Opinion wanted: We Just Purchased at Kierland Villas

[Larry315]

We went to a sales presentation and bought today but want to get opinions on the purchase.

We bought deluxe 1 br EOY at Westin Keirland Villas. It comes with 37000 StarOptions.

An important factor as the ability to purchase 110,000 StarPoints for $2250. We can buy a total of 660,000 for $13,500. (It is sightly more than 2 cents a point.)We like to travel and stay at hotels around the world.

Also, we liked the ability to use our purchase to use Interval International which we may use more Starwood.

Please let us know what you think.

Thank you

 

[DeniseM]

You could pick this up for pennies on the dollar on the resale market.

You can generate nearly free Starpoints with a Starwood AMEX card.

 

[VacationForever]

Plus 37000 StarOptions do not give you enough options to book within the Starwood internal trading system for a week anywhere decent.

 

[Larry315]

I agree it is less expensive to buy this property as a resale.

What intrigued us was the StarPoints (660,000 at $13,500.). That number of points is difficult to accumulate with an AMEX Starwood card.

The current price for a point is 3.5 cents The promotional price with purchase is 2 cents a point. The saving is $9,990, more than the cost of the property, $8,000.

In additon, we have a year to upgrade to EY for $4,000 which gives us another opportunity to purchase another 660,000 for $13,500.

 

[vacationtime1]

What do I think? I think you should rescind.

Why? I recently bought the same unit for $689 including closing costs. Except mine is every year, not every other year.

Yes, StarPoints are nice. We use ours to get suites in Westin hotels in Europe. They are worth $0.025 - $0.03 per point, unless you were going to pay rack rate for the room. We like the product (obviously), but not enough to pay retail. For either a timeshare or for StarPoints.

 

[YYJMSP]

The current price for a point is 3.5 cents The promotional price with purchase is 2 cents a point. The saving is $9,990, more than the cost of the property, $8,000.

it's not $8000 -- remember you'll have to add in the yearly MFs as well...

 

[YYJMSP]

We bought deluxe 1 br EOY at Westin Keirland Villas. It comes with 37000 StarOptions.

...

Also, we liked the ability to use our purchase to use Interval International which we may use more Starwood.

we don't use Interval, but I believe the best value is when you purchase a 2BR lockoff, as that can be split in two and each half can be traded separately in Interval.

So a 2BR LO EOY can be leveraged in to a stay every year, where with the 1BR EOY, you'll only get one use every other year...

and if you aren't going to take advantage of the SO's, which you are only getting 37000 every other year -- EXTREMELY limited things you can do with that few, it doesn't make sense to have bought the unit from the developer instead of resale, a both would get you the same benefits in Interval

 

[sjsharkie]

I agree it is less expensive to buy this property as a resale.

What intrigued us was the StarPoints (660,000 at $13,500.). That number of points is difficult to accumulate with an AMEX Starwood card.

The current price for a point is 3.5 cents The promotional price with purchase is 2 cents a point. The saving is $9,990, more than the cost of the property, $8,000.

In additon, we have a year to upgrade to EY for $4,000 which gives us another opportunity to purchase another 660,000 for $13,500.

Most will tell you that it is never a good idea to hoard points as over time they will devalue -- Starwood keeps moving hotels between the categories (and there almost always are more upward moves than downward moves).

So, if you have specific plans where you know you can leverage the points in the near term, and the point value is 3.5 cents or more, then you should keep the deal since as you mentioned it will be difficult to accumulate such points in a short period of time. Those are a lot of points -- you can probably spend 3 to 4 weeks in Bora Bora at a Cat 7 hotel with that amount of points.

However, in my experience, achieving such cost per point levels are not easy -- possible but not common. I personally value my points at around 2 cents per point, but I have achieved higher than 4 cents on rare occasions.

Otherwise, I would rescind -- even if I wasn't sure I'd rescind as the deal will likely always be there if you change your mind later.

Good luck.

-ryan

 

[clotheshorse]

Bad deal, rescind

The starpoint proposition from the sales team is enticing, I almost fell for it last month. Truth is, as others pointed out, you can buy that unit for less than $500. I purchased two (one premium 1BR and one standard).

You can buy up to 20k starpoints each year through SPG; you probably know this (about $600) and SPG runs two discount specials a year. Buying points, in addition to the Amex card, could get you a decent amount of points. Yes, 660K starpoints are difficult to come by, but will you really need or use them all? I personally don't think it is worth the 15-30k developer price.

I have been in the same place as you and ended up buying resale - thanks to TUG!

Good luck,

 

[capjak]

AGree

$21000 buys a lot of hotel stays.

 

[SMHarman]

As others have said you need a plan for those 600k star points otherwise you have converted from a currency accepted by everyone, the dollar, to one accepted by starwood.
That plan realistically is top end starwood hotels in Europe and Biz flight seats transatlantic or trans pacific. It is hard to get the same value domestically.

If you and your partner are spg amex spending and but when they sell online at a discount you can acquire a decent amount of points each year but not this many.

Remember you may find the resort you want in Bora Bora is FS not Starwood. Now you are spending $ and have $20k of StarOption just hanging around.

 

[YYJMSP]

Those are a lot of points -- you can probably spend 3 to 4 weeks in Bora Bora at a Cat 7 hotel with that amount of points

The over water huts started at 105,000/nt last time we checked, so 660K points would get you 7days (including the 5th night free)...

 

[sjsharkie]

The over water huts started at 105,000/nt last time we checked, so 660K points would get you 7days (including the 5th night free)...

You missed the point ... Bora Bora was just an example

Besides, the over water huts are considered a non-standard suite room at Le Meridien Bora Bora. I can always pick a suite category room and the points will be significantly higher in any category.

