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ROFR- Marriott Complains about 2nd offer

mike2200

mike2200

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2005
Messages
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Location
Calif
My Real estate broker just advised me that when he resubmitted my accepted offer, at a higher price for a Marriott unit, that he was advised that Marriott doesn't like it when they receive a 2nd offer on a property they have used ROFR to try to obtain.

Has anybody ran into this? And if so with what results-
 
Nothing To See Here.

Move along.
 
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Wait--

If Marriott exercised ROFR, then you could not submit a second offer. The unit would belong to Marriott. The way that ROFR works, if you submit an offer, and you and the seller agree, they have to run it by Marriott. If Marriott wants, it can then agree to purchase the unit at the price upon which you agreed. If it does, then it has exercised its ROFR, there has been offer and acceptance, and it will own the unit once it pays the price. If it does not exercise ROFR, then you become the owner once you pay.

There is no "exercise" of ROFR, then you get to submit a higher offer, and Marriott decides whether it will let you take it. Sounds to me like the seller/broker are running a little scam on you, using a phony exercise of ROFR to get you to pay more for the unit.
 
Hoc said:
Wait--

If Marriott exercised ROFR, then you could not submit a second offer. The unit would belong to Marriott. The way that ROFR works, if you submit an offer, and you and the seller agree, they have to run it by Marriott. If Marriott wants, it can then agree to purchase the unit at the price upon which you agreed. If it does, then it has exercised its ROFR, there has been offer and acceptance, and it will own the unit once it pays the price. If it does not exercise ROFR, then you become the owner once you pay.

There is no "exercise" of ROFR, then you get to submit a higher offer, and Marriott decides whether it will let you take it. Sounds to me like the seller/broker are running a little scam on you, using a phony exercise of ROFR to get you to pay more for the unit.
Click to expand...

I have submited a ROFR three times before Marriott waived their right to purchase. So, it is not true that you can't submit a ROFR to Marriott more than once. Maybe the salesperson told them that because they didn't like doing it.
 
saturn28 said:
I have submited a ROFR three times before Marriott waived their right to purchase. So, it is not true that you can't submit a ROFR to Marriott more than once. Maybe the salesperson told them that because they didn't like doing it.
Click to expand...

Sounds to me like there are some unethical folks out there using Marriott's ROFR to extract more money out of buyers when Marriott is not exercising it. The bottom line is that that is not how a ROFR works. Check your contract and you'll see how it operates.
 
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Hoc is correct. If Marriott exercises the ROFR, the deal is done, Marriott has contracted to purchase the unit for the agreed upon price. That unit is off the market- go find another one or find a broker who isn't playing this game!
 
I believe it is more like, that is the way it is "supposed" to work, but I have read of many people making second offers to be able to get past ROFR.

Marriott can't force you sign over your deed after they have executed ROFR unless they do so through a law suit. It is the buyer who usually asks for a second higher offer to be made in order to get it to pass. Of course, the seller will be more than willing to accept the extra money.

Reputable brokers like Seth will not make second offers from what I have read.

:D
 
Surprise, surprise..... another clever scam in the shark infested waters of resales.

Eric
 
LAX Mom said:
Hoc is correct. If Marriott exercises the ROFR, the deal is done, Marriott has contracted to purchase the unit for the agreed upon price. That unit is off the market- go find another one or find a broker who isn't playing this game!
Click to expand...

How much would you be willing to wager.

I phoned Marriott resales department after I made an offer on a week at Grande Vista that Marriott picked up. I asked the Marriott resales agent if I could give the seller another offer and send it in and the they said yes. I asked how many times I could do this and the person said it was up to me. They told me they couldn't tell me what price Marriott would waive their right to purchase but I could continue to submit offers until they waived their right to purchase.

So, I phoned the seller and told them and they were more than willing to re-submit the offer at a higher price. There was no sales agent involved just me and the seller. We made up another sales agreement and emailed it to Marriott. We did this once more and then Marriott waived their right.

So there is nothing strange going on. If you want, phone Marriott resales department and ask any agent that answers the phone.
 
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saturn28 said:
How much would you be willing to wager.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I never make a bet unless I'm sure I'm right! In this case you obviously have more experience dealing with Marriott than I do.
Although I haven't reviewed the exact contractual terms that give Marriott a ROFR, I don't think this is the way the ROFR is supposed to work. I'd look for another seller or broker before I'd play the ROFR game (Guess the price??)with Marriott.
 
