A few thoughts on the Destination Points

Dean · Jul 6, 2010

I haven't read through every thread on this subject so if I'm redundant, please forgive me. Plus there were a couple of angles/tangents to some of the issue that I know has been discussed. Just a few points that I picked up today. Of course I know it's a new system, we're all learning it including Marriott employees that deal with it and much of it can change even if accurate today.

13 month and 10 month reservations go in on Tuesday.
12 month reservations go in on Friday.
We can apparently drop or add days to an existing reservation without it being a cancelation and rebooking.
Supposedly those weeks that were eligible for MR points previously can elect to either take the points they would have gotten under the old system OR convert to Destination points THEN to MR points.
Points are deemed used day by day not at day 1 of the reservation. Thus you can't use banked points for a week that crosses over the UY. I know some are thinking "duh" but there is at least one system that does it the other way.
Apparently the wait list will be pretty flexible and one can go on it the same day that you are eligible for a given reservation. Can specify view type, etc or just search for any view for a given time.
Apparently Marriott is going to put a fair amount of weight behind the Premier Plus and Premier levels.
Can't add outside listings to the Marriott II account.
Other than the Club fee of $169 or $199, it appears the only fees that will remain for those that convert will be the FL Club $39 and any II trade that involves a non Marriott resort even if Marriott is listed also. And like the previous system, that's true even if the ultimate match is to a Marriott week. Thus no II exchange fees to other Marriott's, no lockoff fees, no MR conversion fees, no cancelation fees, no transfer fees, etc.
Cancelations for free up to 60 days out and go into holding account at under 60 days. It appears the cutoff for cancelation to get holding account points is the day before checkin rather than the day of.
Can make a points reservation while searching with II and later cancel subject to the mentioned cancelation rules.

Unit assignment priority at a given resort appears to be uncharted territory. My VOA who seemed VERY knowledgeable didn't know and the GM at Surfwatch said he's asked for clarification on that subject himself. My guess is something like the following.

Premier Plus (regardless of where they own)
Premier (regardless of where they own)
Week owners at that resort and so on per the usual hierarchy we've all known for a while.

I came away from my conversations today with a different sense than I did going in on unit assignments. My assumption going in was that weeks owners at a given resort would have a higher priority and I now do not think that is likely. The other issue that I picked up on from a GM I talked to last week is that apparently in the past Corporate has given a general framework for unit assignments and let the individual resorts have a fair amount of latitude. I got the sense that he did not feel this would be the case, or at least as much so, with the new system.

On a side note, I had asked about our VOA changing if we converted an was told no but there was a change. Apparently the advisors had a choice whether to participate in the new system or stay with the old. They actually had to apply to be a points VOA.

Anyway, a few tidbits and variations that were helpful to me.

puckmanfl · Jul 6, 2010

good morning

Dean...

If you shorten a reservation made during a priority booking period (13 mos for less than 7 days for Premier + ) , then the points returned from the "shortened' days go in "TIME OUT" or as Perry would describe, the "PENALTY BOX".

This is designed to prevent hoarding!!!

Dean · Jul 6, 2010

puckmanfl said:
good morning

Dean...

If you shorten a reservation made during a priority booking period (13 mos for less than 7 days for Premier + ) , then the points returned from the "shortened' days go in "TIME OUT" or as Perry would describe, the "PENALTY BOX".

This is designed to prevent hoarding!!!

That is not my understanding if outside the 60 day window but we're all still learning obviously.

saturn28 · Jul 6, 2010

Dean said:
I haven't read through every thread on this subject so if I'm redundant, please forgive me. Plus there were a couple of angles/tangents to some of the issue that I know has been discussed. Just a few points that I picked up today. Of course I know it's a new system, we're all learning it including Marriott employees that deal with it and much of it can change even if accurate today.

13 month and 10 month reservations go in on Tuesday.

12 month reservations go in on Friday.

We can apparently drop or add days to an existing reservation without it being a cancelation and rebooking.

Supposedly those weeks that were eligible for MR points previously can elect to either take the points they would have gotten under the old system OR convert to Destination points THEN to MR points.

Points are deemed used day by day not at day 1 of the reservation. Thus you can't use banked points for a week that crosses over the UY. I know some are thinking "duh" but there is at least one system that does it the other way.

Apparently the wait list will be pretty flexible and one can go on it the same day that you are eligible for a given reservation. Can specify view type, etc or just search for any view for a given time.

