We did the owners update, bought another unit at WKV, and I have a question for the group.

[amundson]

We are an owner of an unauthorized week at WKV with 148,100 staroptions. We bought it on eBay and it has been great. We enjoy it and I like the trading ability of our unit and the low maintenance fees. We have pretty much visited all of the resorts except Mexico and now we just bought another week, but direct from Vistana, which I wasn't thinking we would ever do!

We were offered $200 debit cards to attend the meeting (4/12/2021). Of course my wife and I talked and said "let's go" but we told each other we would not buy anything. However, they offered us something that was very attractive.

We bought a fall unit that has 44,000 EOY staroptions for $11,600 after closing costs. When the 44000 EOY are combined with the 148,100 it makes us a 3 star elite. We are also now "authorized" because our purchase of $11,600 was over the $10k threshold, which we were told is needed to make us authorized. This purchase also came with a one time bonus of 44,000 staroptions. We also were told about a new Bonvoy AmEx card, which got us another 169,000 (hotel points) and zero interest for 15 months, so we applied for that and paid for the unit with it.

We bought a bit of a promise as we were told that Marriott Vacation Club would (in 2022) merge with Vistana. Because we are now 3-star elite and authorized we were told we would be able to trade our 148,100 yearly + 44,000 EOY points to book Marriott units, giving us more options for in more locations. That is what we really want -- not the 44,000 EOY points, but the flexibility to book at Marriott Vacation Club.

I believe that is all mostly true and I am happy with this purchase.

Now after thinking about this some more.... I believe I could now go back to the aftermarket and buy even more if I want. Maybe I can buy another 148,100 at WKV and still maintain an authorized status. Could I really do that and would that increase my elite status too?

 

[needvaca]

It's not too late to rescind if you bought on 4/12/21.
3 star Elite is almost worthless, and:
1) you paid way to much for a Gold season unit. Gold has too high a maintenance fee to staroption ratio. It can be had on the aftermarket for $1000 or less, sometimes $1.
2) if you ever want to buy more, ONLY buy resale and Platinum. You can get an annual 81,000 Platinum 1br for $9000 or less or a 67,100 Platinum 1br small for $6000 or less (many listed on Redweek).
3) No one (including sales people who lie) knows when the Marriott system will be merged with Vistana. and if it will be desirable/economical to trade for Marriott properties. You paid $11,600 for an unknown. Wait. That offer will still be there in a year or 2 after the merger actually occurs.

 

[pacman777]

“authorized”.... lol

 

[Pathways]

I believe that is all mostly true and I am happy with this purchase.

Glad you are happy, and congratulations.!

Just trying to figure out what your advantage is though.

Could I really do that and would that increase my elite status too

No. The elite status is only on Dev. sales

flexibility to book at Marriott Vacation Club

You already have this (It's called Interval)

We also were told about a new Bonvoy AmEx card,

You could have gotten this anytime - no purchase needed.

So you paid $11,600 for 3* elite. Which does what again?

 

[emeryjre]

The question how Marriott and Vistana will merge, what will be required to participate and the value of staroptions in the merger is all speculation. If you feel comfortable with your purchase, then stay with it. But if you are relying on what your told at the meeting to be a fact, then be aware that there are no facts on how the merger will work.

One other thing, there is no such thing as an "unauthorized" week. Your resale week has all the benefits of any other week. It was just a term the salesperson decided to use and has no real meaning in the Vistana world.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I don't think they can promise anything to you. If you have time to rescind, you should really think about doing that and then buy another 148,000 Mandatory resale WKV. Don't believe the hype of the sales' department. I nearly made the same mistake. I won't fall for that again. Rescind if you can, unless you feel you have money to just throw away on a salesperson's promise, and they cannot promise anything. It's his/her word against yours in the end.

 

[daviator]

I don't really disagree with the other folks here, but there is some value to bringing your ownership into the network so that you can use all the benefits available. The question is whether those benefits are worth $11,000, and only you can answer that.

If your ownership was at a different (voluntary) property where you didn't get StarOptions and could only use that one property, I'd say it was definitely worth it to "authorize" your resale ownership. But given that you own at a mandatory resort and have already been enjoying the use of SOs, the additional benefits are smaller.

