Using Wyndham Pathways to exit my timeshare ownership

[MikeFTC]

I attended an update at National Harbor in April, and my salesperson told me that I was eligible to give back my ownership through the Pathways program. I was very skeptical because no one either at an update nor at member services had ever told me I could do this, and she was very aggressive in trying to get me to then purchase more points to get into the Travel and Leisure program. Had I accepted the offer, it would have cost an additional 19,000 dollars. She stated that although I would be losing my VIP membership, and reducing my points to one quarter of what I own now, I would "benefit" by lowering my maintenance fees, and have access to T&L discounts. Obviously, I declined the offer. My question is, because I converted to Wyndham during the period when Pathways was being offered, is that an option for me to exit my timeshare?

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

I attended an update at National Harbor in April, and my salesperson told me that I was eligible to give back my ownership through the Pathways program. I was very skeptical because no one either at an update nor at member services had ever told me I could do this, and she was very aggressive in trying to get me to then purchase more points to get into the Travel and Leisure program. Had I accepted the offer, it would have cost an additional 19,000 dollars. She stated that although I would be losing my VIP membership, and reducing my points to one quarter of what I own now, I would "benefit" by lowering my maintenance fees, and have access to T&L discounts. Obviously, I declined the offer. My question is, because I converted to Wyndham during the period when Pathways was being offered, is that an option for me to exit my timeshare?

Do you still owe a mortgage on your Wyndham contract? Wyndham has a free exit program called “Certified Exit” that you can use if you don’t owe any money on a loan.

 

[Jan M.]

Only whatever you purchased back when Pathways was being offered is eligible. The deal with Pathways was UP TO 20% of you paid, before the various additional charges, on what Wyndham is willing to take back. There was no guarantee that what you bought at that time was or would be taken back nor was the max of 20% guaranteed.

You can do just as well and sometimes better on various free sites to get the discounts Travel & Leisure offers. The general consensus here is that buying to get T&L is a complete waste of money.

Now about saving you money on the maintenance fees. Unless the basic cost before the extra costs on purchase you made that got you Pathways was close to $100k then you're money in the hole with a new purchase of $19k. You didn't say how many points they were offering for that $19k but I'm guessing it was probably less than 154k points. Of course if you own fewer points your maintenance fees are going to be less. That's Wyndham's typical fake math, bait and switch nonsense.

Here's what's really sickening about what Wyndham salespeople have done to a number of uninformed owners. They've conned way too many owners into giving up contracts at resorts with the highly desirable lowest maintenance fees and typically got those owners to buy something like Club Wyndham Access points with much, much higher maintenance fees. The owners often found they only owed slight less on significantly less points and in some cases they actually owed more!

You didn't say what level VIP you are but I can't think of any good reason to give that up unless you're having financial difficulties that are going to be long term.

You're grandfathered with unlimited housekeeping credits. For the past several years unlimited housekeeping credits is something Wyndham no longer gives new VIP owners. The way it now works if you aren't VIP is one housekeeping credit per 70k points given annually. They don't carry over. Unit size no longer matters and each reservation of 2-14 nights requires one housekeeping credit. If you run out, they're $159.

 

[Jan M.]

If you do have and want to use Pathways, it doesn't require a new purchase to do so.

Also from what I've seen posted in the last year by owners who've used their Pathways option, it takes 4-6 months. I'd guess the 4 months would be if it's Club Wyndham Access points since there's no deed involved with CWA points. If it's deeded points then it's likely to be more like 6 months. You'll still be paying maintenance fees until it's completed.

 

[rickandcindy23]

These sales' pitches are just creepy.

 

[MikeFTC]

Do you still owe a mortgage on your Wyndham contract? Wyndham has a free exit program called “Certified Exit” that you can use if you don’t owe any money on a loan.

I tried that. I originally purchased into the points program of RCI, at Smugglers Notch, and several years later, purchased Access points directly through Wyndham and converted the RCI points. Only the Access points are eligible for Certified Exit.

 

[MikeFTC]

Only whatever you purchased back when Pathways was being offered is eligible. The deal with Pathways was UP TO 20% of you paid, before the various additional charges, on what Wyndham is willing to take back. There was no guarantee that what you bought at that time was or would be taken back nor was the max of 20% guaranteed.

You can do just as well and sometimes better on various free sites to get the discounts Travel & Leisure offers. The general consensus here is that buying to get T&L is a complete waste of money.

Now about saving you money on the maintenance fees. Unless the basic cost before the extra costs on purchase you made that got you Pathways was close to $100k then you're money in the hole with a new purchase of $19k. You didn't say how many points they were offering for that $19k but I'm guessing it was probably less than 154k points. Of course if you own fewer points your maintenance fees are going to be less. That's Wyndham's typical fake math, bait and switch nonsense.

