Hilton Head or Myrtle Beach - Newbie Question

[LiraBelle279]

My husband and I like to go to HHI in September - we don't have any kids and we'd rather avoid the summer crowds - so September is perfect. A couple of years ago we toured the MOW in Myrtle Beach - though we thought it was nice we didn't see ourselves going back to Myrtle Beach a lot. A couple of months ago we toured Surf Watch on HHI. I thought it looked better in pictures than it did in person - and for our personal needs I wouldn't consider the property - but I got into a conversation with the sales rep about HHI vs. Myrtle Beach. He suggested to me that because the properties in HHI were much more expensive than Myrtle Beach that I should consider purchasing a Platinum week in Myrtle Beach and trading it for a Silver week in HHI if September was the time I wanted to travel. With a Platinum week he said I could trade it well into any location I wanted to visit. Is this true? I haven't seen many posts about Ocean Watch in Myrtle Beach but I see that owners rated it in the top 10. Would I have better trading power with it vs. something else?

P.S. I've heard about the changes coming in June so we don't plan to make any decisions right away.

 

[aka Julie]

Boy does that sales person have a load of BS. Why pay the premium for a platinum week to trade into a silver week? Besides September is GOLD season for HHI properties, not silver. We own silver at Barony Beach and have been able (up to now) to trade it for some platinum weeks at some properties -- flexibility in travel dates is key of course, and this may change if Marriott goes to an internal exchange system which is being rumored.

You can pick up a silver week for most of the HHI Marriott properties on the resale market for around $2000. If you are flexible in travel, I'm sure you would be able to trade the silver week for September (especially for dates after the kids are back at school).

I wouldn't buy a property you aren't willing to go to at least 50% of the time. If you really didn't like OceanWatch, I wouldn't buy there. We went to OceanWatch once and feel the same way as you. Much prefer Hilton Head.

You're wise in waiting to make any decision until (if) Marriott announces any changes for exchanging. Luckily we own at properties we are perfectly happy to go to each year.

 

[Dave M]

I think you would be crazy to buy any Platinum week anywhere for the purpose of trading to a Silver week. I can't imagine what kind of spin a salesperson could put on such a proposal to make it sound sensible! The economics don't make sense. Why spend more than you need to for Platinum when you can spend much less for the season you want?

Buy where you want to stay most years. If that's Grande Ocean (for example), then buy at Grande Ocean. Also, September is not Silver season in HH. It's Gold season. So buy Gold season if you like September.

Lastly, consider buying a resale week. You'll pay much less and have exactly the same timeshare experience at Grande Ocean (or where you decide to buy). Yes, you should wait until the new points/exchange program is announced so that you can decide whether buying resale would work for you.

And a hearty welcome to TUG!!!

 

[m61376]

Of course, Dave is right on with his advice.

I find it disturbing that there seems to be a lot of Marriott "sales spin" recently, at best stretching the truth. Maybe it's me, but I thought Marriott salespeople at least used to be held to a higher standard than others.

Why on earth would someone buy a Platinum week to trade consistently for an off season week? You'd be far better off buying when and where you'd like to travel at least some of the time.

 

[SueDonJ]

I hate the sales spin, too, but I do wonder if sometimes what we see here is more a matter of misunderstanding than spin? For one thing, no Marriott salesperson is ever going to suggest that a potential owner research and consider an exernal resale purchase. Ever.

In this particular case, the first thing that jumps out is that September at Hilton Head is gold season, not silver. The second is that any sales rep at the Preview Center at SurfWatch would know that, because it's one of those new-fangled sales offices that sells all available inventory with particular emphasis on the newer Hilton Head, Myrtle Beach and Florida resorts. If as the rep said, September (gold) HH inventory is more expensive than plat Myrtle Beach, then of course the rep is going to suggest plat MB as an option to a customer who indicates that they'll be using their week primarily for September HH but also for exchanges. It's correct that it would be a successful trader most anywhere, in particular into a lesser-demand season at HH. And if it is actually saving the potential customer some money (comparing direct purchases prices only, as the rep should be expected to do) while offering exactly what suits his/her needs then why are we calling this "sales spin"? Don't we want the reps to offer their least-expensive purchase option to each customer?

All that said, of course any potential customer is correct to question the info that's been given by a rep as well as comparing it to whatever else might be out there that fits his/her needs. Gold HH external resales might do just that, and I'd look there first while keeping in mind Dave's caution about a possible new exchange system being rolled out.

