With All Being Equal but Corp vs Regular II account and Deposited 1 year vs 9 months Out - Trading Power Much Different.

[AlmostRetired]

Sorry if I made this confusing by giving so much detail. Bottom line -, if you have a trader week, deposit it into II as soon as possible. Even a month or two could mean the difference in trading power. .

General - At the MGC all but week 52 is platinum. Week 23 has a TDI of 130 and week 24 has a TDI of 135. The only week higher is 52 which is a platinum plus with a TDI of 150. In fairness when I reserve my week I pay attention to TDI but after that I never think about TDI, when I deposited into II, i think of nothing else but the trade. My trades are rather simple the last few years, MGO summer, Aruba summer and a warm week Feb though May by the beach. This is it. The only reason I looked into any of the details was to try and figure out the why?

Lets call this A - A 3 bedroom MGC that was reserved for week 23 for the two bedroom and week 24 for the 1 bedroom. It was deposited into an II corporate account one year out from week 24 in 2023.

Lets call this B - A 3 bedroom MGC that was reserved for week 24 for both the 2 and 1 br. It was deposited into an II account 9 months out from week 24 in 2023.

A and B have trade requests into the MGO for the summer of 2023. I own an MGO week and wanted 5 weeks in 2023 because 2023 is our 40th anniversary and I was thinking we would invite friends and family at various times instead of a party. This was the plan in concept but not sure if the plan will go as planned.

Doing an Instant Trade.
This morning when I got up, I thought it might be nice to spend our actual anniversary (april 10th) with my 2 sons and and my daughter in laws if they could get off or alone if they can't. So I took the 1 br from B (week 24) and decided to see what popped up using instant exchange. St Thomas came up only one week for April, April 29th (week 17) , which is the last week of Platinum season for St Thomas. The date wasn't our anniversary but I did the exchange.

About 2 hours later, I thought it might be nice to actually go on our anniversary so I checked to see what the 2 br (slightly lesser TDI but 2 br vs 1 br) would find in St Thomas. It found the week I wanted starting April 9th. thinking this week just came up, I tried a retrade with the 1 br, but when I did April 9th did not appear. My first thought was maybe retrade has less trading power because they already have you. I decided to try the 1 br of A , week 24 in the corporate II account). sure enough it found April 9th. It actually find about 1/2 dozen dates. BTW, the 2 br of B (week 23) saw all the same 1/2 dozen dates.

At this point I was sure it was the retrade so I called II to cancel the exchange and rebook to April 9th using the 1 br of B. After cancelling the week, the person I was working with could not see the April 9th week in the II account with the 1 br but could see it with the 1 br in the corporate account. I paid the upgrade fee and for eplus and I exchange for the week.

So in Summary
Two 1 br's reserved at the same resort for the same week 24 (same TDI) that were in different II type accounts (corporate) deposited into II 3 months apart at least 9 months from the use of the reserved week. One behaved like the 2 br's in for what i could see and one did not. So whatever algorithm is using by II and taking everything into account, the algorithm either values II account types differently (which I doubt) or gives much higher points to something deposited 12 months vs 9 months out.

Thoughts on you guess is the difference.

 

[Fasttr]

I have always read here that early deposit likely has greater bearing on trading strength than most things (even more so than higher TDI), so my gut is on the extra 3 months giving that week more juice.

 

[NiteMaire]

So whatever algorithm is using and taking everything into account, the algorithm either values II account types differently (which I doubt) or gives much higher points to something deposited 12 months vs 9 months out.

TUG conventional wisdom would lead to what you are saying. II's algorithm is a mysterious black box with an undisclosed formula/algorithm, but tuggers think it's a combination of: resort level/quality; TDI for location/area, specific resort, and deposited week; # bedrooms; kitchen type; resort ratings from traders; season, date of deposit; deposit first vs request first, original trade vs e-plus trade; and maybe a few others I've missed. Some will tell you that the # of bedrooms carries significant weight, maybe even the most weight...but none of us really know the entire algorithm.
With all things being equal except for date of deposit, it's clear that date of deposit is a factor. I also wonder if it being the "2nd" exchange with the unit came into play. I realize it wasn't e-plus, but it's been reported that retrades have slightly less power than original trade power.
135 TDI is most likely the bottom of "high" TDI IMO. It's purely opinion/speculation, but it's due to 1 or 2 documents I've seen from II where they list out # of points required for certain weeks. 135-150 TDI are lumped together (I'm sure it's not completely accurate, because I would expect a Platinum Plus (150 TDI) to pull more than Platinum with 135 TDI); I realize your situation is for weeks, not points, but I presume there's something similar with weeks. I've been able to see weeks with a 135 TDI week that I couldn't see with a 130 TDI week.

