Just rescinded my purchase, now what's next?

[keen1988]

Hi, new member here.
Thanks god I found this BBS after signed the contract at King's Land during a VIP package trip last Sunday.
We liked King's land and the nearby Hilton hotel so much, that we decided to consider buying even before the presentation(though not enough for me to do my study). Compare to last time when we were at Grand Waikikian where I bought the VIP pakeage, King's Land is much more resort like and relax, while Waikiki is just too crowded and busy(hate the parking fee too.)

The offer I got was $24000~(including VIP discount) for a 1BR Plat 4800points/year at Tuscany Seaworld with 12400 bonus points and $1080 MF(including membership.)
I thought it's a good deal since it's lower MF compared to a 2BR Gold, but after read about the $1/points guideline, I know I almost lost $13000 even if I value 12400points at $6200.

Little Kudos to HGVC, their cancellation process is easy, with both email and FAX option available at Hawaii sales office. They even included the cancellation letter for you to sign with deadline clearly marked.

I am extremely grateful for all the information you guys provided here that saved my hard earned $$$.

Now,my current goal is to find a 2BR Plat 7000points under $8000 with MF lower than $1100.

I know it's lame for me, but any quick suggestion on which resort I should looking at? or currently active and reliable resale agents?

Thanks again!

 

[TUGBrian]

congrats on finding us in time after doing your research and saving a fortune! not many get that sort of 2nd chance!

 

[SmithOp]

Seth Nock has a good reputation. 7000 point look high right now, you might have to keep watching for a while. People get more desparate at the end of the year when next year's fees come due.

http://www.sellingtimeshares.net/category/hilton/


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[Talent312]

Seth Nock and his peep has a good rep on this website, as does... Judi Kozlowski and her peep at www.judikoz.com. You can also scan the ads in the marketplace here, www.redweek.com, and closed auctions on eBay.

There are peep who paid "retail" and seem to think that their TS is worth close to what they paid. So, don't be surprised if you see a few over-priced units.

HGVC is a good system... very flexible... It's a shame their sales-weasels can be such sneaky little-devils.

.

 

[davidvel]

Q: Just rescinded my purchase, now what's next?

A: Go out to your most expensive favorite restaurant, invite your best friends. Have a blast, eat and drink all you can, and tell them about the $23,700 extra that you now have in your bank account. (Uber home).

 

[keen1988]

LoL, thanks you all.
Just a little follow up, the sells agent just called me, offering 25000 then even 30000 bonus points instead of original 12400, which did shock me a little bit.
But obviously 49200(30000+4800*4) is too much for us for 4 years, plus too much fees to keep them.

 

[GT75]

Congratulations. You have made a good decision. You have already been given good advice. I will add, take your time, research and ask questions here on TUG. We have a great community, all willing to help.

is too much for us for 4 years

Even though it now no longer matters but bonus points must be used within 2 years.

 

[rfc0001]

As far as what resort resale -- I would solely look at purchase price per point and MF/point.

 

[keen1988]

Congratulations. You have made a good decision. You have already been given good advice. I will add, take your time, research and ask questions here on TUG. We have a great community, all willing to help.


Even though it now no longer matters but bonus points must be used within 2 years.

Oh, I was told at the presentation that I can deposit it into RCI for two more years? Is that ture? That's the reason that I said too much fees to keep and use them,$99ish then $39/per night? Would not bother with HHoner points..too less value....

 

[rfc0001]

Oh, I was told at the presentation that I can deposit it into RCI for two more years? Is that ture? That's the reason that I said too much fees to keep and use them,$99ish then $39/per night? Would not bother with HHoner points..too less value....

Yes, you get 2 years from the date of purchase to use your BPs, then can deposit them to RCI for another two calendar years (so would have until June 2019 to use BPs, then could deposit to RCI and use RCI points through end of 2021 - and can extend them indefinitely for $99/year). Most likely you would end up depositing to RCI since that is a lot of points to use in 2 years. I would value 4800 points (a 2 bedroom red week in RCI) at ~$400/nt * 7 nights - $230 fee = $2570, so would value 30,000 points at at $16K, bringing down your $25K offer down to $9000 in net cost, so around $1.50/pt which is what you are going to pay resale. This is where direct starts making some sense if you are working your way towards elite levels (e.g. to get cash rate discounts in retirement when you need more than just your 1-2 weeks). I'm not suggesting it makes sense for everyone, but it can make sense. It did for us.

