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Why are time shares a scam??

Discussion in 'TUG Lounge' started by Gypsy65, May 14, 2019.

  1. Gypsy65

    Gypsy65 Guest

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    This post may get a lot of backlash

    But I own timeshares and purchased them with the idea they were not an investment but they gave me a nicer place or places to stay at than a hotel

    I read. Read and read some more how horrible they are and people desperately trying to get out and I get that.
    There are times I myself would like the same.
    But the question is why are they a scam?
    I purchased a $80,000 pick up truck and did not go home and immediately get on line looking for a way to get the dealer to take it back. In fact I traded in a 1 year old truck on this one and took a $15,000 loss and never asked the original dealer for a refund or complained that I lost money on it

    I did lose but knew that when I bought the first truck and again when I bought the 2nd
    Poor decisions. Absolutely!! But they were my decisions.
    I will never make $$ on this vehicle as it’s value is dropping faster than the balance owed but it serves a purpose

    How are timeshares any different?
    Sure. Some sales people either lie or they themselves don’t actually know what they are talking about.
    But is it not up to us to make an educated purchase?

    I’ve made many poor financial decisions. Timeshare included, but in the end it was my decision and I was never held at gun point

    I think part of the regret is that many people. Myself included although I think I’m getting better at it. Do not know how to fully use their timeshare

    And I think many people are on a fixed budget and save for a long time or use a credit card to take a vacation and vacations are much different than real life
    They see a resort that took them a few years to save for to get to and fall for the lifestyle
    Then once they get home they quickly realize that they don’t have the extra $$ to live that life or go on that type of vacation every year

    My point is. I don’t think there are really many things in life that make us a profit
    Not my groceries. Not my vehicles. Not my insurances or any of my entertainment so why do we. Again myself included feel that timeshares should be any different??
     
  2. rickandcindy23

    rickandcindy23 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    Well, my only comment is that timeshares via resale are bargains and worth a look for anyone who travels even two weeks a year. You can get great value out of a timeshare, especially when you have kids and want to give them that experience. We sure enjoyed timeshares with our family, and we still do. Now we have grandchildren, and most of our trips are with kids and grandkids today.

    Sure, I want to get rid of some of mine. I have a lot of deposits in II currently, that's for sure.
     
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  3. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    Good points. Another question I wonder about is why do people on TUG get so addicted to timeshares and want to know every nitty gritty detail about them? Especially when TUG is often calling TSs a scam.
     
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  4. rickandcindy23

    rickandcindy23 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    Who calls timeshares a scam? It's a waste of money to buy developer for most timeshares, when resale is much less expensive.
     
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  5. CalGalTraveler

    CalGalTraveler TUG Member

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    It's also more cost effective to buy a certified used car, but many people still buy new. IMO some of the scam stories help the developer because people buy direct from the developer because they are afraid of being scammed. That's why we initially purchased developer (did not find Tug in time). It's a wild west on the resale side and resale prices seem too good to be true.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
    Gypsy65 likes this.
  6. CalGalTraveler

    CalGalTraveler TUG Member

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    For me, we paid developer on our first purchase. Making up for lost ground by being sure we fully researched before we bought our next TSs.
     
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  7. Gypsy65

    Gypsy65 Guest

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    Tons of people
    Just google timeshare and scam is the next word automatically filled in

    Resale works to a point for most people but the resorts know this and therefore offer other perks if you buy from them

    I owned 3 weeks with HICV and purchased them for almost nothing on eBay. Then purchased 2 weeks from the resort which allowed us to bring my eBay buys in as points along with bringing us to Signature Platinum Elite level which has added even more benefits

    So agreed. Resales are cheap if not free but come with some limited restrictions

    Update
    Just reread your post. It was about TUG scam
     
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  8. mpumilia

    mpumilia TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Like a car, resales are usually a better value.
     
  9. Ironwood

    Ironwood TUG Member

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    Because.....like Hotel California..."you can check out any time you like, but you can never leave!"
     
  10. Luvtoride

    Luvtoride TUG Member

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    [QUOTE="Gypsy65,

    I think part of the regret is that many people. Myself included although I think I’m getting better at it. Do not know how to fully use their timeshare
    [/QUOTE]

    Exactly a big part of the reason for dissatisfaction. Those of us on Tug have made it our mission to learn all we can about our TS ownerships. Yes it still costs us alot of money on an ongoing basis but if we feel we are using them for great vacation experiences there is no regret for the “investments” we’ve made.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  11. SteelerGal

    SteelerGal TUG Member

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    Being a family of 7 and spending ridiculous amounts of $$$ at hotel, I am grateful I started researching TS. Found RedWeek and then TUG. Now Dh and I look forward to vacations. 2 more trips planned for this year and then 4 trips planned for next.
    Because of TS, my family is able to travel comfortably at a reasonable price.
     