I has both experiences with 2 different brokers, so I don't know the right answer. One broker (when I tried to by Surf Club) told me I could not resubmit a higher bid after the ROFR. Another broker (When I tried to buy an MMC) said I could, and we actually went up 1k and still got ROFRed, I stopped after that. (So you know, the MMC was the same unit, seller, etc)


Eric F said:
Surprise, surprise..... another clever scam in the shark infested waters of resales.

Eric
Click to expand...

What would the scam be? The broker who resubmits bids only gets that one commission if they resubmit the bid three times. The commission would not be that much greater more because the new bids are probably small bumps. A broker would probably make more money letting the ROFR go thru and getting the client to bid on a new one. The only advantage I see is if it takes forever for them to get their money from Marriott?
 
Don't you just love the developer.....

Alright; let’s hear it for the ROFR – it seems to be doing what it is supposed to do – keep resale prices higher! This is great proof of its purpose and that it does work.

Keep those re-submittals coming! Higher resale prices are great for everyone, including Marriott.

Thanks Marriott for supporting higher resale prices.

This does not seem to be a scam but a kind and gentle Marriott allowing the owner a second bite of the apple.

P.S.
If Marriott doesn't want second offers then it can easily update its edicts and none will be allowed. Until then push that envelope.

Don't you just love it when the buyer demands to pay higher prices - thank the ROFR!

Now don't you wish every developer had the ROFR; the value of your timeshare would be worth a lot more and the developer would be your ally instead of your opponent.
 
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So if you go back a 2nd and 3rd time do you pay the $95 ROFR fee each time?
 
thanks for the responses

I have told my broker to look at TUG for the feedback on the ROFR 2nd offer responses-

He will contact Marriott today to double check on the offer-

Pricing on buying a timeshare is much like buying a home today, with buyers trying to get it as low as possible and the seller depending on circumstances trying to unload the property. And of course then we have Marriott willing to buy any unit purchased at a low price so they can resell it to a retail buyer at 90% more .

So as a resale buyer I am working towards finding that fine line that will allow the property to pass the ROFR but still as low as I can get it. Isn't this the resale purchase benefit?

But as a buyer I will walk away if the number would have to go beyond what I am willing to pay and since there are lots of units for sale I will merely make another offer until I can pick one up for the price I am willing to pay.
 
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If you have a good broker that deals with Marriott all the time, you shouldn't have to re-submit offers. The broker will have sent in enough sales agreements to know what will pass and what won't pass Marriott's ROFR. So, the broker may not be too enthused about re-submitting low offers because it is a waste of their time.

I did it myself and wasn't using a broker. Therefore, I wasn't wasting anyones time. The seller didn't mine because they were going to get more money for their week.
 
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offers on resales

I don't think it is about a broker advising what he thinks you should offer to get past ROFR, it is really about being the buyer and buying the property for the best price you can get it at...and what you feel is a good price for you

And if you make several offers and repeat the ROFR on the same property and then get it for what you (the buyer) thinks is still a good price, it all comes out good- the seller makes more money the buyer gets a price he is happy with-
 
mike2200 said:
I don't think it is about a broker advising what he thinks you should offer to get past ROFR, it is really about being the buyer and buying the property for the best price you can get it at...and what you feel is a good price for you

And if you make several offers and repeat the ROFR on the same property and then get it for what you (the buyer) thinks is still a good price, it all comes out good- the seller makes more money the buyer gets a price he is happy with-
Click to expand...

I agree. this is the way to get the very best price possible. As has been discussed here on Tug so many times, the ROFR number changes day to day. Why would one offer a higher price at the suggestion of a broker when it is possible that your first lower offer goes right through - other than the possibility of a little lost time.

:D
 
thinze3 said:
I agree. this is the way to get the very best price possible. As has been discussed here on Tug so many times, the ROFR number changes day to day. Why would one offer a higher price at the suggestion of a broker when it is possible that your first lower offer goes right through - other than the possibility of a little lost time.

:D
Click to expand...

That may be the best way for the buyer. However, a broker may look at it a different way. I say this because I phoned Remax one time to put in an offer on a Marriott property and the agent told me they have had offers bought back by Marriott at that price. So, they said they had it priced at a level that it would pass ROFR, but there may be some room for a bit of a reduction in price.

I must say that the price they had it listed for was quite low. In fact, that was what attracted me to the week. However, it is always nice to try and squeeze just a little bit more out of the seller.
 
