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WKV Value?

carpie99

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One big advantage in owning the large side one bedroom platinum plus Kierland is its rentability. The large side easily rents for ~$2,350 during March; I have been hardpressed to rent the small side (the 67100 unit) for $1,400, and then only as part of a two bedroom rental.

Another advantage of the large side is if you are going to use it yourself; it is larger and nicer (obviously).

The economics of the small side are superior only if you are going to use its StarOptions every year. If you would be using it in Interval, SDO will get you the same trades for a fraction of the cost.
So I am thinking that for my specific case where I am not looking for a rental stream .... only staroptions or to use as an II trader that the 1 bedroom at Bella is the sweet spot. I just paid $395 for a 1 bedroom annual (44,000 points) ... the maintenance fees are $576. Those 44,000 points in WKV maintenance cost would be $396. Considering the upfront cost of acquisition between $3K and $5K (call it $4K) the breakeven point for the two units is 18 years. And every year I use it as a trader in II extends the breakpoint another year.

Also ... the minimal extra cost in maintenance fees ($25) versus SDO with the flexibility of the possible use of staroptions (combining with my 81,000 to go to Hawaii) makes it a winner.
 

Ken555

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So I am thinking that for my specific case where I am not looking for a rental stream .... only staroptions or to use as an II trader that the 1 bedroom at Bella is the sweet spot. I just paid $395 for a 1 bedroom annual (44,000 points) ... the maintenance fees are $576. Those 44,000 points in WKV maintenance cost would be $396. Considering the upfront cost of acquisition between $3K and $5K (call it $4K) the breakeven point for the two units is 18 years. And every year I use it as a trader in II extends the breakpoint another year.

Also ... the minimal extra cost in maintenance fees ($25) versus SDO with the flexibility of the possible use of staroptions (combining with my 81,000 to go to Hawaii) makes it a winner.
The only downside to owning in Orlando is the uncertainty in selling the unit, when you’re ready to do so. That said, Bella should be much easier to sell than others in Orlando because it has the staroptions. I think it’s a good decision, assuming 44k is sufficient for use within the network (which would not be for me).


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carpie99

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The only downside to owning in Orlando is the uncertainty in selling the unit, when you’re ready to do so. That said, Bella should be much easier to sell than others in Orlando because it has the staroptions. I think it’s a good decision, assuming 44k is sufficient for use within the network (which would not be for me).


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44,000 is enough for a 1 bedroom in Cancun which is a nice option from Charlotte
 

Ken555

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44,000 is enough for a 1 bedroom in Cancun which is a nice option from Charlotte
That there are nice options with just 44,000 is not the question. It’s not enough for my needs. I won’t go to back to Cancun, for example.

Most who buy end up needing more than they originally thought. I’m very glad I took my time and bought a 148k week rather than a smaller unit.


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carpie99

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That there are nice options with just 44,000 is not the question. It’s not enough for my needs. I won’t go to back to Cancun, for example.

Most who buy end up needing more than they originally thought. I’m very glad I took my time and bought a 148k week rather than a smaller unit.


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With the latest additions I am up 290,500
 

Ken555

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With the latest additions I am up 290,500
For some reason I thought the OP had none, so thought my first purchase experience was relevant. But never mind, let’s change focus... so if I was going to add another deed, I doubt I’d add a small 44k week since a) I would never use it in Orlando, b) I would certainly not use it in Cancun, c) it won’t go far in Hawaii, which is where I would use it, and d) I’d rather have another WKV. :)


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I am one of the lucky ones who was able to pick up at Kierland, Platinum, two-bedroom lock off for $12,000. I had “stalked” this property for quite a while and my research led me to believe that the average selling price was approximately $15,000, with a general range of $14,000 - $16,000. It is possible that the prices have come down a bit, but I think $14,000 is much more in the ballpark than $12,000. Just my two cents.
I feel like the prices have come down a bit, and I am not sure why (MF increase a few percent?) Currently on redweek there are two listings for 2 bedroom LO, platinum plus for $10,500 and $12,000
 

vacationtime1

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I feel like the prices have come down a bit, and I am not sure why (MF increase a few percent?) Currently on redweek there are two listings for 2 bedroom LO, platinum plus for $10,500 and $12,000
I saw those also. I suspect the $10.5K listing is a desperation seller; I would jump on that quick.

