Point rip-off

[tiger1210]

I own a platinum week at Shadow Ridge - Jan-May or so. To convert my 2-bedroom week to DCP I would get 3075 points. If I wanted to stay at my timeshare during that time it would cost 4,000 points. How is that a deal? I will never convert my unit for points! I now can lock-off and get 2 weeks of vacation. And I have traded to great places including Hawaii 5 times. I couldn't stay in Hawaii for 3 nights using 3075 points. Someone tell me how this new system is really any good for someone who stays somewhere for a week?

 

[rthib]

Someone tell me how this new system is really any good for someone who stays somewhere for a week?

That is not what it is designed for.

However, if you are like me and need a 3 or 4 days stay, trading a week to get only 4 days is a huge week rip-off.

Luckily, Marriott has given us the option to do what we want.

If you never want to trade for points, then you never have to and there is no rip-off, but for many the flexibility to trade a week for points is a huge advantage.

And you can also use it to extend stays.
I too own Shadow Ridge. I can split one year and deposit one side.
Then use next year for points to make my week stays into 12 days stays.
I get cheaper airfare and more time.

When kids go on Vacation for a week, with points we can go from Friday - Sun, Not Fri-Friday. Extra times is great. And since I am enrolled, I don't even need my own points, I can easily rent points from someone else.

Even without the points, the savings on Split and Exchange fees for my multiple weeks make this a savings.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

I own a platinum week at Shadow Ridge - Jan-May or so. To convert my 2-bedroom week to DCP I would get 3075 points. If I wanted to stay at my timeshare during that time it would cost 4,000 points. How is that a deal? I will never convert my unit for points! I now can lock-off and get 2 weeks of vacation. And I have traded to great places including Hawaii 5 times. I couldn't stay in Hawaii for 3 nights using 3075 points. Someone tell me how this new system is really any good for someone who stays somewhere for a week?

I think you have answered your own question. Why would you convert your week to DC points just to come back to your home resort? That makes no sense. Occupy your home resort week by all means and take advantage of your use period.

Converting to points makes sense when you desire additional flexibility in unit size, view category, time of year, reservation length, differrent experience, etc.

Those 3075 points gets some pretty good vacations at other locations. You might even be able to get 10 days or more with those points. Now it won't be in Hawaii but there are other options which can lead to good quality vacations as well.

Sounds like you are happy with your legacy unit vacations then why even consider converting?

 

[SueDonJ]

That's what TUGgers are calling "skim." In most cases, the amount of DC Points allotted to a Week is not enough to book that same week through the DC Exchange Company. Also, in many cases, the DC allotments may not provide enough Points for exchanges which are similar to the like-for-like and/or uptrades that some Weeks get from II.

However, enrolling a Week in the DC does not equate to a permanent exchange of the Week to DC Points. It's simply another usage option that can be elected on an annual basis.

Many owners of single Weeks have determined that it is cost effective to enroll their Weeks and continue to use them as they always have. If you routinely lock-off and/or exchange through II, which it sounds like you do, you may be one of the owners who will see an eventual cost savings through DC enrollment.

This thread may help to answer your questions. (Note the info in it has not been updated to reflect the 6/14/12 enrollment price increase, to $2,395 for all Weeks.)

 

[bobmcgraw]

I agree with others that have said the points program is not designed for optimizing the use of your owned weeks at your home resort.

It is designed for flexibility.

For me, it has been a great addition to my options. I have used points to:

1) upgrade my view from island view to ocean view
2) extend my stay from 7 days to 9 days
3) after my home resort stay, add a couple days at a resort that I don't own to see if I like it
4) rent to other points owners.

This last option is particularly nice since I don't have to worry about renting my whole week. I just rent the points, transfer them to the other owner and they get to stay where they want, when they want and they make their own reservation.

If none of these are of interest, not enrolling and using your week is a fine option.

 

[tiger1210]

Great replies. Thanks. I think I would always do netter to keep my weeks, deposit to interval and exchange for 2 weeks a year. I think it's more bang for my buck. I did do the upgrade last year for $599, but I won't do anymore.

