• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 26 years!

    Join tens of thousands of other owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered!
  • TUG started 27 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Check out our happy birthday post here: Happy Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $15,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $14 Million dollars
  • Follow the TUG Member Banner as it travels the world on vacation with Timeshare owners! Also sign up to get the banner sent to you so you can submit a photo of your vacation with the banner to share with TUG! Banner Thread
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free! Join tens of thousands of other owners who get this every week! Latest resort reviews and the most important topics discussed by owners during the week!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    Read more Here
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Westin Vistana told me 8 to 0 months soon it will be open to all Marriott 500K owners + 250K vistana + 250K of another group

VacationForever

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
11,790
Reaction score
5,824
Points
748
Location
Somewhere Out There
Hopefully platinum/gold weeks owners in both Vistana and Marriott will hold onto their weeks and not be coerced by Marriott to convert them into Trust points. Those vistana Flex trust points quickly become worthless (or close too). And both Marriott and Vistana trust points have too high maintenance fees and too many restrictions.

As Vistana owners already know, Mandatory resorts are (and will likely continue to be) the best value and most coveted in the network
I don't consider Vistana network "most coveted". I own at both and I see them as equal. Reality of the matter is Flex Trust Point system is here to stay whether weeks owners like it or not. In the merged system, MVC can as easily set the rules that only Flex points can play in the combined system and SVN continue within its system.
 

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
31,578
Reaction score
5,356
Points
899
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Vista
Marriott's Harbour Lake
SVV - Bella
SVV - Key West
I don't consider Vistana network "most coveted". I own at both and I see them as equal. Reality of the matter is Flex Trust Point system is here to stay whether weeks owners like it or not. In the merged system, MVC can as easily set the rules that only Flex points can play in the combined system and SVN continue within its system.
I think the term "most coveted" was used in terms of resale purchases. Those are the best ones to buy if you want access to VSN.
 

VacationForever

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
11,790
Reaction score
5,824
Points
748
Location
Somewhere Out There
I think the term "most coveted" was used in terms of resale purchases. Those are the best ones to buy if you want access to VSN.
True if a resale owner wants to trade within SVN. The same applies to resale Hyatt weeks where they can continue to exchange into other Hyatt properties using the underlying points of each week.
 

vistana101

TUG Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
563
Reaction score
49
Points
238
Resorts Owned
SVV (x2)
Still boggles my mind that these salespeople think a fifth-grade level drawing will entice customers to buy (and believe in) a product. If it was official, they'd have a nicely designed piece of marketing collateral from MVC corporate.
 

CPNY

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
4,369
Reaction score
2,155
Points
299
Resorts Owned
Harborside Resort at Atlantis
SVV - Key West
SVV - Bella
Regal Vista at Massanutten
I know vistana owners have priority 12 - 8 months, but I was told last year it was different inventory than Marriott, now I am told that within the 8 - 0 months reservation window Marriott will allow 500K Marriott owners to book along side the 250K vistana owners + another 250K of other groups. If you think it was hard to book before, soon it will be impossible to book anything when their is 1,000,000 people in the same booking pool. Good luck
the groups include
The 1,000,000 included in the group will be
MVC
WVC
SVC
TRC
VC
I just did the owners update today and this is what I was told by the salesperson, and confirmed it with the manager because I could not believe what they told me.View attachment 30878
This is almost as bad as the guy a while back “who saw a word document” during his presentation. I just did a sales presentation in my house 5 min ago and this is what I got...... shall we compare notes?

Mine is a bit more colorful and has more circles, not to mention the T’s so, I’d probably trust mine

BD4B30C2-4379-466B-9DFF-B14E1CB13179.jpeg
 
Last edited:

vistana101

TUG Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
563
Reaction score
49
Points
238
Resorts Owned
SVV (x2)
This is almost as bad as the guy a while back “who saw a word document” during his presentation. I just did a sales presentation and this is what I got...... shall we compare notes?

Mine is a bit more colorful and has more circles, not to mention the T’s so, I’d probably trust mine
Oh my...I do not understand how management lets these drawings fly
 

CPNY

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
4,369
Reaction score
2,155
Points
299
Resorts Owned
Harborside Resort at Atlantis
SVV - Key West
SVV - Bella
Regal Vista at Massanutten

blondietink

Guest
Joined
Jun 6, 2009
Messages
869
Reaction score
110
Points
203
Location
Western NYS
This is almost as bad as the guy a while back “who saw a word document” during his presentation. I just did a sales presentation in my house 5 min ago and this is what I got...... shall we compare notes?

Mine is a bit more colorful and has more circles, not to mention the T’s so, I’d probably trust mine

View attachment 31089
Only MVC owners can book anything! That is truly laughable, in my opinion.
 

CPNY

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
4,369
Reaction score
2,155
Points
299
Resorts Owned
Harborside Resort at Atlantis
SVV - Key West
SVV - Bella
Regal Vista at Massanutten
Only MVC owners can book anything! That is truly laughable, in my opinion.
That lie has been told by many sales reps according to people reporting back here, it is laughable. Although, some current MVC owners actually believe it so I’m not sure which is more laughable.
 

