Wyndham is closing a handful of legacy resorts - dedicated chart/tracker located in the first post for this unfolding set of events

[comicbookman]

We is 102 owners who worked together. If someone ran out of points or did not have enough points someone who did would help them. It was really beneficial to those who were not VIP. Those who were, shared their VIP discounts with them and they helped the VIP owner cover the cost of buying VIP.

And they let you speak for all of them?

 

[Floridaman76]

Curious, what percentage of your rentals are sourced from the impacted resorts?

And THAT is what this is all about for this individual. They will be monetarily impacted.

I wonder if they have set foot on the property other than to check someone in under their name and collect money.

As I was typing this, I realized that I have stayed at 3 of the affected resorts in the last 9 months (The Glade (Dec), Star Island (Feb), Patriots Place (July)) and have stayed at least once at Edisto, Shawnee, Orlando International and Lake Lure. That's over 50% of the affected resorts. I also frequently stay at Sapphire Valley and have a booking in late December. I'm relieved that's not leaving.

 

[Floridaman76]

And they let you speak for all of them?

I just can't get over this, I was literally laughing as I read his response and "don't cry for me Argentina", then this. I thought he was joking at first, and my initial response was in jest, but he is apparently quite serious and we may have uncovered the "Star Chamber" cabal of timeshare rentals.

A lot of us are upset because we like and use the resorts in question, or have a vested ownership interest in them which is being messed with, to our detriment.

It's hard to get behind the "me and 139 of my pal's might lose some money on our timeshare AirBNB scheme" complaint

 

[HitchHiker71]

There's a difference between saying Wyndham is giving an option they don't have to give, and thinking they're doing it altruistically out of the goodness of their heart or not in service of their bottom line. Everything they do is pretty much in the service of their bottom line.

- I think I posted in this thread that what I refer to as binary thinking will be the end of all of us. It is much more often both/and - not either/or. Wyndham has a fiduciary responsibility to its shareholder base. Wyndham has no fiduciary duty, none, to the ownership base. Wyndham has a contractual responsibility to the ownership base, and Wyndham adheres very well to the confines of its contractual responsibilities. That said, Wyndham generally always tries to deliver both/and, and only when it cannot do so, will it prioritize the fiduciary duties to the shareholder base over the interests of the ownership base, while always adhering to the contractual duties for said ownership base.

Resale CWA contracts are worthless. CWA contracts with VIP eligibility up to Founders, which is what Wyndham is offering (and the status of the owner I was replying to with my previous comment), are worth more to some owners depending on what they're starting with and where they are in their ownership journey. I'm not saying they're worth the full retail price IMO, but for many they may be worth the price of whatever proceeds would have come from a sale of a resort. I'm also not saying this isn't also in the service of Wyndham's bottom line, but just because it helps Wyndham doesn't mean it can't be a beneficial option for certain owners.

Again, both/and, not either/or.

I'm not going to argue that Wyndham's communication strategy on this (and many other matters in the past) is good here. It's a pet peeve of mine and I've commented quite often in this forum about Wyndham's failure to communicate basic information well. I'm also not confident that even with the plan to have this all in place by January 1, that they're going to be able to convert the accounts of how many thousands of owners without glitches in less than 6 months.

- very unhappy with the commmunication gaps on how this whole issue has been transacted, and Wyndham has a storied past history of not doing well when it comes to being customer focused in this regard, despite the fact that Wyndham somehow thinks it is very customer focused, which is also a major gap, due in part to an echo chamber type issue and limited customer feedback mechanisms that exist within Wyndham corporate to some extent. That said, I will also clearly state that the perspectives on TUG, by far, represent a minority viewpoint, given many TUGGERs are power timeshare owners/users that generally have a significantly better understanding of how to break apart the complexities of the timeshare systems to their own advantage. Most of the ownership base, would likely be considered amateurs in comparison, but, it is this majority that Wyndham pays the most attention to. The majority of owners and their collective feedback were very likely instrumental in assisting Wyndham to generate the list of resorts we're tracking in this thread, in addition to their own metrics and fiduciary responsibilities to the shareholder base. Again, both/and, not either/or. Please remember, this is coming from someone who lives within 4-5 hours of six of the resorts being impacted (Shawnee, Skyline, Patriot's Place, Bentley Brook, and the two RI resorts), that we have spent the most time staying in collectively since becoming owners in 2018. So it's not like I'm happy about these developments, but I understand the logic and I understand that the majority of owners don't particularly like these older resorts in more rural areas.

