Major Changes In Marriott Rewards

[icydog]

I bought my first Marriott resale and my second from Marriott. The thinking was that would be able to take that 1st class trip to Europe every few (or more) years using my MR points.

My second honeymoon (25th anniversary) to Europe in summer 2010 was to be done using TWO Marriott Cat 7 travel packages totalling 540K points. I will have about 590K points after purchasing 100K points direct from Marriott in January. With the newest changes, using travel packages for this trip is now out of question!

I can't tell you how disappointed I am.

I WISH I HAD NEVER BOUGHT FROM MARRIOTT!


Terry

I have a unique situation. I just bought two weeks at the new Marriott Reserve in Orlando. I opted to trade for points, for less than the cost of maintenance fees, for two years, for each contract. I did this because the resort will not be built by 2009 or 2010 either. Should I just not pay maintenance fees and not get points. I think that may be an option if they will let me change my mind that is.

I have all these points, and I bought these Marriott weeks specifically because of the points packages, and I haven't even got a deed yet. The weeks are obviously devalued and what am I doing? I'm waiting for the paperwork to clear knowing they are worth less than what we paid and that the point packages, which they touted as being incredible-- are not that incredible after all. Now what? Will they take anything off the price? Will I get a refund because what they promised can no longer be? NOPE they'll do nothing.

 

[GrayFal]

I have to second this post. I was so looking forward to the use of our points and now I am at a loss what we will do going forward. I have a unique situation. I just bought two weeks at the new Marriott Reserve in Orlando. I opted to trade for points, for less than the cost of maintenance fees, for two years, for each contract. I did this because the resort will not be built by 2009 or 2010 either. Should I just not pay maintenance fees and not get points. I think that may be an option if they will let me change my mind that is.

I have all these points, and I bought Marriott specifically because of the points packages, and I feel I have been robbed. I haven't even got a deed and I am screwed. I'm waiting for the paperwork to clear but after that Ladies and Gentlemen I will have a carload of less valuable points. Now what? Will they take anything off the price? Will I get a refund because what they promised can no longer be? NOPE they'll do nothing.

I thought you were SELLING all your Marriott weeks?

Anyway, you should be able to change those terms - tell them u decided to use your weeks instead of taking the points....or was the other option NOT to pay MFs until the resort was open?
That was the option we took when we purchased pre construction in Aruba. No MF until we could use the resort.

Call your salesperson.

 

[musical2]

I am glad I used my 540,000 points this year on two Category 7 packages. I used them at the JW Marriott at Ko Olina for two rooms for one week (then moved over to the Ko Olina Beach club for our second week). Plus it got me six airplane tickets to Oahu from the Washington DC area. Next year it would have cost me 660,000 points for the same package. That's a 22% jump, an extra 120,000 points. I know I won't be turning in any more weeks for points in the future. Also, when I buy another Marriott (if I buy another Marriott) it will not be from the developer. They just made resale look much better.

Bart

 

[thinze3]

I thought you were SELLING all your Marriott weeks? .....

I think she is selling 2 MMC units.

 

[thinze3]

Stepping back to take look at the whole picture.

In a roundabout way Marriott says they are doing what their Marriott Rewards members want, offer more availability.

How many people were able to go online and book a prime Marriott hotel at a prime time or season using "standard" Marriott awards. Yes, a small percentage of experienced MR rewards members (and Tug members) were able to make it work very well, knowing when and where to book to maximize their value. But many, if not most, MR rewards members probably found a dead end when trying to use MR points - either not getting the dates they wanted or having to pay double with "stay anytime" awards.

So, where is the compromise? The compromise is to raise the amount of points required but offer all dates and locations - no blackouts. The compromise is to offer a 5-day travel package to MVCI owners who just got devalued. The cost in terms of MR points is similar to the old 7-day packages, but again, there are no blackouts. One can also add as many days as he likes at a set rate per day.

Platinum elite? I am 51 days away and will never be there so it is of no concern to me. Who knows, maybe Marriott will bring timeshare purchases into this similar to how Starwood does.