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
31,578
Reaction score
5,356
Points
899
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Vista
Marriott's Harbour Lake
SVV - Bella
SVV - Key West
This is almost as bad as the guy a while back “who saw a word document” during his presentation. I just did a sales presentation in my house 5 min ago and this is what I got...... shall we compare notes?

Mine is a bit more colorful and has more circles, not to mention the T’s so, I’d probably trust mine

View attachment 31089
Did you draw this upside down?
 

gtneher

TUG Member
Joined
Nov 19, 2012
Messages
6
Reaction score
0
Points
111
Location
Northville, MI
Well if a sales person and his manager confirmed it, then it must be true. Did he say how long until this happens and if that means that Vistana owners will start being able to book Marriott vacation clubs which would lessen the demand for some of the Westin/sheratons?
I was told the same thing at Vistana Villages 3 weeks ago and he told me we would NOT have access to Marriott properties. This was for resale owners of which I am one. So what recourse is there. It is worthless then. In addition he said there is no longer any chance to buy in( which I would not do anyway).
 

tschwa2

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2008
Messages
12,517
Reaction score
2,101
Points
548
Location
Maryland
Resorts Owned
A few in S and VA, a single resort in NC, MD, PA, and UT, plus Jamaica and the Bahamas
I was told the same thing at Vistana Villages 3 weeks ago and he told me we would NOT have access to Marriott properties. This was for resale owners of which I am one. So what recourse is there. It is worthless then. In addition he said there is no longer any chance to buy in( which I would not do anyway).
You will do what you always did. Use or exchange through Interval.
 

Eric B

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2017
Messages
2,770
Reaction score
2,046
Points
299
Resorts Owned
Vacation Village, Wyndham, WorldMark, SVV, WSJ, Vidanta, Buganvilias, Captain Morgan's
My thoughts on the subject - the addition access to MVC (or any other ownership program) as a special exchange program is contemplated in the VSN Disclosure Guide for mandatory resorts on page 23 as follows:

8.4 Special Exchange Programs. Network Operator reserves the right, from time to time, to enter into special exchange relationships with any entity other than an External Exchange Company pursuant to which Network Members will have access to selected non-Network resorts and non-Network owners will have access to Network accommodations after the Home Resort Reservation Period. Any special exchange programs will be governed by reservation rules and regulations similar to those governing an External Exchange Program.

Source:


The reservation rules and regulations for external exchanges are covered starting on page 21 and don't distinguish between VOI ownership from resale purchases or developer purchases, but allow for use by any mandatory resort owner. I don't own any voluntary resorts, so don't have access to the disclosure guide for those and can't speculate as to whether a resale owner at a voluntary resort would have access to booking through a similar special exchange program, but for at least the mandatory resorts the wording seems to indicate that it is through an access to the VSN rather than otherwise, which leads me to believe that it is unlikely that a voluntary resale VOI that hasn't been converted wouldn't be able to be exchanged using a special exchange program. That's just a guess, of course.

Biggest takeaways for me are, first, that any access for non-network resort owners would not be available until after the home resort period without a change to the VSN rules. Just when access would be available and whether there would be a preference period for Vistana owners using SOs is something that we'll have to wait and see. Second, the discussion that any special exchange program would follow rules and regulations similar to those for the external exchange program (Interval) imply that it would be a week-for-week basis rather than as a points type of exchange system, though I don't think that would be a large hurdle to overcome and set up as some common currency arrangement.
 

Tucsonadventurer

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2014
Messages
1,347
Reaction score
365
Points
194
Location
Tucson
Resorts Owned
Hyatt Pinon Pointe, Hyatt Beach House, Westin Kierland
We went to a Marriott presentation and they said something would be announced in 3 to 6 months but had no specifics but we should buy something just in case .
 

CPNY

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
4,369
Reaction score
2,155
Points
299
Resorts Owned
Harborside Resort at Atlantis
SVV - Key West
SVV - Bella
Regal Vista at Massanutten
I’m going on Tuesday morning for my “update” cannot wait for this one
 

vistana101

TUG Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
563
Reaction score
49
Points
238
Resorts Owned
SVV (x2)
We went to a Marriott presentation and they said something would be announced in 3 to 6 months but had no specifics but we should buy something just in case .
Oh yes, let me drop $30,000 just in case the program changes in 6 months....who would go for that?!
 

farinc

TUG Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2009
Messages
16
Reaction score
2
Points
213
Location
Arlington, VA
does buying a time share make financial sense? Is it a good use of one’s time when planning vacations given the exhaustive amount of time that it takes when one’s time equals money? How much time do you use to find a vacation trade when not just returning to use your purchased time share? Is it frustrating for owners to see time share companies like Vistana change the rules for who can make a reservation and when the reservations can be made, ie watering down the value of the owners’ original TS purchase when it suits the company’s financial whims without consideration to the owners? Do you wish you’d never bought a TS? Trying to decide if it makes sense to buy a TS.
 

