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Silverleaf Owners beware of HIVC conversion.

Discussion in 'All Other Timeshare Systems' started by spoody, Aug 16, 2016.

  1. spoody

    spoody TUG Member

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    This is a posting of a Silverleafresorts Owner who converted to HIVC.

    -------------------------------------------

    This is important for those of you have multiple weeks with EE or BT.

    Here is my story on how HIVC allowed me to "technically" keep bonus time, yet still lose it.

    When I converted to points I made it clear that I would keep Endless Escape (EE) on one unit and Bonus Time (BT) on the other.
    They said no problem and I checked to make sure it was in the paperwork.

    As we know, when booking EE/BT, each account has to wait one full week before being able to book again. For instance, I book EE on one account for 6 days. BT on the other account for the next 3 days, and have a total of 9 days. Neither account can be used again until a week after the original booking, but they can be used in tandem. That was one of the sales pitches for buying multiple weeks after they established the "one week between EE/BT" policy.

    NOT ANY MORE.

    Under the HIVC system you have one membership number for all of your weeks. Therefore in their system, when you book EE/BT on one of your weeks, their account sees them as the same week, so you have to wait one week again before booking, no matter what week you used!

    Essentially, EE/BT on multiple weeks is now useless.

    If you have more than one week with EE/BT, you will lose that benefit on your additional weeks.

    That was an important benefit to me - AND THEY KNEW IT.
    If I knew this would happen I would never have converted to points. BTW - I had to buy a THIRD week with HIVC to get the free points conversion.

    If I could do it again I would have kept what I have. After all, if I really want to use HIVC resorts, I could have always traded in with RCI, right?
     
    Rat Fink and Sabrina like this.
  2. skotrla

    skotrla TUG Member

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    Except that there is 100x availability through HICV internal exchanges as there are through external exchanges, so you can't really compare what you would get through RCI to what you get through HICV. External exchanges are opt-in, so you only see inventory exchanged for what's been actively booked vs. internal exchanges, which include inventory from the majority of timeshare users who don't use their time.

    For example, HICV Galveston in 1-month, the weekend of 9/16/16 within 1 week before or after.

    RCI: Nothing! (HICV or ANY resort in Galveston)
    HICV: 44 possible 3-day reservations, including different start dates and room sizes

    RCI has even less availability than trying to find a week from an owner for rent. Now if you don't care where/when you travel, RCI is useful, but for specific HICV resorts for specific dates, RCI couldn't be much more useless.

    -Scott
    Owner, HICV Google+ Group
     
  3. spoody

    spoody TUG Member

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    Yes but for the additional cost, maintenance fees and loss of Silverleaf benefits this was not acceptable for this owner and would not be for many others.

    Sent from my SM-N910P using Tapatalk
     
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  4. skotrla

    skotrla TUG Member

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    Not saying it's worth the money, just that he wouldn't have meaningful access to HICV properties by keeping what he had. Rarely is giving a developer any money going to be worth it :)

    -Scott
    Owner, HICV Google+ Group
     
  5. Sabrina

    Sabrina Guest

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    I was going to purchase with HIVC and at the end of many hours going over the contract I decided not to purchase and convert cause we discussed I was purchasing a platinum week when going over the paperwork to sign,in small print it said silver week I then said no deal no thank you and left I was very upset for the wasted time. I am still will silverleaf with our six units one being EE the others have regular bonus time. I just wrote BBB today a complaint because was told this week when booking bonus time I can no longer book multiple units at one I have to use one at a time. I have a very large family and have owned for many years and purchased because of the bonus time/ EE. I plan on sitting outside of their South Lee,MA. Property with a sign telling ppl. How they are treating long time owners and not honoring our contract.
     
    dfrosty, spoody and Iggyearl like this.
  6. Rat Fink

    Rat Fink Guest

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    I have not converted it just did not feel right to me, but I would like to know how many are dissatisfied with the rest of the items they have lost since HIVC has taken over? Like early check in and late check out, their VIP status if they owned more than one week, having to pay for extra towels, the $115 deposit at check in. And now I hear they are going public after all have bought weeks and points now you can just walk off the street and rent a room. I signed up for and purchased deeded weeks if I wanted to stay in Hotel I would have just rented a room.
    -------------------------------------------

    This is important for those of you have multiple weeks with EE or BT.

    Here is my story on how HIVC allowed me to "technically" keep bonus time, yet still lose it.

    When I converted to points I made it clear that I would keep Endless Escape (EE) on one unit and Bonus Time (BT) on the other.
    They said no problem and I checked to make sure it was in the paperwork.

    As we know, when booking EE/BT, each account has to wait one full week before being able to book again. For instance, I book EE on one account for 6 days. BT on the other account for the next 3 days, and have a total of 9 days. Neither account can be used again until a week after the original booking, but they can be used in tandem. That was one of the sales pitches for buying multiple weeks after they established the "one week between EE/BT" policy.

