• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 26 years!

    Join tens of thousands of other owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $14,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $14 Million dollars
  • Follow the TUG Member Banner as it travels the world on vacation with Timeshare owners! Also sign up to get the banner sent to you so you can submit a photo of your vacation with the banner to share with TUG! Banner Thread
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free! Join tens of thousands of other owners who get this every week! Latest resort reviews and the most important topics discussed by owners during the week!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    Read more Here
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Warranty Deed Notarized 1.4 Yrs Ago

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
B58D9736-15A0-4A0B-AB1E-77BDD7A8628E.jpeg DF475C57-5B65-4BDB-9EA8-E9E868B51DC1.jpeg I am slightly frustrated. I bought a TS last month from Sumday.

Sumday’s partner, Greatway Services, sent me the attached Warranty Deed, mistakenly backdated and notarized as March 14, 2018. Even the notarized seal memorializing such transfer expired on January 18, 2019.

I think the buyers have either separated, or one buyer has passed away.

If these mistakes are not corrected, I do not wish to move forward with the transfer. I would call the resort to cancel the transfer.

I checked the contract. I’m not responsible for past due MF, but I haven’t received an estoppel. As a New York Bar member, I can be reprimanded or sanctioned for any improperly executed transactions, no matter how convenient for all parties involved.

Advice?
 
Last edited:

goaliedave

Guest
Joined
Jan 5, 2019
Messages
740
Reaction score
493
Points
73
Resorts Owned
vistana, diamond, shell, palace resorts
yikes. highlights the importance of using a reputable transfer company like LT Transfers. I would call LT Transfers and ask them what to do.

Sent from my SM-J327W using Tapatalk
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
As much as I love Williamsburg and all of you have praised Sumday, I’m going to back out. This ain’t worth losing my Bar license or livelihood. Just frustrated.
 

TheTimeTraveler

TUG Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Messages
3,323
Reaction score
784
Points
348
Location
Massachusetts
.

if the seller won't rectify the issue, then do withdraw from purchasing. You are not obligated to purchase UNTIL and UNLESS you receive clear, marketable title (from what you are saying it could be clouded at the current time).

Jeff Brown does have a good reputation, and my guess is that he will make good on it. MAKE HIM AWARE OF IT.

Another alternative would be to turn it over to LT Transfers (www.LTTransfers.com) and see if they'd be willing to handle it for you (it likely will cost you $250).

Wishing you the best!



.
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Thanks all. You all saved me from being a nervous wreck. Time and time again, you all have saved Ts owners from financial regret, guilt, and self-loathing.
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
I think the above advice is good. Contact Sumday and if they won’t correct it, back out.
Thanks. Appreciate the advice. Even reaffirming what others have said is helpful.
 

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
29,220
Reaction score
3,637
Points
699
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Vista
Marriott's Harbour Lake
SVV - Bella
SVV - Key West
I suspect this is a situation where they had the seller sign a blank deed and the fill in the blanks when they go to transfer. So the seller (prior owner) likely signed the deed back in March 2018. The seek probably came from a trade in or PCC and they have the seller sign the deed while they are there so they expedite the closing when they find a buyer. I am not saying it is proper or even legal, but many of the trade in and PCC companies operate this way.

The deed is already recorded, so backing out may not be easy. Un-recording a deed isn't necessarily easy or cheap, as you may know.
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
I suspect this is a situation where they had the seller sign a blank deed and the fill in the blanks when they go to transfer. So the seller (prior owner) likely signed the deed back in March 2018. The seek probably came from a trade in or PCC and they have the seller sign the deed while they are there so they expedite the closing when they find a buyer. I am not saying it is proper or even legal, but many of the trade in and PCC companies operate this way.

The deed is already recorded, so backing out may not be easy. Un-recording a deed isn't necessarily easy or cheap, as you may know.
Thanks for the insight. For anybody that isn’t a lawyer, this backdating process is probably okay with a valid plausible deniability defense.

However, this may end up haunting/ biting me in the back. I could lose my law license or job over this. So if this can’t be rectified, I’m going to have to back out.
 

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
29,220
Reaction score
3,637
Points
699
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Vista
Marriott's Harbour Lake
SVV - Bella
SVV - Key West
Thanks for the insight. For anybody that isn’t a lawyer, this backdating process is probably okay with a valid plausible deniability defense.

