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WYN Account Reconciliation - lost almost all 2019 points?

MattD

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I bought about 7 million points in 12 contracts (all resale). Today when I logged onto my account I find 4 point transactions taking almost all the points out of my first use year (July to June). On the website it calls it "Account Reconciliation". This is for contracts that came into my account between July and September after taking 4 months or so to transfer. Three of the transactions match contract sizes I bought but one is like 4.8 million which must be several contracts. I need guidance because of course no one at Wyndham can talk to me about it, yet they have no problem charging me for the points I don't have.

I called Wyndham, who bounced me around, and they say "It must be that the previous owner used the points" - WHAT? Must be? "Yes we can not verify but the people that do those things are always right. We can do an audit which would take a few months but its probably just that the old owner used them."

How can they put points in your account after months of contract processing and then months later take those points out. Maybe 1 seller took advantage of me but we are talking 12 sellers - I don't believe all of them emptied their accounts before the transfer happened.

Any guidance appreciated. TIA
 

55plus

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Seven million point? Wyndham may consider you a possible/future mega renter. it's like they cut your legs off before you could stand if that's the case.
 

T-Dot-Traveller

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I bought about 7 million points in 12 contracts (all resale). Today when I logged onto my account I find 4 point transactions taking almost all the points out of my first use year (July to June). ....I need guidance because of course no one at Wyndham can talk to me about it, yet they have no problem charging me for the points I don't have......
I called Wyndham, who bounced me around, and they say "It must be that the previous owner used the points" - WHAT? Must be? "Yes we can not verify but the people that do those things are always right. We can do an audit which would take a few months .....

Any guidance appreciated. TIA
Welcome to TUG & your first thread.
There are a number of threads that may assist you . One very long one started in August 2016 - when Wyndham suspended some owners accounts to do reconciliations .

I believe there is an owner care dept that may be useful to contact . Just speaking to customer service is not going to give you answers .

I am not a Wyndham owner / but someone who is may be able to direct you .
They may do it on the forum or via “conversations “ ( private messages - that go to your TUG user name.)

Good luck .
 
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Did you call Title services? If not, I'd suggest you try that dept. Title services should be able to help answer the "previous owner usage" question.
 

dgalati

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I bought about 7 million points in 12 contracts (all resale). Today when I logged onto my account I find 4 point transactions taking almost all the points out of my first use year (July to June). On the website it calls it "Account Reconciliation". This is for contracts that came into my account between July and September after taking 4 months or so to transfer. Three of the transactions match contract sizes I bought but one is like 4.8 million which must be several contracts. I need guidance because of course no one at Wyndham can talk to me about it, yet they have no problem charging me for the points I don't have.

I called Wyndham, who bounced me around, and they say "It must be that the previous owner used the points" - WHAT? Must be? "Yes we can not verify but the people that do those things are always right. We can do an audit which would take a few months but its probably just that the old owner used them."

How can they put points in your account after months of contract processing and then months later take those points out. Maybe 1 seller took advantage of me but we are talking 12 sellers - I don't believe all of them emptied their accounts before the transfer happened.

Any guidance appreciated. TIA
I have been told by Wyndham all points transfer on a sale even if old owner used points. My account is negative points for this reason. Sold 4 contracts after using all points resulting in a negative balance.
 

MattD

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Welcome to TUG & your first thread.
There are a number of threads that may assist you . One very long one started in August 2016 - when Wyndham suspended some owners accounts to do reconciliations .

I believe there is an owner care dept that may be useful to contact . Just speaking to customer service is not going to give you answers .

I am not a Wyndham owner / but someone who is may be able to direct you .
They may do it on the forum or via “conversations “ ( private messages - that go to your TUG user name.)

Good luck .
I did get to owner care - they are the one that said they could maybe do an audit that would take months. I'm going to try title services on Monday.
 