Apparently Marriott is going to put a fair amount of weight behind the Premier Plus and Premier levels.

Can't add outside listings to the Marriott II account.

Other than the Club fee of $169 or $199, it appears the only fees that will remain for those that convert will be the FL Club $39 and any II trade that involves a non Marriott resort even if Marriott is listed also. And like the previous system, that's true even if the ultimate match is to a Marriott week. Thus no II exchange fees to other Marriott's, no lockoff fees, no MR conversion fees, no cancelation fees, no transfer fees, etc.

Cancelations for free up to 60 days out and go into holding account at under 60 days. It appears the cutoff for cancelation to get holding account points is the day before checkin rather than the day of.

Can make a points reservation while searching with II and later cancel subject to the mentioned cancelation rules.

Unit assignment priority at a given resort appears to be uncharted territory. My VOA who seemed VERY knowledgeable didn't know and the GM at Surfwatch said he's asked for clarification on that subject himself. My guess is something like the following.

Premier Plus (regardless of where they own)

Premier (regardless of where they own)

Week owners at that resort and so on per the usual hierarchy we've all known for a while.

I came away from my conversations today with a different sense than I did going in on unit assignments. My assumption going in was that weeks owners at a given resort would have a higher priority and I now do not think that is likely. The other issue that I picked up on from a GM I talked to last week is that apparently in the past Corporate has given a general framework for unit assignments and let the individual resorts have a fair amount of latitude. I got the sense that he did not feel this would be the case, or at least as much so, with the new system.

On a side note, I had asked about our VOA changing if we converted an was told no but there was a change. Apparently the advisors had a choice whether to participate in the new system or stay with the old. They actually had to apply to be a points VOA.

Anyway, a few tidbits and variations that were helpful to me.

Only Points Owners will be able to change their Destination Points into Marriott Reward Points. Legacy Owners (weeks owners) can only change their week into Marriott Reward Points. Once Legacy Owners have elected to give up their week for Destination Points in any given year, they cannot then change their Destination Points into Marriott Reward Points.

WelcomeHome · Jul 6, 2010

Thanks Dean

Thanks Dean, it's great to get some intelligent information. I still feel Marriott's new program shows an arrogant disregard for it's customers base, but at least it's nice to finally hear some specifics regarding the finer points!

Best wishes,
David

puckmanfl · Jul 6, 2010

Good morning

Dean....

if you CANCEL greater than 60 days out, points are returned without penalty.

If you SHORTEN a reservation made during your special priority period the points from the shortened period go to time out....

If this was not the case, a premier owner could book a 7 day stay at 13 months and shorten a few weeks later circumventing the rules about short stay booking..

SueDonJ · Jul 6, 2010

Dean said:
... Unit assignment priority at a given resort appears to be uncharted territory. My VOA who seemed VERY knowledgeable didn't know and the GM at Surfwatch said he's asked for clarification on that subject himself. My guess is something like the following.

Premier Plus (regardless of where they own)

Premier (regardless of where they own)

Week owners at that resort and so on per the usual hierarchy we've all known for a while.

I came away from my conversations today with a different sense than I did going in on unit assignments. My assumption going in was that weeks owners at a given resort would have a higher priority and I now do not think that is likely. The other issue that I picked up on from a GM I talked to last week is that apparently in the past Corporate has given a general framework for unit assignments and let the individual resorts have a fair amount of latitude. I got the sense that he did not feel this would be the case, or at least as much so, with the new system. ...

Very good info in your post, Dean, thanks!

One thing about this that I cut - I know you're waiting on the SurfWatch GM but maybe you can clear up my confusion before you hear. Are you saying that the priority list will always be (well, as much as the other priority list was always utilized

)

- Premier Plus purchased and/or enrolled Points
- Premier purchased and/or enrolled Points
- (un-enrolled) Weeks, etc...

Or, will an enrolled Points member staying at his/her home resort(s) using the underlying Week(s) be third in the list? IOW, will the tier level for Points owners only apply when Enrolled Points owners use Points instead of Week(s)?

siberiavol · Jul 6, 2010

Dean said:
I haven't read through every thread on this subject so if I'm redundant, please forgive me. Plus there were a couple of angles/tangents to some of the issue that I know has been discussed. Just a few points that I picked up today. Of course I know it's a new system, we're all learning it including Marriott employees that deal with it and much of it can change even if accurate today.

