Wyndham programs - confused

[artofm]

EDIT: I just found the Wyndham information thread, am reviewing it now.

I'm seeing a lot of different labels attached to Wyndham programs - "Access", "VIP", "Points", names of various locations, etc.

Can anyone provide a reference to help me understand the differences in all these Wyndham offerings, and the relative rights/priveleges/costs etc of each?

I'm interested in long-term, multiple stays every year - maybe 75-100%.

I have heard of "Last Call", which seems like it can get me a lot of time at some locations at a cost that may or may not be less than the cost of points.

Also, wondering if it makes sense to buy multiple smaller programs or to buy a smaller program and upgrade it, or better to get the highest-value program I can find (on secondary market of course)

 

[obiomach]

I learned that wyndham select is if you have a deed contract to a resort.
Wyndham access is points not tied to any specific resort, as a result s has high monthly maintenance fees that is the average of all the resorts in the system.
Wyndham Prefered or maybe premium is based on west coast resorts.

VIP levels are based on the point levels you have

https://clubwyndham.wyndhamdestinations.com/us/en/club-benefits/vip-by-wyndham

 

[RENTER]

Access is where you own points at many different resorts and the maintenance fees are averaged out. You have priority booking at these resorts over those who own at resorts not in the program. Those who own a specific resort has priority at that resort.

Access has average to above average maintenance fees per 1000. Whereas if you have a specific resort their maintenance fees may be lower or higher then access. Someone can correct me on this but I thought access maintenance fees were around 6.70 per 1000 while specific resorts can range from 5.00 to 8.00 per 1000.

VIP is the most expensive purchase and the most controversial. With VIP you have to buy from Wyndham and you get certain benefits depending on the VIP level you are. Such as getting discounts if you book within 60 days that can range up to 60 percent and later checkouts.

VIP can cost you tens of thousands of dollars where if you bought resale on E bay it would cost you less then a couple hundreds of dollars. Those who believe resale is the only way are not wrong, but some are able to make VIP work for them despite spending all that money.

Points is different than weeks. You have so many points during a calendar year. Each resort has a different point chart and the number of points needed for a reservation depends on the season and if it is a weekend or weekday.

154,000 points will generally buy you a 2 bedroom for a week at a resort. But if you use weekdays or just weekends, you can stretch it.

But with points, you have to be flexible because you have to compete with others and what you want may not be available which is why the priority period to book is important. If you have priority at that resort, you can book 13 months out where as other owners have to wait until 10 months out.

 

[artofm]

Access is where you own points at many different resorts and the maintenance fees are averaged out. You have priority booking at these resorts over those who own at resorts not in the program. Those who own a specific resort has priority at that resort.

Access has average to above average maintenance fees per 1000. Whereas if you have a specific resort their maintenance fees may be lower or higher then access. Someone can correct me on this but I thought access maintenance fees were around 6.70 per 1000 while specific resorts can range from 5.00 to 8.00 per 1000.

VIP is the most expensive purchase and the most controversial. With VIP you have to buy from Wyndham and you get certain benefits depending on the VIP level you are. Such as getting discounts if you book within 60 days that can range up to 60 percent and later checkouts.

VIP can cost you tens of thousands of dollars where if you bought resale on E bay it would cost you less then a couple hundreds of dollars. Those who believe resale is the only way are not wrong, but some are able to make VIP work for them despite spending all that money.

Points is different than weeks. You have so many points during a calendar year. Each resort has a different point chart and the number of points needed for a reservation depends on the season and if it is a weekend or weekday.

154,000 points will generally buy you a 2 bedroom for a week at a resort. But if you use weekdays or just weekends, you can stretch it.

But with points, you have to be flexible because you have to compete with others and what you want may not be available which is why the priority period to book is important. If you have priority at that resort, you can book 13 months out where as other owners have to wait until 10 months out.

Okay, that's a great summary - really helpful, thanks.
If I bought wyndham at a particular location, it sounds like I can still use my points elsewhere, but without priority.

I am considering very heavy usage - possibly as much as 52 weeks a year. I understood from the developer that I would get "unlimited last call" benefits, which I was planning to combine with points usages to get more value from the system.

One thing I'm unsure about is whether some of the features/benefits (such as unlimited last call) would be lost if I purchase it on resale.

If the discounts are very steep, it seems like VIP might be worth the higher fees in order to get huge discounts over the course of a full year.

 

[RENTER]

Okay, that's a great summary - really helpful, thanks.
If I bought wyndham at a particular location, it sounds like I can still use my points elsewhere, but without priority.

I am considering very heavy usage - possibly as much as 52 weeks a year. I understood from the developer that I would get "unlimited last call" benefits, which I was planning to combine with points usages to get more value from the system.

One thing I'm unsure about is whether some of the features/benefits (such as unlimited last call) would be lost if I purchase it on resale.

If the discounts are very steep, it seems like VIP might be worth the higher fees in order to get huge discounts over the course of a full year.

Correct, you have to wait 10 months to book at a resort you do not own at or have access to.

