What is lowest maintenance fee?

[getreal]

Great idea ... but can it happen?

What do you consider to "extra items"? ...

If they don't vote them out.

Carolinian / John

Thanks for your responses.

We all know that some resorts have low MF and some do not. My belief is that the higher MF is not always justified.

John asked what I mean by "extra items". I wasn't thinking about anything specific, I was thinking of money that goes to waste when a resort is mismanaged. John mention of resorts with too low MF that fall apart is another sad form of mismanagement.

BTW I regard the allocation of reserves as a legitimate part of MF.

You both made the point that owners should elect responsible HOA boards, and it is up to the owners to check up on them and "vote them out" if need be.

I agree with both of you on this point in theory, but have either of you ever seen it happen in practice? I have never seen this, but I have seen several resorts badly mismanaged.

In most cases, owners do not question MF, so the resorts have a lot of leeway when it comes adjusting the amount to charge for MF.

After all the theory, I want to focus on something that we all can actually do. Somthing that works.

As a practical matter, I think it is very useful to compare MF between similar resorts before you buy, because it gives you a quick indication about how well the resort is managed.

I understand that this is not the only criterium, and this comparison does not eliminate the need to use common sense. And of course it goes without saying that you have to be smart and compare apples with apples. You should compare resorts that are in the same area to eliminate variation in "wages, insurance, utilities".

If you pick a place where there are many resorts (like Orlando), you'll be surprised to see how big the differences are.

 

[Carol C]

Carolinian / John

Thanks for your responses.

We all know that some resorts have low MF and some do not. My belief is that the higher MF is not always justified.

John asked what I mean by "extra items". I wasn't thinking about anything specific, I was thinking of money that goes to waste when a resort is mismanaged. John mention of resorts with too low MF that fall apart is another sad form of mismanagement.

What folks also need to be cautious of are resorts that keep raising m.f. year after year, even after a special assessment to make the reserves flush. If you dig deeper you may learn that the resort is involved in a pig-headed legal battle and lots of your $$$ is going toward their lawyer's fees. Foxrun is one such resort where maint fees went up $50 per year for a few years right after a $500 special assessment. Of course their board was involved in a foolish and ultimately pointless fight with the resort's amenities provider. Lawyers in these kinds of situations make out like bandits, and owners of weeks pay the freight. So if you're buying resale, it pays to do your due diligence to learn if the resort is involved in any lawsuits.

Just something else to think about!

 

[timeos2]

Lawsuits can destroy a resort

Carol - Good point that most buyers/owners would never think of. There are legit reasons for an Association to fight a lawsuit but the costs can easily get way over the benefit if emotions are allowed to rule. Often a well thought out compromise ends up being the best in the long run even though neither side get 100% of what they wanted (aha - the very definition of a compromise!).

There are a couple examples floating around right now of resort managements and Associations in battles where both sides are spending big money and no one is winning. I would avoid any resort that had those types of issues no matter how nice or how great the location.

 

[getreal]

Lawsuits ... thanks for warning us!

There are a couple examples floating around right now of resort managements and Associations in battles where both sides are spending big money and no one is winning. I would avoid any resort that had those types of issues no matter how nice or how great the location.

John ... You are right on the money here!

All of us would like to stay away from those resorts. Sadly, the for sale ads do not contain this information .

So please list the examples that you mention above. It will benefit all of us.

 

[Carolinian]

I would also avoid resorts which are managed by management companies which are litigation prone rather than working things out with their HOA's.
Fairfield in its situation with Bluebeards Castle, is one example of that. Watching their antics there would cure me of ever wanting to own a Fairfield managed resort.

 

[timeos2]

John ... You are right on the money here!

All of us would like to stay away from those resorts. Sadly, the for sale ads do not contain this information .

So please list the examples that you mention above. It will benefit all of us.

By no means an exhaustive list as these things are hidden from view by most resorts but here are three I know of:

- As Carolinian mentioned the current leader is Blue Beards Castle. His approach seems ot be to tar FF in general due to that fight but I would simply say stay away from that resort as it has been poison long before FF became involved and neither side is likely to give in anytime soon. It has no affect on the rest of the FF system which tends to offer great resorts and mostly reasonable fees. They are very controlling as a management group which does need to change. It has no direct bearing on your enjoyment or ownership of FF resorts.

- One that is even more troubling but gets little press is the BlueTree / Westgate battle in Orlando. Here is a case where a bully organization has tried to run over the owner controlled Association and has done costly things like forcing them out of the Clubhouse/Check in area and putting Westgate management in charge of the units they control. It is a real mess, costly and again no end in sight. No easy answers so certainly one I'd avoid.

- Someone mentioned Foxrun - I'm not too familiar with whats happening there.

I'm sure there are others but unless you somehow get wind of them it is awful easy to buy into a mess and never know it. Best to find some owners - not just the seller - and ask if anything is happening you should know before you buy. Find out if they can interact with the Association Board and if they feel they are kept up to date on what is going on at the resort. If so thats a real sign that things are going to be handled in the owners best interest.

 

[tuc]

hotwire?

We just stayed at some fairly decent Extended Stays and Homestead Suites in Orlando, for $29, through Hotwire. They were nicer than some studios we have seen at timeshares.

I'm not real familiar with hotwire.com, but
don't you have to buy without knowing which
hotel you're buying?

How many stars and which region in Orlando
do you specify to get Extended Stays or
Homestead Suites?

 

[JudyS]

I hadn't checked out this thread in a while, and missed the questions about Foxrun.

Foxrun (as well as several other timeshares) are located in a larger recreational community. The timeshares had a dispute over the amount that timeshares were being asked to contribute towards the upkeep of common areas such as pools and golf courses. My understanding was that this dispute was resolved about a year-and-a-half ago. Foxrun is not involved in any current disputes, as far as I know. (And I really think that i'd hear if they were.)

The 2006 MF at Foxrun is $440, and while that certainly isn't the lowest MF around, I feel that it's a good deal given the size of the units and the resort ‘s amenities.