Wyndham vs cancellation companies!

[TUGBrian]

Our friends at the St. Louis BBB (thanks guys) have provided us a lengthy list of court documents from the Wyndham lawsuit vs a large group of upfront fee cancellation companies.

Ive uploaded this to TUG so that anyone can read! https://tug2.net/news/wyndham-lawsuit.pdf

here is the list of companies and individuals Wyndham is going after...some recognizable names there!

 

[Iggyearl]

Some pretty thorough research, and a lot of interconnections. It's too bad the industry can't keep these guys at bay by their actions, rather than lawsuits. These cancellation guys wouldn't have a market if the industry was responsive to changing customer circumstances. Timeshares shouldn't be perpetual. Notice the request is to sue in Florida (pro developer state) vs Missouri (the domiciled state).

 

[TUGBrian]

the industry isnt the least bit interested in coming down on many of these individuals...and id gander at one time or another they were owners/employees/etc of companies that were ARDA members.

It isnt until the backlash from these sorts of companies started to hit developers in the pocketbooks that the industry as a whole decided they were a bad idea and began action against them.

the timeshare industry backroom spiderweb is vast and nearly impossible to chart.

 

[chapjim]

Haven't read the entire filing but I will. A lot of familiar names and companies are listed as defendants, which supports what people have been saying here for years. It's a relative handful of actors that keep popping up with various corporate names.

One thing I noticed is there are places you could substitute PLAINTIFF for DEFENDANT and still be fairly accurate. Paragraph 8, for example.

 

[LannyPC]

It isnt until the backlash from these sorts of companies started to hit developers in the pocketbooks that the industry as a whole decided they were a bad idea and began action against them.

Is it the developers who get hit when these "cancellation" companies get their way or is it the resorts and their Homeowners' Associations? I know that here on TUG, we've been helping people to see that there is a big difference between these entities.

If the cancellation companies succeed in somehow getting the intervals out of the hands of the owners and back to the resort, the developer does not have to pay the MFs. The developer has long since sold the interval. The resort's HOA has to pay the MFs until a new owner can be found.

 

[tomt73]

Is it the developers who get hit when these "cancellation" companies get their way or is it the resorts and their Homeowners' Associations? I know that here on TUG, we've been helping people to see that there is a big difference between these entities.

If the cancellation companies succeed in somehow getting the intervals out of the hands of the owners and back to the resort, the developer does not have to pay the MFs. The developer has long since sold the interval. The resort's HOA has to pay the MFs until a new owner can be found.

In Wyndham's case, the company owns the properties, and continues to own them even after they sell timeshare points to the public with these as their "home resorts". When the cancellation companies succeed in acquiring the owner's interest and "cancelling" it, it's Wyndham which is out the maintenance fees. It's their pocketbook, and they want it full of your money.

 

[lacofd]

If Wyndham and all the rest would create an Exit Plan for members that didn't punish them, they would eliminate the companies without any court needed.

 

[dandjane1]

If Wyndham and all the rest would create an Exit Plan for members that didn't punish them, they would eliminate the companies without any court needed.

One such plan, albeit not greatly helpful, (20% of what was paid for original Developer points) already exists - the so-called "Pathway" program, which was promptly not renewed after a year or so, back in 2013.

 

[Jan M.]

One such plan, albeit not greatly helpful, (20% of what was paid for original Developer points) already exists - the so-called "Pathway" program, which was promptly not renewed after a year or so, back in 2013.

What many people didn't realize about the Pathways program is that Wyndham reserved the right to only take back what they wanted to take back. There was no guarantee that they would take back anything or all that you owned when you spent the big bucks to be able to get Pathways.