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  12. CalGalTraveler

    CalGalTraveler TUG Member

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    Overly aggressive sales people pitch people on vacation who cannot afford to buy. When they get home and wake up it's too late. They need longer rescission periods.

    Elderly and people with changes in circumstances (health, lost job etc.) cannot easily sell.
     
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  13. bdfitzp

    bdfitzp TUG Member

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    From someone who purchased from developer I have no regrets. I felt I was not scammed. I admit I was not familiar about resales at the time but even after learning I still am happy with my decision. Someone has to be the original purchaser or these fabulous resorts would not exist. So for all those who brag about how they love their timeshares they were able to purchase resale, maybe just a little appreciation and thank you for us "original purchasers" who made your life a little more enjoyable.
     
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  14. Gypsy65

    Gypsy65 Guest

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    I agree
    I know many people who never take vacations or do anything with their family and to me they may regret those decisions when they are older and kids gone

    I think timeshares, no matter how purchased sorta force us to plan and take vacations

    They’re not a financial investment by any meaning of the word but neither are children
    Children are an expense and a lot of work but if you do it right then there’s a satisfaction value
    Same with TS or vacations. The value is the same you would get from your kids or a nice restaurant

    Some things in life you just can’t put a price tag on.
    Would the words
    “ sentimental value “ work here??
     
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  15. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    Yes yes yes! I agree. So many people are dissing the developers and criticizing people who bought direct. I will say Thank you to all the original owners who allowed me to purchase their time share on the resale market. Some day, someone will get an even better deal when they buy my resale-resales.
     
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  16. Jan M.

    Jan M. TUG Member

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    Many of us had no idea about timeshare resales when we bought developer. The best advise is get over what you paid and learn to use what you have. And keep checking for reservations. Persistence pays off.

    For going on 17 years we have vacationed more than most people even dream of doing. And in really nice accommodations. The only studio we've stayed in and go back to is at a resort and area we love. Their studios are large, have a balcony or patio, a full kitchen, have a comfortable queen Murphy bed, a sleeper sofa and a room divider that pulls to section off the Murphy bed at night.

    We moved to Florida for my husband to take a new job after he got downsized from his job up North weeks before his 61st birthday. For four months and a few days, December 5, 2010-April 8, 2011, he lived out of two Wyndham timeshares. Mostly at Palm-Aire and a few weeks Sea Gardens. Whenever I had time I was checking for reservations and all of it was booked with our VIP discount and a free upgrade on the unit size for all most all of it. Our developer purchased timeshare was a real blessing. The best part was that I was able to send my husband off on his own 1,200 miles away to try out a new job for the cost of the gas money to get to Florida. By the end of the first week he told me to go ahead and sell the house as he wasn't coming back. He got really spoiled by housekeeping coming in to clean, bringing him fresh towels, making up the bed with clean sheets and resupplying him with paper and soap products. He only had to wash his clothes and take care of the shopping, cooking and clean up for his meals for a little over four months. It was a tough life but he managed, lol. Btw his whole stay was during the winter months when stays are supposedly hard to find in this part of Florida. And at Palm-Aire they kept him in the same unit so he didn't have to move.
     
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  17. LannyPC

    LannyPC TUG Member

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    I wouldn't necessarily say that they're a scam. Most people who post scathing remarks about TSs on social media call them scams because they feel they, or someone close to them, got suckered in by those infamous sales people. I guess a lot of the half-truths, omission of facts, skewed facts and figures, and outright lies they were told by the sales people make these owners fell like they have been scammed.
     
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  18. joestein

    joestein TUG Member

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    I have to agree. Overly aggressive sales pitch filled with lies. Too often elderly people and poor people are take advantage of. Most have no real value, so they are difficult to get rid of, especially when there is a loan attached. How is it not a scam?

    Look at it from a financial standpoint. Emerald Grand in Destin, which is only part time share. Lets say a 3 bedroom unit goes for $1MM (the prices range from upper 000s to low MMs). Depending on which type of 3 bedroom and time of year you get, the point cost is 325K to 550K a week. Lets say an average of 400K per week. That is 20,800,000 points per year. How much do you think that Wyndham sells that for? at $15K per 100K of points that is around $3MM.

