New to Wyndham resale...

[staceyeileen]

Hello! I currently do not own any Wyndham points, but have been doing some research on buying resale on ebay by searching completed listings and trying to learn as much as I can. Since I don't think the ARP will be that important to us, I am concentrating on picking a resort with the lowest maintenance fees over the long term. I do have a few questions about what I've been seeing on ebay though.

Why do maintenance fees seem to vary from one contract to another even when they are for the same resort? I am looking at two specific auctions where there is a large discrepancy in price per point. I thought the MF was set for the resort not per contract?

Also, do all contracts have the ability to pay annually vs. monthly? I have seem some auctions where they state the fees can be paid either way, but then others are specifically stated as $$/month. If I opt to pay annually, what is the savings?

Thank you!

 

[Rent_Share]

IMHO YMMV - I will defer to an actual WVO owner to answer your WVO Question

1. eBay listings are notoriously full of mistakes as to:

• Size of Unit
• Season
• Maintenance Fees
• View
• Sometimes even Resort

2. eBay auctions for real estate are non-binding and you should never complete the transaction unless what can be be confirmed with the estoppal letter from the HOA is equal to or better than what you bid on based on the description

 

[simpsontruckdriver]

There are many reasons why MFs vary. Tax differences, whether it's still being actively sold, location, etc. In terms of payments, there's very little difference between Annual and Monthly. Unlike what eBay ads say, you can change from Monthly to Annual.

As an example, I have 2 contracts at Star Island in Kissimmee FL. I have never stayed there, and my MF+Tax is $0.00505 per point. Then, add $98 "Program Fee".

TS

 

[staceyeileen]

1. eBay listings are notoriously full of mistakes as to:

This is my main concern.

There are many reasons why MFs vary. Tax differences, whether it's still being actively sold, location, etc.

This would apply even for two contracts with the same home resort?

 

[simpsontruckdriver]

The possible reasons for two different MFs at the same resort:

(1) One was a Fixed Week converted to Points
(2) Incorrect information from the eBay reseller.

TS

 

[staceyeileen]

Would there be any disadvantages to owning a contract that was fixed week converted to points?

 

[vacationhopeful]

All fixed weeks have the same MF based on unit size. A converted f/w would h ave a point value based on season of the underlying week. Low season points would be a very bad ratio of MF cost vs a prime point week.

 

[timeos2]

Would there be any disadvantages to owning a contract that was fixed week converted to points?

Conveted fixed weeks ahve limitations such as what week you can use at your home resort that UDI based points (the vast majority of points out there are UDI type) don't. You should pay less for a converted week due to those limitations. I'd wait for a UDI type as they are readily available at most resorts on resale (the ONLY way to buy Wyndham).

 

[staceyeileen]

Hmm, so all points aren't created equal huh??

Here are the specific auctions I was comparing. The first seems like a way better deal... yet the latter is the one that actually got bids. Same resort, Fairfield Mountains. What am I missing?


154k for $63/month http://bit.ly/Py1yyM

105k for $73/month http://bit.ly/Py4oDR

 

[rrlongwell]

Hmm, so all points aren't created equal huh??

Here are the specific auctions I was comparing. The first seems like a way better deal... yet the latter is the one that actually got bids. Same resort, Fairfield Mountains. What am I missing?


154k for $63/month http://bit.ly/Py1yyM

105k for $73/month http://bit.ly/Py4oDR

I will defer to others on the specific resort because I am not very familiar with it. Congratulations on breaking the Code that a Wyndham Point is NOT a Wyndham Point. Below are just a few examples.

1. Maintance fees per point is a well documented difference.
2. Wyndham points through Worldmark are not used at all resorts in other Wyndham systems and vice a versa.
3. ARP rights very with Wyndham Points.
4. Wyndham Points through Club Wyndham Plus are backed by deeds held by the owners of record where Wyndham Points through Club Wyndham Access and Worldmark are not deeds held by the owners, they are held by their respectivie trusts.
5. Special Assessments based on the number of Wyndham Points owned can vary greatly as a function of the resort owned at.
6. Wyndham points, depending on the Wyndham program they are associated with can vary in terms of how many points are needed for reservations based on VIP levels and/or other discount programs/options.
7. Some Wyndham points come with a RCI membership, some with a II membership.
8. Differences in treatment depending how the Wyndham Point is used. An example of this would be VIP privilages at Resort XYZ used through the Wyndham System and Wyndham points used through the Wyndham/RCI portal for the same resort where, as I understand it, Resort VIP rights are not honored. Another example of a similar nature is, unless something has changed, the VIP discounts are not honored through the Wyndham/RCI portal when trading the points for an exchange.
9. The ability to transfer ownership of various types of Wyndham points when you, your heirs, or your estate wishes to do so. The factors that affect this point are which resort the Wyndham point is at. If the Wyndham points are converted fixed weeks and if so, what week is involved, etc.

 

[staceyeileen]

Thank you for the info! One thing is for sure, I will continue to research this before deciding if buying points is right for us. Right now I am trying to price out some vacations we know we'd like to take (and in one case already have planned and reserved via rented Wyndham points) and compare the price to own points vs. rent them. Is this generally a good comparison? The big wildcard seems to be special assessments. It seems to me that a single special assessment can eat up everything you've saved by owning points versus just renting them.

 

[ronparise]

Hmm, so all points aren't created equal huh??