Then do it. It sounds like this may not be a beneficial option for you. Forgive me for not remembering your VIP level if you have one, but if I didn't have a VIP level or didn't use the benefits, I'd absolutely take the proceeds from the sale. As a resale owner myself, I'd obviously take the proceeds. If you think their CWA offer sucks then let the process play out and take the proceeds - as I said, that's all they're required to offer anyway and that's all that owners in the past whose HOAs/resorts have been closed/sold have been able to take (and I think it sucks for them that they're watching a whole slew of owners get an offer they never got). I'm not saying this to cape for Wyndham, but just that equivalent VIP-eligible CWA points in exchange for a deed from a closing/sold resort is far more than they've ever offered similarly situated owners in the past. It essentially doubles the options for affected owners. It doesn't mean it's going to work for all of them, though.

- Wyndham doesn't have to offer anything, and if they did this one at a time, which is what they've done historically, they likely wouldn't offer anything at all. Contractually, which is the only responsibility Wyndham really has to meet, they don't have to offer anything at all. So again, it's Wyndham choosing to offer a solution to keep owners whole if they so desire, and we should at least acknowledge that this is a decent offer big picture, even if it's not ideal for all involved. There is no one size fits all solution for this type of action, so in cases like this you choose an option that works best for everyone, both for Wyndham and for owners.

 

[HitchHiker71]

We is 102 owners who worked together. If someone ran out of points or did not have enough points someone who did would help them. It was really beneficial to those who were not VIP. Those who were, shared their VIP discounts with them and they helped the VIP owner cover the cost of buying VIP.

Edit. I forgot, most of us met at those rarely occupied Shawnee and Skyline resorts.

Interesting approach - glad it worked well for you all. Reading between the lines, it certainly seems as though this event may negatively impact your rental revenue stream on some level. With this in mind, I'm curious if you take an approach like the legendary @ronparise did where he focused on a specific set of resorts, built relationships with the local resort personnel, and primarily rented via those resorts, particularly targeting holidays and local events in the resort areas. Since you live within driving distance of both Shawnee and Skyline, I thought you might rent quite a bit at these locations given your familiarity.

For my part, we will miss Shawnee without a doubt - but I also happen to know that there are legacy HOAs at Shawnee that Wyndham cannot close out via majority vote, some of the original HOAs that still have legacy weeks and whole owners for example. In these cases, and a subset of the resorts fall into this category, Wyndham will exit the property, but there will still be HOAs outside of Wyndham that will carry on and decide on their own how to proceed, whether to obtain another property management company, sell off, etc. I suspect another timeshare entity will purchase Shawnee and I'm hopeful we can simply use RCI or another trading mechanism and still go there on occasion.

Curious, if you happen to know Shawnee so well, given it's one of the resorts I know best, were you ever able to get a straight answer as to whether the property included the Shawnee Inn and golf course? I got differing answers over time on that particular question. The overall resort area is a large piece of land, some 2200 acres all told.

 

[bamasteve]

I won't be buying more CWA or swapping. I was looking to dump one of my three contracts anyway. I guess instead of dumping my 126K CWA contract, I'll be getting rid of this 154K Fairfield Glade instead, increasing my MFs. As I've said in just about every post, I'm not even upset at any of this. Business is business. I get it. What I am upset at is the lack of transparency and the unknown going into 4Q 2025.

I don't have VIP status by the way. The three contracts I own are all resale. Not that you asked, but I think VIP benefits do not outweigh their costs. So for me, VIP is not a concern. I can, however, certainly understand how for some people who own developer points here and have VIP status, how maintaining that status is a concern.

I'm with you. I'm leaning towards walking away from the Bay and Patirots Place. I am VIP. But I can't say it's really worth it. I used it mostly at the Glade because it was nearby and avialbility was so good, I could get a discount and an upgraded unit quite easily. That benefit is gone and I suspect it will be harder and harder to get last minute VIP deals at resorts. I'm also tired of feeling like I'm a second class citizen becuase I haven't bought into the next higher level of Margaritaville, Presedential etc.....Seems Gold VIP isn't so special anymore.

