Ebay seller didn't pay MF as promised.

[sui]

I just received the welcome letter from starwood for a resale unit, in the listing, the seller promised to pay for 2011 MF, and it is cleared stated in the purchase contract as well, however, I just confirmed with starwood that the MF is past due, I emailed both the seller and the closing agent, waiting for the response now. What should I do? The listing was more than two months ago so I couldn't leave any feedback now, is there any way to contact ebay for buyer protection? Regarding the fees, should I pay it off now and let the seller reimburse it, or just let them pay starwood directly?

 

[Ridewithme38]

Dispute the charges with Paypal AND your credit card company...that'll get the sellers attention, a major part of the purchase agreement was that he would have paid the MF...he didn't, you only received part of what was agreed upon, if anything you deserve a partial refund for the value of the purchase you didn't recieve...and if the MF is more then you paid...they owe you above and beyond...if i buy a full stereo system on ebay but only receive the speakers...i'm owed by the seller the rest of the agreed upon purchase

What was the difference between the purchase price and the MF?

 

[sui]

Dispute the charges with Paypal AND your credit card company...that'll get the sellers attention, a major part of the purchase agreement was that he would have paid the MF...he didn't, you only received part of what was agreed upon, if anything you deserve a partial refund for the value of the purchase you didn't recieve...and if the MF is more then you paid...they owe you above and beyond...if i buy a full stereo system on ebay but only receive the speakers...i'm owed by the seller the rest of the agreed upon purchase

What was the difference between the purchase price and the MF?

The purchase price is 404, and the past due balance is 578.68. I didn't pay with credit card, the closing company would only accept paypal echeck, so it went directly from my checking account, but the payment was processed via paypal, I'll wait for a few days and if still no response, I'll dispute paypal. So ebay is out of protection in this case?

 

[rickandcindy23]

What seller and closing company. If we knew that info, we can advise you better.

I have a current major issue with Memorable Vacations, also a Starwood purchase. I see he finally sent the deed to the county, after nearly five months. Now I wonder how long it will take for him to get the deed back to me, so I can soothe things with Starwood. I plan to pay Starwood for the late fees and MF's directly and not give this guy a dime to do it in my stead. He is scum.

 

[timeos2]

The purchase price is 404, and the past due balance is 578.68. I didn't pay with credit card, the closing company would only accept paypal echeck, so it went directly from my checking account, but the payment was processed via paypal, I'll wait for a few days and if still no response, I'll dispute paypal. So ebay is out of protection in this case?

eBay offers little to no protection to buyers except for the relatively weak "feedback" system. Use whatever other sources you may have as your best bets now.

 

[antjmar]

I had same problem. After lots of calls and e-mails they fixed their error. FYI, No buyer protection on timeshare purchase (real estate). If tiltle company is legit they will correct the error. If all else fails contact the BBB for their area.

 

[jarta]

Yet another good example of why buying timeshares on eBay can be hazardous to one's pocketbook. Sometimes the eBay auctions are not as good a deal as they seem. ... eom

 

[sui]

Seller is snownsun4ever, closing company is Resort Closing Inc.

 

[davhu1]

It should have been part of your purchase contract and the settlement for allocation of funds. The settlement company should have held that amount and they dispursed funds before everything have been paid off, then the settlement is responsible to either collect from the owner or out of their own pocket.

 

[yumdrey]

You can "follow up" your feedback on ebay even if it was 2+ months ago.
TS closing takes more than 2 months usually, so I just leave simple feed back first, and then update it after everything is done.
You can leave feedback within 60 days from the purchase, and if you leave a feedback, you can follow up for up to 2 years.
Usually sellers respond very fast for negative follow ups.

 

[tombo]

Yet another good example of why buying timeshares on eBay can be hazardous to one's pocketbook. Sometimes the eBay auctions are not as good a deal as they seem. ... eom

I have purchased over 20 on e-bay with only one problem sale ever. I could have prevented that problem from occuring by doing a little due diligence.

Call the seller, and ask questions. E-mail the seller and ask questions. Find out the week/unit on the deed and call the resort to see if any back dues are owed. They will tell you if there are in most cases. Pay with paypal. When you get the closing papers call the resort with details of what the deed says to make sure that what you are actually buying is what you think you are buying before signing and mailing it back to the closing company. A couple of simple things can make your e-bay purchase very safe.

A little effort will save you $15,000 to $50,000 over a retail purchase. E-bay resales are are not nearly as hazardous to your pocketbook as buying from the developer.

 

[Ken555]

A little effort will save you $15,000 to $50,000 over a retail purchase. E-bay resales are are not nearly as hazardous to your pocketbook as buying from the developer.