    So, $3MM vs $1MM. How is that not a scam. That is not to mention the maintenance. At $6/1000 points (which is probably low) that is $125,000 year in maintenance vs $1327/month or about $16K. Once again, how not a scam?

    I own resale, but I have begun to wonder if it makes sense to continue to own.
     
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  19. rickandcindy23

    rickandcindy23 TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I think the developers are great for building new resorts for us to trade into. I just don't want to buy into their expensive resorts. I want to stay there for less than the owners pay in MF's via trades, and I mostly don't care if it's off-season. I can travel when kids are in school.

    We just stayed at Marriott's Ko Olina. Wow, I loved it, but I see weeks sitting online for that resorts that I can pick up with my Marriott's Willow Ridge week. Sure it was April, but we got a bargain, and airfare was extra cheap for that time of year (last minute), too.
     
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  20. bogey21

    bogey21 TUG Member

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    I don't believe TimeShares are a scam. My take is that if one understands the product and is nimble TimeShare ownership can be a good deal. My gripe is when the big guys (Wyndham, Hilton, Marriott, Hyatt, etc) unilaterally change the rules to the detriment of Owners...

    George
     
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  21. bnoble

    bnoble TUG Member

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    I don't believe they are a scam. But your analogy is flawed.

    Alan Cole, aka AwayWeGo, puts it best, and has been putting it this way for years now:

    ----------
    "By the time the resale OR original owner shows up & checks in, other people will previously have been staying right there in that very same timeshare unit. Thus all timeshare units are used-used-used any way you shake it -- & so it makes no sense whatever to pay new prices for an item that is plain & simple not new."
    -----------
    That's not true for the truck. There are objective differences between a new truck and one that was previously owned by someone else. You can argue over whether or not those objective differences are worth the difference in price---some people think they are, others that they are not---but they are there. At their most basic, most timeshares purchased from the developer are exactly the same in how they are used vs. those purchased on the secondary market. The people who own them get exactly the same vacation experience.

    So, the obvious question is why are the prices of the two so different? I think the answer lies in the fact that timeshare is a product that is sold, not bought. Very few people wake up in the morning with the idea that they will buy a fractional interest in a vacation condo that obligates them to a lifetime of ongoing maintenance costs. But, lots of people end their days having done just that.

    There are also some timeshares that do provide different experiences, depending on how you buy them. Some of them are modest--an earlier check-in time, a free local paper, etc. Others are quite substantial. For example, resale Diamond timeshares do not have full system privileges, and revert to the underlying collection from which they are drawn, unless you buy some additional points from Diamond to "re-qualify" the purchase. Such differences are becoming more common, and more significant. DVC's newest resort has full system privileges when you buy from Disney, but only privileges at that particular resort if you buy it on the secondary market.

    I expect more timeshare systems to have differences in the future, and they will be more substantial.
     
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  22. easyrider

    easyrider TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I like to know the details of the timeshare systems and resorts I purchase so I can better use them. I don't consider the timeshare a scam but have seen the sales process being a scam occasionally and the exit programs being a scam most of the time.

    Bill
     
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  23. AJCts411

    AJCts411 TUG Member

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    Not sure if you can equate cars to timeshares...but. On one hand when you buy a new car, you know it will depreciate. And when you buy real property you expect it to appreciate. TS, you pay maintenance fees to presumably keep the property in good condition and thus NOT loose value. But, in TS you buy from the "dealer" developer, who then turns around and does everything possible to devalue your purchase, will not even consider a trade in, then sometimes you have to send it to the junkyard and even they will not take it. Point is the whole exit mess is what is causing the perception of a scam. People expectation that property appreciates probability also clouds their decision making process. My TS, I bought to use, and over 3 years they owe me zero, as compared to local vacation rentals or hotels. I find good value in them. But then again, I don't stay at Red Roof or camp out.
     
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  24. Gypsy65

    Gypsy65 Guest

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    Agree with the point
    But. Timeshares have been around a long time and people should know by now that they do not appreciate

    They don’t necessarily depreciate just because they are timeshares
    They depreciate because there is a lot of people trying to sell them therefore there’s a lot of used inventory

    The car thought?
    If Ford flooded the market with the exact same truck as mine and there were a lot of owners who after buying it did not like it for one reason or another, what would happen if they all tried to sell their truck at the same time?

    Supply and demand would kick in
    They flood the market so that drives the “ value “ of my truck down as well as the selling price they can get for the one they want out of
     
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  25. mpumilia

    mpumilia TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Us, too and we never regretted it and it was totally worth it financially. We knew exactly what we were getting into.

    Several years ago when we acquired a free one, we felt like we won the lottery! LOL!
     
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