Anyhow, I am continuing to read and let this sink in. Though I don't like it, I feel a bit better about it today than I did yesterday.

Terry

 

[musical2]

In a roundabout way Marriott says they are doing what their Marriott Rewards members want, offer more availability.

How many people were able to go online and book a prime Marriott hotel at a prime time or season using "standard" Marriott awards. Yes, a small percentage of experienced MR rewards members (and Tug members) were able to make it work very well, knowing when and where to book to maximize their value. But many, if not most, MR rewards members probably found a dead end when trying to use MR points - either not getting the dates they wanted or having to pay double with "stay anytime" awards.

[snip a couple of paragraphs]
Terry

When I booked the JW Marriott using standard rewards it was for the last week of June this past summer. It wasn't hard. I just called and asked for two connecting rooms. They were available so I got them. It just took a little bit of advance planning and coordination between finding the airline with standard FF miles (American in this case) and confirming with Marriott the rooms. Maybe I just had beginner's luck.

 

[Danette]

Response to MVCI owners:

In my email this morning:

As you may have heard, Marriott Rewards® has made exciting program enhancements, providing more flexibility to vacation when and where you want, which will go into effect in 2009. For information on these enhancements, please visit: Marriott.com/Rewards/No-Blackout-Dates.

You will be able to take advantage of these new enhancements after January 15, 2009, and can make your travel arrangements online.

As you are a new Owner, we are able to extend the use of the current Marriott Rewards program* until July 31, 2009.

Should you choose to use the current program after January 15, 2009, travel arrangements can only be booked through Owner Services via phone at 800-845-4226 and travel must commence by December 31, 2009.

For information on other program enhancements and travel packages, please visit:
My-VacationClub.com/MarriottRewards.

Sincerely,



Vice President, Owner Services
Marriott Vacation Club International


*Please refer to your Marriott Rewards At-a-Glance in your Timeshare Ownership kit for current program details.

 

[thinze3]

Sounds like Marriott is trying to keep you happy just long enough for this to settle down a bit. Most likely they are receiving some tough emails and calls.

Terry

 

[lll1929]

Tom-

I just found that info on the MVCI site and it looks like there are additional points charges on these 5 night packages. On the 7 night packages you take the hotel cost and add 120,000 points for the 120,000 miles. It's a 1 for 1 exchange.

However, this new table indicates a charge of 300,000 for 5 nights in a category 8 (4x40,000). The hotel portion should be 160,000 and 120,000 for the hotel would make it 280,000 not 300,000.

Same thing with the category 7 package. 4 nights (5th night should be free) at category 7 is 140,000 (4X35,000). Add 120,000 and the package should be 260,000, not 270,000.

I submitted the following question on Marriott Insider and here is the response:
MVCI Package Question
submitted: Oct 24, 2008 3:16 PM
Question:

In the FAQ section regarding the 7 day travel package, it mentions airline miles being purchased at a 1-1 value to reward points. Why is this NOT the case on the new 5 day travel packages being offered to MVCI members? In doing the math, our airlines mile cost us more reward points? Example: Cat 6 = 30,000 points / night times 4 nights (5th night free) equals 120,000 points. If you choose the 50,000 miles, the total would be 170,000. The cost based on the site is 180,000. Shouldn't we pay 1-1 for the miles?

Answer:

Miles are a large expense for all travel packages and can only be offered at a reduced price because they are being packaged with a seven night hotel rewards. You will notice that a mileage reward on its own ranges from a 5 to 1 to at best a 2.5 to 1 ratio. The fewer nights that are packaged with the reward, the heavier the mileage burden. Because of this, and other considerations, the price of the MVCI 5 night package has been made to mirror the price of the current seven night rewards.

 

[lll1929]

Here is another question I asked regarding existing packages (hotel portion)

Question: There have been several questions on other boards regarding current 7 day certificates. Example, I have a current 7 day certificate from a travel package. What happens to that certificate if it is not attached to a reservation on 1/15/09? Will I be able to attach it to a 7day reservation after 1/15/09 if it's not expired? Will it cost me additional points to attach it to a 7day reservation? Will I be able to extend the certificate for 1 year. Example, the current expiration date is 5/9/09. Will I be allowed to extend it to 5/9/10?


