Going to Bonnet tomorrow for Sales Pitch 3 night stay - Help Please

[Zentos]

Hi All --

I just found this forum this morning and tomorrow we're flying out to Orland to stay at Bonnet Creek for the sales pitch on Thursday.

I am reading as quickly as I can on this forum and I was hoping someone could give me a quick reply on what we should do. I talked to my friend who put me on their friend list for this initial trip and she loves her Wyndham points and the Bonnet resort for 2 years now.

First, should I even entertain purchasing anything this week from them directly? I keep hearing about super inexpensive forclosure deals, but then I'm now reading about this resale points options and those great deals.

I'm reading as much as I can in the short time I have before we leave tomorrow, but was hoping someone could give me a quick run down on what I should do right now on any quick decisions this week.

Thanks!

 

[AwayWeGo]

Nothing The Timeshare Companies Sell At Full Freight Is Worth The Money.

First, should I even entertain purchasing anything this week from them directly? I keep hearing about super inexpensive forclosure deals, but then I'm now reading about this resale points options and those great deals.

Wyndham timeshares are pretty nice (at least the ones we've seen, including Bonnet Creek), & Wyndham timeshare points -- resale only -- are viewed by many savvy timeshare people as an outsanding value.

At full freight, not so much.

I'm reading as much as I can in the short time I have before we leave tomorrow, but was hoping someone could give me a quick run down on what I should do right now on any quick decisions this week.

The quick decision is the obvious & practical decision.

Simply listen politely, pay attention, & then say No Thanks to the nice people at Bonnet Creek.

Have a nice time while you're there, & just don't let the timeshare sellers arm-twist you or high-pressure you or guilt-trip you or otherwise psychologically manipulate you into into going along with their overpriced full-freight timeshares.

Buy timeshares resale only. Save thousands of dollars on exactly the same thing as full freight, or the equivalent, or something even better.

Everything else is details.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[YeongWoo]

Ditto

You'll hear lies about what you would miss if you don't buy from the developer. There are some things that you can only get from developer but the truth is that those things aren't worth the mortgage. I bought resale because Wyndham had locations that work for me and it has been great. I paid less than 5% of what the original purchaser paid. I don't think you'll make a mistake with Wyndham but by resale.

 

[Keep Traveling]

I bought 310k points for $1000 last year and love the membership. In fact i rented my first unit and made a nice profit as well.

The price now should be no more than half of that.

KT

 

[Zentos]

When you say you guys are buying points resale, how does that work if I'm not currently an owner? Are you buying points as a set amount or are they points you get annual or bi-annually?

I'm reading as fast as I can on the old threads, but it seems everyone is talking about buying hundreds of thousands of points and they are current owners already?

Do we have to buy a timeshare from someone and then we can buy the resale points?

So much to read and so little time! This forum is fantastic and wish I had found it weeks ago!!

Thank you all for the quick responses.

 

[timeos2]

Go prepared to know you will not buy retail ever

First, should I even entertain purchasing anything this week from them directly? I keep hearing about super inexpensive forclosure deals, but then I'm now reading about this resale points options and those great deals.

I'm reading as much as I can in the short time I have before we leave tomorrow, but was hoping someone could give me a quick run down on what I should do right now on any quick decisions this week.

Thanks!

Listen to the sales pitch for the great resorts they offer, the ease of using points vs week for week trades, the ties to RCI weeks and the other basic rights a points ownership would give you.

Ignore the heavier pitch they give to the many VIP levels (NEVER worth the extra cost you'd pay vs resale points), the Plus Partners (overpriced things you can easily obtain cheaper on your own web search) and anything else they will not put into writing as a guaranteed part of your retail purchase. If it isn't guaranteed then paying a penny extra is money wasted.

Of course always remember that should you buy retail with whatever temporary or limited perks that may be tacked on after the 7th to 10th day (when the right to rescind ends) you wold have a package worth 90 to 95% or less of what you just paid. Plus in those heady tens of thousand dollar purchases you may end up financing it - another BIG mistake in timeshares. At resale prices are so reasonable that cash purchase is usually a real option.

In both cases it is the annual fees that represent the real cost and those fees are the same for expensive retail buyers and inexpensive resale purchases. Which do you think makes more sense?