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Hoc said:
Wait--

If Marriott exercised ROFR, then you could not submit a second offer. The unit would belong to Marriott. The way that ROFR works, if you submit an offer, and you and the seller agree, they have to run it by Marriott. If Marriott wants, it can then agree to purchase the unit at the price upon which you agreed. If it does, then it has exercised its ROFR, there has been offer and acceptance, and it will own the unit once it pays the price. If it does not exercise ROFR, then you become the owner once you pay.

There is no "exercise" of ROFR, then you get to submit a higher offer, and Marriott decides whether it will let you take it. Sounds to me like the seller/broker are running a little scam on you, using a phony exercise of ROFR to get you to pay more for the unit.
Click to expand...

This is true, real estate wise, anything else would be unscrupulous practices. Their ROFR right is an exclusive right to purchase.
 
ROFR-contract

I have since learned that Marriott mails out a contract to the seller and they must sign and return it to complete the ROFR-purchase

If not signed and returned the seller can look at higher offers and then have them submitted to Marriott for ROFR- The seller just can't accept the orginal offer from the resale buyer

Marriott then goes through the process of deciding to buy the timeshare at the new current offer price- this is why Marriott attempts to avoid 2nd and 3rd offers as this makes more paperwork for them to process each time the offer is upped-
 
mike2200 said:
I have since learned that Marriott mails out a contract to the seller and they must sign and return it to complete the ROFR-purchase

If not signed and returned the seller can look at higher offers and then have them submitted to Marriott for ROFR- The seller just can't accept the orginal offer from the resale buyer

Marriott then goes through the process of deciding to buy the timeshare at the new current offer price- this is why Marriott attempts to avoid 2nd and 3rd offers as this makes more paperwork for them to process each time the offer is upped-
Click to expand...

This must be new, when we purchased in early 2007 they did not send out a contract to the seller to sign and return. If they did our purchase would have taken much longer than the already long delay caused by our seller.
 
Marriott's Maui Ocean Club taken on ROFR!

I have dropped out of the buying of this timeshare (a ocean view 2bd 3ba yearly use) and Marriott has exercised its ROFR with the seller thus the unit was purchased back by Marriott for $30K as my offer had been $32.5k which included closing cost and 2008 MF fees...so there you have it Marriott will now turn around and sell this to some nice buyer for 59K who will get to say they bought it from the developer at a deal-

Now I will just be making another offer on the same type of unit-perhaps I will get a commission from Marriott for these great deals they get-or I will eventually just pick one up for 30k
 
mike2200 said:
I have dropped out of the buying of this timeshare (a ocean view 2bd 3ba yearly use) and Marriott has exercised its ROFR with the seller thus the unit was purchased back by Marriott for $30K as my offer had been $32.5k which included closing cost and 2008 MF fees...so there you have it Marriott will now turn around and sell this to some nice buyer for 59K who will get to say they bought it from the developer at a deal-

Now I will just be making another offer on the same type of unit-perhaps I will get a commission from Marriott for these great deals they get-or I will eventually just pick one up for 30k
Click to expand...

If the current price is $59k (Ocean View) then 60% of that is $35,400 so anything less is ripe for a ROFR.

There are plenty of Mauis for sale on RedWeek – from $28k to $35k plenty more to try.

Sounds like the ROFR is doing its job of keeping prices near $35k with Marriott gladly snapping up firesale priced units.

Good luck,
 
Rofr Gives Marriott Absolute Right To Buy Ts

For what its worth, here is the opinion of an old (59) retired lawyer:

When a buyer and seller agree on a price and enter an agreement there is a binding contract. Marriott then has the right to exercise its option to purchase the TS at the price agreed upon by the buyer and seller. If Marriott exercises its ROFR then it has the absolute right to demand that the seller transfer the TS to Marriott at the price agreed upon in the contract between buyer and seller. The buyer and seller cannot try to circumvent Marriott’s option to purchase by submitting new offers, unless Marriott agrees to allow it.

I agree with Perry, Marriott’s ROFR helps support the resale price of its units and the ROFR is a good thing for those of us that purchased directly from Marriott.

Nonetheless, Marriott is under no obligation to use its ROFR to purchase any TS. It can do so, or not do so, whenever it likes and for whatever reason is chooses. We cannot count on Marriott to support the price of TSs if the market falls in a recession.
 
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