As for last call on resale. I do not know because I always had RCI because I had bought retail and then resale. RCI was included. So, I never thought of it. Someone who has bought resale could help you with that.

As for if the VIP discounts are worth it. for me it is because I do not treat this as a vacation trip but as a second home. I also travel a lot for business. So, I am using it all the time. For me I was able to make VIP worth it because of those discounts. I had extra points because of them so I was able to rent out what I did not need to cover my loan and maintenance fees.

The question is can anyone today do what I did with the change in the rules. No one knows because no one knows the rules.

 

[artofm]

I do not treat this as a vacation trip but as a second home

This is my plan as well - second home or maybe even primary home.
If you were going to choose an aftermarket product today, what would you buy as your "main" product?

 

[paxsarah]

VIP levels are based on the point levels you have
https://clubwyndham.wyndhamdestinations.com/us/en/club-benefits/vip-by-wyndham

VIP levels are based on the number of VIP-eligible point levels you have - purchased from Wyndham, or transferred from an immediate relative who purchased from Wyndham, or a PIC contract (enrolled via a purchase from Wyndham).

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Someone

CWA is currently $7.65/1,000, which is probably the reason they are nearly worthless and can be purchased on eBay for less than closing costs.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Okay, that's a great summary - really helpful, thanks.
If I bought wyndham at a particular location, it sounds like I can still use my points elsewhere, but without priority.

I am considering very heavy usage - possibly as much as 52 weeks a year. I understood from the developer that I would get "unlimited last call" benefits, which I was planning to combine with points usages to get more value from the system.

One thing I'm unsure about is whether some of the features/benefits (such as unlimited last call) would be lost if I purchase it on resale.

If the discounts are very steep, it seems like VIP might be worth the higher fees in order to get huge discounts over the course of a full year.

Last call is through RCI. You get the same RCI access as resale owner. The cost of purchasing enough developer points to stay 52 weeks in a year (even taking into account your ability to get lots of last call and extra vacations inventory) would be insanely expensive. Millions of dollars. Buying enough direct to get to the highest level of VIP and the rest resale would obviously be the way to go there. I still think it would be tough to make that math work and your break even point would be pretty far off, but I guess it’s theoretically possible. If you want to do that you should look into Wyndham’s program where you get to pay to convert a timeshare into direct points for less than a direct purchase. I forget the name of it, I”m sure others will jump on here to explain it.

Also telesales will negotiate a cheaper developer price with you than buying at a resort.

If you’re looking to try to “retire” into a timeshare I probably wouldn’t limit yourself to just Wyndham. I’d be looking at buying resale into multiple systems so you access to both RCI & Interval International. Maybe some good trader Marriott resale weeks for II.

 

[artofm]

CWA is currently $7.65/1,000

Is this Club Wyndham Asia - that was going to be by next question.
After several more hours of research, I finally realized that it is a completely separate system.

Not having any access to RCI is so limiting - I'm having to basically guess at what is possible or not possible through that system.

I did run across information about the interval systems last night - like all the other information on the Wyndham sites, the articles are vague and rife with terminology and concepts that can only be understood by someone who is already very familar with their systems - and then end with an instruction to contact a sales team.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Is this Club Wyndham Asia - that was going to be by next question.
After several more hours of research, I finally realized that it is a completely separate system.

Not having any access to RCI is so limiting - I'm having to basically guess at what is possible or not possible through that system.

I did run across information about the interval systems last night - like all the other information on the Wyndham sites, the articles are vague and rife with terminology and concepts that can only be understood by someone who is already very familar with their systems - and then end with an instruction to contact a sales team.

Club Wyndham Access. It is the trust system where you get Advance Reservation Priority at every resort (based on the amount of points that the trust owns in that resort). It's generally not worth the high maintenance fees since you don't need Advance Reservation Priority most of the time at most resorts for the most common room types.

My advice to you is to start small and make sure you like the system before going full bore and purchasing something for hundreds of thousands of dollars. You could purchase a low maintenance cost points contract on ebay for a few hundred dollars. That'll give you access to RCI for free, and you can see if you like it. I think you're probably going to find that last call and extra vacations through RCI is more limited than you realize, unless you're exclusively looking for Orlando and Vegas.

 

[dioxide45]

I believe Club Wyndham Prefer is the collections that make up the former Shell properties. I understand there are two of them. West and Hawaii.

 

[artofm]

With VIP you have to buy from Wyndham

I found the cause of my confusion - on the TUG listing, there are several "Wyndham VIP" listings, but I checked with the lister and she told me that those are actual CWA listings, but the TUG marketplace doesn't have a category for Access, so she lists them under VIP

 

[RENTER]

I found the cause of my confusion - on the TUG listing, there are several "Wyndham VIP" listings, but I checked with the lister and she told me that those are actual CWA listings, but the TUG marketplace doesn't have a category for Access, so she lists them under VIP

Just remember if you buy resale, the VIP benefits do not transfer to you. Also, if you are already VIP, the resale points no longer get the VIP benefits. They used to but no longer. paxsarah pointed out the exception is if you bought them from an immediate family member

 

[artofm]

Just remember if you buy resale, the VIP benefits do not transfer to you. Also, if you are already VIP, the resale points no longer get the VIP benefits. They used to but no longer. paxsarah pointed out the exception is if you bought them from an immediate family member

Lol, this was exactly the confusion I was having. I asked this exact question to the lister (Express Closings) - how could this be "VIP" on a resale contract?
She responded that they are actually Access listings.