Anything about "you need to own here or be VIP" or whatever they may spew is also weasel speak. Virtually any Wyndham resort is available by using any points based at any resort as that is how the basic system was set up and is guaranteed in your ownership. Unlike VIP or any other perk those basic rights cannot be taken away and thus are real value you can buy. Inexpensively resale or for a Kings Ransom at retail. NEVER buy Wyndham retail. Never.

 

[dcdowden]

You do not need to buy from the developer before buying resale.
Look at the classified ads on TUG or check out EBAY.
Most buyers and sellers use a Timeshare Closing Service to make sure the transaction goes smoothly and both sides are protected. The end result is that you own a deeded property at a specific resort just like you would have if you bought from the developer. Your ownership is expressed in terms of UDI (Undivided Interest) points at that property. UDI points is your basic currency within the Wyndham system to reserve at your home resort at 13 months or at other resorts at 10 months. At this point there are so many people looking to sell or rent their timeshare ownership, I would suggest you just look at renting at a few different resorts and avoid making the commitment to pay maintenance fees forever which is required by ownership.
Doug

 

[vacationhopeful]

No need to buy retail as your first Wyndham purchase. There are advantages to WHERE you buy your HOME RESORT as the UDI points are deeded to. WHO you buy from does not matter except the original costs. Wyndham points can be used to book reservations at ANY of the Wyndham points resorts IF the is an available UNIT for the number points that you have in that use year.

Remember, ANY and ALL ONE TIME only offers they make you will still be available NEXT week. Wyndham & the TS sales staff are experts at double-speak where some of them make $200,000+ a year selling TS. Used car salesmen are bush league in training, tactics and false promises compared to these TS sales pros. You need a car; very few people absolutely can't live w/o a TS. If the TS salesperson's lips are moving, they are NOT TELLING the truth fully or correctly or w/o implications you want to believe.

As you are inbound on a "FREE" stay, there will be a required number of HOURS you have to stay with your sales person. Then you will get a "closer", then an evaluator of your salesperson, the one time DISCOVERY PROGRAM PACKAGE, then a gifter to explain your "gift" (loot) and then just one more person for you to sign off on the onetime only offer which will never to availalbe to you again.

Don't wear deoderant, fart if you can, bring a 2 yo who stinky poops, and leave your credit cards and checkbook in the room's safe. And be ready to fake an emergency back at the room call 15 minutes after the length of time you must stay.

I love to BS about everything under the sun and then use my excuse - I was here and your failure to control the topics for the 45 minutes I had to be here, is not my problem or concern. Give me my GIFT for attending now!

I now just refuse to WASTE my time doing the update. No $50/$75 gift card is worth the waste of my vacation day.

Good luck.

 

[AwayWeGo]

Fret Not. Just Listen Politely & Pay Attention, Then Say, "No Thanks."

leave your credit cards and checkbook in the room's safe

When you check in to get the sales pitch, the receptionist will want to see a credit card & a photo I.D. card.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[rickandcindy23]

First, welcome to TUG! We are all very cynical about developers and timeshare salespeople here, but we all (most of us) do love the timeshares we own and use. Resale is the BEST!

Heaven help you, my friend, because timeshares are hard to sell these days, and the sales pitch will be pushier than we have probably ever experienced.

Don't tell the timeshare salesperson you are considering resale, because the lies that come from that point on will be accelerated. No point in angering the sales staff and have them tell you what a terrible thing it is to buy resale. Although, when they start talking about resale like it's a huge mistake, I think it's the perfect time to say, "So your product has no value whatsoever on the resale market, and you think that's okay to say that aloud, to a potential buyer?":rofl: or, "I guess you aren't going to sell me on this as an investment, which will go up in value, if resale points are so worthless." :rofl: It amazes me how quickly a timeshare salesperson can cut down his/her own product by demonizing resale.

We actually heard a DVC salesperson talk badly of resale points during our last trip, and I was shocked to hear it, because certainly DVC doesn't have to hard-sell anyone on their product. That is a sign of the current economy.

But no point during your sales tour should you allow any salesperson to get you hooked with the absurdity of their claim that developer points are so much better.

I get a kick out of the timeshare sales pitches, because they are just so transparent to me. And consider the fact that most people believe every lie they tell, and many of them pay way too much.

Sure, there are benefits to a VIP Gold or Platinum membership with Wyndham, which you can only get through the developer (not necessarily, see last sentence). You have to buy 500K points to get Gold (or PIC a week you own in a 3 bedroom and buy the difference in points). Its 1,000,000 points for Platinum, and what does that cost? Try $100K or so. :rofl: but you can also re-qualify your resale points as Platinum or Gold through Wyndham Corporate, for about $3K, and they will let you PIC a week, too, and then you are as good as anyone who paid $100K. Wyn Corporate is hurting their sales departments with that little trick.