Well said. Of course, using a reputable broker is always a good option. But my eBay transactions had no difficulty whatsoever (they were about as smooth as could be).

 

[Fredm]

Oftentimes, a buyer can have the best of all situations.
Use a reputable/knowledgeable broker, and buy at a low price.
They are not mutually exclusive.

 

[ada903]

I think eBay is a bit of a lottery even when the PCC sellers have generally favorable feedback. They handle a large number of transactions, rely on quantity rather than quality, and make an awful number of mistakes and misrepresentations. The eBay deals are hot - but let me tell you my best purchases and best experiences were not from eBay sellers. It is possible to find great prices on tug and redweek - for example I bought a gold 2 bdr annual WKV for $1,500 from a broker, and a Marriott Shadow Ridge biennial platinum 2 bdr for $1,500 from another broker. In the case of the Marriott purchase my broker went in person to record the deed to help me speed up the process and when Marriott screwed up the title transfer and misapplied my maintenance fee payment, he worked with the title company to fix the problem in 24 hours. Now I am ready to book my preferred 2012 week - I would have lost the opportunity if my broker wasn't as fast and reliable. Meanwhile my eBay purchased SDO is in the eight week of processing, and even though a fantastic title company is processing it (JRA), the eBay seller has dragged it's feet. First, they argued I owed 2011 fees even though the ad said free 2011 usage. Then they sent the papers to another closing company by mistake, whereas I had already sent a check as requested to JRA. For almost eight weeks JRA could not even move on to request an estopel letter.

I have to say I bumped into some very reliable brokers linked to PCC's - the brokers are generally great but the PCC's are the problem. I had to have deeds re-recorded and waited for as long as six months for PCC transactions to close. I had to ask for additional title searches because the property had a lien on it (and I figured that doing my own research)!

Bottom line, you can get a great price from a broker and better service and smooth closing. I am still browsing eBay but I am very cautious about who I buy from.

 

[eal]

I have purchased from snowsun4ever and used Resort Closings several times. They were both reputable companies. Others have posted here about mistakes that happened but got corrected. I would keep in close contact with both and make sure they fix this for you.

 

[jarta]

tombo, ... eBay is a great place to pick up a bargain on a distressed property. However, eBay is no place for unwary people, like the OP.

I said that "buying timeshares on eBay can be hazardous to one's pocketbook. Sometimes the eBay auctions are not as good a deal as they seem." I did not say and did not mean to imply that buying on eBay will be hazardous to one's pocketbook. I bought 3 of the 9 timeshares I own on eBay.

An estoppel letter or call to the resort would not have helped. The OP already knew the MF were unpaid ("the seller promised to pay for 2011 MF, and it is cleared stated in the purchase contract as well") - but relied on the promise that the MF would be paid by the seller outside the closing and not from the closing proceeds.

Proper escrow instructions for the closer (a different person with differing responsibilities from the seller's) would have helped the OP avoid the problem. But, the OP has probably never even heard of escrow instructions. ... eom

 

[jarta]

Fredm, ... "They (eBay and reputable brokers) are not mutually exclusive."

This winter I picked up 2 Gold (non-prime) FSA weeks. The 2-br lockoff was purchased on eBay for $3.5K. The free-standing 1-br was purchased through a reputable broker for $2.0K. The 2-br lockoff has 1,670 sq. ft. The free-standing 1-br has 1,330 sq. ft.

Both are good buys. However, on a sq. ft. basis, the 1-br purchase using the broker was cheaper and took far less time to close. ... eom

 

[Fredm]

Fredm, ... "They (eBay and reputable brokers) are not mutually exclusive."

"They" (Reputable brokers and low prices) are not mutually exclusive.

Your FS example reflected my meaning. Your quote above did not

 

[sui]

Yes, I didn't do enough work, I thought I was triple guarded by ebay, paypal, and the closing company, but, ..., well, this is what I learned from this bad experience, hope others could benefit from my mistake.

1. Always leave a feedback within 60 days, so that if something happens, I could follow up on the feedback.

2. Paypal will only take disputes within 45 days of payment, so I should talk to the closing company to see whether they would take a credit-card funded paypal payment, but maybe the 45 days rule is exactly why they didn't want to take credit card payment? They don't want you to dispute the payment?

3. You could call the resort to verify the payment of MF, I thought that information is confidential, so I didn't even bother to make a call. Had I called and found it out, I could take actions like leaving a negative feedback or dispute paypal.