 

[Bill4728]

We have two weeks at NCV Newport Coast. One week is in the DC, the other was bought after the cutoff. We use one to generate points (2750 pts for our gold week) and use the other to stay at the resort.

We use points for things like this:
We 're staying at NCV during plat season (but the low demand fall) for 5 days and using only 1500 pts. We'll still have almost 1300 pts left so we can do this again (renting the extra 200 pts needed for about $100) at time between do and next June. So our 7 days of NCV ownership gets us (two) 5 day vacations to our home resort.

If we want to extend our stay in SoCal we can use hotel points to stay at a hotel in the general area that is close enough to drive to but far enough away from the resort to make a there and back day trip a pain ( like 2 days in San Deigo or Santa Barbara)

 

[SueDonJ]

Great replies. Thanks. I think I would always do netter to keep my weeks, deposit to interval and exchange for 2 weeks a year. I think it's more bang for my buck. I did do the upgrade last year for $599, but I won't do anymore.

Oh, I'm sorry, I thought you were wondering whether you should enroll or not. But since you have already (and at the lower price before the 6/12 increase) is there a reason why you won't continue to pay the annual Club Dues fee to take advantage of the cost savings between that and the per-transaction fees of un-enrolled weeks?

Or by "won't do anymore" do you mean that you'll stay enrolled but won't convert your Week to Points? In which case, nevermind.

 

[Mamianka]

Great replies. Thanks. I think I would always do netter to keep my weeks, deposit to interval and exchange for 2 weeks a year. I think it's more bang for my buck. I did do the upgrade last year for $599, but I won't do anymore.

We own an annual 2BR lockoff at Grand Chateau, and a EOY lockoff at Beach Place Towers. If we have to spend a week together in a guest room, we will kill each other - no matter how much in love we are now, after 40 years together. So, we keep the BPT, because the guest room is larger than some others, and endure - we are outside a lot. But the MGC gets traded into points more often than not - this way, we can get more vacations, even if some are 5 nights instead of 7, in the larger rooms. By going at times of the year when we wish, we can make this work out well - we end up with the same amount of aggregate nights as if we straight-traded our weeks, but far more of them are in the larger halves of lockouts. As we often say here - despite the skim, you are trading time for square footage, and vice versa. Works for us. Any system needs attention to make it work - there are no 2 of us here with the same ownerships and trade goals. We have flip-flopped more than some folks running for office - but now, after a couple of years, have a far better handle on how this works for US. Your mileage may vary.

Mamianka

 

[Mr. Vker]

I own a platinum week at Shadow Ridge - Jan-May or so. To convert my 2-bedroom week to DCP I would get 3075 points. If I wanted to stay at my timeshare during that time it would cost 4,000 points. How is that a deal? I will never convert my unit for points! I now can lock-off and get 2 weeks of vacation. And I have traded to great places including Hawaii 5 times. I couldn't stay in Hawaii for 3 nights using 3075 points. Someone tell me how this new system is really any good for someone who stays somewhere for a week?

That's like having the expectation of paying the same for your resort today as it may have cost 5 years ago. (If bought from MVCI.)

Aruba SC has gotten more expensive. I couldn't "buy" my week today for what we paid in 2005. Same principle.

As others have said, you wouldn't use your points to occupy your home resort-in season. You use them other places.

 

[dougp26364]

The "skim" is Marriott's price for flexablity.

I never thought we'd use points but, we had some major health and financial issues and our paid-time-off banks took a hit. This necessitated checking in on non-traditional days and/or taking shortened vacations. For this the DC points worked out perfectly.

The ONLY reason we joined was to get away from the ala carte fee's. We were locking off two weeks and making three exchanges. The one club fee was less expensive than all the ala carte fee's. Break even under the original fee structure was going to be about 3 1/2 years. Since it's saved our vacations by allowing us the flexablity to book fewer than seven nights and use Thurs. check in days vs Fri, Sat, or Sun. I'd say it's paid for itself already in our case.

