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Honor deal or accept higher offer?

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I am with you Joe - this is a TS rental we are discussing here - not life/death or severely impacting someone's livelihood - balanced against your family's needs. I am all about honoring contracts as well - to a point...

$2K is $2K (not $200) - it is easy for others to tell you how to act when it is not their money and effort at stake.
 
If I had agreed "in principle" to sell someone something at a given price, as long as they completed their portion of the agreement in a timely manner, I'd honor my portion. Just the way I was raised, I guess.
 
So I listed a week for sale and accepted an offer. I sent a purchase agreement for review but it has not been signed or no money has been exchanged.

Just this morning someone who expressed interest earlier increased their bid by $2k above the person I had come to terms with. <snip>but my over-riding thought are my family's best interest which would be accepting the higher offer.

What would most do if you were in my shoes?

Sorry, Joe ... this is your FIRST post. You clearly stated YOUR ACCEPTED the first bidders OFFER.

Your second bidder did WHAT? He increased his bid over the FIRST bidders offer which YOU ACCEPTED.

And then 1 hours and 23 minutes later, YOU contacted the 1st bidder (the one who YOU had accepted their offer) to see if he would MATCH your counter offer for his bidder?

You got offered more money! But after you accepted an offer from the first bidder.

You are just trying to justify collecting $2,000 more.
REASONS: sick wife, kid in college & second kid about in college.

Hard for you to admit this important FACT: you need the $2,000.
 
Sorry, Joe ... this is your FIRST post. You clearly stated YOUR ACCEPTED the first bidders OFFER.

Your second bidder did WHAT? He increased his bid over the FIRST bidders offer which YOU ACCEPTED.

And then 1 hours and 23 minutes later, YOU contacted the 1st bidder (the one who YOU had accepted their offer) to see if he would MATCH your counter offer for his bidder?

You got offered more money! But after you accepted an offer from the first bidder.

You are just trying to justify collecting $2,000 more.
REASONS: sick wife, kid in college & second kid about in college.

Hard for you to admit this important FACT: you need the $2,000.

I accepted but he never did.
 
I am with you Joe - this is a TS rental we are discussing here - not life/death or severely impacting someone's livelihood - balanced against your family's needs. I am all about honoring contracts as well - to a point...

$2K is $2K (not $200) - it is easy for others to tell you how to act when it is not their money and effort at stake.

Actually it was a sale, a slightly more permanent transaction. It's easy for those he asked to give him an opinion. And yes, most of us find it easy Be honorable. It's how my parents raised me and how I have raised my children. From your statements, I would not do business with you either. Also I hope neither the OP or you are hypocritical enough to say bad things about TS salesmen, as your statements beg you as no more ethical than them.
 
I've seen a proposed real-estate contract bounced back and forth between parties with relatively minor changes so many times, it was like they were playing ping-pong. Some changes were so hard to find that the receiving party had to compare it word-for-word with the version they sent over.

IMHO, unless and until: (1) The OP's signature was on the the contract he sent to the buyer, and (2) the buyer signed the same contract and delivered it to the seller; either party was free to cancel the deal... too bad, so sad.
 
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For those that made disapproving comments I can understand the sentiment but I don't agree and as I think about it more I'm ok with my actions.

Business is business and even though we talked about agreeable terms he never said "I accept" in any way shape or form only that it sounds good and he would review the agreement to make sure it looks good. To be fair we were in agreement on the terms but he was cautious to say "I accept" because he wanted to see it in writing.

As I look at the timing I sent the agreement to him at 437pm yesterday and the unsolicited 2nd bid came in this morning at 9am. I immediately contacted the 1st buyer this morning at 1022am with the bad news but with an opportunity to match.

This happens all the time in business and it is not seen as either unethical or socially distasteful in my experience.
you can justify anything if you try hard enough, but I believe your word is one of the most important things you can offer. If you didn't already know the answer you would not have started the thread. Sorry but most won't give you a pass on this. your word is your word. I wonder what your post would have been if you were on the other end.
 
Title: Honor Deal or Accept Higher Offer

Second time in recent months that a thread was started about "business" and what you should do.

Asked for opinions. You got them. Many times when folks post asking for opinions, they're more inclined to have already made their decision and are looking for support of that decision.

I have been in a similar situation a time or two. I feel that I have the "right" thing in the past. However, I learned from the situation and tweaked things to cover future transactions.

You've made your decision, and as long as you're comfortable with it; so be it.

It all seemed like smooth sailing in the past for your "business", but sooner or later things do crop up if your in business long enough. This will be another learning experience for the next time.

I believe the clock should have started ticking when something in writing was provided to the first person. The potential buyer should have been informed how long they had to return the signed Agreement or that offers would still be considered until it was returned. Some people think that they are the only ones that have an interest. Each person needs to be reminded of what your terms are and do not assume that they should know.