 

[Fredm]

3. You could call the resort to verify the payment of MF, I thought that information is confidential, so I didn't even bother to make a call. Had I called and found it out, I could take actions like leaving a negative feedback or dispute paypal.

Starwood will not disclose this information to a buyer without a signed Limited Authorization & Release from the existing owner of record.

 

[jarta]

Fredm, ... The OP's problem is that he did not force the payment of the delinquent MF through the closing escrow and follow it up with escrow instructions which would force the seller to give the delinquent MF to the closer and the closer to pay the delinquent MF.

If the buyer agrees to let the seller pay the delinquent MF and it is not paid, the buyer has no recourse against either the closing agent (it violated no instruction) or the broker (the broker didn't promise to pay the MF). The resort is not a party to the transfer, wasn't asked, doesn't care and will (rightly) deny use until the delinquent MF is paid.

The seller is someone probably unknown to the buyer and is hard to track down.

And, that's exactly why escrows are used for closing real estate transactions. The OP, by stating that he could have called the resort, demonstrates he still doesn't get it.

On eBay people think they are dealing with the actual owner of the timeshare. They aren't. They are dealng with an advertiser/selling agent of the true owner and a closing firm both of whom may or may not be licensed and bonded and both of whom may or may not be honest or competent. So, sometimes things go awry and the advertiser/selling agent and the closing company are insulated from liability to the buyer. ... eom

 

[ronparise]

No need to get excited, at least not yet....just notify your seller and the title company and I bet they get it straight.

I had exactly the same problem, I blame Wyndham, but it could have been a mistake at the title company. I dont care. I notified the seller and the title company, and within a week my account at Wyndham was credited with the payment. They made it right.

I recommend Carefree Journeys and their title company Timeshare Closing Services Inc. wholeheartedly

 

[Fredm]

Fredm, ... The OP's problem is that he did not force the payment of the delinquent MF through the closing escrow and follow it up with escrow instructions which would force the seller to give the delinquent MF to the closer and the closer to pay the delinquent MF.

If the buyer agrees to let the seller pay the delinquent MF and it is not paid, the buyer has no recourse against either the closing agent (it violated no instruction) or the broker (the broker didn't promise to pay the MF). The resort is not a party to the transfer, wasn't asked, doesn't care and will (rightly) deny use until the delinquent MF is paid.

The seller is someone probably unknown to the buyer and is hard to track down.

And, that's exactly why escrows are used for closing real estate transactions. The OP, by stating that he could have called the resort, demonstrates he still doesn't get it.

On eBay people think they are dealing with the actual owner of the timeshare. They aren't. They are dealng with an advertiser/selling agent of the true owner and a closing firm both of whom may or may not be licensed and bonded and both of whom may or may not be honest or competent. So, sometimes things go awry and the advertiser/selling agent and the closing company are insulated from liability to the buyer. ... eom

I agree with you.

I was just saying that a prospective buyer could not merely perform "due diligence" by contacting Starwood about the status of m/f's, use-year availability, etc., as has been suggested by tombo, and the OP.
They would need a signed Authorization from Starwood's actual owner of record.
Even if they did have the signed Authorization, it would not have prevented what happened to the OP for the reasons you mentioned.

 

[clsmit]

This is why I choose, where possible, to tell the seller I will pay the MF for the current year. Then it's my problem to deal with it, and to try to negotiate with SVO on late fees.

 

[sui]

Fredm, ... The OP's problem is that he did not force the payment of the delinquent MF through the closing escrow and follow it up with escrow instructions which would force the seller to give the delinquent MF to the closer and the closer to pay the delinquent MF.

If the buyer agrees to let the seller pay the delinquent MF and it is not paid, the buyer has no recourse against either the closing agent (it violated no instruction) or the broker (the broker didn't promise to pay the MF). The resort is not a party to the transfer, wasn't asked, doesn't care and will (rightly) deny use until the delinquent MF is paid.

The seller is someone probably unknown to the buyer and is hard to track down.

And, that's exactly why escrows are used for closing real estate transactions. The OP, by stating that he could have called the resort, demonstrates he still doesn't get it.

On eBay people think they are dealing with the actual owner of the timeshare. They aren't. They are dealng with an advertiser/selling agent of the true owner and a closing firm both of whom may or may not be licensed and bonded and both of whom may or may not be honest or competent. So, sometimes things go awry and the advertiser/selling agent and the closing company are insulated from liability to the buyer. ... eom

I still don't get it. What should I do exactly next time to prevent such problems? I know better buy it off from a broker, but finding a good broker with the right timeshare is too much work for me, at least for now. So given that ebay is risky, is there anyway to reduce the risk?