Like all systems this one can be exploited. You just have to look at it in non-traditional ways such as finding the bargain resorts (non-beach front HHI resorts for example) or utilizing Sun-Thurs short stays.

You also have the flexablity to pay for your view. No more checking into a beach front resort and getting a garden or island view when you really want an ocean front unit. With points, you book and pay for what you want. Save points on the worst view or spend points on the best view. The choice is yours.

 

[swaits]

We always elect our three weeks into points, even for stays at our home resort. A 7 day stay just doesn't fit within our lifestyle. We require and enjoy the flexibility. The DC program has vastly improved our ownership experience.

 

[MALC9990]

As soon as the DC points option became available to European resort owners we signed up. Break even on fees will be quite a few years away since we have resale weeks so the enrollment cost was the high end charge plus 18% Spanish Taxes. We cashed in 3 of our 2013 week for points. None of our weeks are plat since we avoid school holiday times so our points values are lower than many other weeks. However I have now booked 2 weeks in MFC and added 2 days to an II exchange into MMC both in 2013. The points remaining are still sufficient to get me a week somewhere or I may bank them into 2014.

So I am very happy with the new points system and will continue to look at how I can best use the points to improve our vacation experiences.

 

[scpoidog]

Home resort using points can be optimal

Admittedly I'm not as timeshare savvy as some Tuggers, but I just used the points system to book into my home resort of Ko Olina for 2013.

My converted my week (ocean view ph) and got 5925 points. I then looked up the various dates and found I could get 10 nights and 11 days (including Labor Day) if I was flexible with the view. Turns out you can book a 2br penthouse MV for the same points as a regular MV, so I'll be higher up and will avoid the dreaded parking lot view from the third floor.

I was also short 50 points, so I went on Greg's point rental board and bought the points I needed to complete my transaction.

After all is said and done, I got 3 extra nights, got to pick what day I'm coming in (Weds- not limited to weekend start/stop), and still have a 2 br w/ a kick axx view of the golf course. Granted some flexibility on my part is required- the downgrade of view and an extra $50 to rent points" but that's what the points system is all about. FLEXIBILITY!!!

This might not be the perfect scenario for everyone but it works out great for us. If anyone has any ideas of how I could have accomplished this using the old system, please share.

 

[dougp26364]

Admittedly I'm not as timeshare savvy as some Tuggers, but I just used the points system to book into my home resort of Ko Olina for 2013.

My converted my week (ocean view ph) and got 5925 points. I then looked up the various dates and found I could get 10 nights and 11 days (including Labor Day) if I was flexible with the view. Turns out you can book a 2br penthouse MV for the same points as a regular MV, so I'll be higher up and will avoid the dreaded parking lot view from the third floor.

I was also short 50 points, so I went on Greg's point rental board and bought the points I needed to complete my transaction.

After all is said and done, I got 3 extra nights, got to pick what day I'm coming in (Weds- not limited to weekend start/stop), and still have a 2 br w/ a kick axx view of the golf course. Granted some flexibility on my part is required- the downgrade of view and an extra $50 to rent points" but that's what the points system is all about. FLEXIBILITY!!!

This might not be the perfect scenario for everyone but it works out great for us. If anyone has any ideas of how I could have accomplished this using the old system, please share.

Moving down in season or view can work out well.

I've said it before but I'll say it again. Owners of high value weeks that don't lockoff are going to find better value in the DC than owners of low value weeks. An example of an owner that won't find a great deal of value in the DC might be those who own summer season at Streamside in Vail or the non-beach front resorts in HHI. If I recall there were some weeks that Marriott refused to take into the DC and didn't offer the owners any points at all.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

Moving down in season or view can work out well.

I've said it before but I'll say it again. Owners of high value weeks that don't lockoff are going to find better value in the DC than owners of low value weeks. An example of an owner that won't find a great deal of value in the DC might be those who own summer season at Streamside in Vail or the non-beach front resorts in HHI. If I recall there were some weeks that Marriott refused to take into the DC and didn't offer the owners any points at all.