13 month and 10 month reservations go in on Tuesday.

12 month reservations go in on Friday.

We can apparently drop or add days to an existing reservation without it being a cancelation and rebooking.

Supposedly those weeks that were eligible for MR points previously can elect to either take the points they would have gotten under the old system OR convert to Destination points THEN to MR points.

Points are deemed used day by day not at day 1 of the reservation. Thus you can't use banked points for a week that crosses over the UY. I know some are thinking "duh" but there is at least one system that does it the other way.

Apparently the wait list will be pretty flexible and one can go on it the same day that you are eligible for a given reservation. Can specify view type, etc or just search for any view for a given time.

Apparently Marriott is going to put a fair amount of weight behind the Premier Plus and Premier levels.

Can't add outside listings to the Marriott II account.

Other than the Club fee of $169 or $199, it appears the only fees that will remain for those that convert will be the FL Club $39 and any II trade that involves a non Marriott resort even if Marriott is listed also. And like the previous system, that's true even if the ultimate match is to a Marriott week. Thus no II exchange fees to other Marriott's, no lockoff fees, no MR conversion fees, no cancelation fees, no transfer fees, etc.

Cancelations for free up to 60 days out and go into holding account at under 60 days. It appears the cutoff for cancelation to get holding account points is the day before checkin rather than the day of.

Can make a points reservation while searching with II and later cancel subject to the mentioned cancelation rules.

Unit assignment priority at a given resort appears to be uncharted territory. My VOA who seemed VERY knowledgeable didn't know and the GM at Surfwatch said he's asked for clarification on that subject himself. My guess is something like the following.

Premier Plus (regardless of where they own)

Premier (regardless of where they own)

Week owners at that resort and so on per the usual hierarchy we've all known for a while.

I came away from my conversations today with a different sense than I did going in on unit assignments. My assumption going in was that weeks owners at a given resort would have a higher priority and I now do not think that is likely. The other issue that I picked up on from a GM I talked to last week is that apparently in the past Corporate has given a general framework for unit assignments and let the individual resorts have a fair amount of latitude. I got the sense that he did not feel this would be the case, or at least as much so, with the new system.

On a side note, I had asked about our VOA changing if we converted an was told no but there was a change. Apparently the advisors had a choice whether to participate in the new system or stay with the old. They actually had to apply to be a points VOA.

Anyway, a few tidbits and variations that were helpful to me.

Could you explain " thus you can't use banked points for a week that crosses the UY" and perhaps give an example?
Thanks

5infam · Jul 6, 2010

Hi Dean,

This is probably a stupid question to others, but somewhere along the line I missed the info about a 10 month window - what is that? I understand 13/12 months, but what happens at 10 months out?

TIA!!

m61376 · Jul 6, 2010

"We can apparently drop or add days to an existing reservation without it being a cancelation and rebooking."

It was my understanding that you couldn't drop part of a reservation without a penalty; that points from those days would go into a holding account if the remaining reservation was less than 7 days and was made before the 10 month mark (except for Premier+ members, who can make single day reservations at 13 months)

5infam- at 10 months Premier and Standard members can book 1+ nights.

Wow- I hope the VOA was wrong about the reservation priority! Are you saying that owners using their owned resort would drop to third on the list and that point users exchanging in would have room priority?!

Now that would be a significant devaluation!!

rylan · Jul 6, 2010

That will be another big thing to PO people if weeks owners at their home resort do not get priority for room assignment/preference over points.

Also, what is to prevent a weeks owner who spent a LOT more for a Plat Plus week from getting shut out at their home resort by a points owners grabbing up the inventory before the PlatPlus owners can make their reservations?

Dave M · Jul 6, 2010

m61376 said:
It was my understanding that you couldn't drop part of a reservation without a penalty; that points from those days would go into a holding account if the remaining reservation was less than 7 days and was made before the 10 month mark (except for Premier+ members, who can make single day reservations at 13 months)

That's essentiially correct. Although there are several different cancellation rules that apply to limit the use of points that would be restored to the member's account, this one is most applicable to the current discussion:

If a reservation is modified prior to the first day of a confirmed Use Period to result in a shorter duration than would have been permitted at the time the reservation was made, any Exchange Points restored to the Member shall be placed into the Member’s Holding Account, subject to the restrictions on Holding Accounts as set forth in these Exchange Procedures.

