Wyndham is closing a handful of legacy resorts - dedicated chart/tracker located in the first post for this unfolding set of events

[HitchHiker71]

Absolutely agree. I would guess that the offer to move to CWA will stay on the table until the entire process ends. As I mentioned, Wyndham probably wants to conclude this as quickly as possible. Once the resort closes, it will cost about $50k/month from the reserves to maintain it and meet other obligations. Each month that passes is about $35k less of a payout to Wyndham at the conclusion of the process.

Not sure what exactly you mean by the offer to do the CWA swap will stay on the table until the entire process ends. I'm assuming you mean there won't be a timetable on this offer. That would be an incorrect assumption. There will be an explicit time window to accept or reject the CWA swap offer. From what I've heard, it will be either 30 or 60 days. Don't wait, as Wyndham may not honor any exception once the time window documented in the letter received expires.

 

[bamasteve]

So we're not going to take the CWA offer. I've walked through our personal reaons below:

• Financials: CWA costs are higher, I'm at $3200 per year (current cost) and my kids don't want this expense - it's only going to go up. I'm going to retire in 3 to 7 years.
• Rental Options: The options for a similar condo is becoming easier - with AirBNB and VRBO, even hotels with so much more selection
• Resort Locations: Wyndam and RCI resort locations are more and more limiting - We find ourselves wanting to go to a greater variety of locations - often there is no RCI or Wyndham where we want to go - or we want to shift from location to location (e.g. touring Europe)
• RCI getting worse: All my searches depress me - the resorts offered at the locations I want are poorly rated, often not available when I want exactly and add on excessive fees ($20 per day for AC, $110 for cleaning fee, $12/day ammenities fee - the recent one)
• VIP: I'm Wyndham VIP Gold - It's getting more and more watered down. I could get upgrades at places like The Glade - but I think those days are over. Gold VIP not enough to stay
• The Wyndham sales pitch: IYKYK

For over 30 years Fairfield/Wyndham has been great for our family.
These are our personal decision factors - curious what others are thinking as they make the decision to take CWA or wait for liquidation?

 

[donno]

There was one question that I forgot to ask. They mentioned that they had a 39% occupancy for last year. I wonder if that was just based on owner occupy and trades or if it included third party rentals. Doesn't make any difference, but it would have been interesting to know.

I asked that question at our HOA meeting and they said the occupancy rate included all sources (wyndham owners and guests and rentals through extra holidays, rci, etc.).

 

[jp10558]

So we're not going to take the CWA offer. I've walked through our personal reaons below:

• Rental Options: The options for a similar condo is becoming easier - with AirBNB and VRBO, even hotels with so much more selection

Are you having good experiences with VRBO? I did my first one and it made me long for every TS except for Villa Roma it was so bad.

 

[hnybee09]

I don't remember which buildings at Star Island Wyndham has units in but I know it's not all the buildings. I know it's building 25 and I'm thinking 20, 21, and maybe units some in 28. Maybe 22, 23, and 24 too.

View attachment 116315

I stayed in a Wyndham unit a couple years ago, it was a 2 bedroom lock off that backed up to the Tennis courts. Pretty sure it was building 23.

 

[bamasteve]

Are you having good experiences with VRBO? I did my first one and it made me long for every TS except for Villa Roma it was so bad.

I've had great experiences with AirBnB getting Wyndham quality units at similar prices. My son in law has had good experience with VRBO. Interestingly we just compared his cost versus with VRBO my cost with Wyndham Points to stay at the same resort in Hawaii. The costs were very comparable.

 

[dioxide45]

I suspect the occupancy numbers are for the whole year, so summer might be as high as 75% and winter as low as 10%. It all works out to the 35%.

 

[hnybee09]

Can someone help me out with something please? I can't find my deed for Bentley Brook and now I am wondering if we ever received it. Where can I go to get a copy?
Thanks!!!

 

[HitchHiker71]

Someone with a Pagosa deed said in one of the groups that she received an HOA letter with information about a bankruptcy, but no additional details (like which HOA). I know we hadn't heard of any Pagosa in this round. Not enough information to add to the list yet, but just for everyone to be on the lookout for more such reports or check with sources.

Confirmed that Pagosa is consolidating. I don't yet have the names of the HOAs, but it's not very impactful overall. Maybe 1-2 HOAs. The reason resorts like Pagosa didn't turn up sooner is because there were no employee impacts involved - so resorts like Pagosa, Edisto, etc., - where zero employees were impacted - didn't receive any employee impact notifications like other resorts on our list.