 

[GT75]

Oh, I was told at the presentation that I can deposit it into RCI for two more years?

My bad, I was only thinking about HGVC usage. I am not the RCI expert because I have never used RCI but I believe @rfc0001 response is correct (two additional year usage). If it isn't, someone will correct.

 

[GT75]

Would not bother with HHoner points..too less value....

Your understanding of converting to Hilton Honors points is correct. It isn't worth it unless you have nothing else to use them on and you are about to lose them. The other problem with bonus points (again in HGVC system), they can not be mixed with regular points in the same reservation and their reservation are non-changeable. But, you luckily won't need to deal with those issues.

 

[keen1988]

Yes, you get 2 years from the date of purchase to use your BPs, then can deposit them to RCI for another two calendar years (so would have until June 2019 to use BPs, then could deposit to RCI and use RCI points through end of 2021 - and can extend them indefinitely for $99/year). Most likely you would end up depositing to RCI since that is a lot of points to use in 2 years. I would value 4800 points (a 2 bedroom red week in RCI) at ~$400/nt * 7 nights - $230 fee = $2570, so would value 30,000 points at at $16K, bringing down your $25K offer down to $9000 in net cost, so around $1.50/pt which is what you are going to pay resale. This is where direct starts making some sense if you are working your way towards elite levels (e.g. to get cash rate discounts in retirement when you need more than just your 1-2 weeks). I'm not suggesting it makes sense for everyone, but it can make sense. It did for us.

Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts, I simplely put $0.5/point value at beginning when doing my math, and as the larger the bonus gets, the less I valued them at, maybe $0.40/points for 30000, left me $17000 at cost, which is still $13000 higher than two listing I saw. I didn't thought about Elite status a lot though, as I'm far from retiring(you can tell from my username), and can get hilton gold status easily by keeping a credit card around, it just not worth a five figure for me.

Seems you put very high value to RCI weeks, close to my valuation of HGVCs in Hawaii and peak season at mainland, makes me curious about your prefered destinations~ a quick search on RCI.com yesterday left me a little bit dispointed, hard to find a good resort comparable to HGVC, maybe I just too new to it, too early for me to dig into that~

 

[keen1988]

Deleted

 

[keen1988]

The other problem with bonus points (again in HGVC system), they can not be mixed with regular points in the same reservation and their reservation are non-changeable. But, you luckily won't need to deal with those issues.

Oh....so many traps....

 

[SmithOp]

Whoa, $400 a night is a way overvalued for an RCI nightly rate.

The top shelf in RCI is Disney and HGVC, and Disney hasn't deposited 2 bedroom units in ages. HGVC is limited to 9 months so you will only be able to trade back in to Vegas or Orlando, you'll have to be very lucky to pull a Hawaii unit that might be worth $400/night.

I just reserved a cash rental using RCI, a 2 bedroom in Sedona, week 50, Arroyo Roble, $700 for a week. Expedia rate was $223/night.


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[GT75]

Seems you put very high value to RCI weeks

I agree, the reason that I haven't used RCI is because I just don't see that it has the same standards or value as HGVC. I don't think that I agree with @rfc1000 math. I think an RCI night isn't worth $400/night (2 Bd). I don't even place 3 bedroom unit in HGVC that high (maybe prime week such as ski). Just my opinion anyway.

 

[rfc0001]

Thanks so much for sharing your thoughts, I simplely put $0.5/point value at beginning when doing my math, and as the larger the bonus gets, the less I valued them at, maybe $0.40/points for 30000, left me $17000 at cost, which is still $13000 higher than two listing I saw. I didn't thought about Elite status a lot though, as I'm far from retiring(you can tell from my username), and can get hilton gold status easily by keeping a credit card around, it just not worth a five figure for me.

You don't need to be retired to take advantage of the cash rate discounts -- which are 10%, 15%, and 30% depending on elite level. You just need to need more weeks than you own. I just said retirement since you need to slowly build up to elite if you buy direct, and need flexibility in when you travel. We fully plan on using discounted cash rates (primarily in Hawaii) when we have more flexibility (which actually is only 10 years away -- once kids graduate). The only reason I harp on cash discounts is because that's really the only elite benefit worth anything significant.