 

[AlmostRetired]

I've been able to see weeks with a 135 TDI week that I couldn't see with a 130 TDI week.

Both 1 bedroom were the same TDI of 135. One found it and more, the other didn't.

 

[10spro]

I can add another data point. I've got 3 Marriott DSV-I White weeks. For the past many years, I always wait until Oct/Nov to reserve the coveted Thanksgiving week. At 125 TDI, it's the best I can do with that season, but it means I can't deposit to II until end of the year. I ran out of traders this year, so decided to go with the best early week I could get and reserved early June at TDI 100. So far I find that it pulls exactly what my supposedly higher TDI week would. I always lock off, so my strongest trading power is only a 1BR. I'm convinced that a 2BR would pull more. but have not tested it yet. I also have personally found no difference with inventory returned between my corporate II and my personal II accounts.

 

[AlmostRetired]

I have always read here that early deposit likely has greater bearing on trading strength than most things (even more so than higher TDI), so my gut is on the extra 3 months giving that week more juice.

Your gut is right and my takeaway from all this. The nine month window still got me the original week so would have still be a great trade. Just not the one I wanted. It was a newly purchase EOY 3 bedroom with first use year 2023. After it closed I went for the highest TDI which was already at the 9 month mark. Moving forward I will go for the 12 or 13 month deposit window.

 

[GregT]

I do agree with Fasttr and suspect that the extra three months made a difference in trading power. Interesting experiment and thank you for posting this!

Best,

Greg

 

[Dean]

My understanding is that 10 months out is the cutoff when trade power starts to slowly decline, or at least it was a few years ago. In general, my investigation has led me to be slightly less enthused with the trade power of GC than others are so I'm not surprised at the difference. I'd also point out that TDI is a general and fairly static reference while actual trade power internally at II is more fluid and may vary year to year even if all parameters are the same on the customers side. That is also true on the destination side as well.

 

[AlmostRetired]

Learned two lessons -
1 - when you deposit definitely matters.
2 - When you book in April, check to see when Easter Falls within the month (April 9th). Airfares from NY to St Thomas over 1300 a ticket. If my kids want to go, I can see my wife wanting us to pay. Truthfully, 2600 for 2 not worth it when I can move trip a few weeks in either direction to get airfares are 1/2 the price. Cancelled exchange.

 

[HudsHut]

@l0410z
The date you were seeking is out there again in case you're looking for another unit.

 

[AlmostRetired]

@l0410z
The date you were seeking is out there again in case you're looking for another unit.

Thank you, I did see the units this morning. Starting on the 7 th, the flights look relatively reasonable for 2 using points. I am waiting for my wife to agree that if kids go, it is on their dime for airfare and ours for only meals. Also holding out a bit to see if April 29th comes back up again. The fares are good and I can use the 1 br with the lesser trading value.

 

[AlmostRetired]

Interesting experiment.

Greg, thank you for planting the seed of an experiment because my original intent was just documenting what happened.

I’ve had a trader since 1995 and up until this year have been tied to a school schedule so I traveled peak. We mostly trade for HHI summer (specific MGO with occasional Monarch ) which is very difficult, some summer Aruba (easy), and warmer weather Christmas, February break and Spring break. We trade exclusively Marriott and since we know the traders are only that, always (except this one time deposit them at the 12 month window I’ve adjusted my portfolio a few times since 1995 to get what I need to accomplish what I want. I went from Monarch & Non Marriott trader to Monarch x2 & 2 br EYO GC to Monarch & GO & 3 br GC to GO, 3 br GC, 3Br EOY GC. If I can find a GO at the price I am willing to pay this will likely be my last purchased until I execute my exit strategy.

I am very good at using II to get vacations they way we enjoy vacationing and adjusting my portfolio for life events of kids in college, kids careers, daughter in laws, their careers and a grand kid is part of it.

The experiment
Given the only differences with the 1 bedrooms are deposits 12 and 9 months out. I ruled out Corp and regular II account as a variable because MVCI would rather the unit not be deposited in II so I think this is neutral. I did 2 instant trades looks on Tuesday, 4 Wednesday and 4 Thursday at various times and 2 today. I have traded enough over the last 27 years to make an relatively educated guess on what difference that 3 month window made.