I have not checked how much per night in points it would actually be in a while -- it used to be 30K-35K/night for the standard room (not over water) in Bora Bora + 5th night free in the lowest season, but YMMV for Cat 7. I based my estimate off of that. More to my point that the OP should have specific plans and calculations for usage of the Starpoints before buying.

-ryan

 

[DavidnRobin]

Back to the OP - RESCIND!
You are putting too much value on the SP incentive - even with fuzzy math argument.
37K SO is not enough. These level WKV weeks can be found on the resale market for very little for a reason.
Most put a realistic value of SPs at 2 cents/SP, used to be 2.25 c/SP but have devalued over time. Certainly possible to achieve more, but do not fall into the SVO Sales ploy of overvaluing them.

 

[Ken555]

Horrible deal. The only exception, as most others state, is if you have an intended use case for the StarPoints in the near future.

Keep in mind that the week you bought on the resale market is worthless, and you'd have an uphill battle even finding someone to take it for free. The only exception would be someone who wants to trade in II, since the StarOptions are too low to do anything worthwhile except a small unit in the desert during summer and perhaps a few nights elsewhere.

On the other hand, someone has to pay retail so if you're comfortable with these costs, then thanks for keeping SVN in business!


Sent from my iPad

 

[Amiller4879]

Don't Do It

You should rescind before dusk today! Don't fall for their sales pitch! I have the exact unit at Westin Kierland and can't GIVE it away. Buy resale. It's a "mandatory" property and even a resale will come with everything included as when you buy from the developer.
If you think it's easy to exchange for other resorts, you're in for a surprise. I inherited 3 units and if I'm lucky, I'll give 2 of them away! And interval isn't all it's cracked up to be. Just my opinion, but it's SO not worth the yearly maintenance fee!
They talk a very good line but don't fall for it!

 

[YYJMSP]

You missed the point ... Bora Bora was just an example

Besides, the over water huts are considered a non-standard suite room at Le Meridien Bora Bora. I can always pick a suite category room and the points will be significantly higher in any category.

I have not checked how much per night in points it would actually be in a while -- it used to be 30K-35K/night for the standard room (not over water) in Bora Bora + 5th night free in the lowest season, but YMMV for Cat 7. I based my estimate off of that. More to my point that the OP should have specific plans and calculations for usage of the Starpoints before buying.

-ryan

No worries, not picking on you specifically, just wanted to make sure that there wasn't the impression that buying those points would get a month in Bora Bora -- that's pretty much exactly what a salesperson would push as the reason to buy.

We've toyed with the idea of trading all of 7 weeks of usage for one year to get a week in those huts a bunch of times, :whoopie:

600K would get you a month in Europe in luxurious suites with business class airfare for 2 from North America quite easily.

 

[DeniseM]

One really important point: Did you finance this purchase?

If so, the interest you will pay completely negates any benefit you may get from the Starpoint discount.

 

[Joshadelic]

OP - I don't think you're going to find anyone here who will tell you anything other than to rescind — which is what you should do. Now!

 

[Larry315]

I appreciate everyone's replies and their thoughtful responses.

Here are two points that keep us with the purchase:

1. We are not "resort people" and are aware that the SO makes this a lousy property for trading in Starwood, though we do like Kierland and would be ok staying their once in a great while, even in the shoulder season.

We are ok trading in II for a week (Please let us know if you find it is a difficult to do with this type of property.) every 2 years. Yes, it can be done much more inexpensively through resale, but trading for us is an added benefit, not the purpose of the purchase.

2. We do have plans for the 660,000 points and with stay 4/ get 1 free plus the average cost of 10,000 points for the hotels we would stay over two weeks for $2250. The comparable cost, using a conservative $150 @ night (24 x $150) = $3600, which does not include taxes.

Looking forward to your thoughts.

 

[DeniseM]

Did you finance it?

An off-season week will not have strong trading power in II.

 

[Larry315]

We did not. We used our Starwood AMEX card.

 

[DeniseM]

We did not. We used our Starwood AMEX card.

An you will pay it off at the end of the month?

 

[sjsharkie]

I appreciate everyone's replies and their thoughtful responses.

Here are two points that keep us with the purchase:

1. We are not "resort people" and are aware that the SO makes this a lousy property for trading in Starwood, though we do like Kierland and would be ok staying their once in a great while, even in the shoulder season.

We are ok trading in II for a week (Please let us know if you find it is a difficult to do with this type of property.) every 2 years. Yes, it can be done much more inexpensively through resale, but trading for us is an added benefit, not the purpose of the purchase.

2. We do have plans for the 660,000 points and with stay 4/ get 1 free plus the average cost of 10,000 points for the hotels we would stay over two weeks for $2250. The comparable cost, using a conservative $150 @ night (24 x $150) = $3600, which does not include taxes.

Looking forward to your thoughts.

If you've done the math, and (you seem to) understand that you are buying for the discounted SOs instead of the underlying property, then it sounds like you have made an informed choice.

I hope you do understand that you are buying in the low season and you really will have a tough time getting rid of the property cost free should you tire of it.

I don't agree with the decision, but you seem comfortable with it and that's all that matters. Now sit back and enjoy your ownership!

-ryan

 

[Larry315]

That is something we are not clear about even though we have read the posts on TUG.

How much doe it matter that we have a Starwood property, or one at Kierland, or does it matter more it is Gold rather than Platinum?

If we are relatively flexible when and where we go, though avoiding the time of the year that has the worst weather, like summer in Phoenix or winter in Chicago, will we find it difficult to book?