Now I know why w-9 needs to be completed and sign when buying a timeshare

[Panina]

When I purchased a fixed week at Blue Ridge Village, Bluegreen the management company required a w-9 to be submitted. I really never got a clear reason why.

The following is on the hgvc ownership site now which says they require a w-9 now. Interesting only “US Citizen” or “US person” has to fill this out.

Taxpayer Identification Letter Notice

The U.S. Internal Revenue Service (IRS) requires that we obtain a Taxpayer Identification Number for our customers if they are a U.S. Citizen or a non-Citizen that is considered to be a U.S. Person.

As a result, Hilton Resorts Corp. has hired a third-party compliance vendor (located in Kentucky, KY) to mail letters to Club Members from whom we don’t have a Taxpayer Identification Number on file. The letters will arrive via the postal service in the coming weeks and will be accompanied by an official Form W-9 (Request for Taxpayer Identification Number and Certification).

If you received the letter and you are a U.S. Citizen or meet the requirements of the IRS to be considered a U.S. Person, please complete and sign the form W-9. If you are not a U.S. Citizen or do not meet IRS requirements to be considered a U.S. Person, you may disregard the letter.

Thank you for your cooperation and assistance. We appreciate your business.

 

[T-Dot-Traveller]

Thanks for posting .

 

[bogey21]

The U.S. Internal Revenue Service (IRS) requires that we obtain a Taxpayer Identification Number for our customers if they are a U.S. Citizen or a non-Citizen that is considered to be a U.S. Person.

I'm not sure I believe this...

George

 

[RX8]

Thanks Panina. With all due respect though I don’t think this explains why a W9 is needed. Just because HGVC says the IRS requires it doesn’t answer the question why.

I am sure there are more qualified experts out there but from what I understand a W9’s primary purpose is to obtain tax information on vendors you pay, such as landscapers that HOAs hire. That has nothing to do with HGVC owners. It also appears that for real estate transactions a W9 is needed when there is a mortgage since a home owner can deduct mortgage interest. This would pertain to some HGVC owners but certainly not all.

So, while HGVC may technically be correct by saying the IRS requires a W9, it appears that HGVC is applying it as a blanket request even for those that have no mortgage.

 

[davidvel]

When I purchased a fixed week at Blue Ridge Village, Bluegreen the management company required a w-9 to be submitted. I really never got a clear reason why.

The following is on the hgvc ownership site now which says they require a w-9 now. Interesting only “US Citizen” or “US person” has to fill this out.

Taxpayer Identification Letter Notice

The U.S. Internal Revenue Service (IRS) requires that we obtain a Taxpayer Identification Number for our customers if they are a U.S. Citizen or a non-Citizen that is considered to be a U.S. Person.

As a result, Hilton Resorts Corp. has hired a third-party compliance vendor (located in Kentucky, KY) to mail letters to Club Members from whom we don’t have a Taxpayer Identification Number on file. The letters will arrive via the postal service in the coming weeks and will be accompanied by an official Form W-9 (Request for Taxpayer Identification Number and Certification).

If you received the letter and you are a U.S. Citizen or meet the requirements of the IRS to be considered a U.S. Person, please complete and sign the form W-9. If you are not a U.S. Citizen or do not meet IRS requirements to be considered a U.S. Person, you may disregard the letter.

Thank you for your cooperation and assistance. We appreciate your business.

Can you post a link to the website?

 

[dayooper]

Thanks Panina. With all due respect though I don’t think this explains why a W9 is needed. Just because HGVC says the IRS requires it doesn’t answer the question why.

I am sure there are more qualified experts out there but from what I understand a W9’s primary purpose is to obtain tax information on vendors you pay, such as landscapers that HOAs hire. That has nothing to do with HGVC owners. It also appears that for real estate transactions a W9 is needed when there is a mortgage since a home owner can deduct mortgage interest. This would pertain to some HGVC owners but certainly not all.

So, while HGVC may technically be correct by saying the IRS requires a W9, it appears that HGVC is applying it as a blanket request even for those that have no mortgage.

Preparing for future developer purchases?

Can you post a link to the website?

https://club.hiltongrandvacations.com/en/help/club-navigator/taxpayer-identification-letter-notice

 

[grab]

Sure sounds like a great way to get tax payer ID number in case you are late on payments. I’m pretty sure they can’t trash your credit rating unless they have you tax payer ID or ss#.

 

[Panina]

Thanks Panina. With all due respect though I don’t think this explains why a W9 is needed. Just because HGVC says the IRS requires it doesn’t answer the question why.

I am sure there are more qualified experts out there but from what I understand a W9’s primary purpose is to obtain tax information on vendors you pay, such as landscapers that HOAs hire. That has nothing to do with HGVC owners. It also appears that for real estate transactions a W9 is needed when there is a mortgage since a home owner can deduct mortgage interest. This would pertain to some HGVC owners but certainly not all.

So, while HGVC may technically be correct by saying the IRS requires a W9, it appears that HGVC is applying it as a blanket request even for those that have no mortgage.

I agree the explanation is not clear except that it is required from the IRS. I don’t believe hgvc would put that in writing saying the it is required by the irs unless they have it in writing themselves. The question would be why does the irs want it? And that I will assume we will never get a clear answer for.

 

[vacationhopeful]

If your real estate taxes or (interest on loan) are separately reported and this is deeded property (like as in a 2nd home), you can deduct from your income tax.

If you sell or are credited with a value on a trade in, your value sold on the closing paperwork will be sent to the IRS and YOU have to prove your current basis.

Just think about it like the infor you provide on buying or selling your home (with or without a mortgage).

I would bet the ONLY entity a timeshare company fears, is the IRS.

