with point owners when Diamond cancelled our affiliation with II. That is why it states the requirements to be an owner at a Diamond managed resort. It wasn't really an effort to compete with RCI/II. Most of the listings in DEX are RCI based.
 
Status only comes with purchasing from the developer. They are what we call "clean" points. Dirty points are resale points and have no status or benefits with them. We used to (maybe still do) have the ability to clean up dirty points by making a purchase of clean points the equaled at least 50% of the dirty points (clean 10,000 dirty points by purchasing 5,000 clean points and ending up with 15,000 clean points).

I truly hope that we get to keep our status and booking privileges as well. Personally, I don't care who takes my maint fees each year as long as I get to continue enjoying what I bought. If we lose our status or force us into HGVC's rules though, that isn't what we, as Diamond owners, bought and I believe HGVC will see a large exodus of Diamond owners.

One of the great aspects of HGVC is resale purchases. I am a fully resale member and, with the exception of Elite Status, my membership is no different from any other member. I have the same booking windows and rights as someone who bought all of their deeds from HGVC. As @Sandy VDH says above, most of the Elite perks are pretty paltry. Could that change? Sure, but it would reduce the value the developer bought deeds.
 
I find myself wondering if Diamond's online reservation system is any better than the horror that is HGVC's.....

I have absolutely no problem with Diamond's old reservation system. The new one though looks horrible (becuase some thought it needed changing). The weird thing is the two platforms are still being run simultaneously. On a phone, only the new version can be accessed. On a computer, some folks (such as myself) can still access the old one.
 
The new system is for both weeks and points based owners. We can, however, remain with II if we choose to pay their membership fee.

Actually, it's an older system updated to add points owners 01 Jan 2021. Yes, members can stay with II if they pay their own membership fee now.
 
Bent Creek Golf and Sunrise Ridge Resort are the only non-affiliated resorts in Tennessee. Not sure of the quality of those, but they are pure Diamond. I have heard talk of a resort in Virginia Beach as maybe being close to HGVC standards. There are a lot of pure DRI resorts in Virginia. Having more drivable locations (I live in Michigan) would be a plus

I took a peek at the Cabos resort and it looks like an HGVC resort already (at least the pictures do). I would love to have access to that resort. 2 locations in Los Cabos would be great! Ka'anapoli and Point at Poipu look like great locations and should be able to be brought up to HGVC standards as well. The Modern looks like a Diamond version of a bHC property. Lake Tahoe would be fun as well.
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My big hope is that HGVC treats the existing DRI members well and keeps their basic system in place. There will be changes, but if how they treat HGVC members is any indication, they will most definitely not throw existing DRI owners to the wayside. HGVC treats its members very well and I expect they will do the same for the DRI owners as well. An internal exchange system between the two might be a way to keep things on the level.

Oceaniare is the fancy (expensive) resort in Virginia Beach that you are referring to.

I LOVE Bent Creek. Is it fancy, no. Is it relaxing, absolutely. And if you book a Golf Deluxe unit you have great views of the mountain across the golf course. You can allso holler "hey batter batter" at the golfers. LOL

I have the exact same hopes as you do.
 
People should also be aware that in the Diamond system, a 7-day stay with check-in/-out on Friday or Saturday will require fewer points than a 7-day with check-in any other day of the week. The "week" rate in the charts only applies to those check-in days.

Friday, Saturday, and Sunday check ins have normal weekly costs. Mon-Thur check in dates have a 10% premium for checking in on a "non-standard" day. Didn't use to be like that though (a recent.....last 5 years.....change). For nightly rates, Sun-Thur is 10% of the weekly rate and Fri and Sat are 30% of the weekly rate (also a change....originally Fri & Sat were 25% of the weekly rate which worked out to the correct 100% of the week.....then they decided more people were doing weekends and boosted it to 30%).
 
One of the great aspects of HGVC is resale purchases. I am a fully resale member and, with the exception of Elite Status, my membership is no different from any other member. I have the same booking windows and rights as someone who bought all of their deeds from HGVC. As @Sandy VDH says above, most of the Elite perks are pretty paltry. Could that change? Sure, but it would reduce the value the developer bought deeds.

Booking windows are not based on status in Diamond (other than the relatively new privilege for Platinum owners that added a month). Every point owner has a 13 month booking window in collection and 10 month out of collection (14 and 11 for Plats) no matter the status and dirty or clean points. The Club (clean points) is for other benefits such as upgrades, early check in, guest certificates, selecting specific units, being able to book across collections, and some other stuff. A clean point owner can book in any collection. A dirty point owner can only book in the collection they own in. If you own in the Latino Collection, looks like you'll be going to Cabo every year. If you own dirty points in the US Collection though you've still got about 55 resorts you can book in. And because we own in a trust, we don't have deeded weeks assigned. We just have points in the trust.

This is the latest Diamond Loyalty List that shows perks based on status.
 

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Well, I don't think that can really translate well. In Maui, the KBC only has 4 2bdrm units and I don't think any of them are ocean front. For Point @ Poipu, all units are 2 bdrm and I believe the ocean front units go for about 12,000 points for a week. At a Platinum rate of 18.4 cent per point (2021) in maint fees, that would work out to about $2,208 for the week. Hopefully that helps.

One correction...KBC actually has sixteen 2BR units. Four each on floors 8-9 are part of one room category and then four more on both floors 3-4, I believe, were sold as another room category. Owners on 8-9 can't book the ones on 3-4 and vice versa. They also have, I think, one or two larger Presidential Suites that are also 2BR. We bought a 2BR in the floor 8-9 group back in 1998 when it was the Embassy Vacation Resort. We sold our unit in 2014 after we bought into the Marriott Vacation Club program. Here is a diagram of floor 8, with floor 9 being identical. I think the floor 3-4 units are also basically laid out the same.

KBC Floor 8 small.jpg


The 16 2BR units have wrap-around lanais and all of the floor 8-9 units have at least a small ocean view. In our years of ownership we stayed in 824, 834, and 839. Units 829/929 and 834/934 are mainly mountain view from the long side of the lanai, but they do have a view of the ocean from the shorter side. 824/924 and 839/929 basically have full ocean views, but aren't classified as ocean front because they are in the stack farthest back from the beach. The units on floors 3-4 would have essentially the same views, but being much lower, would be less impressive and perhaps partially blocked by trees. Here are a few pics from floor 8:

1) First, the views from the long and short side of the lanai of unit 834.

Long side view:
20080618_Hawaii2008_6760.jpg


Shorter side:
20110615_Maui_0404.jpg


2) Second, the views from the long and short side of unit 839.

Long side:
small20050620_Hawaii-Maui_5409.jpg


Shorter side:
small20050621_Hawaii-Maui_5604.jpg

Note: This last shot was taken with a zoom lens in 2005, prior to the construction of the Honua Kai condos. That is the Westin Kaanapali Ocean Resort Villas on the other side of the open land in the photo.
 
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Well, I don't think that can really translate well. In Maui, the KBC only has 4 2bdrm units and I don't think any of them are ocean front. For Point @ Poipu, all units are 2 bdrm and I believe the ocean front units go for about 12,000 points for a week. At a Platinum rate of 18.4 cent per point (2021) in maint fees, that would work out to about $2,208 for the week. Hopefully that helps.
I have a map of kbc. There are 16 2-bedroom units. 4 units on floors 3, 4, 8, and 9. None of them are ocean front
 

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