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Westgate Park City Week 7

gsilverman

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Hello would like some help...I was offered a biannual one bedroom Deed at Westgate Park City week7 for 22k and maintenance of 850. What do you guys think? I'm a teacher so need to do Presidents week. What do you think about this deal?
 

tschwa2

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I think you should be able to get something for less and in no circumstances should you buy a Westgate unit there if it is not a fixed week and guaranteed that the fixed week would transfer to anyone you sell it to.

Westgate has it in the original offering document for this resort that floating resale owners can only book in there float period at 60 days or less. It might be 90 days or less but either way high demand weeks would not be available for resale owners and the resale value would be $0 even for the platinum time period.
 

Passepartout

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I think $22k for ANY timeshare is about the most I've seen a resale cost for years. And for a Wastegate, no less. It seems a little (OK, a LOT) dear to me. I'm not in the market, but would think that about $2-3K for this FIXED week would be about right, and if the fixed week doesn't transfer to a new owner, it isn't worth a plugged nickel.

A Marriott Summit Watch 2BR lockoff sold for $497.00, A Marriott Mountainside 2BR sold for $505. A Wastegate 2BR Grand got no bids at $1500. These and a lot more from the last week on eBay.

I'd negotiate towards those numbers. and it would be a 'no sale' without the guaranteed fixed week.

Jim
 

gsilverman

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But...doesn't the value go up due to it being week 7? I think $1,500 wouldn't apply for peak ski season Presidents...this is not a resale...
 
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Passepartout

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Sure, it would have more value, but there is a lot of wiggle room between $1,500, and $22,000! AND a lot of difference between Wastegate and Marriott. Looking at a few more completed auctions, I DID see a platinum season 2 BR Marriott Mountainside that actually sold for $12,500, so maybe the right number is somewhere around there, but again, that's for a Marriott AND it was for annual use.

It's your money, and you can spend it however you like, but I wouldn't give David Siegal a red cent. The ownership and management of Wastegate are without honor. Deal with them at your peril.
 
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tschwa2

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Fixed week 7 at the Marriotts probably go closer to $20-$30,000 if you can find a seller. But those are every year, those are 2 br and a better management company.

An every other year 1 br in a ski in ski out with an $850 ish MF's, I wouldn't think would be worth more than $10-$11,000. You would of course have to find an owner willing to sell for that price.

Are you looking at a resale or are you talking with Westgate? Before making any deal you would definitely need to triple check that the week remains fixed no matter what and that selling or transferring the week does not lose the fixed week status.
 

gsilverman

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I'm dealing with Westgate...not a reseller...I can't find that fixed presidents week slopeside from owners...I like the Westgate resort a ton more then the Marriott...
 

gsilverman

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I really appreciate everyone's help. So, if I can't find a reseller... And as u said a reseller about 10/11k. How much can I get the West gate sellers to drop from that 22k?
 

Passepartout

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Ahhh, a retail purchase from the developer. Judging from the resales, if you buy it, you will never be able to get anything close to that number when the time comes to sell. Wastegate strips any perks of value from resale contracts, making them worthless- this is the reason we've cautioned you to assure yourself that the fixed week stays with it. Without that, this is not worth one dollar. eBay and Redweek and TUG marketplace is full of Wastegate weeks for $1 and no bids.

All the more reason to run away as fast as you can.
 

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Amazing advice with making sure the fixed week stays! It is deeded.Thank you..thank you.Well we wanted to give it to our kids. So, assuming that we never sell, how much lower from that 22 can we get it ya think? Just want to know what number I should reasonably expect they can go to...
 

Passepartout

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Hope your kids want it (our experience here is that kids don't want them after the folks are gone, and the MF has doubled about every 7-9 years) but go for $10K. That's still $9900 too much, but you seem to see value in it.

Jim
 

gsilverman

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Thanks Jim...but I don't think I'll get 10k for presidents week slopeside..maybe from an owner....kids are being born in a year or two...so we will make it a biannual ski family trip...
 
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gsilverman

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Anyways, I would like to thank the group for giving me more reasonable numbers to work with. I now have the knowledge to walk away if not satisfied with the negotiations. Thank You.
 

tschwa2

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First of all deeded week 7 means nothing. All weeks are deeded with something. You need to get it in writing that it is a fixed week and will remain a fixed week no matter what. Doesn't matter that you don't plan on selling. Things change and you want something worth in the neighborhood of at least half of what you paid.

Next before entering into any agreement with Westgate, resale or retail, you should watch Queen of Versaille. It is available on Hulu, amazon prime, etc. This will show you the kind of person Siegel is. He 100% feels he is the only owner of Westgate and despite selling deeds, he thinks of the "owners" who bought from Westgate as insignificant annoyance who have absolutely no say in how he runs any resort. And know that even with a contract guarantee that if Westgate decides not to honor it they won't and you may be looking at legal action even to enforce what is clearly in the contract.

