How does an executor give a Marriott timeshare back to Marriott?

[barsue00]

I am the executor of a friend's estate. He has no family, no heirs, his estate will be going to charity. The charity will not accept the timeshare as is. He has 2 weeks with Marriott vacation club. I called the exit service at Marriott, they told me that after probate, I should do a deed change in California to a living person, and then get back with them to start the buy back or give back process. The problem is that I do not have a living person who would be willing to put their name on a deed. Any advice?? Thank you so much for any help you can give to me. Susan

 

[dioxide45]

WHat are the resorts and seasons. They may have some resale value. It seems that Marriott doesn't want to take the deeds directly out of probate.

 

[barsue00]

WHat are the resorts and seasons. They may have some resale value. It seems that Marriott doesn't want to take the deeds directly out of probate.

One week is Desert Springs II, the other is Shadow Ridge. I know that he always went in the April/May timeframe. I know nothing about timeshares, so I may not answer questions correctly, be kind please!

 

[dougp26364]

Have you tried to sell them? Have you asked the probate court or probate attorney, if you have one, what needs to be done in the particular state the deceased lived in? That’s where I would start. Since the owner is deceased, you’ll probably need court papers to transfer a deed or property.

It was a process when we purchased a car out of an estate. It had to be paid off first, then the title was transferred into the estate, then the estate was able to transfer the title into my name.

Probate can be tricky. That’s why I always recommend getting a good probate attorney

 

[barsue00]

Have you tried to sell them? Have you asked the probate court or probate attorney, if you have one, what needs to be done in the particular state the deceased lived in? That’s where I would start. Since the owner is deceased, you’ll probably need court papers to transfer a deed or property.

It was a process when we purchased a car out of an estate. It had to be paid off first, then the title was transferred into the estate, then the estate was able to transfer the title into my name.

Probate can be tricky. That’s why I always recommend getting a good probate attorney

Thank you. No, I have not yet tried to sell them. I was hoping to just give them back. Yes, I am in touch with a probate attorney in my state. The problem is Marriott wants the deed to go to a "living person", not to the estate, as what happened with your car.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

re: putting the deed in the name of a living person. Trusts and estates own deeds all of the time and executors and trustees take action. Something fishy here or horribly incorrect direction from MVC.

You have control as executor to deed it back from the estate to MVC. Check with @LeslieDet. She sometimes checks in here but also moderates a forum on FB on MVC Q&A. If you don't hear back here on TUG check with her on FB. Do not put this in your or anyone's name without knowing the implications if MVC refuses.

If MVC refuses, you can try to give it away here on TUG. If that doesn't work, then I believe both of these are in California. California is a very consumer friendly state. It is an anti-deficiency state even when it is judicial when it comes to timeshare deeds. Although this is a last resort, you may want MVC to be aware that this may be your action if they don't accept the deeds back without charging a high fee. It will cost them a lot more to recover via foreclosure if they don't accept your terms. Here are the state by state timeshare laws which you can share with your lawyer (and cite to MVC).

Links to Official State Timeshare Laws and Guides/Manuals

@TUGBrian @DeniseM @CalGalTraveler take a look. This weekend, I’m creating a spreadsheet with official links to states’ timeshare laws, as well as their statuses as to non-judicial, anti-deficiency foreclosures. In the meantime, I will just keep adding notes. * Legal Disclaimer: This list...

tugbbs.com

 

[TUGBrian]

would contact the marriott deedback department:

exit.services@mvwc.com 800-226-9150

 

[barsue00]

re: putting the deed in the name of a living person. Trusts and estates own deeds all of the time and executors and trustees take action. Something fishy here or horribly incorrect direction from MVC.

You have control as executor to deed it back from the estate to MVC. Check with @LeslieDet. She sometimes checks in here but also moderates a forum on FB on MVC Q&A. If you don't hear back here on TUG check with her on FB. Do not put this in your or anyone's name without knowing the implications.

If MVC refuses, you can try to give it away here on TUG. If that doesn't work, then I believe both of these are in California. California is a very consumer friendly state. It is an anti-deficiency state even when it is judicial when it comes to timeshare deeds. Although this is a last resort, you may want MVC to be aware that this may be your action if they don't accept the deeds back without charging a high fee. It will cost them a lot more to recover if they don't accept your terms. Here are the state by state timeshare laws which you can share with your lawyer (and cite to MVC).