    NOT ANY MORE.

    Under the HIVC system you have one membership number for all of your weeks. Therefore in their system, when you book EE/BT on one of your weeks, their account sees them as the same week, so you have to wait one week again before booking, no matter what week you used!

    Essentially, EE/BT on multiple weeks is now useless.

    If you have more than one week with EE/BT, you will lose that benefit on your additional weeks.

    That was an important benefit to me - AND THEY KNEW IT.
    If I knew this would happen I would never have converted to points. BTW - I had to buy a THIRD week with HIVC to get the free points conversion.

    If I could do it again I would have kept what I have. After all, if I really want to use HIVC resorts, I could have always traded in with RCI, right?[/QUOTE]
     
  7. Rat Fink

    Rat Fink Guest

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    I have not converted it just did not feel right to me, but I would like to know how many are dissatisfied with the rest of the items they have lost since HIVC has taken over? Like early check in and late check out, their VIP status if they owned more than one week, having to pay for extra towels, the $115 deposit at check in. And now I hear they are going public after all have bought weeks and points now you can just walk off the street and rent a room. I signed up for and purchased deeded weeks if I wanted to stay in Hotel I would have just rented a room.
     
  8. skotrla

    skotrla TUG Member

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    [/QUOTE]

    RCI availability of HICV units is 1/100 or less of what HICV availability is - if you want to keep your stand-alone Silverleaf benefits and also stay at other HICV properties regularly, you really have to own in both systems independently. However, you can buy HICV resale at the 3 points resorts (Lake Geneva, South Beach, and Gatlinburg).

    -Scott
    Owner, HICV Google+ Group
     
  9. ecwinch

    ecwinch Moderator

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    Does Bonus Time transfer with resale accounts?
     
  10. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    @spoody:
    Did you ever get the issue resolved?

    As you, we have two units with both EE/BT. We just converted, but the documents we signed stated that Bonus Time would continued to be managed by Silverleaf. I asked about that and was told that I would still have the Silverleaf portal to manage my bonus time.
     
  11. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    No
     
  12. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    We just received our welcome email and the Endless Escapes was transferred to the new Holiday Inn website and our other property at Hill Country still shows up on the old Silverleaf Owner Portal which allows us to book Bonus Time. (whew! :ponder:)

    If anybody else is considering converting and you have multiple Bonus Time/Endless Escapes, make sure you only convert one deed and keep the others in your home resort.
     
  13. PBandJ

    PBandJ Guest

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    Hello, We recently received a letter in the mail indicating bonus time was adjusting its prices. We had Endless Escapes. Does anyone know if the are impacted too? I am assuming we are since we received the letter
     
  14. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    Can you post a scan of the letter blocking out any personal information?

    Here is HICV's statement on Bonus Time

    At the very bottom:
    **Owners having Endless Escape privileges may book up to six nights and are not subject to weekend fees.

    There is no statement or alert when you log on the Silverleaf owner's portal.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2018
  15. Jadams

    Jadams Guest

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  16. Tank

    Tank TUG Member

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    Silverleaf owners had a good thing going with BT and EE
    It cost Silverleaf a lot of money all those free nights some bragging as much as 150 nights a year. Maybe this is why it has been sold a couple times already. Has to be profitable or you can't stay in business, or make improvements as needed. One thing we are all finding is the rules can change without notice exspecually in a buyout.
    As an original Orange Lake owner to HICV owner now, i love the growth.
    I would like those perks to disappear because they are costing us money paying for your free nights. If the room sat empty would not put wear and tear on the property, and if you use it we have to pay for the cleaning. They want the HICV use without a sacrifice and I don't see that happening. These perks were not well thought out when put in place.
    HICV will do everything they can to profit. Those unused nights should be rented to help pay for the upgrades needed to get them up to HICV standards.

    On the flip side I also see Silverleaf getting ripped in the conversion to the HICV points system. The MF's for the same unit will in many cases double. I don't get that at all, the MF's should not change on the same unit. It has not on the other purchases Orange lake made. This is where I see Silverleaf owners are being mishandled by HICV. They claim it is because of all the new choices they will have but the cost per point ratio is double what I pay. Just not fair.
    One person was paying $1200 a year, after converting they had to pay $2700 for the same unit with points.
    Probably best to keep what you got. HICV will find a way for these perks to slowly go away.

    IMHO

    Dave
     
  17. Jadams

    Jadams Guest

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    We got a letter too. Apparently it starts 1/1/19.
     
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2018
  18. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    I think Silverleaf's problem's did not stem from Bonus Time and Endless Escapes. It was a marketing tool used to sell timeshares. They did stop the bleeding with Endless Escapes when some of the first generation with the three week reservation window bought three weeks and could set up "permanent" residence on bonus time. ETA: They stopped Endless Escapes and started Bonus Time.