 

[AwayWeGo]

No Shortage Of TUG Information About Resisting The High-Pressure Pitches.

Click here for a recent TUG-BBS discussion topic devoted to handling timeshare sales pitches.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[vacationdoc]

Have a great vacation but leave without buying anything. The pressure will be huge, but just keep saying no, thanks, I am not going to sign anything today. Every argument and once in a lifetime deal they use to force you into a quick decision on the day of the sales pitch will be available later, when you have time to learn what is best for you, not the timeshare salesperson. You have paid for the vacation by listening politely to their sales pitch, and do not have to buy anything.

 

[Zentos]

Thank you all for your feedback and the great information. I will most definitely not be purchasing this week and I'm also very glad I'm taking my 2 year old son with us to the 2 hour pitch to help us have our "out"!

We're looking forward to our 3 nights in Bonnet Creek for this visit and our free trip to Magic Kingdom and escaping the snow and cold of Chicago!

Thanks again everyone and I'll be back doing lots of research on resales when we return!

 

[Rob&Carol Q]

Sigh....

Where were you guys when I bought my Points way back in the day... Oh yeah, Al Gore hadn't finished inventing the internet yet.

Oh well, can't say I dislike my points, just the price I paid. I've been to several updates and presentations since that fateful original sin and I too, am quite amused. :hysterical:

Seriously, I go to Williamsburg about every other year and haven't bought a ticket to Colonial Williamsburg in probably more than two decades. Sadly, my Bride has no resistance to buying artsy "stuff". For Better of Worse, right?

Our next points will be ebay...probably later this Summer. My only issues then will be reading up on how to close and transfer. A subject well covered on these boards.

 

[YeongWoo]

Take your time and watch the clock

Thank you all for your feedback and the great information. I will most definitely not be purchasing this week and I'm also very glad I'm taking my 2 year old son with us to the 2 hour pitch to help us have our "out"!

We're looking forward to our 3 nights in Bonnet Creek for this visit and our free trip to Magic Kingdom and escaping the snow and cold of Chicago!

Thanks again everyone and I'll be back doing lots of research on resales when we return!

Take your time on buying because the good deals are going to be here for a while. I recommend a long research period before making a move and there's no point in paying them for a "discovery" deal or anything else because you can easily rent.

There's usually an agreed to time so make sure they stick to it. They deal with screaming kids all the time so your son will probably unnerve you more than them. Usually there is a playroom for the little ones. Don't get the idea that you will meet the devil because these salespeople aren't. You are going to meet a new best friend and hopefully everything about the stay/tour goes pleasantly. That's always been my experience all the way up to the point that I tell them absolutely not. It's get ugly after that but what do I care.

 

[bamasteve]

Just say no

You are brave for going on the trip. My wife refuses to go on these things anymore. The gifts are never as great as expected. The last restaurant voucher we got was a mediocre place and we had to sit through a pretty offensive presentation. I was told things that were not really true and some pretty offensive things were said in front of my young daughters. Things I just can't repeat here.


Just grin and bear the presentation. Take the freebie and run. Don't be too nice....they think you are interested. Maybe bring up some intestinal problem you have or borrow some really loud and obnoxious children to bring with you.

Yes, I bought from them, yes I paid too much. But I do love the condos and the non sales staff and resorts. But I now stay as far away as possible from the sales staff. I do like the VIP benefits. I'm making great use of the 35% discount on points and the upgrades. Just got the Presidential 4 Bedroom for spring break at the Glade. VIP benefit is great but it is icing on the cake and not worth paying extra.

 

[AwayWeGo]

After Action Report.

I'll be back doing lots of research on resales when we return!

Be sure to let us know how it went after you get back from the old hard sell.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[#1 Cowboys Fan]

Perhaps a TUGger can provide a link to a recent ebay sale that occurred at Bonnet Creek .

If so, OP can print it and provide it if they aren't taking "NO" for an answer.

