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Another ROFR, darn...

mcernik said:
WKORV-N EOY ODD 2BDR OCEAN VIEW - $12,225

Stinkers.... Giving up trying for now..
Click to expand...

Perfect example of why ROFR hurts everyone. Now there is a buyer who won't offer because after he does the work it is taken from hm. So future sellers have one less buyer meaning they are more likely to have NO offers - thus sit unable to sell what they own at ANY price! It hurts the market, does nothing to support prices in fact may depress them and lead to lower prices in sellers desperation to sell. If it does the BUYERS don't benefit - the ROFR holder will after doing NOTHING but stealing the week & depressing the value. So the next buyer someone manages to find -IF they can - will wisely offer less - the ROFR holder gets it even cheaper and another buyer just exits the market for equal or better places without the nightmare of ROFR. It is a very bad joke that hurts Owners, buyers and timeshare in general.
 
Yeah, I'm not going to pay more for it. That was the whole benefit of buying resale. So now I wait till the units get back to affordable. A timeshare isn't something I NEED. Especially when you are paying MF's on non usage years.
 
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timeos2 said:
Perfect example of why ROFR hurts everyone. Now there is a buyer who won't offer because after he does the work it is taken from hm. So future sellers have one less buyer meaning they are more likely to have NO offers - thus sit unable to sell what they own at ANY price! It hurts the market, does nothing to support prices in fact may depress them and lead to lower prices in sellers desperation to sell. If it does the BUYERS don't benefit - the ROFR holder will after doing NOTHING but stealing the week & depressing the value. So the next buyer someone manages to find -IF they can - will wisely offer less - the ROFR holder gets it even cheaper and another buyer just exits the market for equal or better places without the nightmare of ROFR. It is a very bad joke that hurts Owners, buyers and timeshare in general.
Click to expand...

So, the "seller gets paid either way" argument doesn't work for you either?

Careful, or we might inadvertently stumble back into the taboo subject, well at least here on the SVO board, of theorizing about potential remedies.

-nodge
 
nodge said:
So, the "seller gets paid either way" argument doesn't work for you either?

Careful, or we might inadvertently stumble back into the taboo subject, well at least here on the SVO board, of theorizing about potential remedies.

-nodge
Click to expand...

Yes the seller gets paid the LOW amount either way BUT it gets harder & harder to find anyone even willing to offer if they think it wull just be taken from them after they (and the seller) do all the work. It just isn't a positive thing and needlessly adds even more roadblocks to an already tough market.
 
mcernik said:
Yeah, I'm not going to pay more for it. That was the whole benefit of buying resale. So now I wait till the units get back to affordable. A timeshare isn't something I NEED. Especially when you are paying MF's on non usage years.
Click to expand...

Disappointing. But, your complaint re payment timing doesn't make sense. You're paying half the annual usage every year, so it's not like you're paying more for your usage than anyone else who owns there. I believe there's a $20 or so fee for eoy owners, so it's slightly more than annual.

And.. I'd suggest buying WKV and simply trade in using staroptions. You'll pay about half as much for MF as well.
 
Ken555 said:
And.. I'd suggest buying WKV and simply trade in using staroptions. You'll pay about half as much for MF as well.
Click to expand...

But he was trying to purchase an oceanview, which you would not be guaranteed if you exchanged in from another SVO resort using Staroptions...
 
J&JFamily said:
But he was trying to purchase an oceanview, which you would not be guaranteed if you exchanged in from another SVO resort using Staroptions...
Click to expand...

True, though in my experience you have a good chance of getting one anyway. But, at this point in my opinion I'd simply rent.
 
mcernik said:
WKORV-N EOY ODD 2BDR OCEAN VIEW - $12,225

Stinkers.... Giving up trying for now..
Click to expand...

Starwood is now learning from Hilton on how to play this game to acquire cheap inventory and resell (instead of developing new resorts to sell).
 
