Oceanwatch Update Today - VIP True levels and master deeds. Huh?

[kozykritter]

I don't think I've ever left a sales presentation as confused as I was today here at Oceanwatch! After I checked in, they came and told me that since I'm a dual owner, they wanted to have me do a different kind of update with a corporate employee that was based in their office, Jimmy. He's not a salesperson but instead a corporate trainer of salespersons so he couldn't sell me anything himself. I was happy to not have to fend off the normal schtick in order to claim my 45K Bonvoy points so I was up for it.

To make a long story short, he told me that I was missing out on being a VIP True Executive because my Executive status came from Vistana 3* grandfathering instead of owning 7K+ club points (my value is currently 5,695 CPs). If I bought 1,500 CPs to get over 7K CPS, they would issue me a master deed that covered both my MVC trust points and my Sheraton Flex (without giving that up), and then I would qualify for extra benefits. Of course I wanted to see a list of these special benefits but instead he showed me a PowerPoint containing things like 50% off bookings within 60 days, unlimited II getaways for $99-$299 max, discounts off Homes & Villas rentals and access to an outside rental broker that would fully manage any rental weeks I gave them for far less than Marriott charges, better availability of inventory for Club Point booking, etc. I was like, wait, are you telling me that I'm seeing less inventory because I'm a grandfathered Executive? And he said not exactly and then mentioned something about having higher priority on waitlists as a VIP True Owner so you can access inventory regular Executive owners can't. The whole reason they put me with him is because on my paperwork, it says I'm not eligible for a rebate on a purchase to become a VIP True owner because I declined it and he wanted to get feedback as to why....I saw on the printout the word Declined. I was never offered something like that before beyond someone at HHI a couple of years ago recommending that I buy the 1,500 points to lock in my Executive status in the face of them raising the levels (that old chestnut), which Jimmy too said is coming soon with Executive going to 10K. I said, yeah, yeah, we've heard that one for years and he said the change was bogged down in the aftermath of the Abound launch but now they are fully focused on it happening. (insert eyeroll here).

He went and called corporate to find out what rebate the system showed I declined and it was $6k off my purchase. Points are now $19.91 (yikes!) and I said maybe if they told me about it when I bought my tiny 1K trust points back in 2022 when the price was $16, I might have thought about it. Even with the rebate it was $24K plus they don't offer that 10% discount on top of it like you would normally get for 1,500 points (at least that's what they pitched in the past.) I asked him if that was a real thing, why wasn't it listed somewhere on the website as a level of benefits and he said Executive benefits are listed there...but I already have those benefits, so was even more confused. He asked at the end if there was any other information he could give me to help me understand better, and I said a list of the benefits on a sheet of paper would really help. Needless to say, that didn't happen. He said they hadn't officially reactivated the rebate/offer for me so I can just think about it for awhile but hey, don't wait too long because levels are going up soon

Has anyone heard anything about these VIP True levels or master deeds? He said you can't get there with resale because the Club Points have to be all combined into one purchase from Marriott to qualify for master deeding. Still confused! P.S. - He asked questions about all the sales persons I've had presentations with the past couple years, took names and is going to follow up with them for not bringing this up/offering me bundles instead/etc. Greeeat.


Just to be clear, I wasn't going to buy anything nor was I taken in by the approach. I'm just curious if this is something real or something completely made up.

 

[cubigbird]

The fact that you couldn’t leave with any benefits on paper should tell you all you need to know. Do you usually believe what sales tells you? Sounds like he just made some things up. Major changes or updates or announcements to elite levels would come with official correspondence from corporate. Sales is going to have to up their gifting game given the recent Bonvoy devaluation.

 

[Fasttr]

Smoke and mirrors designed to confuse you enough to feel as if you are missing out on something that you are not. You were wise to walk out with your money in your pocket.

 

[pedro47]

Corporate person was a TS salesperson.

 

[kozykritter]

The fact that you couldn’t leave with any benefits on paper should tell you all you need to know. Do you usually believe what sales tells you? Sounds like he just made some things up. Major changes or updates or announcements to elite levels would come with official correspondence from corporate. Sales is going to have to up their gifting game given the recent Bonvoy devaluation.

That correspondence comes after they change, not before. I don't immediately discount everything a salesperson tells me...I'm the curious sort so I want to know what exactly they are trying to say and then ask for any proof! Just for my own knowledge.