Links to Official State Timeshare Laws and Guides/Manuals

@TUGBrian @DeniseM @CalGalTraveler take a look. This weekend, I’m creating a spreadsheet with official links to states’ timeshare laws, as well as their statuses as to non-judicial, anti-deficiency foreclosures. In the meantime, I will just keep adding notes. * Legal Disclaimer: This list...

tugbbs.com

Thank you! Exactly what I thought. I was very specific...why can't I put the deed in the Estate name. She could not answer why it had to be a "living person".

I will read through the manual you shared. Thank you very much.

 

[barsue00]

re: putting the deed in the name of a living person. Trusts and estates own deeds all of the time and executors and trustees take action. Something fishy here or horribly incorrect direction from MVC.

You have control as executor to deed it back from the estate to MVC. Check with @LeslieDet. She sometimes checks in here but also moderates a forum on FB on MVC Q&A. If you don't hear back here on TUG check with her on FB. Do not put this in your or anyone's name without knowing the implications if MVC refuses.

If MVC refuses, you can try to give it away here on TUG. If that doesn't work, then I believe both of these are in California. California is a very consumer friendly state. It is an anti-deficiency state even when it is judicial when it comes to timeshare deeds. Although this is a last resort, you may want MVC to be aware that this may be your action if they don't accept the deeds back without charging a high fee. It will cost them a lot more to recover via foreclosure if they don't accept your terms. Here are the state by state timeshare laws which you can share with your lawyer (and cite to MVC).

Links to Official State Timeshare Laws and Guides/Manuals

@TUGBrian @DeniseM @CalGalTraveler take a look. This weekend, I’m creating a spreadsheet with official links to states’ timeshare laws, as well as their statuses as to non-judicial, anti-deficiency foreclosures. In the meantime, I will just keep adding notes. * Legal Disclaimer: This list...

tugbbs.com

This is probably a dim question...am I reading the laws for where the timeshare is located, or where the owner died?

 

[TUGBrian]

depends on what you are looking into!

for the transfer of the deed, the rules and regulations of the state/county the deed is recorded in will apply.

for probate/estate/etc matters, the state of residence will apply.

 

[dioxide45]

Thank you! Exactly what I thought. I was very specific...why can't I put the deed in the Estate name. She could not answer why it had to be a "living person".

I will read through the manual you shared. Thank you very much.

You can't and wouldn't put it in the estates name. It needs to be transferred out of the estate or out of the name of the deceased. There may be legailties and tax implications for MVC to take the deed straight from the estate. Thus why they are asking you to transfer it to someone else first.

 

[Passepartout]

Have counsel write them that no living heir can be found to accept the bequest. Then just let them foreclose if that's their choice. A credit score ding won't hurt the decedent, so just walk away.

Sometimes being an executor is just a thankless job. All the best to you.

Jim

 

[barsue00]

Have counsel write them that no living heir can be found to accept the bequest. Then just let them foreclose if that's their choice. A credit score ding won't hurt the decedent, so just walk away.

Sometimes being an executor is just a thankless job. All the best to you.

Jim

Thank you. One of the people I spoke with at MVC did suggest that option. I asked if there was a better way to do it that, to just foreclose now, and she said no. It seems silly for them to do it that way, but that might be the path I take.

 

[Dean]

I wonder if you have to go t through probate in CA as well. Given that the weeks are likely not worth much, I tend to agree with Jim that getting a lawyer to write them a letter as suggested and not worrying about it is likely best. Offer to deed them back if they want. While you might be able to sell them, you might end up with $4K at max if they are Platinum (RED) weeks and nothing if they are Gold (White) weeks.

 

[dougp26364]

You can't and wouldn't put it in the estates name. It needs to be transferred out of the estate or out of the name of the deceased. There may be legailties and tax implications for MVC to take the deed straight from the estate. Thus why they are asking you to transfer it to someone else first.

I’m not certain it actually goes into the estates “name, but rather changes the name to the estate of the decedent. It seems to me this was the wording used in transferring property from our recent experince in selling two vehicles and a house for an estate. In order for the executor to sign the documents, it could no longer be in the decedents name. There was a process we went thru that took a couple of weeks, including getting the title of the vehicles changed to the estate of the decedent. When we titled one of the cars, we had to have the new deed and the letters of administration showing that the person signing over the deed had the courts authority to do so.