 

[tlwmkw]

Does anyone have the MVCI prices for HHI gold vs. Oceanwatch Platinum? I seriously doubt that the OW Plat is cheaper than anything at HHI gold. They prob. don't have any gold HHI inventory and that's why he said that. Also he may have meant if you buy gardenview plat that would be cheaper than gold oceanfront which would trade the same with Interval International but with the changes coming in June then that would be bad advice imo.

tlwmkw

 

[SueDonJ]

That's the great unknown, the prices of whatever available inventory the rep was comparing. I don't know if there's any Gold developer inventory left at any HH resort other than SW, but I'm pretty sure that there are still developer-held Gold 3BR and 2BR weeks there. Isn't it possible that those could be higher-priced than OceanWatch Plat 2BR especially if it's like what you say and the available OW are gardenview and SW are oceanside? Plus the OP indicated that s/he wouldn't consider SurfWatch for use, so maybe the rep's thinking was that if what was available at SW was more expensive than what was available at MB, a MB for both use and exchanging would be better than a SW for only exchanging?

I didn't write my last post with the intent to prove that this OP's sales rep didn't use "sales spin," but rather to show how it's impossible to tell if he did or didn't without a whole lot of missing details. The most important thing is that the OP found TUG and can now put together everything s/he heard from the rep with all the knowledge from folks here, in order to make an informed decision no matter what resort and method of purchase s/he chooses. If nothing else, we can help to flesh out the right questions to go back and ask the rep. LiraBelle, I'd start with, "Do you have any Gold weeks on the waiting lists of owners wishing to sell at non-SW HH resorts, and what are the prices for those?" And then I'd compare that info to similar listings on the external resale market.

 

[LiraBelle279]

Thanks everyone for your advice. I just found TUG recently so I didn't know about the resale market at all when I was speaking to the rep. Basically he said that a platinum week Ocean Front in Myrtle Beach would cost me $26K direct sale from Marriott. He said that the week I would want to purchase in HHI would cost me much more than that, which is why he suggested the Myrtle Beach property. I have to admit that I'm also enticed with the idea of trading my week in for points if I decide not to use it in a given year. Since we only go to HHI about every other or every third year I thought the trade for points was an interesting option. (I know that costs extra and so does trading, and now I know it's probably not as cost effective as buying resale). I'm a bit of a points hound and I know that points would give us flexibility for other vacations.) Also, if we wanted to rent it out one year would we have a better chance of renting out a Myrtle Beach property in a platinum week than a gold HHI in September. He said that if we wanted to go to the most sought after properties such as Hawaii and Aruba (which of course we do) then the trading power of this platinum week in Myrtle Beach would get us there. He also said that a platinum week in Myrtle Beach would be bought back from Marriott (ROFR) faster than any other. (which is probably bunk).

 

[dioxide45]

I hate the sales spin, too, but I do wonder if sometimes what we see here is more a matter of misunderstanding than spin? For one thing, no Marriott salesperson is ever going to suggest that a potential owner research and consider an exernal resale purchase. Ever.

I don't think the OP indicated that the rep said anything about buying resale. So I don't think that happened and as you said, would never ever happen.

 

[SueDonJ]

I don't think the OP indicated that the rep said anything about buying resale. So I don't think that happened and as you said, would never ever happen.

No, of course not, but I was following the train of thought brought up by the posters before me, that the "spin" given by that sales rep was made even more ridiculous by the existence of an external resale market.

IMO, reading LiraBelle's second post it's easier to see how and why the sales rep made the recommendation that he did, and that the only "spin" he made that didn't actually take into consideration the OP's needs is the bunk about faster ROFR.

 

[KathyPet]

I still think that the salesperson advice flies in the face of everything that has been recommended over and over again here on TUG. Buy where you want to go and when you want to go there. I still think that buying a platinum Myrtle Beach week when you really want a gold Barony Beach week is absurd. I have received from very nice trades with my gold GO week. To purchase a platinum week at OW because you MIGHT want to go to Hawaii once and it MIGHT be easier to get that trade with the platinum week then the gold is absurd. If you are determined to buy direct from Marriott I would also check the point values that you would get from trading a platinum OW vs a Gold GO for points and I would also check the current asking prices for a gold GO week vs a platiunum OW week before making any decision. Of course if you want to buy resale and forgo the points you will really save $$$$.

 

[SueDonJ]

I'm not disagreeing, Kathy, just saying why I don't believe that the immediate assumption in this thread of "sales spin" by the sales rep was correct. I think it's easy to see why he recommended a plat OceanWatch week. OP went to the Preview Center not knowing about external resales and said that they'll probably visit HHI every other or every third year during (gold season) September, will "of course" be looking to exchange to high-demand resorts such as Aruba and Hawaii, as a "points hound" will also be exchanging for MR points, and will consider renting her week out as well. She'd seen SurfWatch and knew that she wouldn't want to stay there. She'd also seen Myrtle Beach and liked it somewhat better than SW. Assuming that what the rep said is true, that a plat MB would be less expensive than any available HHI inventory (reasonable to assume with the deal Marriott is running at the resorts still holding developer inventory) and that a plat MB would have high exchange/rental value, I don't see what's wrong with his recommendation - it simply makes no sense to me to call it "sales spin."