I just had someone contact me to ask if they had dropped the ball on a timeshare that they were interested in purchasing. I don't chase down potential buyers. I didn't hear back and moved on. It was 60 days since their last contact. The timeshare had been sold to someone else in the meantime.

I respect everyone's right to an opinion and I won't go on about this but will respond to you to say you must not be a modern day businessman or negotiator because nobody does business on their word anymore because there are too many devils in the details. What I wouldn't do and don't think I did was violate any ethical business practice.

He did see the terms in writing via email but just wouldn't accept them in that form. I also said at one point " As soon as you offically accept I take down the Redweek ad and stop accepting offers" I guess he didn't think someone else would come along. Nor did I but it happened.

What was I supposed to do at that point be a nice guy at the detriment of my family and say I told you this could happen and even though you ignored that statement I'll accept this over another substantially higher bid? That wouldn't be in my family's best interest.
 
Email is not binding. He was correct not to trust you, as you clearly state here your word is worthless "nobody does business on their word anymore". I am at a loss as to why you posted the Original question since it is clear you don' t feel obligated to honor your word. Saying he never said "I accept" is just rationalizing. From your statements, you had agreed on everything. Your buyer was following your philosophy in requesting the terms in writing, something stressed over and over here on TUG. What you did was legal, but very unethical. I have been a businessman and a lawyer ( technically I'm still a lawyer). I would advise anyone asking to not do business with you, as you have proved you are not to be trusted and are not bothered by that.

So as a lawyer you can honestly say that is how you conducted business? I'm not an attorney but have a master degree in commercial contracts and I help negotiate $20-50 million dollar deals from an IT perspective with many big time attorneys and I can guarantee none of them would see them as unethical.

Until the deal is done its not, so close the deal.

All he had to do is say he officially accepts or if it was me I would have signed the agreement immediately. He's on the west coast so he got it at 1pm and didn't call or respond in anyway until I gave him the bad news the next day.

For all I know he was going to back out because at that point he had not agreed officially or agreed to my $3000 deposit that was to be directly to me. That was still a sticking point. Now I was going to negotiate on that and would have accepted as little as $500 but again the devil is in the details and he wanted to see all the details.
 
What would you think if you were the original buyer?

Egret made some very good comments and I agree completely. Time limitations and clear instructions need to be included in all transactions. Remember, legal and ethical are two different things. Doing one is easy. Doing both can be tough.
 
I believe the clock should have started ticking when something in writing was provided to the first person. The potential buyer should have been informed how long they had to return the signed Agreement or that offers would still be considered until it was returned. Some people think that they are the only ones that have an interest. Each person needs to be reminded of what your terms are and do not assume that they should know.

I just had someone contact me to ask if they had dropped the ball on a timeshare that they were interested in purchasing. I don't chase down potential buyers. I didn't hear back and moved on. It was 60 days since their last contact. The timeshare had been sold to someone else in the meantime.

I'm really not trying to rewrite how it happened just honestly remembering the conversation so take that for what it's worth but I even told him as soon as he officially accepts he had a 7 day exclusivity where I wouldn't entertain any other offers and we could sign the docs and make the deposit. He never accepted and the offer came in.

Did I remind him of these statements, as we were working through the details, no but is that my obligation? I don't think so.

We both assumed the deal was going to go through but stuff happens.
 
I have been on both ends of this situation.

Last week, I was on the buyers end.The seller and I had an agreed price and I had forwarded them the closing company info etc. I contacted the closing company with my information and asked the seller to do the same. Approximately five hours later the seller contacted me saying they had an offer for $600 more and they were going with the higher offer.

I understood their situation, but was still disappointed and a bit upset. They did not ask me if I wanted to raise my offer to meet the higher one and honestly, I don't think I would have anyway. It made me uncomfortable and I did wonder if I was being played.

I have also been on the sellers end. I had agreed to rent a unit to someone at about $100 off the asking and had sent them the contract to sign. Meanwhile I received an offer at list price. I told the second person that I thought the unit was rented, but that I would verify and let them know. The following day the first person changed their mind and I rented it to the second person at full price.

It can be a hard decision either way - but especially so, before a contract is signed or money has changed hands.
 
It appears from your posts that the first buyer understood

I also said at one point " As soon as you offically accept I take down the Redweek ad and stop accepting offers" I guess he didn't think someone else would come along. Nor did I but it happened.

My previous post was made previous to this being shared.

I think the first buyer understood because you did make that statement. As long as the first buyer knew that other offers would be considered until he officially accepted, then you SHOULD be comfortable with your decision.

I don't think your integrity should be called into question any further. No, you were not obligated to the first buyer. You stated your requirements. You did not verbally agree to hold the timeshare until he "decided" to perform.