Every state is different. The process to sell my mother’s house in Missouri was a little different than selling the house in Kansas. This is where a good probate attorney is worth the price paid as the process was navigated quickly and easily.

 

[barsue00]

I’m not certain it actually goes into the estates “name, but rather changes the name to the estate of the decedent. It seems to me this was the wording used in transferring property from our recent experince in selling two vehicles and a house for an estate. In order for the executor to sign the documents, it could no longer be in the decedents name. There was a process we went thru that took a couple of weeks, including getting the title of the vehicles changed to the estate of the decedent. When we titled one of the cars, we had to have the new deed and the letters of administration showing that the person signing over the deed had the courts authority to do so.

Every state is different. The process to sell my mother’s house in Missouri was a little different than selling the house in Kansas. This is where a good probate attorney is worth the price paid as the process was navigated quickly and easily.

Yes, that is how it works in Texas. Everything gets changed to Estate of XXX. I have executed 4 family estates, but this is the first to involve a Timeshare. I assumed it would work just like everything else I have dealt with in the past, but nope, not when the MVC exit department told me it has to be deeded first to a "living person". My attorney is good, but I do not want to pay the hourly rate for her to delve very far into something that really has no value. The Estate out-of-pocket would be more than it takes in, which seems to be unfair to the charities that are receiving the residual of the estate.

 

[barsue00]

would contact the marriott deedback department:

exit.services@mvwc.com 800-226-9150

That is who I spoke with.

 

[dougp26364]

Yes, that is how it works in Texas. Everything gets changed to Estate of XXX. I have executed 4 family estates, but this is the first to involve a Timeshare. I assumed it would work just like everything else I have dealt with in the past, but nope, not when the MVC exit department told me it has to be deeded first to a "living person". My attorney is good, but I do not want to pay the hourly rate for her to delve very far into something that really has no value. The Estate out-of-pocket would be more than it takes in, which seems to be unfair to the charities that are receiving the residual of the estate.

I think I’d try to sell them through one of the trusted brokers who occasionally posts on this site, assuming you can move them quickly enough. If the selling price is to low, Marriott will execute ROFR and take them back that way, as a purchase rather than just allowing them to be deeded back. Seems stupid on their part since they could get them for nothing but, that appears to be the game they want to play.

I’m sure someone will be able to come up with those brokers names. Seems one was Judy, but I can’t remember them at the moment.

Four estates? Either you’re a saint or a gluten for punishment.

 

[larryallen]

You say you spoke to an attorney. I would HIRE a probate attorney to represent you as executor. Be aware that your fiduciary duty is to the charity. If there is economic value you shouldn't just give it away for free. In my experience, which is significant in this area of the world, charities are not necessarily friendly beneficiaries. They can be like most beneficiaries, if not worse, and out for EVERY DOLLAR they are "entitled." Tread carefully! I would be sure all legal steps are taken to protect YOURSELF.

 

[barsue00]

You say you spoke to an attorney. I would HIRE a probate attorney to represent you as executor. Be aware that your fiduciary duty is to the charity. If there is economic value you shouldn't just give it away for free. In my experience, which is significant in this area of the world, charities are not necessarily friendly beneficiaries. They can be like most beneficiaries, if not worse, and out for EVERY DOLLAR they are "entitled." Tread carefully! I would be sure all legal steps are taken to protect YOURSELF.

Thank you. Don't forget, yes, my fiduciary duty is to the charity, and if I pay attorney fees that are more than the value of the property, that is not looking out for the charity. It's a catch-22! I have hired an attorney; we will figure it out. I was just looking here for anyone with prior experience in this situation

 

[larryallen]

Thank you. Don't forget, yes, my fiduciary duty is to the charity, and if I pay attorney fees that are more than the value of the property, that is not looking out for the charity. It's a catch-22! I have hired an attorney; we will figure it out. I was just looking here for anyone with prior experience in this situation

Yes and no. A timeshare is often a liability not an asset. A good executor hires the attorney to deal with all liabilities as well as assets. You need to be 100% sure when you write the last check to the charity that no obligations will come up as you could be personally liable for them. I think my overriding point is there is a proper process to go through assets, liabilities, taxes, etc after death. Being penny wise on attorney fees could be pound foolish for YOU! Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[LeslieDet]

Thank you. No, I have not yet tried to sell them. I was hoping to just give them back. Yes, I am in touch with a probate attorney in my state. The problem is Marriott wants the deed to go to a "living person", not to the estate, as what happened with your car.