But of course now that she's found TUG and knows about the external resale market she can research gold (September) weeks at whichever HHI resorts she would be interested in purchasing. Now she can find out all of the external market info that the sales rep naturally wouldn't make available to her, and weigh the prices there against her desire to make use of the MRP exchange option and Marriott's rental program as well as any possible ramifications of a new Marriott exchange system IF it's rolled out.

 

[Dave M]

I'm also enticed with the idea of trading my week in for points if I decide not to use it in a given year. Since we only go to HHI about every other or every third year I thought the trade for points was an interesting option. (I know that costs extra and so does trading, and now I know it's probably not as cost effective as buying resale).

You don't need to buy from Marriott to amass a lot of points. You and your spouse can buy 100,000 points each year (50,000 for each account), whether or not you own a Marriott timeshare. The cost is $12.50 per 1,000 points - $1,250 for 100,000. That's not a lot more than the annual maintenance fee for the timeshares you are considering and the cost savings from buying resale is tremendous.

 

[pwrshift]

I suggest you really look at what you want from TS ownership ... Using, trading for other TS, or trading for points. Once my kids grew up and left the nest I felt having a 2bdrm suite was a waste and preferred lockoffs because you can split them into 2 parts for $75 and get an extra week ... But you can't get lockoffs in either place you're looking. I also found out I loved points travel on business class flights which otherwise are way too expensive ... But what a treat on points!

It takes a lot of years to build enough points for frequent package travel .. Air plus hotels ... And buying just 100k a year would take you about 7 years for a nice 2 week trip..unless you get a ton of points for buying direct, more than one week to trade for points, and follow the MR plan to the fullest with the VISA card, hotel stays, etc. Otherwise, buy resale 2 weeks where and when you want to go and book 13 months ahead.

Brian

 

[LiraBelle279]

Good to know about purchasing points. I know you can do that with the airlines but I didn't know you could do that with Marriott as well. Thanks everyone! I think now I have a better idea of the questions I need to go back and ask - though I think I'll wait until June to see what happens with the changes before I go any further.

Another quick question for those of you with several timeshares - have you ever rented out one of your weeks? Has the rent you've received from the rental been enough to cover the MFs on your other units?

 

[LiraBelle279]

Hi Brian - actually I want it all! I want to be able to use it the years that I want to or if I want to go somewhere new/different one year I want to be able to trade it. I would also consider purchasing more than one in order to rent one and use one - hopefully making enough on the rental to pay for the MF for both. And as I've said before it would be nice to trade it for points if I wanted to pay the money to buy direct. Should I ask about resales sold directly through Marriott? Would that lessen my cost by much? What about negotiating the cost? Is there much negotiating going on with direct sales given the economy?

 

[SueDonJ]

I haven't rented so can't answer that, but Resales-by-Marriott are actually the same as purchasing direct inventory from Marriott. Buyers pay Marriott's prices with no negotiation allowed and get exactly the same usage options (e.g. the MRP exchange benefit that's not transferable on the external market does transfer with a resale-by-Marriot.) For purposes of the new exchange system that Marriott MAY roll out, and any other future changes, we're collectively assuming that resales-by-Marriott will always be considered as any other direct purchase. Also, late last year Marriott reduced prices of developer inventory across the board but that still doesn't allow any price negotiation.

Where there might be some leeway is in the incentives (such as MR point packages) attached to direct purchases, but I'm not sure that an individual buyer can negotiate those differently from any others. Rather, buyers may be able to choose to pay one price and get an MRP package, or pay a lesser price and get no incentives. Relating this to the price you were given, it appears that $26K OceanWatch week did not include an MRP incentive package?

 

[pwrshift]

Over the last year or so, rentals of TS weeks has been very poor and some owners rented on ebay for less than their maintenance cost just to help with their financial commitments, so it has been better trading into II so you could at least use it for another stay someday.

The economy is getting better ... And prices for renting, resales, direct purchases, etc, will be going up along with hotel rates. Marriott stock is way way up over the last year. This could mean it's a buy now market. just my opinion.

Brian

 

[LiraBelle279]

Yes, I'm a Marriott stockholder so I know that the shares are doing much better these days. I think it's probably the right time to buy before things start moving back up again I'm just not sure about what their plans are for June, so I will continue to hold off until I know more.