I may have missed this statement previously in another post. I don't think you would have gotten some of the opinions you got if folks knew that you had informed your potential buyer that you would still be accepting offers.

I know it changes my opinion of the handling of the situation.
 
My previous post was made previous to this being shared.

I think the first buyer understood because you did make that statement. As long as the first buyer knew that other offers would be considered until he officially accepted, then you SHOULD be comfortable with your decision.

I don't think your integrity should be called into question any further. No, you were not obligated to the first buyer. You stated your requirements. You did not verbally agree to hold the timeshare until he "decided" to perform.

I may have missed this statement previously in another post. I don't think you would have gotten some of the opinions you got if folks knew that you had informed your potential buyer that you would still be accepting offers.

I know it changes my opinion of the handling of the situation.

It doesn't change mine. Nothing the OP has said to try to justify his actions has changed my opinion that the situation doesn't reflect favorably on him. (And it's worth noting here that if the OP had asked only for posts from people who would validate his opinion, those of us who disagree wouldn't be participating in this thread.)

He drew up a contract and sent it to a buyer, implying that he was accepting the buyer's offer, and then reneged on it when a better offer came along. The better offer wasn't weeks later, it was within hours. There wasn't time for the first buyer to "officially accept" (i.e. execute the contract) before he was notified that the price was being increased! If the timeshare was still on the market even after the first offer came in, papers shouldn't have been drawn up for the sale on the first buyer's terms and certainly nothing should have been sent to the first buyer.

Sheeesh. I agree with those who ask how he or anyone validating his actions would feel if they were on the receiving end of these shenanigans. It really is no wonder at all why the resale timeshare business is thought of as a sleazy business. I hope if ever it is regulated, legislation is enacted that would prevent this from happening.
 
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My previous post was made previous to this being shared.

I think the first buyer understood because you did make that statement. As long as the first buyer knew that other offers would be considered until he officially accepted, then you SHOULD be comfortable with your decision.

I don't think your integrity should be called into question any further. No, you were not obligated to the first buyer. You stated your requirements. You did not verbally agree to hold the timeshare until he "decided" to perform.

I may have missed this statement previously in another post. I don't think you would have gotten some of the opinions you got if folks knew that you had informed your potential buyer that you would still be accepting offers.

I know it changes my opinion of the handling of the situation.

I didn't mention it earlier but I can honestly say in my first emails always as part of my spiel to all my renters and buyers is to please say "I Accept" and that triggers exclusivity to close the deal and the taking down of the ad.

I have to take this approach because I do get multiple offers at once and if I didn't specify this then I have to worry about someone getting pissed because they delayed, thought they had exclusivity and someone else came along. I'm sure others that rents many units do the same thing

The reason why I did put this string up in the first place is because I was struggling with the decision not for validation. Still am because in an ideal world money wouldn't be an issue but it is so all things considered even having mixed feelings about it myself I did the right thing for my family and "didn't harm anyone" which were the exact words from the first buyer.
 
I see nothing at all wrong with what Joe did. Nothing was signed and a higher offer came along. The original buyer should know that until a contract is signed there is no deal.

If you are involved in a lot of real estate transactions you would realize that it happens all the time. Very simply, its business.
 
It doesn't change mine. Nothing the OP has said to try to justify his actions has changed my opinion that the situation doesn't reflect favorably on him. (And it's worth noting here that if the OP had asked only for posts from people who would validate his opinion, those of us who disagree wouldn't be participating in this thread.)

He drew up a contract and sent it to a buyer, implying that he was accepting the buyer's offer, and then reneged on it when a better offer came along. The better offer wasn't weeks later, it was within hours. There wasn't time for the first buyer to "officially accept" (i.e. execute the contract) before he was notified that the price was being increased! If the timeshare was still on the market even after the first offer came in, papers shouldn't have been drawn up for the sale on the first buyer's terms and certainly nothing should have been sent to the first buyer.

Sheeesh. I agree with those who ask how he or anyone validating his actions would feel if they were on the receiving end of these shenanigans. It really is no wonder at all why the resale timeshare business is thought of as a sleazy business. I hope if ever it is regulated, legislation is enacted that would prevent this from happening.

Have you ever rented a week? I can't tell you how many times I've gotten to this point only to be told "sorry plans have changed". It has got to number in the 50s over the course of my 12 years of renting units.

So before the deal is done is it ok for buyers to do it but not sellers?


So when I clearly state please officially accept and they don't I fulfilled my obligation

This is a business for me so I run it as one. I think that is this issue with the disapprovers is that they don't like what I do in the first place so that is some of the disdain for me.

That's ok I understand where that is coming from.
 
I see nothing at all wrong with what Joe did. Nothing was signed and a higher offer came along. The original buyer should know that until a contract is signed there is no deal.