The sales people have no idea when, or how, the Vistana and Marriott programs are going to merge, and they are making promises that may or may not happen. There will probably be some sort of internal exchange process between MVC and Vistana properties, but I'll bet we'll have to pay for it. I think a true merger of the programs is really unlikely, the way that the deeds are held just makes that very tough. Maybe Flex will somehow merge with Marriott's Destination Club points program but I'm skeptical that the purported merger will be as significant as they want you to think.

I agree with those who say that there will be new deals that will be equally good (or bad) when and if the purported merger actually happens. I'll wait and make decisions based on reality and not on their promises.

BTW, their sales people are really, really good at what they do. If you're having second thoughts now, don't feel badly... they are some of the best sales people I've ever encountered. Their sales training program is probably world class. Whether to rescind or not depends on how much you will miss that $11K.

 

[Ken555]

Rescind. Buy resale. Be happy. Elite is mostly worthless, IMO.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[sharr7]

I'm not any star elite but looking at the chart it always seemed like there was actually some value in 5-star elite. Bonvoy Platinum status and the ability to bank SO until the very end of the year and for free all seem like things I would want. Though I imagine the counterargument is if you're using a 5-star-elite level of SO each year you're probably already at a Platinum # of nights and would only be banking small percentage of points more for convenience than need. Curious if anyone has thoughts.

 

[DanCali]

I don't know if there is any black and white answer here. My thoughts -

1) Since this is a "mandatory" resort (you can already use staroptions to trade internally) the immediate advantage of getting the unit "authorized" (or "Retro'd") is minimal. You can now trade a 2BR timeshare for hotel points whenever you want. But how often will you do that even with the relatively generous Bonvoy points it'd get you (I think 216,000 or so)? You're better off renting the 2BR Spring Break week for cash than getting 5 nights at a Westin or Marriott hotel.

2) The EOY fall week is pretty worthless on the resale market. So you paid $11K for something with zero resale value. You'd always pay the developer more than the resale value but, if you decide to go down this road, it may actually makes more sense to pay more and get something that is still worth something on the resale market (like a Platinum Plus week) and that would also give you more Staroptions to play with. I'm not saying you should go and spend more, but people tend to ignore the upfront loss when paying for a timeshare. If you spend say $24,000(?) on something with a resale value of $6000 (say a small 1BR Spring week) vs spending $11,000 on something worth zero, your out of pocket is $13K more ($24K-$11K) but it's almost like spending only $7K more because the more expensive purchase is not worthless if you try to sell it next week. The developer's pricing doesn't account for that - for example, they might price Mission Hills Platinum and Kierland Platinum weeks the same, but Kierland has higher resale values. And if that gives you 67,000 SOs every year vs 44,000 EOY it's a big difference. I'll emphasize again - I'm not saying you should do this, but oftentimes the cheapest option they give you is not something that you can do much with.

3) The 44,000 bonus SO are worth about $1000 - you can use them for a stay somewhere

4) It does make sense that IF Marriott Vacation Club combines Vistana somehow into the Destination Club, you will be able to trade with the 148,000 SOs and that you couldn't do it if you didn't retro the unit. And if that's the case you will gain a lot of flexibility. But, as others said, nobody has a clue how it will work.

5) A similar point on the Elite status. While 3-Star Elite may be pretty useless, as other said, IF that translates to "Executive" in the Marriott system, that has some decent benefits (most notably booking 1+ nights at 13 months out and a 25% point discount for reservations 30-days prior to arrival). But nobody knows.... It could map to "Select" status, which is also pretty useless (based on the conversion ratio of 1:32 that's been discussed then "Select" seems more likely).

6) If you wanted to buy another resale week on the resale market, like you said at the end of your post, then you should definitely do that BEFORE you buy from the developer. They will allow you to "retro" multiple weeks when you buy from them (more "authorized" weeks require slightly higher purchase price $15K purchase for 2 weeks), but they have to be in your account when you make the developer purchase.

7) You said - "I believe that is all mostly true and I am happy with this purchase." That's what matters most!!

 

[DanCali]

I'm not any star elite but looking at the chart it always seemed like there was actually some value in 5-star elite. Bonvoy Platinum status and the ability to bank SO until the very end of the year and for free all seem like things I would want. Though I imagine the counterargument is if you're using a 5-star-elite level of SO each year you're probably already at a Platinum # of nights and would only be banking small percentage of points more for convenience than need. Curious if anyone has thoughts.