Answer: The hotel portion of a travel package is different from other hotel rewards because it can sit in your account without being attached to a reservation. If you have one of these rewards, you can rest assured it will not become worthless after January 15th. These rewards are good for one year from the date of issuance and will be good even for reservation booked on or after January 15th as long you are staying before your certificate expires.


She didn't answer if they would offer extensions so I would say probably not. If you have one that expires before you want to use it, attach it to a reservation before 1/15/09 and make sure they extend it when they attach it.

 

[ondeadlin]

In a roundabout way Marriott says they are doing what their Marriott Rewards members want, offer more availability.

How many people were able to go online and book a prime Marriott hotel at a prime time or season using "standard" Marriott awards. Yes, a small percentage of experienced MR rewards members (and Tug members) were able to make it work very well, knowing when and where to book to maximize their value. But many, if not most, MR rewards members probably found a dead end when trying to use MR points - either not getting the dates they wanted or having to pay double with "stay anytime" awards.

So, where is the compromise? The compromise is to raise the amount of points required but offer all dates and locations - no blackouts. The compromise is to offer a 5-day travel package to MVCI owners who just got devalued. The cost in terms of MR points is similar to the old 7-day packages, but again, there are no blackouts. One can also add as many days as he likes at a set rate per day.

Platinum elite? I am 51 days away and will never be there so it is of no concern to me. Who knows, maybe Marriott will bring timeshare purchases into this similar to how Starwood does.

Anyhow, I am continuing to read and let this sink in. Though I don't like it, I feel a bit better about it today than I did yesterday.

Terry

See my post above.

Maybe next time they won't even kick the dog! Those swell Marriott folks!

 

[winger]

Forgive me but it is now very hard to keep up with all this change in the past few days...

What happens to certificates (hotel) ordered and unused prior to Jan 15, 2009 ???

I am asking b/c if Marriott allows grandfathering of unused certif's, it is cheaper to get a 7-night certif now than AFTER jan 15, 2009. I would then consider burning through all my MRP's now and order a FEW unused hotel certif's and getting the FF miles while I am at it.

 

[LAX Mom]

Forgive me but it is now very hard to keep up with all this change in the past few days...

What happens to certificates (hotel) ordered and unused prior to Jan 15, 2009 ???

I am asking b/c if Marriott allows grandfathering of unused certif's, it is cheaper to get a 7-night certif now than AFTER jan 15, 2009. I would then consider burning through all my MRP's now and order a FEW unused hotel certif's and getting the FF miles while I am at it.

My understanding is that you can order travel packages now with the hotel certificates valid for 1 year. They cannot be extended when they expire. The certificates can be used for reservations made now but occuring after Jan. 15, 2009. If reservations are made after Jan. 15, they will be subject to hotel category changes (if there are some hotels adjusted to new categories).

For instance if you order a category 6 cert, you can use it for any hotel that is now a category 6 until it expires in one year if you make the reservation before Jan. 15. If you don't make your reservation until after Jan. 15, you will be limited to the hotels that are category 6 at that time.

Did I just confuse the issue?

 

[winger]

is that 'not extendable' aspect of hotel certif's a new thing? i am not planning on using mine for another 3-5 yrs! i already extended the certif one yr

 

[LAX Mom]

Yes, it's part of the new Marriott "enhancements". If you order certificates under the new program after Jan. 15, I think you can still extend those. I can't recall the specifics but this was addressed on flyertalk. I'll look for that info and post it here.

Marriott Concierge definitely stated that any certificates from travel packages and Euro Hopper packages must be used by their expiration date, unless extended prior to Jan. 15. An extension prior to Jan. 15 will at most get you one year to Jan. 14, 2010. He specifically stated that certificates from the current program cannot be used after 2009.

If anyone has outstanding certs from travel packages, you should extend them for another year at the end of Dec. That will allow you to use then during 2009 before they expire.

The only other option is to re-deposit them for points, but you get so few points that it makes more sense to use them, even for a long weekend.