MattD

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I have been told by Wyndham all points transfer on a sale even if old owner used points. My account is negative points for this reason. Sold 4 contracts after using all points resulting in a negative balance.
That's what I thought too.
 

bnoble

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Ever since the new "no bucket" inventory/point management system came on line, transfers have been wonky. For a while, deeds/contracts were transferring with the full allotment of points in the current UY even if they'd been used by the owner already. I would not be surprised to hear that some clever folks were taking advantage of that (I think there are a few such folks here, for example). If enough people were doing that, and Wyndham took notice, these by-hand reconciliations could be the way Wyndham has elected to solve the problem.
 

tschwa2

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I have been told by Wyndham all points transfer on a sale even if old owner used points. My account is negative points for this reason. Sold 4 contracts after using all points resulting in a negative balance.
I think now they are saying it depends when the transfer is initiated. For sure the first 6 months of the use year all the points should transfer and I think it may even be the first 9 months. I think if it is initiated in the last 3 months or so even if it happens to transfer before the end of the use year, I don't think any points transfer whether available or not.
 

Jan M.

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It sounds like they may have realigned the use year on some or all of your contracts so they all have a January 1 use year.

I would ask for the audit and copies of it. Some people have reported that mistakes were made when their use years were realigned. I personally have an issue with Wyndham doing anything that reduces the number of points an owner previously had and not automatically providing an accounting of how it was done. Just that they did it.
 

dgalati

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I think now they are saying it depends when the transfer is initiated. For sure the first 6 months of the use year all the points should transfer and I think it may even be the first 9 months. I think if it is initiated in the last 3 months or so even if it happens to transfer before the end of the use year, I don't think any points transfer whether available or not.
More Mystery meat being served by Wyndham. Try to ask them to email details recapping phone conversations on policy changes. The reply I have always recieved is they will not. Ask them if any written policies are available that can be emailed and you will recieve the same reply.
 

MattD

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It sounds like they may have realigned the use year on some or all of your contracts so they all have a January 1 use year.

I would ask for the audit and copies of it. Some people have reported that mistakes were made when their use years were realigned. I personally have an issue with Wyndham doing anything that reduces the number of points an owner previously had and not automatically providing an accounting of how it was done. Just that they did it.
Do you think they will give copy of audit info? It’s not use year, they did that at time of transfers.
 

Jan M.

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Do you think they will give copy of audit info? It’s not use year, they did that at time of transfers.
Yes they should. Call and request one. However it sounds more like you need to ask them for a written explanation of what was done and why so you really understand. Sometimes what they tell you over the phone feels like a pat answer that is nothing more than attempt to blow you off. That isn't necessarily what they're doing but that's often how it makes people feel.
 

dgalati

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Yes they should. Call and request one. However it sounds more like you need to ask them for a written explanation of what was done and why so you really understand. Sometimes what they tell you over the phone feels like a pat answer that is nothing more than attempt to blow you off. That isn't necessarily what they're doing but that's often how it makes people feel.
Good luck getting a written response or anything discussed over the phone recapped in a email. All calls are recorded for their review and benefit only.
 

dgalati

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Ever since the new "no bucket" inventory/point management system came on line, transfers have been wonky. For a while, deeds/contracts were transferring with the full allotment of points in the current UY even if they'd been used by the owner already. I would not be surprised to hear that some clever folks were taking advantage of that (I think there are a few such folks here, for example). If enough people were doing that, and Wyndham took notice, these by-hand reconciliations could be the way Wyndham has elected to solve the problem.
Wyndham's policy on the transfer of points at a point of sale is not available in written or in a email for anyone to review. It is a work in progress that I compare to a moving target- changes are being made to prevent trading from occurring. The way Wyndham is trying to stop the few that have taken what is being given is on the sellers side when points go negative. This has defiantly changed a traders strategy. The negative balance has helped slow down the trading of deeds but with Wyndham transferring full points when none are available it also has created another opportunity for traders to take advantage of. I compare all this to how Wyndham all but eliminated a loophole called cancel and re book because of how it was being taken advantage of by many VIP members. Wyndham found mega renters were cutting into their rental business and also found out traders prevented deeds from retuning to them with Ovations. Unfortunately for the mega renters and traders Wyndham has the ability to change the rules to eliminate the competition.
 

dgalati

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Do you think they will give copy of audit info? It’s not use year, they did that at time of transfers.
Login to your account online. Click on the My ownership tab then the points tab. Scroll down and you will see all your points history including the deeds that transferred in or out, RCI exchanges plus any adjustments that were made to your account. You may find what deeds the points were taken from. Other then this no written explanation will be sent. You can call and get the run around or worse yet wait 3 months for a audit to be completed and still get the run around from another Wyndham rep. If you try to ask for a manager you will hear the same B.S. from them.
 