vacationtime1

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2006
Messages
4,001
Reaction score
1,463
Points
399
Location
San Francisco
Resorts Owned
WKORV-OF (Maui)
WKV x3 (Scottsdale)
does buying a time share make financial sense? Is it a good use of one’s time when planning vacations given the exhaustive amount of time that it takes when one’s time equals money? How much time do you use to find a vacation trade when not just returning to use your purchased time share? Is it frustrating for owners to see time share companies like Vistana change the rules for who can make a reservation and when the reservations can be made, ie watering down the value of the owners’ original TS purchase when it suits the company’s financial whims without consideration to the owners? Do you wish you’d never bought a TS? Trying to decide if it makes sense to buy a TS.
Timeshares can make financial sense -- IF you buy resale, actually use your unit every year, and use it to its potential. We stay in upscale oceanfront suites in Hawaii for <$200/day out of pocket -- including parking, taxes, and resort fees (but excluding capital costs). Comparable hotels or condo rentals would cost 3-4x more.

Yes, rule changes are frustrating. As are the sometimes inexplicable cost increases. One must remain educated and flexible to stay on top of things; for example, we just sold off both of our Marriott Hawaii units as MF's escalated. But no regrets about purchasing, and those vacations were excellent, too.
 

Negma

TUG Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
527
Reaction score
47
Points
238
Location
California
Resorts Owned
DVC Boardwalk WKV WMH WKORVN SVR Harborside 5* and spoiled
This topic has a lot ways to evaluate. Some use what if the money was invested, what if you booked independent vacations, etc. Here are our costs over the last 10 years. We love our timeshare travels. We PLAN. We could have saved more had we learned about resale earlier, but we didn't, so the costs are what they are. Resale would probably have saved us 70K or so. Half of our 9 purchases are resale.
I focus on the last 10 years because that was when we really owned the majority of our properties. Started in 2005, over 15 years we have spent 170K in purchases. Over the last 10 years we have spent and average of 9600 year in maintenance fees. if you take the 170/15 and the last 10 years of Maintenance fees we have spent about 20K a year for TS vacations. So I am including what our capital cost was in the figure. Take the purchase price out, and we are at $100/night. The hard part is what does this cost per vacation equal because we have done so many different vacations every year.
We arguably have 100 nights a year of stays (a two bedroom in our mind = 2 nights since it would be 2 hotel rooms for the family). So to vacationtime1 point, about 200 night over the last 10 years. Keep in mind timeshare rooms are NOT hotel rooms. This year we already have 57 nights booked in Hawaii. If you believe a hotel in Maui is roughly 400, there is $22800 just to start. This is just a basic feel. But I am retired and we would not spend 20K in retirement dollars just for Hawaii every year. We figure we have another 3-4 trips depending on COVID.
Just food for thought, I am not going to debate costs and value because that becomes a personal decision. Hope it helps.
 

amycurl

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2011
Messages
2,074
Reaction score
1,597
Points
274
Location
Greensboro, NC
I’m going on Tuesday morning for my “update” cannot wait for this one
Please tell me that you'll bring your notes and compare them!! Tell them that you should get more credit since yours has color! :D
 

amycurl

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2011
Messages
2,074
Reaction score
1,597
Points
274
Location
Greensboro, NC
does buying a time share make financial sense? Is it a good use of one’s time when planning vacations given the exhaustive amount of time that it takes when one’s time equals money? How much time do you use to find a vacation trade when not just returning to use your purchased time share? Is it frustrating for owners to see time share companies like Vistana change the rules for who can make a reservation and when the reservations can be made, ie watering down the value of the owners’ original TS purchase when it suits the company’s financial whims without consideration to the owners? Do you wish you’d never bought a TS? Trying to decide if it makes sense to buy a TS.
You've been on TUG now for over a decade....and you've chosen this thread to ask these questions? REALLY? Sure, I can see someone new starting a thread to ask these questions....but someone who has been reading and engaging with TUG should be able to answer these questions, at least for themselves, by now, I would think.
 

Henry M.

TUG Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
2,094
Reaction score
334
Points
293
Location
Austin, TX
I'm like Negma. When I started out, I didn't know about TUG and bought all my units from the developer, starting in 2002. I actually considered resale for the last one, but prices weren't that much less at the time because the resorts were almost new. Looking back, I don't miss what I spent and have memories and family time together that are worth much more to me. We probably wouldn't have taken half the trips we have if they weren't already budgeted as part of our timeshare ownership and maintenance fee payments. We've also had amazing hotel stays using hotel points. I travel a lot overseas, and hotel points provide a lot of value abroad.

I have enjoyed my timeshares for a long time, and have had good use out of them. They are not financial investments, but if used consistently, they provide vacations at much lower cost than trying to book equivalent hotel accommodations. I also find it easier to just go when I've already paid for everything than if I had to make a separate decision to spend the money every year. I realize I could use the same amount of money without the commitment to a program, but I find it useful to go ahead and make the commitment. So far I haven't been disappointed, because I have the time and resources to fully utilize what I own.
 
Top