Edited to add quote from flyertalk (Marriott Concierge):

Quote:
Originally Posted by frisbeeace
Many of us have unused hotel certificates that were part of a travel package and were issued BEFORE these new rules were announced. We were confidently saving those certificates for the future in the knowledge that they were (are?) extendable at any time. Those certificates may have already expired or may expire soon. So my questions are:

1. What can we do with those certificates that we thought were extendable and will expire before we are able to use them?

2. Can we keep them alive by making a reservation up to Jan 15th even if they expired before that date?

3. What will happen with a certificate that is already attached to a reservation if you need to change dates or hotel beyond its expiration date?

4. Wouldn´t it make sense to establish a deadline for all certificates issued under the old T&C by January 15th, 2010 giving exactly 1 year after the start of the new program?

Question 1: If the hotel portion of a travel package cannot be used you can turn it back in for some points. To be honest, the points you get for returning the hotel portion of a travel package is pretty insignificant. You usually get a better value if you use them for a weekend somewhere when you can get a way for seven nights.

Question 2: You do not need to make a reservation to extend a travel package. Contact guest services and let them know you have a hotel portion of a travel package that will be expiring and ask them to reissue it for you. That will change the valid date to a year from when it is reissued. Keep in mind you need to do this before January 15th.

Question 3: If you think this may happen I recommend you call sometime in January (before the 15th) explain that you are uncertain about the dates and would like to have your hotel portion reissued so that the expiration date is a year form when you call.

Question 4: Some of the current travel packages will be issued after January 15th in order to accommodate redemption reservations made prior to the change. These certificates though will have a final expiration date of sometime around January 15th 2010, regardless of when in 2009 they were ordered.

 

[Cruiser Too]

Yes, it's part of the new Marriott "enhancements". ....... Marriott Concierge definitely stated that any certificates from travel packages and Euro Hopper packages must be used by their expiration date, unless extended prior to Jan. 15. An extension prior to Jan. 15 will at most get you one year to Jan. 14, 2010. He specifically stated that certificates from the current program cannot be used after 2009. If anyone has outstanding certs from travel packages, you should extend them for another year at the end of Dec. That will allow you to use then during 2009 before they expire.

Yikes !!!!
I was planning to redeem as many travel-packages, as my current number of points would allow.
And use them at some future dates (2009, 2010, etc.).

I'm a tad confused:
"An extension prior to Jan. 15 will at most get you one year to Jan. 14, 2010."

But you also mentioned:
"He specifically stated that certificates from the current program cannot be used after 2009."

Or am I misinterpreting you ???

Doug

 

[LAX Mom]

Doug-

I've been following the thread on flyertalk so I can decide how to use my MRP. The Marriott Concierge is an official Marriott rep and has been attempting to answer questions about the new program. From everything I'ver read there, it seems 7 night certificates received with a travel package should be used by Dec. 31, 2009 at the latest. It is possible you could extend that date to Jan. 14, 2010 if you actually purchase (or extent) on Jan. 14, 2009. But I think it's clear that these certificates will be good for one year and no longer be extended after Jan. 15.

If you purchase travel packages now and can't use the hotel portion in 2009, then you only receive a small amount of points (10,000 for a category 5?) if you turn the certificate back to Marriott.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=879191

 

[LAX Mom]

Yikes !!!!
I was planning to redeem as many travel-packages, as my current number of points would allow.
And use them at some future dates (2009, 2010, etc.).

I'm a tad confused:
"An extension prior to Jan. 15 will at most get you one year to Jan. 14, 2010."

But you also mentioned:
"He specifically stated that certificates from the current program cannot be used after 2009."

Or am I misinterpreting you ???

Doug

Doug-
Sorry for the confusion, but the Marriott Concierge on flyertalk has stated that the certificates will only be good through 2009 and can't be used in 2010. In another post I think he stated that if you purchased a travel package on Jan. 14, 2008 the hotel cert would be good for 1 year to Jan. 14, 2010.

So it isn't real clear about those 14 days in early Jan. 2010.