Pat

 

[Zentos]

Well we went and stayed at Bonnet for our 4 days & 3 nights in a 2 bedroom. The room was huge and the resort was very nice. We had our sales pitch at 1:30pm the 2nd day we were there and we were there for a little over 2 hours in total. We got our original sales lady who gave us the details of the points system and VIP, showed us the Presidential 4 BR, which was massive. Once we told her No, another guy came out talking about Inventory and that they were only selling in Tower 6 now and this was the last tower and units would be gone after that. After we told them No again, another lady came out to take a Survey on our experience, then she proceeded to try and sell us the Discovery? option where we get the 155,000 points for a flat rate and then can use that money towards purchasing at a later date. We told her No and then we were walked to the gift desk to get our disney tickets and such.

Overall the pressure wasn't too much and I've had far worse from car salesman. Now it's time to do huge research on resales and figure out if this is what we want to do.

My wife really like the units and the point system and the Wyndham program as a whole. She was also very intrigued by the VIP program and actually talked about it might be worth paying more to get that, but I can't see getting that return value from it.

Thank you all for the advice and I'm sure this isn't the last time you'll hear from me as I read up on the resales.

Thanks!

 

[AwayWeGo]

VIP Is Worth $500 Or So But It Costs Thousands.

She was also very intrigued by the VIP program and actually talked about it might be worth paying more to get that, but I can't see getting that return value from it.

Around here The Chief Of Staff also got semi-interested in Wyndham VIP while we were getting the old hard sell at Bonnet Creek, but fortunately not to the point where I thought she might whip out her checkbook.

When she thought about it, she decided that maybe -- maybe, not definitely -- maybe VIP could be worth a few hundred dollars if -- & from what I understand it's a big if -- if it worked as described by the timeshare sellers.

The free newspaper every morning is nice. What's that worth -- $1 daily ?

The points-discounted reservations are also nice -- if any happen to be available at any of the Wyndham timeshare resorts during times we want to go.

The upgraded units are nice -- if any are available. (No guarantees.)

And speaking of No Guarantees, nothing keeps Wyndham from dropping or watering down or changing or raising the requirements for VIP any time they decide to do so. VIP perks are strictly For The Time Being. All that's guaranteed is what's in the deed.

Now if a points-based Wyndham deed is what The Chief Of Staff wants, she can get that for nickels if not pennies on the full-freight dollar from eBay & other resale sources. Then, if she wants the extras that the VIP people get "free" (i.e., at no additional cost beyond the exorbitant big bux price they pay for their full-freight Wyndham timeshares), she can pay for those herself & still be thousands of dollars ahead compared with springing for a Wyndham timeshare from the Wyndham timeshare company.

Buy timeshares resale. Save thousands of dollars on exactly the same thing, or the equivalent, or something even better.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[timeos2]

There is a real name for retail buyers today - and it's not VIP!

My wife really like the units and the point system and the Wyndham program as a whole.

Excellent. You can get an unbelievable deal with resale and enjoy those resorts & features you liked for less than 10% of the cost you just heard.

She was also very intrigued by the VIP program and actually talked about it might be worth paying more to get that, but I can't see getting that return value from it.

Thanks!

That is what they expect you to do (Think of the movie AIRPLANE!). I cannot believe how good they are at selling "air". Nothing in VIP is guaranteed - it is all sales supported perks that can disappear tomorrow and you have no recourse (they are not sold to you nor given in writing). By paying 90% or more UPFRONT you have set yourself up to need ten to twenty years of maximizing those potential benefits (do you really think that those points discounts will be available for the prime time resort/use you really want? Of course not - the discounts, if any, are on off times as you would expect. Far cheaper to own the resale points and simply reserve those times OR pay the same amount of points a VIP member would for the prime times but with your points discounted at purchase by 90% or more. You both (retail & resale buyer) pay the same annual fees so who do you think got the better deal?

If she got sold on the "value" have her write it down. What exactly will you save per reservation? Maximize it just for fun and do the math to see how long it would take, if you actually got that value, simply to break even on the original purchase cost you are paying UPFRONT vs the resale cost of the points required to do the exact same thing with tens of thousands saved. You'll be surprised what that "free" paper and maybe, if you actually need/get it, housekeeping credit will be costing you.

There is no way to ever make retail cost pay in Wyndham no matter what level of VIP they talk you into. If you plan to do that then the "buy" recommendation of the product at resale level turns to a "pass" recommendation as anything you would think of buying that loses 90%+ of its value at resale on the 7th to 10th day you own it is NOT a good deal! Really. And it doesn't matter if they call you VIP or "suckers", the end result is the same, don't spend the money at retail.