5-star has some decent "perks" especially the extended deadlines. It's debatable if it's worth it when you consider how much you have to spend to get there. Saving $60 here or $100 there or 10% extra Bonvoy points if converting is nice and adds up but with developer purchases people might spend over $200,000 to get that privilege. With resales and retros it can be done for substantially less but requires more effort and patience. The one thing that would be most useful is allowing cancelations without restricting SOs at 60 days or less (maybe change to 14 days or 30 days) - THAT would be very useful (and maybe make it more enticing for buyers, especially post-covid).

 

[daviator]

5) A similar point on the Elite status. While 3-Star Elite may be pretty useless, as other said, IF that translates to "Executive" in the Marriott system, that has some decent benefits (most notably booking 1+ nights at 13 months out and a 25% point discount for reservations 30-days prior to arrival). But nobody knows.... It could map to "Select" status, which is also pretty useless.

If they DO combine the programs in some way, it's likely that Elite owners will end up getting Bonvoy Platinum at a minimum (as all of the elite MVC owners already do.) Three Star Elite might even put you at a level that gets Titanium. I think there's value in that. But I would wait and see what actually happens with combining the programs, I would not buy something with the idea that you'll only be eligible for wonderful unknown benefits if you do.

 

[daviator]

5-star has some decent "perks" especially the extended deadlines. It's debatable if it's worth it when you consider how much you have to spend to get there. Saving $60 here or $100 there or 10% extra Bonvoy points if converting is nice and adds up but with developer purchases people might spend over $200,000 to get that privilege. With resales and retros it can be done for substantially less but requires more effort and patience. The one thing that would be most useful is allowing cancelations without restricting SOs at 60 days or less (maybe change to 14 days or 30 days) - THAT would be very useful (and maybe make it more enticing for buyers, especially post-covid).

The late check-out for 5 star elite is a benefit I frequently covet. But it has a disclaimer, subject to availability or something like that, so I don't know if they are always able to accommodate 5 star owners who request it.

 

[CPNY]

We are an owner of an unauthorized week at WKV with 148,100 staroptions. We bought it on eBay and it has been great. We enjoy it and I like the trading ability of our unit and the low maintenance fees. We have pretty much visited all of the resorts except Mexico and now we just bought another week, but direct from Vistana, which I wasn't thinking we would ever do!

We were offered $200 debit cards to attend the meeting (4/12/2021). Of course my wife and I talked and said "let's go" but we told each other we would not buy anything. However, they offered us something that was very attractive.

We bought a fall unit that has 44,000 EOY staroptions for $11,600 after closing costs. When the 44000 EOY are combined with the 148,100 it makes us a 3 star elite. We are also now "authorized" because our purchase of $11,600 was over the $10k threshold, which we were told is needed to make us authorized. This purchase also came with a one time bonus of 44,000 staroptions. We also were told about a new Bonvoy AmEx card, which got us another 169,000 (hotel points) and zero interest for 15 months, so we applied for that and paid for the unit with it.

We bought a bit of a promise as we were told that Marriott Vacation Club would (in 2022) merge with Vistana. Because we are now 3-star elite and authorized we were told we would be able to trade our 148,100 yearly + 44,000 EOY points to book Marriott units, giving us more options for in more locations. That is what we really want -- not the 44,000 EOY points, but the flexibility to book at Marriott Vacation Club.

I believe that is all mostly true and I am happy with this purchase.

Now after thinking about this some more.... I believe I could now go back to the aftermarket and buy even more if I want. Maybe I can buy another 148,100 at WKV and still maintain an authorized status. Could I really do that and would that increase my elite status too?

Rescind.... what a waste of 11K. Elite is useless and you’ll almost never convert the 148,100 WKV SO to bonvoy points. You overpaid for 44K flex options and the MF ratio is terrible. Buy another mandatory week resale and enjoy the 8 month booking window in the VSN when you’re not going to WKV

 

[DanCali]

If they DO combine the programs in some way, it's likely that Elite owners will end up getting Bonvoy Platinum at a minimum (as all of the elite MVC owners already do.) Three Star Elite might even put you at a level that gets Titanium. I think there's value in that. But I would wait and see what actually happens with combining the programs, I would not buy something with the idea that you'll only be eligible for wonderful unknown benefits if you do.

Titanium not going to happen with 3-star IMO.