Here's what's really sickening about what Wyndham salespeople have done to a number of uninformed owners. They've conned way too many owners into giving up contracts at resorts with the highly desirable lowest maintenance fees and typically got those owners to buy something like Club Wyndham Access points with much, much higher maintenance fees. The owners often found they only owed slight less on significantly less points and in some cases they actually owed more!

You didn't say what level VIP you are but I can't think of any good reason to give that up unless you're having financial difficulties that are going to be long term.

You're grandfathered with unlimited housekeeping credits. For the past several years unlimited housekeeping credits is something Wyndham no longer gives new VIP owners. The way it now works if you aren't VIP is one housekeeping credit per 70k points given annually. They don't carry over. Unit size no longer matters and each reservation of 2-14 nights requires one housekeeping credit. If you run out, they're $159.

Thank you for your response. As I stated, I have no interest in purchasing more points or converting what I already have. I have spoken to several salespeople at updates and member services, and have been told by all of them that only my Access points are eligible for Certified Access, not the points I originally purchased into RCI points and later converted to a Wyndham contract. The agent at National Harbor is the first person connected to Wyndham to tell me that all of my Access and converted points could be turned into the Pathways program. The 19,000 dollar deal would have given me 84,000 Access points. Since I have over 250,000 points between Access and the converted deeded points, obviously it would be a very bad deal for me.

 

[Jan M.]

Thank you for your response. As I stated, I have no interest in purchasing more points or converting what I already have. I have spoken to several salespeople at updates and member services, and have been told by all of them that only my Access points are eligible for Certified Access, not the points I originally purchased into RCI points and later converted to a Wyndham contract. The agent at National Harbor is the first person connected to Wyndham to tell me that all of my Access and converted points could be turned into the Pathways program. The 19,000 dollar deal would have given me 84,000 Access points. Since I have over 250,000 points between Access and the converted deeded points, obviously it would be a very bad deal for me.

Did you convert what you had as part of the same purchase of the CWA points? If so then you might have Pathways on all of it. That would be great if you do ever decide to divest yourself of your ownership.

There are only few resorts Wyndham isn't accepting back through Certified Exit and that list has been known to change. Which resort are your converted points at?

I wonder if you would be given the option to decide between doing Pathways or the Limited option of Certified Exit that would give you 3 years use of the points with no maintenance fees. The only downside I'm aware of with the Certified Exit Limited option is that you can only use stays for yourself, no guest certificates.

Salespeople shouldn't be regarded as a reliable source because their primary goal is to sell you more points. They will say pretty much anything to do that. Anymore Owner Care often isn't a reliable source either. Mainly because they're poorly trained and often don't even really understand the owners questions. It's become extremely difficult to get your call escalated to actually talk to an Owner Care supervisor or manager. Typically the entry level Owner Care rep, most likely working from home, will do a quick online chat with their supervisor. That usually works about as well as you'd expect when they don't even understand the issue to start with. It's so frustrating! TUG has now become an even more invaluable resource for owners.

 

[Happy Hopian]

I agree on the owner care issue Jan. The front line folks should do reservation booking and leave the ownership issues to the veteran folks. I will say that the last couple of times I've needed something I just call in and tell them I was on hold for OC and they transfer me through. One time I had a person say they needed to help me first but that was resolved with d/c and redial. I'd rather wait on hold for 10 minutes, then have someone who knows less than me tell me I'm wrong when I'm reading it from the directory...and of course I've never had OC tell me I'm wrong when I'm tellling them what page it is on.

 

[tschwa2]

I attended an update at National Harbor in April, and my salesperson told me that I was eligible to give back my ownership through the Pathways program. I was very skeptical because no one either at an update nor at member services had ever told me I could do this, and she was very aggressive in trying to get me to then purchase more points to get into the Travel and Leisure program. Had I accepted the offer, it would have cost an additional 19,000 dollars. She stated that although I would be losing my VIP membership, and reducing my points to one quarter of what I own now, I would "benefit" by lowering my maintenance fees, and have access to T&L discounts. Obviously, I declined the offer. My question is, because I converted to Wyndham during the period when Pathways was being offered, is that an option for me to exit my timeshare?

You need to pull out your contract of when you converted to see if there is any mention of Pathways. If it is not specifially addressed in your contract, you don't have it regardless of your purchase history during the time it was offered. It was not offered in all markets and even when it was, if they throught they could make the sale without it, they sometimes didn't even include it even when the purchase was eligible. I wouldn't go by anything the salesperson told you. He/she probably has only the vaguest idea of how pathways or any exit program for that matter works. I would be surprised if your conversion qualifies for pathways. If you had to make an additional purchase when you converted the additional purchase may qualify if it is in the contract.