Next order of business. You don't by any chance have the $20,000 or so available so you don't need to finance or can pay it off within 12 months? If not you should just rent. You do not want to be financing a timeshare.

As to the best deal, if you walked away today without signing anything then that might be their best deal. You could always try offering $15,000 (which they will not accept) or $18,000 (which they probably won't accept) just to see what they will offer. Be careful. Generally if you are quibbling too much about price they will try to change you over to a floating week or a non ski week but try to make you think that you will still have no problem doing an internal exchange and getting the week you want.

You just need to be really careful. If it is truly a fixed week 7 and you think it will cost you more than $1800 to rent the same week every other year for the next 10 years and you have the money- go for it.

That's my opinion.
Tracey
 

gsilverman

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Thanks Tracey... We walked away...but they gave us a trial week presidents week for $1,000. I'm guessing they will try to get me to sign then. So, I just want to be very prepared. They tried that float nonsense... But I shot that down. So, after Presidents week I will try to negotiate again... Def won't pay 22 after reading this discussion. Thank you guys!
 

theo

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My $0.02 worth...

<snip> We walked away...but they gave us a trial week presidents week for $1,000. I'm guessing they will try to get me to sign then. So, I just want to be very prepared. They tried that float nonsense... But I shot that down. So, after Presidents week I will try to negotiate again... Def won't pay 22 after reading this discussion. Thank you guys!
My own contempt for Westgate (the sleaziest company in the entire U.S. timeshare industry, IMnsHO) frankly knows no limits. That admittedly subjective viewpoint aside however, I would respectfully suggest that you consider just renting something for your President's week vacations, rather than buying at all.

As you look closely at the numbers, please remind yourself that any developer-direct purchase (certainly including Westgate) will be worth 50 to 90% less in the resale market two minutes after you sign on the dotted line. It's not an "investment" that will gain in value over time --- quite the contrary, in fact.

Moreover, although you might currently view passing the ownership on to your children as a potential future "gift", the recipients might very well instead regard it (and its' associated ever-increasing and obligatory maintenance fees) as an unsolicited and unwelcome financial burden and obligation down the road, confining and constraining them to one single destination for their President's week vacations.
The fact that Westgate appears fond of "trying to move the goalposts around and change the rules while the game is in progress" only further devalues any and every Westgate ownership, at least IMnsHO.

The $20k+ you're considering spending would go a very long way toward annual rentals that do not tie you (...or should I say "handcuff and hog tie" you) to an association with the slimy likes of Westgate.

Just my own thoughts and personal opinion... :shrug:
 
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Passepartout

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Thanks Tracey... We walked away...but they gave us a trial week presidents week for $1,000. I'm guessing they will try to get me to sign then. So, I just want to be very prepared.
This is the right response. Walking- not the $1000 and giving them another chance at you. They didn't give you anything. They sold you a bill of goods.

We're extremely happy though, that you've found TUG and at least been inoculated against these sleazebags. If you truly have the timeshare bug, spend some more time here, reading. You will be able to truly give yourselves some great family vacations, and save a whole lot of money to share with those unborn kiddos.

Just, PLEASE, do as suggested and watch the movie "The Queen of Versailles". It will show you a life of excess from Wastegate owner Siegel and how he dupes timeshare owners into financing a lavish lifestyle for the undeserving.

Jim
 

pacodemountainside

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Check out this thread!

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=199861&highlight=David+Siegel


Do the math. Say you pay $22K including closing costs pulling the money out of a good investment yielding around 10%. You sure don't want to finance at their 16%+.

So you keep your money invested and earn around $2,000 a year. Throw in 1/2 of MF and that is $400. So, you have $2,400 every year to vacation on and your $20K will be available for kids college.

Be prepared to lose a ski day for a marathon sales pitch when you use week the gave you for $1,000.
 

pacodemountainside

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stoler527

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The Westgate in park city is a beautiful resort. We have stayed there more than once.

That being said, I would take another look at the Marriotts in the area. We have also stayed at both of them. The rooms are nice, but not as luxurious as the Westgate. Some of their weeks are fixed. I believe that you should stay in whatever resort you are considering buying before you sign anything.

Deer Valley is the place to be in Park city. Renting at the Stein Erikson Lodge would be a dream vacation. With the money that you have to spend, I personally, would settle for nothing less than deer valley.

In my opinion, the bad reputation of the Westgate will taint your association with them. You will always have to be on guard for fear they will change your ownership to devalue it.

Do a lot more research before you sign anything.
 

tschwa2

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There is also the Sunrise Lodge which is now part of the Hilton Vacation Club. It is also in the Canyons.
 

Rent_Share

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Rent and be patient, watch the postings sites

Redweek

Look for aged listings on the pay to list sites

Make low opening offers, and walk away another one will be listed soon
 
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