 

[HitchHiker71]

We are ViP Gold and have 105,000 converted points at Fairfield Bay. Our total point total is 608,000 so we were grandfathered in based on the new points requirement. If we lost the 105,000 points from Bay we would still have 503,000 points which was over the old VIP Gold level. Our decision to take the CWA points will be purely based on if we still retain VIP Gold. Any thoughts?

So the official answer is - call Wyndham once you receive the notification for the CWA swap. An account review is in order to ensure a correct answer. The small group of Owner Services reps that will be handling the calls for the impacted resorts will provide the official answer. The answer depends upon the VIP grandfathering tier (there are multiple), the mix of contracts in the account, etc. In general, given what you've outlined here, you should retain your legacy VIPG level, but again, call to be sure once you receive the official paperwork/email.

All emails for the CWA swap notifications will come from: Donotreply@email.wyndhamvo.com

It'd be a good idea to whitelist this email address in your email system if you're expecting this communication.

It's also worth noting that Wyndham is preparing an owner communication to share more information on these actions in the mid-late October timeframe, best estimate, subject to change as always.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Okay, but then how does that work exactly? Especially if the units are just mixed in with others. Or are all the Wyndham units in their own separate buildings?

I'm not sure what you're really getting at here. Whether the units are intermixed in various buildings or not, isn't going to prevent Wyndham from selling the units right?

 

[chapjim]

So the official answer is - call Wyndham once you receive the notification for the CWA swap. An account review is in order to ensure a correct answer. The small group of Owner Services reps that will be handling the calls for the impacted resorts will provide the official answer. The answer depends upon the VIP grandfathering tier (there are multiple), the mix of contracts in the account, etc. In general, given what you've outlined here, you should retain your legacy VIPG level, but again, call to be sure once you receive the official paperwork/email.

All emails for the CWA swap notifications will come from: Donotreply@email.wyndhamvo.com

It'd be a good idea to whitelist this email address in your email system if you're expecting this communication.

It's also worth noting that Wyndham is preparing an owner communication to share more information on these actions in the mid-late October timeframe, best estimate, subject to change as always.

Any indication when these notifications will be forthcoming? If they want to expedite things, the notifications could come this fall. If they need to wait until a sale is consummated and approved by the Bankruptcy Court, it will be a while.

 

[Floridaman76]

Are you having good experiences with VRBO? I did my first one and it made me long for every TS except for Villa Roma it was so bad.

VRBO / AirBnB and their ilk are an absolute cancer on neighborhoods.

I lived across the street from one for about 9 months before a concerted effort between our HOA and Code Enforcement shut them down.

The investor clowns who bought the house threw a coat of paint on it, never did any yard work, seemed to search for the most unruly people on earth who made a mess and a lot of noise each and every weekend.

After the short term rental nonsense was shut down they have a decent family living in the house now, go figure.

 

[dioxide45]

I'm not sure what you're really getting at here. Whether the units are intermixed in various buildings or not, isn't going to prevent Wyndham from selling the units right?

I am just trying to understand how it would impact non Wyndham units. Are we saying that a property like Star Island won't close. It will cary on and the Wyndham units will go somewhere else? The big question is, are the Wyndham units at Star Island a separate HOA from the other non Wyndham units? If they are, who is going to step in to buy the Wyndham units. If they aren't, then it would seem the entire property is impacted, even if you own a non Wyndham unit.

 

[jp10558]

VRBO / AirBnB and their ilk are an absolute cancer on neighborhoods.

I lived across the street from one for about 9 months before a concerted effort between our HOA and Code Enforcement shut them down.

The investor clowns who bought the house threw a coat of paint on it, never did any yard work, seemed to search for the most unruly people on earth who made a mess and a lot of noise each and every weekend.

After the short term rental nonsense was shut down they have a decent family living in the house now, go figure.

Presumably if you're renting a resort that's not a problem. The problem as the consumer at resorts is I bet many of the companies want to shut down VRBO renting like Wyndham did or at least tried to do. In which case I'm going to be worried I'll get there and not have a place to stay. Though that may have been better than the VRBO undisclosed deep clean at the end requirement (that later I found out was no longer allowed lol, jokes on me I guess). Upshot is VRBO doesn't let them charge you a surprise cleaning fee unlike AirB&B (as I understand).