I'm hoping I will still be able to rent a unit at the Glade after this. We have so many fond family memories over the last 30+ years of going to the Glade.

My wife and I honeymooned at Patriots Place in 1989.

I understand how this is an emotional event for many - I'm sure we have all made some great memories in these resorts. Alas, time marches on.

 

[dioxide45]

Received a proxy form in the mail today from the Orlando International Resort Club Condo. Assn., Inc. announcing a Special Meeting of the Association to be held on August 5, 2025 at 9:00 AM Eastern at Cypress Palms Resort. Two relevant paragraphs are quoted verbatim (out of three and a half legal size pages of legalese). There are more details but these two paragraphs are the gist of it.

"The finances of the Association are currently sound. However, certain members belive that it is in the best interests of all members to explore the sale of the Resort and that members will receive a greater distribution if the entire resort is sold as opposed to piecemeal sale of intervals."

"The purpose of the special meeting is for the members to discuss and vote on whether to authorize the Board of Directors to file a chapter 11 bankruptcy case for the Association for the primary purpose of pursuing a sale of the entire resort. A bankruptcy court may allow the Resort to be sold as a whole property free and clear of the interests of all creditors and interval owners. Proceeds of any sale would be distributed pursuant to bankruptcy court order. Interval owners would receive a pro rata distribution from the sale of the Resort after payment of priority liens and claims and costs of sale."

We hold two contracts, 175,000 points each. I paid a total of $1.00 for both, including closing costs. I think I'll give a proxy to the Association's management firm and see how it plays out.

Should Orlando International be updated in post #1 based on this information? @HitchHiker71

 

[Sandi Bo]

I've yet to see a good explanation for what's going on. Preaching to the choir - TERRIBLE communication. Tell us why Wyndham. Please start with Bentley
Brook. And please explain all the remodeling and renovations in advance of this? If it's for fiduciary reasons, explain, PLEASE!

Really, from the presentations I've been to - I thought the goal/objective was to add dots. So very disapointing losses over the years, yes I include the affiliate resorts as a loss. And the shenanigans with Club Pass (we used to be able to book those resorts on the owner website.

And thankful I don't have any deeds at any of the resorts we've heard about -- I would NOT want CWA in exchange. I realize it will never happen, but Wyndham should have to disclose this as a possibility when someone buys (developer at least). Purchasing presidential level to have it swapped to CWA would be a slap in the face, it would be hard to feel like anyone was doing me a favor.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Skyline was fine. I enjoyed it when I went a few months ago (visiting my in laws in New Jersey, it was a good base of operations).

I’m personally sad to see it go but I also completely understand why it is going. It is definitely not snobbish to call out Atlantic City for what it is. It is extremely extremely run down and seedy. Going in the off season like we did was really eye opening.

 

[CO skier]

I've yet to see a good explanation for what's going on.

Wyndham explained it in the announcement; "Out with the old."

"While the vast majority of Club Wyndham resorts meet the expectations and desires of owners, we understand there are some properties that require significant upgrades or are simply located in destinations that aren’t as desirable as they once were. To keep maintenance fees affordable, avoid costly special assessments, and ensure each and every resort sets the stage for memorable vacations, a handful of resorts may be removed from the Club Wyndham portfolio.

This is a circumstance that is commonly occurring across the timeshare industry as properties age to the anticipated life expectancy of the resort or timeshare regime."

 

[Sandi Bo]

Wyndham explained it in the announcement; "Out with the old."

"While the vast majority of Club Wyndham resorts meet the expectations and desires of owners, we understand there are some properties that require significant upgrades or are simply located in destinations that aren’t as desirable as they once were. To keep maintenance fees affordable, avoid costly special assessments, and ensure each and every resort sets the stage for memorable vacations, a handful of resorts may be removed from the Club Wyndham portfolio.

This is a circumstance that is commonly occurring across the timeshare industry as properties age to the anticipated life expectancy of the resort or timeshare regime."

That's BS for Bentley Brook. It's not a good explanation if it's not honest.

 

[bnoble]

to be honest, I'm not sure why there needs to be an filing to a bankruptcy court.