 

[Jayham78]

Every developer has some sort of program that they use to deed back inventory. They are now giving these programs names and they are telling the public that these programs are new and that they have done this to help their owners. Not true. They have been working with many of these companies for years. Originally they would only take the inventory back that they wanted and these companies would dump the rest into viking ship companies. After a few years these viking ship companies went backrupt and hurt both owners and developers. What happened was years went by with no maintenance fees paid to the developers for those that went into the viking ship companies and after bankruptcy, those companies were not liable for the back maintenance fees, the original owners were.
So developers went to their politicians and had these practices deemed illegal and had them stopped. Good for owners and developers. Not all the cancelation companies practiced this type of business and therefore the developers kept doing business with them and taking inventory back. They did, however, negotiate that the developers would take back the deeds they had no interest in and the agreement was that the cancelation companies would now pay a small fee to the developers for taking all their inventory. The Cancellation companies then took a page out of the developers play book and passed this fee down to the owners unfortunately.
In 2017 things changed and some developers started buying inventory from these companies. But I'll save that for another day.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

 

[ecwinch]

This sums it up nicely if you dance with these guys:

What these companies frequently do is fail to disclose to the consumers that they will, in fact, do very little, if anything, for the consumer and frequently force the consumer’s timeshare interest into default and eventually foreclosure, after which the TPE claims that it helped the consumer “exit” their timeshare contract. Frequently, the consumer is not aware that their timeshare interest was actually foreclosed and their credit rating adversely impacted. In sum, consumers are persuaded to pay TPEs for illusory services.

First they get swindled by Wyndham, then they get robbed trying to exit.

 

[DrQ]

Principal Transfer Group seems to be out of the same office as Mutual Release Corporation according to the BBB site. It seems that Mutual Release Corporation is being sued by Diamond Resorts in Missouri Western Court. That suite started in February of this year. The Cause of Action: Civil Action to Protect Trade Secrets

It's time to declare Chapter 7 and move on.

 

[peaceandquiet]

Some pretty thorough research, and a lot of interconnections. It's too bad the industry can't keep these guys at bay by their actions, rather than lawsuits. These cancellation guys wouldn't have a market if the industry was responsive to changing customer circumstances. Timeshares shouldn't be perpetual. Notice the request is to sue in Florida (pro developer state) vs Missouri (the domiciled state).

I read the complaint and they did a big spiel pointing out what errors and misdeeds the timeshare exit companies do. However I could personally write a BOOK on what Wyndham and other timeshare companies say and do to hood wink innocent people into buying these nearly worthless contracts. The FCC got involved with Amway making them disclose how little money the reps made on average. I think the FCC should force the timeshare salesmen to DISCLOSE how expensive it is to trade your points and weeks on the RCI and II systems. If they had to sit and tell people it will cost about $250 for a guest to use your week with RCI I bet NOBODY would be hood winked into thinking they can trade it and jet set around the glove. OR WORSE disclose how many people get turned AWAY from a coveted holiday week such as Christmas, New Years, July 4th, etc... They also need to disclose how few two bedroom units are on the trade market and how many one bedroom sleeps 4 are on the market. So much fine print. Wyndham nickles and dimes at every corner. This is laughable!

 

[Fredflintstone]

If timeshares worked the same way as regular real estate law, we would not see owners walking away, timeshare exit companies profiting from owner desperation and law suits springing up.

Instead of attempting to get a hooked in prospect to sign binding, heavily sided papers at the presentation, any legal documents would exchange between buyer and seller lawyers. The buyers lawyer would clearly outline all terms and notarized upon completion. Buyers can back out at anytime by not signing. This protects everyone and makes any allegation of fraud, misrepresentation moot. Also, the signed papers make it clear that timeshare values typically drop like a rock after retail, owners are locked in to rising maintenance fees and possible special assessments and owners are responsible for resales if they want out. Resale’s should work the exact same way.

This way, everyone goes in with their eyes wide open and no chance of feeling scammed. This also strengthens timeshare companies contract position since they rely so heavily on that signed contract.

 

[TUGBrian]

and thats the fascinating part...timeshares ARE considered real estate in every US state!