    From a cost standpoint, they paid for their housekeeping staff full time. That is a fixed cost. The only added cost is the energy/water/supplies for laundry/cleaning.

    Where they got squeezed was in their expansion plans. The Presidential and Ambassador build outs, waterpark and large cash payments for update meetings (we could get as much as $140 cash) coupled with massive lending caught up with them. Throw in 2008 and they got caught short.

    ETA: Silverleaf didn't adopt the Points system. This was probably due to their antiquated mainframe computer system which could not be updated to a more flexible and popular purchase model.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2018
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  19. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    Nevermind, I missed the scan of the letter.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2018
  20. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    Thanks for the scan.

    The letter says it all. Endless Escapes now only gives you 6 nights instead of 3.

    Everybody gets charged $25/night Sun - Thu; $75/night Fri/Sat
     
  21. Betsy9599

    Betsy9599 Guest

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    I just received my letter. It is a bunch of BS. Silverleaf lost a class action lawsuit years ago concerning EE. I am just waiting for the class action lawsuit. Don't settle for what this letter says. 14 days Before check-in IS NOT causing them to lose any business. They are just wanting to take our bonus time away. I do NOT believe they will get by with this.
     
  22. Jadams

    Jadams Guest

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    I see this change different than you do. HICV owners are not paying for our "free" nights. We paid out the ass to have that perk. For an ambassador unit on the beach with endless escapes, we paid about 7 times more than owners that purchased a lodge with a one week usage per year. We have prepaid for those "free" nights as you call them and we paid a lot of money to have that exclusive perk. Just because someone bought them out doesnt mean they can now strip us from benefits we rightfully paid for just because the new owners cant profit from them. I am still paying off a deed that I inherited. That should tell you right there how much my family has spent to own this timeshare if I am still paying it off.

    I'm glad you love the growth of HICV because you are the only ones that are benefitting from it. You dont have to "upgrade" to a Silverleaf membership to use these properties, but Silverleaf owners are being forced to "upgrade" to points and have to spend more money on top of what we have already paid just to continue using the properties we have already paid to use. HICV owners just get to start using all of these new properties whenever they want and dont have to purchase more points to do it. We got told it will cost us another $30,000 to "upgrade" to points just so we can continue using the properties we've already paid to use.

    I didnt complain when they started charging to change out towels halfway through our annual week stay or about them making us rent pool towels at the pool now even though I got as many bath and pool towels as I wanted free of charge when I stayed the night at a regular Holiday Inn hotel. It took a lot of strength, but I didnt even complain when I saw them renting out units to the public on a nightly basis when we were told to our faces that they weren't going to do. But I will be complaining about them taking away perks that we paid a lot of money to have.

    As an owner who has spent a lot of money to have this ownership, I can tell you that I take care of every unit that I have ever stayed in because I pay monthly for the upkeep and maintenance of these units. The ones who are costing both of us more money are the ones who now have the option to rent these units for one night only so they can throw a party with music blasting all night, breezeways smelling like weed, and trashing the "hotel room" because they paid for the night and dont have to spend another dime at the place once they leave in the morning. You can think all you want that ending bonus time and endless escapes is the answer to their money problem, but I would rather have another owner rent that night on bonus time because I know that they paid tens of thousands of dollars more than anyone else just to have that option and will take care of that unit, than someone off the street who rents it for $200 a night and does nothing but trash the place and leave the next morning.
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2018
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  23. Happytravels

    Happytravels Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    It says RIGHT HERE they are already paid for. These mf's are approx. twice the normal of a weeks TS.
    In order to allow Silverleaf Club to determine which accommodations will be available for the Bonus Time Program, Members must notify Silverleaf Club either in writing addressed to Silverleaf Club, 9395 S. John Young Parkway, Orlando, FL 32819, or by phone at (800) 613-0310, whether or not a Member will be occupying his or her Timeshare Period. Such notification must be received by the Silverleaf Club at least thirty (30) days before the check-in day for the Member’s Timeshare Period and if such timely notification is not received by Silverleaf Club, then the Member’s Timeshare Period will be automatically placed into the Bonus Time Program and will not be available for the Member’s use. Any Timeshare Periods placed into the Bonus Time Program which are not used for Reservations in the Bonus Time Program shall remain unused for that year.
     
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  24. Jadams

    Jadams Guest

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    Is this a letter that you have or on your deed? Either way can you send me a copy of it without your name and information? There is a very pissed off group of silverleaf owners that would love to get their hands on the document that states this!
     
  25. DrQ

    DrQ TUG Member

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    It is interesting ... when I received my letter, it made NO reference to Endless Escapes as the exemplar provided by Jadams. It only referenced Bonus Time.

    I wonder if HICV is stepping back, or if they are bunching Bonus Time and Endless Escapes together and hope that it goes unnoticed.

    Curiouser and curiouser ...
     

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