Zeke_62

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@dgalati What did Wyndham tell you about your negative balance? I have the same issue, I sold a contract and had used all of this years points by the time Wyndham processed the transfer. When I called they said to watch for an email where i would be required to borrow points from next year, or rent points from this year to cover the negative balance.
 

raygo123

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I bought points at National Harbor then went back with with the Kindle and said I want to rescind. They lowered the price and when I got home I noticed I had 300,000 more points than I should have. I called and told Wyndham what happened and they audied my account. And it came back and now it showed 500,000 too many I called again and they audited a third time and came back and said that it was correct. A week later 300,000 points were added and immediately deposited them to RCI FIGURING three times a charm, and if they check again well I tried and the points will not show up.i went from 490,000 to 1.2 million and 300,000 in RCI.

Sent from my Lenovo TB-X103F using Tapatalk
 

55plus

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That's called Wyndham math...
 

Sandi Bo

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It can be very shocking what Wyndham can do to your account. Often it seems like on a whim.

In your situation I think you need Owner Care. The people answering the regular lines (as helpful as they may try to be) will never be able to help you.

I recently noticed 38 transactions in my transaction history. I had no contact from Wyndham advising of an audit or forthcoming adjustment. I'm still trying to get to the bottom of it (and looking forward to the owners meeting in Austin as I'm hopeful someone there (being face to face) can help). My best guess is they were aligning contract years. But many of the contracts noted have contract numbers of zeroes and adjustments of 0. There are a couple contract numbers that are not mine (however I lost 6 months of usage on the points - moving points (for a contract that isn't mine) from July-June to Jan-Dec. There are 4 contracts that are actually mine that were adjusted as described - 2 of them duplicated (kind feels like they robbed me 6 months of usage on those twice).

Most of the transactions are coded 'Contract Adjustment'. There are a couple that are Award Expirations (of 0 points and -49 Housekeeping Credits). I have unlimited Housekeeping so for me those don't matter. But I have no idea why they would happen.

I will never understand how Wyndham is able to nilly will add or subtract points. To me they are money and should be treated as such. Things should have to balance.
 

Jan M.

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I will never understand how Wyndham is able to nilly will add or subtract points. To me they are money and should be treated as such.
I agree 100% that points are money. When points are taken and use years realigned owners are entitled to a detailed explanation and accounting that at least most people can understand. I would like to see some transparency as in the explanation of how many months you get and formula they use when they realign your use year. I'm sure they have standard guidelines and the formula they use. Why not simply tell us what it is so we can see it for ourselves rather than make us think you are doing something wrong.

When Voyager began our entire account had the use year realigned from July 1 to January 1 because we had one every other year contract. I was told that an EOY contract now has to be January 1 and ours was April 1. That meant that our whole account now had to be January 1. They did give us a one time point adjustment and it seemed about right but I couldn't tell if we broke even, lost points or made out on the deal because I hadn't taken a screenshot of our point balances when I should have. My fault. I got busy that day and forgot. When I looked the next day it was too late. They did give me the option of taking that point adjustment for the current year or one of the two future years without having to pay the $39 fee which I did appreciate.

It still ticks me off when other people say that they have multiple use years and/or EOY contracts in their account and they weren't forced to have their use year changed so everything in their account has the same use year. Wyndham was telling everyone who got their use year changed and their points realigned that with the new Voyager system that this was the way it had to be now for everyone. Yeah that didn't happen.

Ever since then it has bothered me that we didn't get an accounting of how it was done even though I didn't suspect they had made an error. At that time there were people who said there were errors made when their realignments were done. They got it reviewed and points given back. Bank statements come with a work sheet on the back so you can reconcile your checkbook to your statement. You wouldn't accept your bank taking money out of your account without an accounting and explanation. We took money/points out of your account is not an accounting nor an explanation! If your credit card company or a business sent you a bill you would expect an explanation of what the charges are for. And you wouldn't accept being given a because we say so explanation.

There will always be those people that no matter how it is explained to them they refuse to understand because all they want is the points they think they should have back. Ask anyone who has ever worked in customer service call center about having to deal with people that no matter how well you explain things to them, nothing makes a dent. They want what they want and if you aren't giving that to them they hear nothing you are telling them. But that doesn't mean they aren't entitled to the full accounting and explanation even if they don't want to understand it because it doesn't support what they want.
 