I suspect it is an end run around what would otherwise be a lengthy process to close out all of the outstanding deeds via quit claim (at best) or foreclosure (at worst.)

 

[HitchHiker71]

The only POS I have access (lol) to is the 2018 version that’s linked in one of the sticky threads here.

Yeah I have that one as well, I also have the first one somewhere, I'll have to dig it up.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Yeah, I thought the same thing at first reading. It isn't the usual Chapter 7 or Chapter 11 filing that is caused by the financial condition and to be honest, I'm not sure why there needs to be an filing to a bankruptcy court. Why not propose to the members of the Association sale of the entire resort?

I studied bankruptcy decades ago under Judge Douglas Ginsburg, a master in the classroom. This type of thing wasn't covered. Maybe someone more current will jump in.

ID - they specifically state a Chapter 11 bankruptcy reorganization don't they? It sounds like they may be trying to minimize outlays to creditors, potentially even to interval owners. Thanks for sharing this information, good to know. For all other TUGGERs, please share if/when you receive these types of notices for the other impacted resorts so we can better understand what's actually transpiring on a per resort basis. I can always modify the tracking table to add these types of data points as needed.

 

[CO skier]

That's BS for Bentley Brook. It's not a good explanation if it's not honest.

It is a 99.99% certainty that is all we can expect from Wyndham. Bentley Brook does seem to be the outlier, and it has piqued my interest (). Why is it not part of CWA?

 

[chapjim]

I suspect it is an end run around what would otherwise be a lengthy process to close out all of the outstanding deeds via quit claim (at best) or foreclosure (at worst.)

That for sure. It is explicitly stated in my Post #843.

This particular resort seems to be getting out in front of whatever Wyndham is doing, at least they're trying. I'm not sure how speedy bankruptcy court proceedings will be but the concept of selling the entire resort seems to have merit.

 

[RENTER]

How is what you posted a response to what Hitchhiker 71 said? By the way, I have been going to skyline since it opened. After the first 5 or 6 years the only time I saw it full was on Holidays.

in your dreams

 

[RENTER]

better check if you have New Years Eve plans. Resorts to be shut down on the 31st and not the first

 

[CO skier]

ID - they specifically state a Chapter 11 bankruptcy reorganization don't they?

Consulting the internet, timeshare Chapter 11 is not an uncommon occurrence, reasons vary widely, and many are part of a strategy to gain court protection during the process.

 

[CO skier]

This particular resort seems to be getting out in front of whatever Wyndham is doing, at least they're trying. I'm not sure how speedy bankruptcy court proceedings will be but the concept of selling the entire resort seems to have merit.

The end point to this would be exactly the same as Wyndham "closing" a resort.

How do we know Wyndham is not driving this vote?

eta: A vote like this is not exactly something that can be cobbled together in a week.

 

[comicbookman]

in your dreams

No, in my eyes and my ease of making last minute reservations.

 

[chapjim]

The end point to this would be exactly the same as Wyndham "closing" a resort.

How do we know Wyndham is not driving this vote?

Could be! The Notice says, ". . . certain members believe that it is in the best interests . . . ."

Who the "certain members" are is anyone's guess.

 

[RENTER]

No, in my eyes and my ease of making last minute reservations.

yeah right. Only thing usually available at the last minute if any is a 1 bedroom suite. So you got lucky when someone just cancelled or you're a Wyndham mouthpiece

 

[bnoble]

That for sure. It is explicitly stated in my Post #843.

And that might well be the *only* reason. The KBV board (cleverly IMO) is proposing to use a provision of Hawaii condo law to similarly avoid cleaning up hundreds of otherwise worthless deeds.

 

[comicbookman]

yeah right. Only thing usually available at the last minute if any is a 1 bedroom suite. So you got lucky when someone just cancelled or you're a Wyndham mouthpiece

No, we usually had a 2 bedroom as we had kids. we have been owners since the very early 90's. I am about as far from a wyndham mouthpiece as you will find for someone who still likes the system in general. go look up my old posts. You are a barely coherent shill for a secret group (by your own admission) of owners. Now you have every right to use the system in your own way, as long as you stay within the rules. But I find most of what you say, those parts that are decipherable, to be of dubious veracity. Also, the fact that you can't even be bothered to become a tug member, despite making a large number of posts, speaks volumes about your character.