Seems you put very high value to RCI weeks, close to my valuation of HGVCs in Hawaii and peak season at mainland, makes me curious about your prefered destinations~ a quick search on RCI.com yesterday left me a little bit dispointed, hard to find a good resort comparable to HGVC, maybe I just too new to it, too early for me to dig into that~

Correct -- we've exchanged into RCI 11 times (and counting) -- 8 of which were 1 bedrooms in DVC worth at least $400/nt for 3400 pts each. Wyndham National Harbor 2 bdrm was another (probably closer to $1400 rental value for 4800 pts). The last was King's land (yes, you can exchange into HGVC) 2 bdrm for 4800 pts which was going for $400/night direct through Hilton.

ETA: you have to spend a lot of time setting up OGSes and have a lot of patience and flexibility to get the top tier RCI resorts. My experience it not at all typical, but shows that it is possible.

 

[rfc0001]

Whoa, $400 a night is a way overvalued for an RCI nightly rate.

The top shelf in RCI is Disney and HGVC, and Disney hasn't deposited 2 bedroom units in ages. HGVC is limited to 9 months so you will only be able to trade back in to Vegas or Orlando, you'll have to be very lucky to pull a Hawaii unit that might be worth $400/night.

I just reserved a cash rental using RCI, a 2 bedroom in Sedona, week 50, Arroyo Roble, $700 for a week. Expedia rate was $223/night.


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See previous response -- all DVC (and HGVC King's land) -- so you are correct.

 

[davidvel]

Oh....so many traps....

Yes, these are not the droids you are looking for. Just plan your dinner.

 

[keen1988]

Two more question, the agent called me yesterday also warned me that I will not get upgrade option for a resale, is that ture? But I read some posts here that resale owners were also invited to some owner update, too, so they got a chance to upgrade?? or they can only buy extra ones?

Another one is about estoppel, will I get it from the resale agent or Hilton? what is it for?

Thanks!

 

[GT75]

Another one is about estoppel, will I get it from the resale agent or Hilton? what is it for?

Someone just posted a partial copy of information on espotopple. You can see what is provided. It comes from HGVC but usually the closing company orders it (assuming you use a closing company). The sellers and buyers name and property will be on this document plus a section on ROFR.
http://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?...ut-not-available-for-use.257985/#post-2018673

 

[WalnutBaron]

Just to expand on GT's response, an estoppel letter is a document issued by the closing company with copies to both the buyer and seller, explaining in full detail exactly what is being exchanged under the purchase contract, at what price, and how funds will be collected and issued to the seller upon completion of the transaction. When you receive this letter, you should review it very carefully because once you sign that document--either by your own hand or electronically--you will not have any opportunity later to make changes or tell your broker that you didn't understand or agree with certain provisions in the letter. During a purchase I made earlier this year, I did find an error and a point of clarification and--when contacting the closing company--they immediately made the corrections and re-issued the document. Remember that your broker and the closing company process scores of these documents monthly and no one is going to read the estoppel letter more closely than you--so take the time to do so.

 

[Talent312]

Of course, the sales-weasel is lying. Resales can get an upgrade option.
At an "owner's update," they offered to credit my resale-TS against a new one.
Of course the deal was crap: Lose a perfectly good TS to pay full-freight for another one.

There are reports that resale-owners are not often invited to "owner's updates" anymore.
No loss there, IMHO.

.

 

[rfc0001]

Of course, the sales-weasel is lying. Resales can get an upgrade option.
At an "owner's update," they offered to credit my resale-TS against a new one.
Of course the deal was crap: Lose a perfectly good TS to pay full-freight for another one.

There are reports that resale-owners are not often invited to "owner's updates" anymore.
No loss there, IMHO.

.

Curious, what price did they offer to pay for your resale? What you paid for it?

Just to note, none of the new HGVC resorts (where HGVC is simply managing the sales and operations but another investor is paying for the development) are available for upgrade - even for direct purchases. Seems they are phasing that out (along with direct development for the most part).