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bendadin

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It can be very shocking what Wyndham can do to your account.
I was realigned last year after speaking to someone at the owner's meeting. I had empty buckets in my account preventing me from borrowing. And my account was locked so no contracts could go in or out, developer or resale because my account was such a mess. It took about a week to get the account unlocked to make a developer purchase. I thought that they empty bucket thing was behind me but they actually are still alive and kicking. I found them in the RCI points deposit tab. Hopefully they fall away but I was pretty surprised that they were still around.

And that is nothing compared to the headache that I have now. I can't make reservations (because they are $19 each.) My discount percentage is wrong. I am not making my upgrades so they have to rebook things and goodwill the points back to me. My RCI account can't pull points now. This is rather a pain.
 

Sandi Bo

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38 transactions with this kind of this stuff :)

I can post the above because I don't think it's mine. Not my contract numbers. I don't have anything with 414100 of points. Even if it were an error and they adjusted the wrong account and then tried to give it back - they bumped them forward.

There are some transactions that do have real contract numbers and needed to be aligned (which I did not post here).

I don't think anything got prorated (but how would you know? LOL).

I firmly believe when accounts are aligned the points should be prorated. That has not happened for me except for 1 time.

My account was not aligned during the initial great alignment. I had a resale contract that was converted and had a use year of Oct-Sept. That stumped Wyndham (years ago). Said it couldn't be so (like it was my fault). Converted fixed week deeds 'HAD TO' have Jan-Dec use years - but mine did not. It stopped them from adjusting me - they couldn't figure out how to (crazy as it sounds). A couple years later - after mulitple attempts - they did align my account. That included 1.4 developer points with April to March use year. Got adjusted to Jan to Dec. No proration because it wasn't done during a time where Wyndham was offering it. Even though they were the ones that couldn't do it. Yup - I am still whining about this.

The last resale contract I purchased did not transfer some points shown on the estoppel. It did originally transfer the full point amount for each use (current + 2). When audited they took some away. So I am pretty gun shy regarding audits. In that scenario I did not go back to the person I bought the contract from (because Wyndham really couldn't say what happened). Just told me too bad (and that if it had gone the other way I wouldn't be complaining). Gotta love Owner Care these days.

One more thing while I'm whining. All these adjustments - and they still don't have all the owners that are on my deeds on my account. That's about a 2 year old problem now (with a rush ticket or two into IT).
 

dgalati

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38 transactions with this kind of this stuff :)

I can post the above because I don't think it's mine. Not my contract numbers. I don't have anything with 414100 of points. Even if it were an error and they adjusted the wrong account and then tried to give it back - they bumped them forward.

There are some transactions that do have real contract numbers and needed to be aligned (which I did not post here).

I don't think anything got prorated (but how would you know? LOL).

I firmly believe when accounts are aligned the points should be prorated. That has not happened for me except for 1 time.
I have been told by a few on this board you lose no points on a use year alignment. LOL
My account was not aligned during the initial great alignment. I had a resale contract that was converted and had a use year of Oct-Sept. That stumped Wyndham (years ago). Said it couldn't be so (like it was my fault). Converted fixed week deeds 'HAD TO' have Jan-Dec use years - but mine did not. It stopped them from adjusting me - they couldn't figure out how to (crazy as it sounds). A couple years later - after mulitple attempts - they did align my account. That included 1.4 developer points with April to March use year. Got adjusted to Jan to Dec. No proration because it wasn't done during a time where Wyndham was offering it. Even though they were the ones that couldn't do it. Yup - I am still whining about this.

The last resale contract I purchased did not transfer some points shown on the estoppel. It did originally transfer the full point amount for each use (current + 2). When audited they took some away. So I am pretty gun shy regarding audits. In that scenario I did not go back to the person I bought the contract from (because Wyndham really couldn't say what happened). Just told me too bad (and that if it had gone the other way I wouldn't be complaining). Gotta love Owner Care these days.

One more thing while I'm whining. All these adjustments - and they still don't have all the owners that are on my deeds on my account. That's about a 2 year old problem now (with a rush ticket or two into IT).
 
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