Conclusion
As a one bedroom into a one bedroom trade there was zero difference in the 3 months difference. They saw all the same things including a 1 br Maui Ocean mid July which has a TDI of 150. It made no difference. The big difference was that the 1 bedroom 12 month out saw many more options for 2 bedrooms than the 1 bedroom 9 months out. This is actually extremely important to me. The 1 bedroom 12 months out, 2 bedroom 12 months out and 2 bedroom 9 months out all saw the exact same traded. It made no difference . Given this, and the fact that last year (2021) I traded into the platinum MGO (2022) by using 2022 GC 1 bedroom and 2 bedroom, I am relatively confident the 2 bedroom at the 9 month window still will get me annMGO.

I decide to use the 1 bedroom 9 month window to get into ST Thomas April 29th and leave the other 3 trades to the MGO putting me in a good position to get 4 weeks into MGO (when I add my owner week).


The 3 months makes a really big difference upgrading from a 1 bedroom into a 2 bedroom platinum. 1 bedroom to 1 bedroom no difference,

 

[winger]

Sorry if I made this confusing by giving so much detail. Bottom line -, if you have a trader week, deposit it into II as soon as possible. Even a month or two could mean the difference in trading power. .

... .

A fellow exchanger here also.

I wonder if an exchange request (from OGS) were matched and you declined within that first 24 hrs of matching and the OGS resumes, if the trader's trading power is unchanged (compared to before the match) .

 

[AlmostRetired]

I booked my second 1 bedroom (the one deposited 12 months window) for Crystal Shores (2 br) for the end of June which is gold season and a TDI of 120. As a reminder my other 1 bedroom (deposited 9 window) traded for St Thomas in April during the end of Platinum season ( the one bedroom @ 12 months saw earlier platinum dates in St Thomas). I am going to stop the mini experiment. Though I don't know at one point it makes a difference, I am comfortable saying that the only difference between 12 month and 9 month deposits for a platinum 1 bedroom lock-off week at Grand Chateau is the 12 month deposit saw more trades for 2 bedrooms during platinum a higher TDI units for the same resort. Trading 1 bedroom for 1 bedroom made no difference between 9 and 12 months.

 

[AlmostRetired]

This is now a head scratcher for me. The two 2 bedrooms I have at the Grand Chateau both reserved for the same week (6-10-2023) both had trade requests for summer Grande Ocean from mid June until the end of July. Reminder, one was deposited at 12 months out and the other at 9 months. Both requests made as soon as deposited. The 9 month out deposited week just exchanged for a Grande Ocean. The 12 month out request is still outstanding. I am happy with the exchange but it makes no sense. I may actually call II tomorrow to see if they can shed light on this.

 

[AlmostRetired]

My goal was 5 summer weeks at the MGO. I got my owner week the end of June. I got 2 consecutive weeks in mid July with a 2 day overlap (so only 12 days) and a weeks in early August. I could have had a second August week but kept St Thomas instead. I am happy with my trading results, and this is all that matters but the trading system did not work the way It should have.
Recap
4 requests placed, two 2 bedroom MGC, two 1 Bedroom MGC which are from two 3 bedroom MGC booked for sane dates. one 3 bedroom deposited 12 months out, one 9 months out. All trades for MGO

Plan
4 weeks deposited into II with trade requests for last week June to end of July. This was expanded to mid August based kids work schedule.

Execution
First change to plan. Used instant exchange for 1 bedroom for platinum St Thomas for 30th anniversary. The 12 month deposited 1 bedroom showed more platinum dates than 9 months out. No surprise. Used 9 month out to book April.
First surprise - the 9 month 2 bedroom confirmed a July MGO before the 12 month trade. Called II to understand why. No one could explain it. Transferred to different people before i was told a super skilled agent pulled it manually before week actually made trading system. Took it to be true but who knows.
Second surprise - I called II to see if adding the monarch to my search to my other 1 bedroom would keep the original search date. (Answer was yes). During the call, the rep found a July week for the other 2 bedroom. I took it and asked why the 2 bedroom trade in the system did not get this week on a trade. He had no answer.
Third surprise this morning. - I was looking to do a retrade of the 1 bedroom in St Thomas looking to see if I could get a St Thomas week closer to my anniversary in April. Just for the heck of it, I decided to check HHI for summertime. 3 consecutive weeks at the MGO showed up starting the first Friday in August. My 1 bedroom trade still outstanding should have grabbed this, it did not. So I booked the first week with the outstanding 1 bedroom trade using instant exchange.

Bottom line
Of the 3 trade requests, the 2 bedroom with the lower trading power because of trade window deposit, grabbed an MGO first. Two other weeks were gotten outside of the automated trading system by either a person on the phone or an instant exchange. after 25 years of trading Marriott within II, the trading system is still a mystery on how it really works. Also, there is no one way to be successful trading in II, and it takes work, but the effort is worth it.