 

[Hindsite]

Yep seen the master deed thing mentioned on some FB pages, it seems to vary how the craft the lie, including one where they said they would consolidate 6 different trust point deeds into 1 master deed, because having different ones meant the owner was missing out on the magic additional inventory that they craved!!!

Its just another desperate way to find a way to convince someone to buy what they don't need. The whole thing was a pantomime, right from the "Corporate" person who can't sell to you, who promptly went on to sell to you through the fictional benefits of the fictional status, on to the unlimited II getaways for $99-$299 max and ultimately to the point of him not being able to provide any of it in writing.

So, so, so sad that they have sunk to these levels, its such a great product that they spoil by spinning outright lies.

 

[dioxide45]

I think the fibs (aka lies) started at the beginning. We've got the schtick before about our "salesperson" being some corporate employee who earns a salary and not a commission. We get him because of this or that. Perhaps also at least once because we too owned both Marriott and Vistana. I never believe this because that person's job is still to sell you a timeshare.

The only drawback you have of having Executive with 5,695 is that you can't book as much as someone with Executive and 7,000 points. That's all. You get all the same benefits and buying up to 7,000 won't get you any more except more points and less money in your pocket.

There is no such thing as VIP True levels. It is all part of their angle to see if it would work on you. Perhaps it worked for them in the past. They were hoping you didn't know enough about how it all worked and would fall for it. Many people have no clue what they own and I am sure it works on others. They'll note the system and try something different next time around. Or they may try the same pitch again.

 

[cubigbird]

I’d be curious to what “system notes” they have on us and our sales file……”we tried the same sales angle on them and it didn’t work.”

 

[jwalk03]

Nothing but a bunch of sales BS like usual.

 

[Pamplemousse]

I don't think I've ever left a sales presentation as confused as I was today here at Oceanwatch! After I checked in, they came and told me that since I'm a dual owner, they wanted to have me do a different kind of update with a corporate employee that was based in their office, Jimmy. He's not a salesperson but instead a corporate trainer of salespersons so he couldn't sell me anything himself. I was happy to not have to fend off the normal schtick in order to claim my 45K Bonvoy points so I was up for it.

To make a long story short, he told me that I was missing out on being a VIP True Executive because my Executive status came from Vistana 3* grandfathering instead of owning 7K+ club points (my value is currently 5,695 CPs). If I bought 1,500 CPs to get over 7K CPS, they would issue me a master deed that covered both my MVC trust points and my Sheraton Flex (without giving that up), and then I would qualify for extra benefits. Of course I wanted to see a list of these special benefits but instead he showed me a PowerPoint containing things like 50% off bookings within 60 days, unlimited II getaways for $99-$299 max, discounts off Homes & Villas rentals and access to an outside rental broker that would fully manage any rental weeks I gave them for far less than Marriott charges, better availability of inventory for Club Point booking, etc. I was like, wait, are you telling me that I'm seeing less inventory because I'm a grandfathered Executive? And he said not exactly and then mentioned something about having higher priority on waitlists as a VIP True Owner so you can access inventory regular Executive owners can't. The whole reason they put me with him is because on my paperwork, it says I'm not eligible for a rebate on a purchase to become a VIP True owner because I declined it and he wanted to get feedback as to why....I saw on the printout the word Declined. I was never offered something like that before beyond someone at HHI a couple of years ago recommending that I buy the 1,500 points to lock in my Executive status in the face of them raising the levels (that old chestnut), which Jimmy too said is coming soon with Executive going to 10K. I said, yeah, yeah, we've heard that one for years and he said the change was bogged down in the aftermath of the Abound launch but now they are fully focused on it happening. (insert eyeroll here).

He went and called corporate to find out what rebate the system showed I declined and it was $6k off my purchase. Points are now $19.91 (yikes!) and I said maybe if they told me about it when I bought my tiny 1K trust points back in 2022 when the price was $16, I might have thought about it. Even with the rebate it was $24K plus they don't offer that 10% discount on top of it like you would normally get for 1,500 points (at least that's what they pitched in the past.) I asked him if that was a real thing, why wasn't it listed somewhere on the website as a level of benefits and he said Executive benefits are listed there...but I already have those benefits, so was even more confused. He asked at the end if there was any other information he could give me to help me understand better, and I said a list of the benefits on a sheet of paper would really help. Needless to say, that didn't happen. He said they hadn't officially reactivated the rebate/offer for me so I can just think about it for awhile but hey, don't wait too long because levels are going up soon

Has anyone heard anything about these VIP True levels or master deeds? He said you can't get there with resale because the Club Points have to be all combined into one purchase from Marriott to qualify for master deeding. Still confused! P.S. - He asked questions about all the sales persons I've had presentations with the past couple years, took names and is going to follow up with them for not bringing this up/offering me bundles instead/etc. Greeeat.