 

[chapjim]

I am just trying to understand how it would impact non Wyndham units. Are we saying that a property like Star Island won't close. It will cary on and the Wyndham units will go somewhere else? The big question is, are the Wyndham units at Star Island a separate HOA from the other non Wyndham units? If they are, who is going to step in to buy the Wyndham units. If they aren't, then it would seem the entire property is impacted, even if you own a non Wyndham unit.

Assuming at least one other HOA besides Wyndham's, in what way is an entire property impacted? How are non-Wyndham owners affected?

 

[dioxide45]

Assuming at least one other HOA besides Wyndham's, in what way is an entire property impacted. How are non-Wyndham owners affected?

But, from what I understand at Star Island, the Wyndham units aren't segregated completely from the non-Wyndham units. Do we know there is another HOA? How did Wyndham come about to own units at Star Island? Do we KNOW FOR SURE, there is a separate HOA? Why are there no Wyndham staff at Star Island?

I am first trying to understand the make up and dynamics of the property. If there are Club Wyndham units mixed in and around non-Club Wyndham units, how does that work exactly? I guess they just sit empty until the HOA or Wyndham can figure out what to do with them. Often with separate associations there is also a master association that covers amenities that are shared between all the HOAs at a property. Do those Wyndham units become delinquent to the master association?

 

[chapjim]

But, from what I understand at Star Island, the Wyndham units aren't segregated completely from the non-Wyndham units.

Does it matter?

Do we know there is another HOA? How did Wyndham come about to own units at Star Island? Do we KNOW FOR SURE, there is a separate HOA?

I don't know but can't imagine that Wyndham would not have a separate HOA. Does it matter how Wyndham acquired units at Star Island?

Why are there no Wyndham staff at Star Island?

Wyndham doesn't manage the resort.

I am first trying to understand the make up and dynamics of the property. If there are Club Wyndham units mixed in and around non-Club Wyndham units, how does that work exactly? I guess they just sit empty until the HOA or Wyndham can figure out what to do with them. Often with separate associations there is also a master association that covers amenities that are shared between all the HOAs at a property. Do those Wyndham units become delinquent to the master association?

So, say Unit 1001 is an occupied non-Wyndham unit and Unit 1002 is an unoccupied Wyndham unit. Somehow, they managed to get along before and will continue to get along. The Wyndham units will have to be maintained by the contractor hired by the management company, funded by Wyndham or its successor.

I don't see why these issues are so important or so mysterious.

 

[dioxide45]

Does it matter?


I don't know but can't imagine that Wyndham would not have a separate HOA. Does it matter how Wyndham acquired units at Star Island?



Wyndham doesn't manage the resort.


So, say Unit 1001 is an occupied non-Wyndham unit and Unit 1002 is an unoccupied Wyndham unit. Somehow, they managed to get along before and will continue to get along. The Wyndham units will have to be maintained by the contractor hired by the management company, funded by Wyndham or its successor.

I don't see why these issues are so important or so mysterious.

It seems that you don't really know the answers and just asking questions in return. The big question is WHO is the successor? Who is going to be willing to buy units that are part of some other association? Who takes over the Wyndham units after bankruptcy? The existing management company of the resort? Why would they want them? What would they do with them?

I suppose no one really knows the answers and we will just have to have it play out. If there is a single HOA, then Star Island can only go down the bankruptcy route as a whole. That is why separate vs one HOA really matters.

I never said the issues were important. Though I am sure they are important to someone. I am asking logical questions and you seem to just be replying to post a reply that doesn't really answer any of the questions. It is okay if you don't know the answers, but just say so and don't dismiss the questions as somehow unimportant. The answers may not matter to you, but I find it interesting.

 

[HitchHiker71]

It seems that you don't really know the answers and just asking questions in return. The big question is WHO is the successor? Who is going to be willing to buy units that are part of some other association? Who takes over the Wyndham units after bankruptcy? The existing management company of the resort? Why would they want them? What would they do with them?

I suppose no one really knows the answers and we will just have to have it play out. If there is a single HOA, then Star Island can only go down the bankruptcy route as a whole. That is why separate vs one HOA really matters.

I never said the issues were important. Though I am sure they are important to someone. I am asking logical questions and you seem to just be replying to post a reply that doesn't really answer any of the questions. It is okay if you don't know the answers, but just say so and don't dismiss the questions as somehow unimportant. The answers may not matter to you, but I find it interesting.