Here are the specific auctions I was comparing. The first seems like a way better deal... yet the latter is the one that actually got bids. Same resort, Fairfield Mountains. What am I missing?


154k for $63/month http://bit.ly/Py1yyM

105k for $73/month http://bit.ly/Py4oDR

The second includes 2012 points that the buyer will be able to use now and no fees until January

The first has no points included and fees start in October

 

[ronparise]

I will defer to others on the specific resort because I am not very familiar with it. Congratulations on breaking the Code that a Wyndham Point is NOT a Wyndham Point. Below are just a few examples.

1. Maintance fees per point is a well documented difference.
2. Wyndham points through Worldmark are not used at all resorts in other Wyndham systems and vice a versa.
3. ARP rights very with Wyndham Points.
4. Wyndham Points through Club Wyndham Plus are backed by deeds held by the owners of record where Wyndham Points through Club Wyndham Access and Worldmark are not deeds held by the owners, they are held by their respectivie trusts.
5. Special Assessments based on the number of Wyndham Points owned can vary greatly as a function of the resort owned at.
6. Wyndham points, depending on the Wyndham program they are associated with can vary in terms of how many points are needed for reservations based on VIP levels and/or other discount programs/options.
7. Some Wyndham points come with a RCI membership, some with a II membership.
8. Differences in treatment depending how the Wyndham Point is used. An example of this would be VIP privilages at Resort XYZ used through the Wyndham System and Wyndham points used through the Wyndham/RCI portal for the same resort where, as I understand it, Resort VIP rights are not honored. Another example of a similar nature is, unless something has changed, the VIP discounts are not honored through the Wyndham/RCI portal when trading the points for an exchange.
9. The ability to transfer ownership of various types of Wyndham points when you, your heirs, or your estate wishes to do so. The factors that affect this point are which resort the Wyndham point is at. If the Wyndham points are converted fixed weeks and if so, what week is involved, etc.

When I say points are points (and I do) I know its an oversimplification. But Im thinking in terms of how the points are used in the standard reservation window..It doesnt matter how they were created or how much they might have cost you; they all spend the same...

And when I say points are points its always in that context...how the points are being used. So shop well and find the best value


Its like 3 guys put up $1000 each to rent a room for next years superbowl. I might say that they all paid exactly the same amount. after all a dollar is a dollar..

But the one guy flips hamburgers for a living at $7 an hour His trip is costing him nearly a months labor

the second guy is a corporate attorney that bills at $500 an hour..his trip costs him just 2 hours of work

and the 3rd guy lives off the interest generated form money he inherited from his grandfather.. he didnt have to work for his trip at all

So is a thousand dollars a thousand dollars??? certainly not in in terms of how the money was earned, but yes in terms of how it was spent

 

[staceyeileen]

Thank you for all the help thus far. I am still here researching and am now an official TUG member.

A question on special assessments. If a resort has had a recent special assessment, is that generally a sign of bad money management and therefore a good idea to stay away from purchasing there for fear of more assessments down the road? Or, do you view it as a sign that the resort should have sufficient funds post-assessment to not have another one for a very long time?

Obviously, it's hard to make a blanket statement, but in GENERAL, what is YOUR opinion?

 

[Cheryl20772]

Thank you for all the help thus far. I am still here researching and am now an official TUG member.

A question on special assessments. If a resort has had a recent special assessment, is that generally a sign of bad money management and therefore a good idea to stay away from purchasing there for fear of more assessments down the road? Or, do you view it as a sign that the resort should have sufficient funds post-assessment to not have another one for a very long time?

Obviously, it's hard to make a blanket statement, but in GENERAL, what is YOUR opinion?

What will trigger an SA? When we owned at Kingsgate, there was an SA to bring the resort up to code and abate a mold problem. Was that from bad management? I can't say.

Earlier this month I got a letter from another resort we own saying there's a meeting on July 20th to vote on an SA of "$90-$100 per owner" (not per size unit owned). The purpose of the SA is to fill the operating fund deficit caused by steadily increasing bad debts for uncollected owner assessments. Would that be caused by "bad money management"? How many other resorts are sitting on similar SA bombs? Another year we had an SA from that resort to obtain the deductible on insurance coverage for repairs after a hurricane. Things do happen and someone has to pay the bills one way or another. I don't think it's a safe assumption that just because there was a recent SA, there will not be another one.

 

[staceyeileen]

Thanks to all the help on this board, I found what I think is a good deal on an EOY even contract and have started the transfer process. My intent is to couple this with an EOY odd contract if I see one that suits my needs. I know I've read that Wyndham combines multiple contracts into one account, but is this true if I don't already have an account? just wondering if I should hold off on looking for a 2nd contract until my first is successfully transferred and I have access to the account, or does it make no difference? I don't want to end up with two different accounts.

 

[rrlongwell]

Thanks to all the help on this board, I found what I think is a good deal on an EOY even contract and have started the transfer process. My intent is to couple this with an EOY odd contract if I see one that suits my needs. I know I've read that Wyndham combines multiple contracts into one account, but is this true if I don't already have an account? just wondering if I should hold off on looking for a 2nd contract until my first is successfully transferred and I have access to the account, or does it make no difference? I don't want to end up with two different accounts.

To be on the safe side, not a bad idea.

 

[learnalot]

To be on the safe side, not a bad idea.

I agree that it might involve less hassle if you receive get an account number for your first contract and then add additional contracts to that account.

 

[staceyeileen]

Will do. Thats what I figured. Must stop stalking eBay now!