At MVC regular owners get Gold. Select (4000-6999 points) and Executive (7000-9999 points) are Platinum. Presidential (10,000-14,999 points) and Chairman Club (15,000+ points) above are Titanium. If the ratio of 1:32 has anything to do with reality, you'd need 320,000 Staroptions (developer and/or retro) to get Titanium. I believe the 4-star cutoff is 359,000 so the ballpark for Titanium is around there if any of that logic makes sense.

But having Titanium for Life unrelated to timeshares (a status they no longer give), I wish they made it even harder to get that status via the timeshares It's turned for something "Nice" to something "nice to have". Rarely the suite upgrades that Starwood used to regularly give to Platinums 15-20 years ago, even with the suite night awards.

 

[DanCali]

Rescind.... what a waste of 11K. Elite is useless and you’ll almost never convert the 148,100 WKV SO to bonvoy points. You overpaid for 44K flex options and the MF ratio is terrible. Buy another mandatory week resale and enjoy the 8 month booking window in the VSN when you’re not going to WKV

Doesn't sound like he bought flex. It sounds like he bough a Premium 1BR Gold Plus EOY week. I think the maintenance fees on that are much lower, no?

 

[CPNY]

Doesn't sound like he bought flex. It sounds like he bough a Premium 1BR Gold Plus EOY week. I think the maintenance fees on that are much lower, no?

44K EOY for 11K is horrible and not “attractive” at all. This person needs to rescind ASAP

 

[controller1]

The late check-out for 5 star elite is a benefit I frequently covet. But it has a disclaimer, subject to availability or something like that, so I don't know if they are always able to accommodate 5 star owners who request it.

I'm 5-Star Elite (purchased prior to finding TUG). I've been able to use the early check-in and late check-out at every resort we've visited with the exception of Westin Riverfront. I attribute that to the small number of villas at WRF.

 

[vistana101]

I would say it's worth it if you plan to convert to Bonvoy points...elite lets you convert every year also which is nice if need be. Too soon to tell if it will be necessary to trade into Marriott timeshares...I wouldn't count on the salesperson's info for that, personally.

 

[critterchick]

If they DO combine the programs in some way, it's likely that Elite owners will end up getting Bonvoy Platinum at a minimum (as all of the elite MVC owners already do.) Three Star Elite might even put you at a level that gets Titanium. I think there's value in that. But I would wait and see what actually happens with combining the programs, I would not buy something with the idea that you'll only be eligible for wonderful unknown benefits if you do.

My thought is that3* and 4* owners should have become Platinum and 5* should have become Titanium when the merger occurred. Marriott have devalued the Bonvoy tiers to the point that Platinum is the old Gold (no free breakfast perk is gone, among others that I don't immediately recall) and Titanium the old Platinum.

The late check-out for 5 star elite is a benefit I frequently covet. But it has a disclaimer, subject to availability or something like that, so I don't know if they are always able to accommodate 5 star owners who request it.

We've always gotten the late checkout (have never arrived early enough for the early checkin). But we often have to explain to the front desk person that it's a Vistana benefit. They think we're asking for the Bonvoy 4:00pm. One even said, "even if you were Titanium, we couldn't give it to you." My response was, "[DS] is Titanium, but that's not what we're asking for." And here at WDW we get a card from the GM reminding us of it - I had the front desk clerk tell me no, anyway, so called the number on the card. I can be like a dog with a bone, lol. The T&C do say that "some" resorts don't participate in the perk, but are silent as to which ones.

It's always annoyed me that only one person in the household gets Platinum status - we both got Gold when we were 3* and 4*. We work around that by booking most of our stays in DH's name, making sure that his Bonvoy number is on the reservation (we call the resort in advance to get it done) and then following up after when it (usually) doesn't appear in his account. He's made Titanium for a couple of years using that system. So now I want it, too, lol.

 

[daviator]

My thought is that3* and 4* owners should have become Platinum and 5* should have become Titanium when the merger occurred. Marriott have devalued the Bonvoy tiers to the point that Platinum is the old Gold (no free breakfast perk is gone, among others that I don't immediately recall) and Titanium the old Platinum.

Yes, I completely agree. It's ridiculous that every MVC elite level gets (at least) platinum and the top couple get titanium, when only "our" top level gets Platinum. And yes, Gold is completely worthless these days. I do miss SPG...

The only saving grace is that our Vistana stays now count toward elite status, which makes it easier to earn Platinum or more based on stays. But it ought to be automatic for elite owners.