The $12.5K is a broker who prices to sell quickly; we have seen him multiple times in the past.

Once these are gone (and they will go fast), the listing prices will revert to where they were.
 

pacman777

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I feel like the prices have come down a bit, and I am not sure why (MF increase a few percent?) Currently on redweek there are two listings for 2 bedroom LO, platinum plus for $10,500 and $12,000
I believe the $10.5k listing is pending as I had made an offer and that was the response
 

djohn06

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Not the same as what the OP was Looking for but this is a good comparison.

I was patiently looking a for a good deal on a WKV platinum 1 bedroom (81k SO yearly) summer of 2018. By good deal I was hoping to pay 5k max. In the process of looking for an annual, I purchased an even year 81k SO for $2,250, and a small WKV 1 bedroom 67k SO platinum odd year for $2,150. I already had 2 other SVV contracts so these 2 had no impact on the $195 club fee.

So I kind of got what I wanted.
 
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djohn06

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So I am thinking that for my specific case where I am not looking for a rental stream .... only staroptions or to use as an II trader that the 1 bedroom at Bella is the sweet spot. I just paid $395 for a 1 bedroom annual (44,000 points) ... the maintenance fees are $576. Those 44,000 points in WKV maintenance cost would be $396. Considering the upfront cost of acquisition between $3K and $5K (call it $4K) the breakeven point for the two units is 18 years. And every year I use it as a trader in II extends the breakpoint another year.

Also ... the minimal extra cost in maintenance fees ($25) versus SDO with the flexibility of the possible use of staroptions (combining with my 81,000 to go to Hawaii) makes it a winner.
For those not interested in renting, this is a good strategy. I did not realize Bella had such a low maint fee on a 1 bedroom. I could buy two of them to get above 81k and that would put the maint fee at $1,152. Not bad.
 

carpie99

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For those not interested in renting, this is a good strategy. I did not realize Bella had such a low maint fee on a 1 bedroom. I could buy two of them to get above 81k and that would put the maint fee at $1,152. Not bad.
The Bella 1 bedroom is such a winner I just bought another odd and even Bella 1bed platinum for $195 each. I am not interested in waiting 18 years for the WKV to be a better option.
 

Ken555

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The Bella 1 bedroom is such a winner I just bought another odd and even Bella 1bed platinum for $195 each. I am not interested in waiting 18 years for the WKV to be a better option.
Bella deed for $195 would be a great buy.


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DavidnRobin

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18 years?
I bought WKV resale in 2007 for $10K that is now worth ~$7K (~$3K loss)

However, since 2007, I have rented for an average profit of ~$1200 per year (~$14K over 12 years).

$14,000 - $3000 = $11,000 gain
since 2007, and still have the WKV villa worth ~$7K if I were to sell (nope...).

Renting the Plat+ WKV villa has been relatively easy. In fact, currently I get contacted to rent these out from StayPC well in advance (a very smooth transaction).

This is a huge advantage of WKV over SVV-Bella. The only downside is the upfront cost.






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vacationtime1

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Our experience is similar to David's. We bought a WKV 1bd Plat+ several years ago for $7,250. We have rented it every year except one (exchanged into WKORV); our overall rental profit is >$8K.

We bought this interval to use, but renting has been so profitable -- and we have too many units anyway -- that this secondary use has been useful, to say the least. We average a 18% ROI on our $7,250 "investment".
 

carpie99

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18 years?
I bought WKV resale in 2007 for $10K that is now worth ~$7K (~$3K loss)

However, since 2007, I have rented for an average profit of ~$1200 per year (~$14K over 12 years).

$14,000 - $3000 = $11,000 gain
since 2007, and still have the WKV villa worth ~$7K if I were to sell (nope...).

Renting the Plat+ WKV villa has been relatively easy. In fact, currently I get contacted to rent these out from StayPC well in advance (a very smooth transaction).