I have not read every comment. I did see that the two timeshares are in CA -- Desert Springs II and Shadow Ridge. It sounds like the decedent lived outside of CA and that you are also outside of CA.

I suspect that there was a miscommunication between you and the MVC person you spoke with. You cannot simply deed the two CA timeshare interests to MVC unless you go through an ancillary probate in Riverside County, CA. There would be no ability for you to transfer title to anyone without the ancillary probate. The owner is dead. You can't sign a deed for the deceased owner. Rather, the ancillary probate would legally transfer the deed from the estate of the deceased to whomever will be receiving it, whether it is a transfer to MVC or to someone else you find who want the title. That is why I think there was a miscommunication or a misunderstanding when you contacted MVC.

Assuming MVC will accept the property ownership, there would be no need to put the title in someone else's name to only then transfer to MVC. Thus, I'd suggest you reach back to MVC legal and receive confirmation that they will accept the deed, once you, as executor, are legally able to convey clear title.

BTW - you mentioned that you are wanting to look out for the charity because of your fiduciary duties. You are the executor. It is your job to dispose of the property of the decedent. If it costs money for an ancillary probate, then that is what you need to do to get rid of the property owned by the decedent in CA. The charity doesn't get to keep the money that is required for you to properly administer the estate. The charity gets what is left after you take care of your legal obligations to the estate.

 

[LeslieDet]

I wonder if you have to go t through probate in CA as well. Given that the weeks are likely not worth much, I tend to agree with Jim that getting a lawyer to write them a letter as suggested and not worrying about it is likely best. Offer to deed them back if they want. While you might be able to sell them, you might end up with $4K at max if they are Platinum (RED) weeks and nothing if they are Gold (White) weeks.

An executor of an estate is not legally allowed to convey ownership of any real property owned by the estate unless probate court approval is obtained. With real estate, the only probate court with jurisdiction to approve a transfer of title from the estate of a deceased to any buyer or gift recipient is the one located in the same county where the real estate is located. The executor cannot simply offer to "deed it back" legally and cannot legally sell the ts ownership without going through ancillary probate (required because the deceased wasn't a resident of Riverside County, CA, where the ts are located).

 

[LeslieDet]

That is who I spoke with.

I would suggest you reach back out to MVC and speak with the legal department, not "exit services". As far as I'm aware, exit services requires the owner to be alive; that would be why the person you spoke with said it needed to be transferred to someone first. You need to speak with someone from the department who deals with estates and dead owners. I'd guess that would be legal.

 

[barsue00]

I have not read every comment. I did see that the two timeshares are in CA -- Desert Springs II and Shadow Ridge. It sounds like the decedent lived outside of CA and that you are also outside of CA.

I suspect that there was a miscommunication between you and the MVC person you spoke with. You cannot simply deed the two CA timeshare interests to MVC unless you go through an ancillary probate in Riverside County, CA. There would be no ability for you to transfer title to anyone without the ancillary probate. The owner is dead. You can't sign a deed for the deceased owner. Rather, the ancillary probate would legally transfer the deed from the estate of the deceased to whomever will be receiving it, whether it is a transfer to MVC or to someone else you find who want the title. That is why I think there was a miscommunication or a misunderstanding when you contacted MVC.

Assuming MVC will accept the property ownership, there would be no need to put the title in someone else's name to only then transfer to MVC. Thus, I'd suggest you reach back to MVC legal and receive confirmation that they will accept the deed, once you, as executor, are legally able to convey clear title.

BTW - you mentioned that you are wanting to look out for the charity because of your fiduciary duties. You are the executor. It is your job to dispose of the property of the decedent. If it costs money for an ancillary probate, then that is what you need to do to get rid of the property owned by the decedent in CA. The charity doesn't get to keep the money that is required for you to properly administer the estate. The charity gets what is left after you take care of your legal obligations to the estate.

Thank you! I will start over with MVC legal.