If you are involved in a lot of real estate transactions you would realize that it happens all the time. Very simply, its business.

A certain amount of integrity is inherent in business. It's not legally required, no, but many people measure it and decide to deal with others or not based on whether it's present or not.

This isn't a black/white issue and neither side will ever convince the other that they're correct.
 
deleted.

Thanks for everyone's opinions. I value none others more than TUGGERS!!
 
Have you ever rented a week? I can't tell you how many times I've gotten to this point only to be told "sorry plans have changed". It has got to number in the 50s over the course of my 12 years of renting units.

So before the deal is done is it ok for buyers to do it but not sellers?


So when I clearly state please officially accept and they don't I fulfilled my obligation

This is a business for me so I run it as one. I think that is this issue with the disapprovers is that they don't like what I do in the first place so that is some of the disdain for me.

That's ok I understand where that is coming from.

Please don't make it worse by attributing a mindset to your detractors that simply isn't in play here. I couldn't care less if you rent/buy/sell timeshares from now until the end of time, and you know that I defend owners' rights to perform those practices the same as I defend any that are allowed by the timeshare contracts. My opinion isn't based on what I do or don't do with my timeshares, and if you didn't want to hear people's opinions about what you're doing then you shouldn't have asked.

If you ever want to ask if it's okay for rentees/buyers to play similar games, my answer then will also be, "no."
 
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I always tell people that there is no agreement until they send me money. Seems like everyone wants to put stuff on hold with no intention of following through on buying or renting. I just let them know nothing gets on hold until I have money. Seems to shut a lot of people up.

I still stand by that I would have given first buyer 24 hours to sign and agreement and send money. Nobody likes to hear, "Sorry, I changed my mind." Even worse is, "I changed my mind unless you will pay more." That sounds like a bait and switch scam artist, no matter how legit the reasons are for doing that.
 
From Joe's postings, it seems the first buyer understood and isn't mad/upset.

First buyer may have been disappointed. Joe didn't come here asking what was everyone's opinion on his handling of the situation because this person was mad.

For those who are saying derogatory things about his "word". What about his words of saying that he would still be accepting offers until there was acceptance? Once the buyer heard that, he could have asked Joe for a 24 hour or more time frame to review the document. He did not. He is not mad at Joe about what happened because he understood that Joe would still be accepting offers until he accepted. He knows that he "rolled the dice" and lost out. He didn't expect to lose out. But he did and, according to Joe's posts, he accepted it.

No one knows if this person actually would have proceeded. Just because someone says they "will, want, can" or whatever, until it's done, it don't mean a thing. Anyone that rents or sells anything knows that people will change their minds and move on. Some don't even have the courtesy to notify you that they have changed their minds.

I've got a long list of people that didn't keep their "word" about purchasing or renting, didn't do what they assured me they would do, didn't let me know that they had changed their minds and moved on, signed an agreement that they didn't read or understand and then expected me to forego the terms to my detriment, etc., etc., etc. I will be happy to forward my list to you, so that you can let them know what pieces of work they are. It's a two-way street.

My opinions of the first buyer's understanding of Joe's actions are based on his postings in this thread. Naturally, no one knows what happened or what was said other than the two people involved.





I have found more often lately that buyers and renters believe contracts and agreements are solely for the purpose of protecting them. Some feel that even though they did not follow what was agreed to in the contract/agreement, that somehow the seller/owner should not enforce it. A lot more of that entitlement going around.
 
When someone asks for more time to make a decision, for whatever reason, I usually tell them, that I will hold it for them for 24 or 48 hours, and then it's back on the market at 12:00 noon, on a specific date. I make it very clear that I need to receive their deposit before that point, if they want to continue.

Then, in 24/48 hours, if I haven't received a deposit from them, I send them a friendly email saying that since I haven't heard from them, it was back on the market, but I'd be happy to work with them in the future, and I hoped they would find what they were looking for.

I think a lot of people are busy, or procrastinators, and having a deadline helps them make a decision.
 
Some don't even have the courtesy to notify you that they have changed their minds.

This happened to us. We had made an offer to buy a week below asking price but it was accepted. I as the buyer drew up the contract and sent it to the seller. I never heard another word. Even sent several follow up e-mails. Later looked up the deed online and found they sold the unit for full asking price. No biggie, but they could have had the decency to at least respond to one of my e-mails:annoyed:
 
From a strictly legal standpoint, acceptance of an offer has nothing to do with signing anything. If I say to you, "I'll give you $500 for your watch," and you say, "I accept," you could technically sue me to enforce that oral agreement.

That is not the way it works in a real estate transaction. The first person to return a signed purchase agreement with the agreed earnest money gets the property. Anyone who has dilly-dallied and lost their dream home, learns this the hard way.
 
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