This is a huge advantage of WKV over SVV-Bella. The only downside is the upfront cost.

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The math was only regarding the staroption/MF ratio not as a rental stream:

I just paid $395 for a Bella 1 bedroom annual (44,000 points) ... the maintenance fees are $576. Those 44,000 points in WKV maintenance cost would be $396. Considering the upfront cost of acquisition between $3K and $5K (call it $4K) the breakeven point for the two units is 18 years. And every year I use it as a trader in II extends the breakpoint another year.

For 44,000 points the SVV annual cost is $180 more expensive than what those same points would be at WKV. If it costs me $4000 to buy versus $395 then it would take me 20 years to make up that cost .... $3605/$180 = 20.03 years.

Now as a straight rental property ... I might need to consider that
 

Tucsonadventurer

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I saw those also. I suspect the $10.5K listing is a desperation seller; I would jump on that quick.

The $12.5K is a broker who prices to sell quickly; we have seen him multiple times in the past.

Once these are gone (and they will go fast), the listing prices will revert to where they were.
Once the buy backs get more aggressive prices will increase
 

DavidnRobin

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The math was only regarding the staroption/MF ratio not as a rental stream:

I just paid $395 for a Bella 1 bedroom annual (44,000 points) ... the maintenance fees are $576. Those 44,000 points in WKV maintenance cost would be $396. Considering the upfront cost of acquisition between $3K and $5K (call it $4K) the breakeven point for the two units is 18 years. And every year I use it as a trader in II extends the breakpoint another year.

For 44,000 points the SVV annual cost is $180 more expensive than what those same points would be at WKV. If it costs me $4000 to buy versus $395 then it would take me 20 years to make up that cost .... $3605/$180 = 20.03 years.

Now as a straight rental property ... I might need to consider that
I understood that part of math - but all aspects should be considered because just purchase cost recapture and MFs is an incomplete valuation (as shown by also looking at ease of renting, and rent over MFs) as these aspects are quite important. This goes to the upfront and long-term costs as well.

And it goes beyond Rentability -another important one is Location (Buy where you would want to go).
For us - WKV covers this aspect as it is an excellent resort on it’s own, and we can drive there if needed (e.g. VSN is dissolved, Renting is not feasible anymore, etc.).

Number of VOIs (SOs) also plays a roll. Not dissimilar to the value of SPs (BonVoy Points) based on the number already owned. The value of SOs is tied to the need and ability to use those SOs.

Also, disposable income plays a roll. Less disposable income would support Bella over WKV.

Certainly not a ‘One Size fits All’ scenario.

I am not saying WKV is better than Bella - just that the extrapolation out to the future years based on a single factor that has uncertainty and high potential for variability is too one-dimensional.

Adding the Rental factor substantially deceases those differences causes the cost-recapture valuation calculation to collapse (as discussed).




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dioxide45

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Bella deed for $195 would be a great buy.


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For an EOY 1BR, it is about the going price. I paid $199 (closing costs only) for a Key West 1BR EOY a few years ago off the Bargain Deals forum.
 

Ken555

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For an EOY 1BR, it is about the going price. I paid $199 (closing costs only) for a Key West 1BR EOY a few years ago off the Bargain Deals forum.
I thought he found an annual for $195. Was it EOY?


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dioxide45

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I thought he found an annual for $195. Was it EOY?


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It seems it was two EOY, for $195 each.

The Bella 1 bedroom is such a winner I just bought another odd and even Bella 1bed platinum for $195 each. I am not interested in waiting 18 years for the WKV to be a better option.
 

djohn06

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Just received acceptance on an even year Kierland 67k platinum small one bedroom for $2,400.

Sell pays all closing and transfer fees. No reimbursement on maint fees for 2019 either.

After 2 rentals I will definitely recoup the $2,400 I spent purchasing it.
 

Ken555

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Just received acceptance on an even year Kierland 67k platinum small one bedroom for $2,400.

Sell pays all closing and transfer fees. No reimbursement on maint fees for 2019 either.

After 2 rentals I will definitely recoup the $2,400 I spent purchasing it.
Great deal! Where’d you find it?


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