 

[ausman]

The form W9 itself (https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw9.pdf ) shows the purpose of the form.

Sending a blanket request for taxpayer identification numbers/social security numbers without a valid relationship with the requester smackes of ineptitude or worse. The consequence of not supplying the W9 would be to be subject to backup witholding which would not happen if there is no relationship. No way would I comply with this request as formulated.

As for being "required" by the IRS that is a crock, it is required only in certain circumstances as explained in the form itself and instructions.

 

[klpca]

If you are not a U.S. Citizen or do not meet IRS requirements to be considered a U.S. Person, you may disregard the letter.

Ours is titled in our living trust. I plan on disregarding the letter, per their instructions.

The form W9 itself (https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw9.pdf ) shows the purpose of the form.

Sending a blanket request for taxpayer identification numbers/social security numbers without a valid relationship with the requester smackes of ineptitude or worse. The consequence of not supplying the W9 would be to be subject to backup witholding which would not happen if there is no relationship. No way would I comply with this request as formulated.

As for being "required" by the IRS that is a crock, it is required only in certain circumstances as explained in the form itself and instructions.

Totally agree with this, especially after I read the W-9 instructions. I just can't see where the IRS is requiring this information.

Personally, I think that someone is confused by the rules and this is a gigantic CYA maneuver. I wonder what their plan is to safeguard my private information? Can I sue them if there is a breach? I think that this broad request should be given more thought.

 

[DrQ]

Other than an employer, I have NEVER had a W-9 request. I would ignore the request.

 

[davidvel]

The form W9 itself (https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/fw9.pdf ) shows the purpose of the form.

Sending a blanket request for taxpayer identification numbers/social security numbers without a valid relationship with the requester smackes of ineptitude or worse. The consequence of not supplying the W9 would be to be subject to backup witholding which would not happen if there is no relationship. No way would I comply with this request as formulated.

As for being "required" by the IRS that is a crock, it is required only in certain circumstances as explained in the form itself and instructions.

I agree 100%. Simply owning a timeshare is not a legitimate reason to give your SSN. Something very fishy here.

 

[DrQ]

I agree 100%. Simply owning a timeshare is not a legitimate reason to give your SSN. Something very fishy here.

I may have to provide my SSN for county tax records, but I don't need to fill out a W-9.

 

[CO skier]

For some reason, that is way over my head, W-9s are required as a result of my receiving bonus credits when my referral sits through an owner update, but is not required when I receive a "gift card" for sitting through an owner update. (I receive much more per year in gift cards than owner referral credits).

I filled out the W-9, but nothing was reported, because the total value of the referral credits for the year did not exceed the $600 reporting requirement.

Not the same as the HGVC situation, obviously, but it is an example of when a W-9 is required as part of a timeshare ownership.

I now make sure that my referrals take a gift card instead of "benefiting" me with bonus credits.

 

[DrQ]

For some reason, that is way over my head, W-9s are required as a result of my receiving bonus credits when my referral sits through an owner update, but is not required when I receive a "gift card" for sitting through an owner update. (I receive much more per year in gift cards than owner referral credits).

I filled out the W-9, but nothing was reported, because the total value of the referral credits for the year did not exceed the $600 reporting requirement.

Agreed, I could see that if you received a gift which the value exceeds the IRS limit of $600 might require a W-9, but usually they just ask for the SSN.

 

[Eric B]

There was a 2015 (or maybe 2014) Tax Court ruling that agreed with an earlier IRS determination that in kind promotional benefits like frequent flier miles are not taxable. More details are available in an IRS letter bulletin on the subject, but I don’t remember when that came out. The resorts probably view the gift cards, etc., that they provide when you have traveled there and gone to an update as in kind promotional benefits associated with your travel and therefore not taxable or reportable to the IRS.

On the other hand, payment for referrals is not really associated with your travel, so wouldn’t be covered by the treatment of in kind promotional benefits and would be taxable and reportable if it meets the amount criteria. I’ve had to fill out a W-9 for referrals, but never for sitting through an update.

This isn’t intended as legal advice, of course; if you have any need you should consult someone appropriate for your situation. I’m just relating my recollection of readings on the subject a few years ago.

 

[SmithOp]

If I get one its going in the shredder. If I don’t I’m not going to worry about it.

I am more concerned when they farm out data collection to third parties, low bidders that cut corners on data security.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Panina]

I think the real issue for most will be future resale buying. I know Bluegreen will not allow transfer to happen unless you sign this form. Now it looks the same with hgvc.

I had a prior post where I had the issue with bluegreen you either fill it out or no transfer. Already the estoppel was done and the deed was filed.

If this is illegal someone will have to sue to get it changed. I wonder where we could go to ask if this is a legal requirement. Calling the IRS, if like my previous contacts, will give different answers based on who you speak to.

 

[hurnik]

I'll have to ask my sister, but if she gets one (she was gifted an HGVC timeshare this year), I'm sure she'll let me know. She's a CPA/CFP, so this should be a tax question she'd know if it really needs to be filled out or not.

 

[Frasier]

I signed into my account and clicked on the banner at the top that is titled “Taxpayer Number Letter Update” and further clicked on the hyperlink “letters”. There is an example of the letter that is being sent out. It appears the purpose of the letter is to obtain correct taxpayer ID numbers where Hilton has obtained an incorrect one that does not match IRS records. The letter mentions the IRS requires it for tax reporting requirements, such as verification of a mortgage interest deduction. The IRS may request your ID number for a variety of reasons but in the case of Hilton’s request it appears to apply to owners who have loans that are reporting interest paid to the IRS.

Since I don’t have any timeshare loans I see no reason to provide my ID number if requested unless a convincing reason is given.