 

[Frisbeeace]

Still it is not clear to me if Marriott can retroactively change the conditions under which the old certificates were issued. I mean that those were extendable as many times as you wish into the future. Previous to the "enhancements" I redeemed points for 2 travel packages and I currently have 3 unused hotel certificates which I did not plan to use in 2009. Bottomline is that we have to renew this certificates just before Jan 15 to get an additional year until they expire forever.

On another note, a friend of mine purchased his second week from Marriott on Thursday and the agent did not mention the recent changes. He paid $2,000 as downpayment but will send his lawyers on Monday.

Finally, devaluation will be more severe than what the difference in points show after Marriott discloses which properties were upgraded in category. Last year more than 500 did so.

 

[JoeMO]

Platinum Elite

What is the difference between Platinum and Platinum Elite?

Last week, while staying at a Marriott, they had the names of the rewards members staying at the hotel on a small bulletin board at the front desk. They listed four categories: Silver, Gold, Platinum and Platinum Elite with the members names under each section. These were not people who had used rewards points but were people staying there that had obtained the specific rewards level and were staying at the hotel.

This has been mentioned a couple of times on this thread so I thought someone might know the difference. I tried calling Marriott Rewards but they are closed on the weekend. On the website it only list the three categories but calls them all Elite Rewards. I am back at the same hotel next week and I will ask when I check in.

Thanks,
Joe

 

[Dave M]

Still it is not clear to me if Marriott can retroactively change the conditions under which the old certificates were issued. I mean that those were extendable as many times as you wish into the future.

There was no formal program provision that allowed us to extend those hotel certificates indefinitely. Nothing was in writing. Marriott allowed people to extend them one year at a time as a courtesy, but you won't find anything in writing about it.

You can bet Marriott's lawyers are comfortable with these changes. Also, the same thing happened the last time there was a major change (in 2000). The old "World Trip" certificates could not be extended once the changes were effective. Also, the Marriott Rewards T&C are very clear, stating that terms can be changed at any time or, if Marriott so decides, the entire Marriott Rewards program can be terminated.

On another note, a friend of mine purchased his second week from Marriott on Thursday and the agent did not mention the recent changes.

If he wants to cancel, he can. Tell him to follow the cancellation instructions on the last page of the contract. He's still within the cancellation period. Now is the time to do it if he wants to do so. Claiming he wasn't notified of forthcoming Marriott Rewards changes won't get him out of the commitment later because the disclosures and qualifications in the contract he signed protect Marriott for almost any change.

 

[LAX Mom]

Dave is correct, Marriott can definitely refuse to extend our travel package hotel certificates in the future. Those of us with unused certificates better make plans now to use them in 2009!

 

[dioxide45]

If he wants to cancel, he can. Tell him to follow the cancellation instructions on the last page of the contract. He's still within the cancellation period. Now is the time to do it if he wants to do so. Claiming he wasn't notified of forthcoming Marriott Rewards changes won't get him out of the commitment later because the disclosures and qualifications in the contract he signed protect Marriott for almost any change.

One must question however what program the buyer was shown when the salesman made the presentation. The Marriott sales staff always uses the travel packages as a huge selling point and they do quote the number of points needed. If they were shown and told numbers based on the current program that is down right deceptive.

 

[winger]

Extending existing cat 6 hotel certif-will give a shot tomorrow

I have an unused cat 6 hotel certif set to expire approx Dec 2008...I will call tomorrow to see how all this change will affect this.

My situation is I have too much vaca already scheduled for 2009 to use this hotel certif. IF I can extend 1-yr to Dec 2009, AND between now and Dec 2009 I can plan/reserve a hotel stay sometime before Dec 2010, then I am ok since this gives us sufficient time to plan. IF not, then this certif is a big fat waste of money (points) and I will not be a very happy camper, to say the least.

 

[Dave M]

According to the rules as explained above and at FlyerTalk and at the Marriott blog, you can extend your certificate once more for a year - to use it for dates on or before January 14, 2010. If you haven't used it for a stay that occurs before then, it will be worthless. Thus, if you can't use it, you should consider giving the use to a friend or relative or turning it in for the meager points credit that Marriott offers.