Confused????!!!!????

timeos2 said:
Perfect example of why ROFR hurts everyone. Now there is a buyer who won't offer because after he does the work it is taken from hm. So future sellers have one less buyer meaning they are more likely to have NO offers - thus sit unable to sell what they own at ANY price! It hurts the market, does nothing to support prices in fact may depress them and lead to lower prices in sellers desperation to sell. If it does the BUYERS don't benefit - the ROFR holder will after doing NOTHING but stealing the week & depressing the value. So the next buyer someone manages to find -IF they can - will wisely offer less - the ROFR holder gets it even cheaper and another buyer just exits the market for equal or better places without the nightmare of ROFR. It is a very bad joke that hurts Owners, buyers and timeshare in general.
Click to expand...

I thought that ROFR help support prices and kept them from bottoming out to the $1 Ebay sale. What am I missing or where did I go wrong in reading this? Maybe not in this particular forum, but definitely on this board. You can't have it both ways; so which way is really better? Selling for $12,225 is better than $1, plus paying all closing cost and MF is it not?

Gordon
 
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DrBopp said:
I thought that ROFR help support prices and kept them from bottoming out to the $1 Ebay sale. What am I missing or where did I go wrong in reading this? Maybe not in this particular forum, but definitely on this board. You can't have it both ways; so which way is really better? Selling for $12,225 is better than $1, plus paying all closing cost and MF is it not?

Gordon
Click to expand...

One explanation is that you get the highest price when you have the most buyers (or bidders). A ROFR where it is widely known that it will be exercised at a certain price adds one additional phantom bidder. So in some circumstances a bidder will bid higher than they normally would because they know they have competition from the ROFR.

However, in the overall scheme of things, the existence of a ROFR lowers the overall number of bidders because many don't want to deal with the hassles involved. So with less bidders, the lower the price. You may never get an offer that come close to what Starwood would be willing to exercise its ROFR. So the lower offer you get because you have less bidders is what the ROFR will match, ultimately causing you to lose money compared to if you had more bidders involved.

It's a similar analysis with auctions with reserves vs. starting bids of $1 with no reserve. You get higher prices with the later because a lot of people don't bother with auctions with reserves because so many of them have unrealistic reserve prices, making a lot of those auctions a complete waste of time. Less bidder=lower price.
 
sjuhawk_jd said:
Starwood is now learning from Hilton on how to play this game to acquire cheap inventory and resell (instead of developing new resorts to sell).
Click to expand...

So if Starwood buys these units back ROFR on the resale market and then resell them, do they come with SOs? Can this new buyer also exchange for SPs?
 
Westin5Star said:
So if Starwood buys these units back ROFR on the resale market and then resell them, do they come with SOs? Can this new buyer also exchange for SPs?
Click to expand...

Yes! I believe so. Disney does this all the time with the reacquired points they get from ROFR. As a matter of fact, my sales rep told me they were ROFRing my Beach Club points since it was a sold out resort and I sort of 'watched' it happen in front of my eyes. Then they appeared in THEIR database and voila, they resold them to me with full developer benefits.

Katherine
 
Thanks Katherine. I guess that I had assumed that the developer was a serarate entity than the one doing the ROFR.
 
If SVO uses their ROFR, it now becomes part of their inventory and within their system (SVN, SO-SP conversion rights) when they sell, but at a very high premium as with a normal SVO sale.

Opens up an interesting question - what happens with a foreclosure of a SVO VOI. If this VOI is taken by the HOA - does it get full SVO rights when resold? What about one taken up at auction?

For example: A foreclosed Voluntary VOI gets SVN and SO-SP conversion and a foreclosed Mandatory property gets SO-SP conversion.
 
ROFR and Value

If Starwood exercises their ROFR, it would seem to me that the price agreed upon by the seller and bidder is lower than market value, since Starwood will buy it for AT least that much.
Isn't the message .... sell your timeshare for more money?

A true ROFR is a lien against a title, the deed cannot transfer if the holder of the ROFR exercises their right of first refusal...so I guess in this case it's a sellers market!!
 
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