The quote comes from section IV. D. 4. of the Exchange Procedures (log-in required).

Luckybee · Jul 6, 2010

I think Rylan has raised a very interesting question. If you're correct Dean then in essense the theory that many on here have been concerned about seems to be correct. That is theoretically a weeks owner could find themselves having great difficulty booking their home resort. Now I wouldnt expect that to happen quickly(there are not that many premier and plus members at this point), but with the higher demand locations it would eventually seem almost inevitable wouldnt it?

hotcoffee · Jul 6, 2010

SueDonJ said:
IOW, will the tier level for Points owners only apply when Enrolled Points owners use Points instead of Week(s)?

Assuming I understand your question, I can answer this because I asked this very question. A premier member who does not exchange for points will not be able to reserve at 13 months unless he is always able to do that. In other words, being premier only applies to points.

SueDonJ · Jul 6, 2010

hotcoffee said:
Assuming I understand your question, I can answer this because I asked this very question. A premier member who does not exchange for points will not be able to reserve at 13 months unless he is always able to do that. In other words, being premier only applies to points.

I figured that you can only reserve according to the rules of whichever system you're using for that particular reservation. But what I'm asking here is - when the room assigner is doing placements, if you're a Premier Plus owner (for example) are you always considered to be that or only when using Points for the stay? IOW is the designation always applied if you're enrolled (regardless of whether you use Points or Week(s) for a particular reservation?)

hotcoffee · Jul 6, 2010

Luckybee said:
I think Rylan has raised a very interesting question. If you're correct Dean then in essense the theory that many on here have been concerned about seems to be correct. That is theoretically a weeks owner could find themselves having great difficulty booking their home resort. Now I wouldnt expect that to happen quickly(there are not that many premier and plus members at this point), but with the higher demand locations it would eventually seem almost inevitable wouldnt it?

Reread the priority. Only Premier and Premier Plus members have the priority because they can book at 13 months rather than 12 months. In addition, based upon much discussion here, it appears that the 50% rule is still in effect: those who book at 13 months only have access to 50% of the available weeks.

Also, none of the points exchangers can book a non-existent week. That is, if no owners at the resort exchanges, there will be no weeks available for the points exchangers to reserve. The only exception will be weeks in the Trust at that resort will be available to points exchangers. So, there might well be some competition that wasn't there before.

hotcoffee · Jul 6, 2010

SueDonJ said:
I figured that you can only reserve according to the rules of whichever system you're using for that particular reservation. But what I'm asking here is - when the room assigner is doing placements, if you're a Premier Plus owner (for example) are you always considered to be that or only when using Points for the stay? IOW is the designation always applied if you're enrolled (regardless of whether you use Points or Week(s) for a particular reservation?)

Oh sorry. Sort of like Marriott assigning dignataries to better accomodations merely because they are dignataries? Will the resort even know that?

SueDonJ · Jul 6, 2010

hotcoffee said:
Oh sorry. Sort of like Marriott assigning dignataries to better accomodations merely because they are dignataries? Will the resort even know that?

Oh no, don't apologize - we're all confused to begin with, it's no surprise that now we're confusing each other. :shrug:

I don't know what the resorts will know, hopefully Dean can offer more info about how this impacts Priority Lists for placement.

On the one hand, I don't like the sound of Weeks owners using their own weeks at their home resort being trumped by Points owners. But on the other hand (selfishly, I admit,) I like the sound of having a Premier Plus priority designation for every stay.

BUT (before they tie me up and burn me at the stake!) if given the choice of one or the other, I really do prefer the Weeks owners getting top billing at their home resorts when using their owned weeks.

siberiavol · Jul 6, 2010

Premeir owner A has points on deposit. He gets a shot at the points pool for a property XYZ on Tuesday.

Mutiple week owner XYZ owner B has weeks but no points. He gets a shot at the weeks pool on Thursday for resort XYZ.

Owner C has points on deposit but also has multiple weeks in resort xyz. He could use his points to get a reservation like owner A on Tuesday or like owner B on Thursday.He could do both if he met the requirements.

The points schedule make clear who can do what with the points and when. The old rules make clear who can do what and when with the weeks.

sdtugger · Jul 6, 2010

siberiavol said:
Premeir owner A has points on deposit. He gets a shot at the points pool for a property XYZ on Tuesday.