Just to be clear, I wasn't going to buy anything nor was I taken in by the approach. I'm just curious if this is something real or something completely made up.

Have you looked at what executive status gets you?

 

[WBP]

The timeshare salesman may be, one day, on the male side of the prison where Martha Stewart was incarcerated.

And, rest assured, MVC Leadership knows all about this timeshare salesman's sales presentation and “representations," and does nothing about it.

If it were me, I’d report the timeshare salesman to the South Carolina Real Estate Commission (who may have “registered” him (see link, below)), and since MVW is publicly traded, I’d let the SEC know about the timeshare salesman's misrepresentations and deceptive sales techniques (a question for the SEC is does MVW “profit,” based on calculated, consistent misrepresentations by their salespeople, a “pattern,” thereto, and “profit” by preying on naive consumers) .

https://www.llr.sc.gov/re/recpdf/doc270.pdf

What’s ironic about Timeshare Salesperson “Registration,” in South Carolina, is that timeshare salespeople, working for “a registered timeshare developer,” need not complete the requisites for “Timeshare Salesperson Registration,” licensure as an Associate (salesperson) with the South Carolina Real Estate Division, have that requisite knowledge of a real estate salesperson, or be bound by the regulatory or ethical requirements that accompany an Associate position with the South Carolina Real Estate Division. If I were a betting man, I’d bet that this is the work of the timeshare developers in South Carolina, and ARDA. You can be sure that ARDA has not/does not look after the best interests of timeshare consumers, even though they represent their “Resort Owners Coalition (ARDA-ROC)” of doing that (they even ask you for a “contribution” each year, facilitated by your timeshare management company (e.g. MVC, MVW), to make such a contribution).

 

[kozykritter]

Have you looked at what executive status gets you?

Yes, I've had executive status ever since Abound launched so I'm familiar with the benefits. These mythical extra benefits are undocumented in any of the materials available online.

 

[jwalk03]

Yes, I've had executive status ever since Abound launched so I'm familiar with the benefits. These mythical extra benefits are undocumented in any of the materials available online.

Right because they are not real. The salesman was lying through his teeth.

 

[kozykritter]

I’d be curious to what “system notes” they have on us and our sales file……”we tried the same sales angle on them and it didn’t work.”

Funny you should say that as he told me that my sales file was about two inches thick! I don't mind if they think of me as a troublemaker in sales presentations

 

[cubigbird]

We’re starting to see the same sales reps trying the same sales angle each time.

Funny you should say that as he told me that my sales file was about two inches thick! I don't mind if they think of me as a troublemaker in sales presentations

 

[Superchief]

The timeshare salesman may be, one day, on the male side of the prison where Martha Stewart was incarcerated.

And, rest assured, MVC Leadership knows all about this timeshare salesman's sales presentation and “representations," and does nothing about it.

If it were me, I’d report the timeshare salesman to the South Carolina Real Estate Commission (who may have “registered” him (see link, below)), and since MVW is publicly traded, I’d let the SEC know about the timeshare salesman's misrepresentations and deceptive sales techniques (a question for the SEC is does MVW “profit,” based on calculated, consistent misrepresentations by their salespeople, a “pattern,” thereto, and “profit” by preying on naive consumers) .

https://www.llr.sc.gov/re/recpdf/doc270.pdf

What’s ironic about Timeshare Salesperson “Registration,” in South Carolina, is that timeshare salespeople, working for “a registered timeshare developer,” need not complete the requisites for “Timeshare Salesperson Registration,” licensure as an Associate (salesperson) with the South Carolina Real Estate Division, have that requisite knowledge of a real estate salesperson, or be bound by the regulatory or ethical requirements that accompany an Associate position with the South Carolina Real Estate Division. If I were a betting man, I’d bet that this is the work of the timeshare developers in South Carolina, and ARDA. You can be sure that ARDA has not/does not look after the best interests of timeshare consumers, even though they represent their “Resort Owners Coalition (ARDA-ROC)” of doing that (they even ask you for a “contribution” each year, facilitated by your timeshare management company (e.g. MVC, MVW), to make such a contribution).

They are probably working part-time as timeshare salesmen. Their full-time job is personal injury lawyer. There are a lot of them in South Carolina.