Should we propose a change to the Admins to change the name of the this resort name from "VIP" to "Access"?

 

[RENTER]

Lol, this was exactly the confusion I was having. I asked this exact question to the lister (Express Closings) - how could this be "VIP" on a resale contract?
She responded that they are actually Access listings.

Should we propose a change to the Admins to change the name of the this resort name from "VIP" to "Access"?

yes because that is false advertising

 

[ncaahockeyfan]

Did Club Wyndham Plus deeded ownerships become Club Wyndham Select after they made the most recent (I think) changes?

 

[Sandy VDH]

Did Club Wyndham Plus deeded ownerships become Club Wyndham Select after they made the most recent (I think) changes?

It has been Select since they introduced Access. Select is owning a specific resort, that is deeded. Access is owning from a points pool at NO specific resorts. Many different resorts have inventory in CWA, so your Advanced Reservation Priority ( ARP)is <13 to >10 months prior) has access to any of that pool of inventory at all CWA locations inventory. ARP for Select is access to your specific resort. Some contracts have a reciprocal ARP (RARP) at other resorts, depending on your contract. RARP is <11 months but >10 months.

At 10 months both pools of inventory merge into a single general inventory pool which is at SRP (Standard Reservation Priority).

Borrowing and Renting of additional points are permitted during ERP (Express Reservation Priority) which begins at 3 months out.

If you have VIP based on level discounts start at 2 months for Platinum, 45 days for gold, and 1 month for silver. VIP can only be obtained when buying from the Developer.

Presidential Reserve (PR) has a slightly different pool of inventory, and different rules when it goes into the general pool.

 

[dioxide45]

It has been Select since they introduced Access.

So why is the forum name "Club Wyndham Plus". What is Club Wyndham Plus?

 

[Sandy VDH]

So why is the forum name "Club Wyndham Plus". What is Club Wyndham Plus?

Because everything together, Select, Access, PR which is all points based is CW Plus.

You can own Club Wyndham deeded ONLY not converted to points, you are just CW.

 

[pauljeffrey10]

Whether you choose to but Wyndham developer points, at their high cost, or resale points at a fraction of the cost depends a lot on where you want to go and when, and how long ahead you want to decide where to go.
I own Wyndham developer points (Platinum status) because we like to go to the best resorts at high season. St. Thomas, or Florida beachfront in April, Park City of Steamboat Springs in March to ski. Vermont in January/February to ski, and the Caribbean in November and early December. Most of those locations will sell out completely to those who own Select at that resort, or own CWA in the 13 or 11 month window. Resale may not get you access to those resorts.
That said, I have seen resale deeded (Select) contracts at Clearwater Beach sell for $2,500 that would cost $50,000 at Wyndham price. And that resort is really hard to book. If you want to spend a month at Clearwater, for example, that is one way to do it.

I should mention that you don't need to be part of Wyndham at all. For I just bought a separate timeshare week at Wyndham Limetree in St. Thomas for $1.00. That will not even be part of my Wyndham inventory.
We just really like that resort and now I can get the 1st week in the new unit I own and a 2nd week at the same resort using my Wyndham timeshare CWA points.
That may be your best approach if you want to spend 75% of your time away.
Just realize that most nice resorts will cost you about $1200 - $2000 pr week in maintenance fees after you purchase the units.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Resale may not get you access to those resorts.

What do you mean by this? Resale has the exact same access to those resorts as developer. You can purchase resale CWA, or you can purchase resale at those resorts for home resort priority, the same as you can with developer points. Club Wyndham Access is basically free right now on eBay.

 

[bnoble]

VIP accounts have a set number of reservations that can be made at 11 months each year, but only at the subset of resorts with UDI inventory. This is called RARP in the VIP benefits list.

This is less helpful than it sounds because the truly in-demand inventory is taken earlier in the ARP period and major holidays are blacked out, as is summer in Myrtle. There are very few units that can’t be had at ten months but can in RARP. It can give one a little extra peace of mind, but you pay a VERY high price for it.

There is also some oddness with how VIP accesses Margaritaville inventory but again that’s at the margins.

So while it is technically true that VIP accounts have more access, in practice points are points for nearly all cases.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Right now you can get Bonnet Creek for about any dates you want. I will be booking at 60 days out for our trip, but until we are in that range, you are pretty certain to get anything you want, even the bigger units and even for Christmas season. 8 months out is all you need.

I am booking something in two days that I am going to get at a substantial discount because there are multiple units available, and that discount will come in handy.