Mutiple week owner XYZ owner B has weeks but no points. He gets a shot at the weeks pool on Thursday for resort XYZ.

Owner C has points on deposit but also has multiple weeks in resort xyz. He could use his points to get a reservation like owner A on Tuesday or like owner B on Thursday.He could do both if he met the requirements.

The points schedule make clear who can do what with the points and when. The old rules make clear who can do what and when with the weeks.

I was told that the weeks owners would be able to reserve the thursday BEFORE the following Tuesday when points owners could reserve. Did they get it backwards?

SueDonJ · Jul 6, 2010

siberiavol said:
Premeir owner A has points on deposit. He gets a shot at the points pool for a property XYZ on Tuesday.

Mutiple week owner XYZ owner B has weeks but no points. He gets a shot at the weeks pool on Thursday for resort XYZ.

Owner C has points on deposit but also has multiple weeks in resort xyz. He could use his points to get a reservation like owner A on Tuesday or like owner B on Thursday.He could do both if he met the requirements.

The points schedule make clear who can do what with the points and when. The old rules make clear who can do what and when with the weeks.

Hmmmm. I agree that each of the systems has its own reservation procedures that have to be followed depending on the type of stay being booked, Weeks or Points. But I'm confused ...

With "C" - can an Enrolled Points owner decide to use Points for one stay at the same time s/he's able to book that stay using Points? Isn't there a deadline for exchanging Week(s) for Points?

As far as Points and Weeks reservation windows, Weeks don't have certain day-of-the-week call-in days like Points do. With Weeks the windows are 13- and 12-months in advance of the first possible check-in day of the desired week - that's not always a Thursday.

Found a related thread ...

SueDonJ · Jul 6, 2010

sdtugger said:
I was told that the weeks owners would be able to reserve the thursday BEFORE the following Tuesday when points owners could reserve. Did they get it backwards?

I don't think so, sd, I think they told you correctly that Weeks owners have a jump on Points owners. But it's not always the same number of days, because Weeks owners don't always call on a Thursday - check out that link.

siberiavol · Jul 6, 2010

SueDonJ said:
Hmmmm. I agree that each of the systems has its own reservation procedures that have to be followed depending on the type of stay being booked, Weeks or Points. But I'm confused ...

With "C" - can an Enrolled Points owner decide to use Points for one stay at the same time s/he's able to book that stay using Points? Isn't there a deadline for exchanging Week(s) for Points?

As far as Points and Weeks reservation windows, Weeks don't have certain day-of-the-week call-in days like Points do. With Weeks the windows are 13- and 12-months in advance of the first possible check-in day of the desired week - that's not always a Thursday.

Found the thread mentioned above ...

You are exactly right about the weeks date. I was thinking about the resorts that have a Thursday check in. I should have been clearer.

Owner C would be someone who had multiple weeks. Owner trades some of weeks to get points but retains his two weeks in XYZ. I see no reason owner couldn't get multiple weeks at home resort if they were available in the separate pools.

SueDonJ · Jul 6, 2010

siberiavol said:
You are exactly right about the weeks date. I was thinking about the resorts that have a Thursday check in. I should have been clearer.

Owner C would be someone who had multiple weeks. Owner trades some of weeks to get points but retains his two weeks in XYZ. I see no reason owner couldn't get multiple weeks at home resort if they were available in the separate pools.

Got it. Yep, I agree, as long as whatever you're trying to reserve falls within the related reservation windows and according to the related procedures, anything is possible.

siberiavol · Jul 6, 2010

sdtugger said:
I was told that the weeks owners would be able to reserve the thursday BEFORE the following Tuesday when points owners could reserve. Did they get it backwards?

We asked the same question and got a different answer. I don't know which is right. I don't however see how the points owner would be getting a thirteen months head start if they didn't get to reserve till AFTER the actual thirteenth month date. The same would be true of weeks. It would seem both would have to have a date concurrent with or before the eligible reservation date.

A few thoughts on the Destination Points

Dean

TUG Review Crew

puckmanfl

Dean

TUG Review Crew

saturn28

WelcomeHome

puckmanfl

SueDonJ

siberiavol

5infam

m61376

Tug Review Crew

rylan

Dave M

Luckybee

hotcoffee

SueDonJ

hotcoffee

hotcoffee

SueDonJ

siberiavol

sdtugger

SueDonJ

SueDonJ

siberiavol

SueDonJ

siberiavol