Based upon my enrollment documents in DC I can't find any language that states that enrollment of legacy weeks is selective nor have any sort of eligibility requirements so I don't understand the statement regarding Marriott refusing to take weeks.

I could be wrong but this sounds more like rumor than confirmed facts to me.

 

[GregT]

What I think Doug was referring to was something like the Summit Watch bronze week. You could enroll it, but it was worth zero points. I believe BocaBum99 had one of those and reported the goose egg.

Best,

Greg

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

What I think Doug was referring to was something like the Summit Watch bronze week. You could enroll it, but it was worth zero points. I believe BocaBum99 had one of those and reported the goose egg.

Best,

Greg

Greg; Yes, I believe you are correct. Matter of fact, last I knew, Marriott still had some of those Bronze weeks for sale @ Summit Watch and were still offering them to anyone for $1,500. However, I am not sure whether or not you could obtain Marriott Reward Points every other year in lieu of use.

I do remember hearing that these Bronze weeks were ineligible to convert to Destination Club Points.




.

 

[Bill4728]

What I think Doug was referring to was something like the Summit Watch bronze week. You could enroll it, but it was worth zero points. I believe BocaBum99 had one of those and reported the goose egg.

Greg; Yes, I believe you are correct. Matter of fact, last I knew, Marriott still had some of those Bronze weeks for sale @ Summit Watch and were still offering them to anyone for $1,500. However, I am not sure whether or not you could obtain Marriott Reward Points every other year in lieu of use.

I do remember hearing that these Bronze weeks were ineligible to convert to Destination Club Points.

For some people having a no point value week in the DC may make sense even though it generated no pts. Because they would get use of the free DC II account account to do their trading. Therefore not paying for a separate II account.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

For some people having a no point value week in the DC may make sense even though it generated no pts. Because they would get use of the free DC II account account to do their trading. Therefore not paying for a separate II account.

Wow, I don't know how I would react to this case. I would probably get really upset at Marriott and not join the DC at all or even sell all my units and remain with a feeling of being de-frauded.

A tough situation nonetheless. I just can't get over the fact that they would tell some of their most loyal customers that the product they purchased is now irrelevant.

 

[rthib]

Wow, I don't know how I would react to this case. I would probably get really upset at Marriott and not join the DC at all or even sell all my units and remain with a feeling of being de-frauded.

A tough situation nonetheless. I just can't get over the fact that they would tell some of their most loyal customers that the product they purchased is now irrelevant.

How is it defrauded.
When they bought the unit, there was never a promise of DC.
The only thing anyone ever bought when they bought a week was the ability to use that resort during that season. Everything else was just possible benefits you might get.

 

[dougp26364]

What I think Doug was referring to was something like the Summit Watch bronze week. You could enroll it, but it was worth zero points. I believe BocaBum99 had one of those and reported the goose egg.

Best,

Greg

For some people having a no point value week in the DC may make sense even though it generated no pts. Because they would get use of the free DC II account account to do their trading. Therefore not paying for a separate II account.

Yes on both accounts

 

[dougp26364]

How is it defrauded.
When they bought the unit, there was never a promise of DC.
The only thing anyone ever bought when they bought a week was the ability to use that resort during that season. Everything else was just possible benefits you might get.

Maybe defrauded on the sense Marriott sold the week for cold hard cash, then shows the real worth by assigning it 0 points.

 

[FractionalTraveler]

Maybe defrauded on the sense Marriott sold the week for cold hard cash, then shows the real worth by assigning it 0 points.

Bingo! My point exactly.

 

[dougp26364]

Bingo! My point exactly.

i know that's how I'd feel about it, just because I know how those salesmen would sell those weeks. Great value for less money. Use the week to trade up in season. Use the week as a MR points generator. Use the week for flexchange opportunities et.... They make a low value week sound like a great bargain, then WHAM-O, Marriott tells those owners that they're worth ZIPPO in the fantastic new DC program.

Talk about a slap in the face!