Star Island voted this week in the affirmative for the same bankruptcy proceedings. We can therefore easily deduce that, as I said previously, Wyndham has its own HOA at Star Island for the units under ownership, since this HOA just voted this week using the same templated HOA and proxy statement verbiage as other resorts.

If there was a much larger HOA encompassing other non-Wyndham units, then Wyndham would not hold the majority of the intervals to control the member votes, nor would Wyndham hold the majority on the HOA BOD. Basic logical deduction here.


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[chapjim]

It seems that you don't really know the answers and just asking questions in return. The big question is WHO is the successor? Who is going to be willing to buy units that are part of some other association? Who takes over the Wyndham units after bankruptcy? The existing management company of the resort? Why would they want them? What would they do with them?

I suppose no one really knows the answers and we will just have to have it play out. If there is a single HOA, then Star Island can only go down the bankruptcy route as a whole. That is why separate vs one HOA really matters.

I never said the issues were important. Though I am sure they are important to someone. I am asking logical questions and you seem to just be replying to post a reply that doesn't really answer any of the questions. It is okay if you don't know the answers, but just say so and don't dismiss the questions as somehow unimportant. The answers may not matter to you, but I find it interesting.

No, I don't know some of the answers but the resort has been functioning for some time with how many ever HOAs it has.

Have you made any calls to get answers to questions you find interesting (albeit perhaps not important)?

The existing management company will take care of (not take over) the Wyndham (or successor) units because they are being paid to do so. Just like now.

 

[dioxide45]

Star Island voted this week in the affirmative for the same bankruptcy proceedings. We can therefore easily deduce that, as I said previously, Wyndham has its own HOA at Star Island for the units under ownership, since this HOA just voted this week using the same templated HOA and proxy statement verbiage as other resorts.

If there was a much larger HOA encompassing other non-Wyndham units, then Wyndham would not hold the majority of the intervals to control the member votes, nor would Wyndham hold the majority on the HOA BOD. Basic logical deduction here.


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So it would seem that the Wyndham owned units would have to carry on as timeshare. I suppose they could sell them as whole ownership but I would hazard to guess a company like Capital Vacations would have to step in and buy the units.

are there both converted weeks and CWA at Star Island? I suppose they would be treated the same but someone has to be willing to buy them. It doesn’t seem like they can just unload the property as a whole like they plan for some of the others.

 

[dioxide45]

No, I don't know some of the answers but the resort has been functioning for some time with how many ever HOAs it has.

Have you made any calls to get answers to questions you find interesting (albeit perhaps not important)?

The existing management company will take care of (not take over) the Wyndham (or successor) units because they are being paid to do so. Just like now.

I don’t own Star Island, so i doubt they would answer my questions. Who exactly is paying the management company to maintain the Wyndham units after the HOA is bankrupt?

 

[CO skier]

If there is a single HOA, then Star Island can only go down the bankruptcy route as a whole. That is why separate vs one HOA really matters.

There is this, fwiw. Same address as Club Wyndham Star Island.

 

[Floridaman76]

I don’t own Star Island, so i doubt they would answer my questions. Who exactly is paying the management company to maintain the Wyndham units after the HOA is bankrupt?

Star Island is an odd duck in this whole thing. But it's not alone being that there is at least one other property which has Wyndham and non-Wyndham inventory available to book by Club Wyndham owners.

Fairfield Mountains Lake Lure (VRI and I think Diamond).

I was thinking possibly there may be a similar situation at Shawnee and Edisto too, but i'm not sure.

Again, speculating, but one would assume that the non-Wyndham owned inventory at Star Island and Lake Lure will continue to be timeshares and probably in RCI. But not bookable using Club Wyndham points as they are now.

As far as the question of "who will maintain the Wyndham units at these locations". Wyndham likely will, and paid out of reserves until the resorts sell.

But since these units will not be being used, there should be relatively little maintenance to occur once the units are cleaned and any necessary repairs done after the last customer leaves at the end of December.

Obviously landscaping and misc things will occur, probably paid out of reserves.

As far as the non-Wyndham inventory... from Wyndham's perspective, that's none of their concern I guess. I am curious if Star Island (the non-Wyndham inventory) will still be bookable through Wyndham Rewards. I'm guessing not. But I guess we will see.