I think the rentals have more to do with the weeks of the years and locations. We rented last year on HHI using VRBO and there were really low rates in May some were $600.00 for memorial day week with ocean views but still the same 2-4K rates for the hot weeks in July and they were rented pretty early (on Redweek as well) so I don't know if that had more to do with the time of year and locations than anything else. People always want to go away for 4th of July or any of the July weeks.

Susan - as for the MRP incentives he said I could get 250K MR points every year if I purchased MB OF and traded it in for points, because they can get top dollar for those weeks on rentals. I don't recall if there was a bonus of MR points for purchasing - perhaps there was but I don't remember. So what he was saying made sense to me at the time. I guess I could always purchase one direct for the points and another off the resale market if I figured out whether platinum or Gold was better for me. Still have to do more research and ask more questions. My husband and I plan to travel quite a lot in the next 5-10 years so I'm just looking for ways to maximize our ability to do that.

For those with multiple TS - did you have a time share strategy or was it just that you liked the first property that you picked and decided to get another week at the same location and it just evolved from there?

 

[Dave M]

he said I could get 250K MR points every year if I purchased MB OF and traded it in for points....

I think there was a miscommunication there. No way will you get 250,000 points by trading for points every year unless you buy two platinum weeks.

 

[SueDonJ]

... Susan - as for the MRP incentives he said I could get 250K MR points every year if I purchased MB OF and traded it in for points, because they can get top dollar for those weeks on rentals. I don't recall if there was a bonus of MR points for purchasing - perhaps there was but I don't remember. So what he was saying made sense to me at the time. I guess I could always purchase one direct for the points and another off the resale market if I figured out whether platinum or Gold was better for me. Still have to do more research and ask more questions. My husband and I plan to travel quite a lot in the next 5-10 years so I'm just looking for ways to maximize our ability to do that.

The purchase incentive MRP packages are different than the MRP exchange usage option. Purchase incentives are one-time MRP bonuses that used to be standard with every direct purchase but aren't since late last year when Marriott responded to the economic conditions by reducing their prices. Purchase incentives are/were different at every resort, and in this current pricing structure they may not be available at all. I'd guess that if you were offered an MRP purchase incentive you would remember it as that, because the sales reps make quite a big deal of it. Plus, the $26K price you were given for OF seems more like a developer-inventory reduced price than an incentive-laden price.

The MRP exchange usage option is completely separate from the incentive packages. It provides that for the length of your ownership (*as long as the program is administered by Marriott) you can exchange your week for a certain stipulated amount of MRP either annually or bi-annually, and different resorts and purchase dates can have different options. The purchase documents will set out the details very clearly, which means that usually a sales rep will not "spin" that information. Like Dave says, 250K points annually is a very generous option compared to most others - you should verify that number.

I think you're doing the right thing by asking all kinds of questions to sort out how timeshare ownership will fit into your vacationing needs, and which resort/unit/season and type of purchase makes the most sense for you. This thing about Marriott possibly rolling out a new internal exchange system come June certainly throws a monkey wrench into all ownerships, but maybe the one good thing is that it does give you time to make your decision. Good luck whatever you decide.

For those with multiple TS - did you have a time share strategy or was it just that you liked the first property that you picked and decided to get another week at the same location and it just evolved from there?

We fell in love with Hilton Head on our first trip there when we rented an oceanfront condo from ResortQuest. The next year we did the same thing, but during that trip we visited a local real estate agent who quickly brought us back to the real world - there was no way a $3-4M condo purchase would fit into our future plans. But he sent us over to SurfWatch where we took a tour and talked to a rep who didn't try to "spin" anything. I'd already been looking into DVC ownership because I'm a Disney whacko. (Don isn't and so DVC will never happen for us.) But that rep was able to explain Marriott's product and compare it to DVC's so that it made sense to us. We LOVE SurfWatch - purchasing there made perfect sense for our vacation plans, which were to return to a nice condo-type place with resort amenities on Hilton Head for at least two weeks every year. The following year we visited Barony Beach and fell in love with that, too, and figured that purchasing there would get us an extra week to use as well as give us an additional advantage when using the 13-mo consecutive/concurrent reservation system. So here we are, very happy and satisfied MVCI owners.

 

[KathyPet]

I concurr with Dave. You should get 125,000 MR reward points for trading in a platinum oceanfront unit every other year not 250,000. You may get a one time incentive of Marriott reward points when your purchase although they have had price reductions and may not be offering that with the reduced price.

 

[pwrshift]

There are some resorts you can trade in every year for points if you buy Direct ... Monarch in HH is one I think, and 125,000 pts. Beachplace too in ft. Laud and I think some of the older ones in Orlando. Probably more. IMO it can be a nice benefit if you need or want it ... If I traded all mine in one year I'd get over 600,000 pts for about $5500 which would force me to clear out my II inventory.

Brian