However, this may end up haunting/ biting me in the back. I could lose my law license or job over this. So if this can’t be rectified, I’m going to have to back out.
I guess, what I am wondering, how do you back out at this point? The deal is done, the bad deed is already recorded with the county. Perhaps you could sign a deed back over, but would that clear up the situation you are in? Perhaps a costly Quiet Title is the other way to fix it?
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
I guess, what I am wondering, how do you back out at this point? The deal is done, the bad deed is already recorded with the county. Perhaps you could sign a deed back over, but would that clear up the situation you are in? Perhaps a costly Quiet Title is the other way to fix it?
A quiet title wouldn’t be costly to me. It’d be annoying to file the quiet title lawsuit myself, mostly about ten hours.

If I wanted to, I can call the resort, tell them of the circumstances and not to accept the transfer. I could tell them: 1) I’d be willing to sign a quitclaim, or 2) let the TS foreclose. I will let them know that if I am reported to the three credit agencies, I will sue the resort.
 
Last edited:

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Crap. Even a quiet title lawsuit handled myself will cost $800 in filing fees.
 

dioxide45

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
May 20, 2006
Messages
29,220
Reaction score
3,637
Points
699
Location
NE Florida
Resorts Owned
Marriott's Grande Vista
Marriott's Harbour Lake
SVV - Bella
SVV - Key West
Would you even be able to file the quiet title yourself if the timeshare isn't located in NY? Would you need to use an attorney in the state that the property is located?
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Would you even be able to file the quiet title yourself if the timeshare isn't located in NY? Would you need to use an attorney in the state that the property is located?
Quiet title claims are done within the court of the county of the property location. Thus, the court would be in the VA county where Williamsburg is located. Luckily, it’s a rather simple procedure that I can do myself. I just have to learn how it’s done in Va. it will take me about ten hours, but other Va attorneys would take about five (5) houre.

However, traveling to VA to file the quiet title lawsuit would be annoying. If there are no objections, then I wouldn’t have to travel a second time.

I’m not sure if I can trust Sumday anymore. This is a huge red flag.
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Thanks for everyone’s advice. I’m going to call the NY Bar Ethics Hotline later this afternoon. I’d call in the morning, but I don’t want to interrupt their religious services.

I’ve cool down. I definitely would not lose my Bar license over this, but I might get publicly reprimanded and suspended for one (1) month. I will see what the NY Bar Ethics hotline will say.
 
Last edited:

missyrcrews

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2014
Messages
776
Reaction score
736
Points
203
Location
West Bath, me
Resorts Owned
Cold Spring Resort
Have you contacted Sumday yet? Seems to me that's the place to start.
 

bogey21

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
7,676
Reaction score
2,487
Points
499
Location
Fort Worth, Texas
Looks to me like Sellers signed the Deed with a blank Grantee a long time ago but Sumday wasn't able to find Buyer until OP came along when they filled in Buyer's name and recorded it. Question Number One - is there any requirement that a Deed has to be recorded within "x" days of the date on it? Question Number Two - did Sumday keep MFs current? If answer to Question Number One is "No" and answer to Question Number Two is "Yes", what is the problem...

George
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Have you contacted Sumday yet? Seems to me that's the place to start.
I contacted last night. I haven’t received a response as it’s the weekend. Maybe I will wait until Monday.
 

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Looks to me like Sellers signed the Deed with a blank Grantee a long time ago but Sumday wasn't able to find Buyer until OP came along when they filled in Buyer's name and recorded it. Question Number One - is there any requirement that a Deed has to be recorded within "x" days of the date on it? Question Number Two - did Sumday keep MFs current? If answer to Question Number One is "No" and answer to Question Number Two is "Yes", what is the problem...

George
There are actually several problems. One, as notarized statement was altered or filled in after notarization, transfer arguably was invalid. That’s why there was discussion of a quiet title lawsuit.
Two, there’s a misleading statement within James County Court Clerks office with my name on it, that the transfer happened on March 2018. The transfer happened in July 2019. There are appropriate instances to backdate, such as a renter and landlord memorializing a lease one month after the fact. This isn’t an appropriate instance to backdate.
Third, as an attorney bound to the NY Model Rules of Professional Conduct, I cannot make misleading statements to the courts or let them go uncorrected. For example, I know one lawyer who was suspended for one month for depositing her client’s $1,725 INS fees into her business but not client account. She paid her client’s $1,725 INS fees from her business, not but client account.

There are huge technicalities I have to follow. Backdating is one of them.
 
Last edited:

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1

Grammarhero

Official TUGBBS Rescission Master
TUG Lifetime Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Messages
2,264
Reaction score
1,551
Points
324
Location
Washington, DC Area
Resorts Owned
Wyndham 353k pts, Williamsburg Plant 4L/4 & 2/2, DRI South Bend 1/1
Last edited:

bogey21

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
7,676
Reaction score
2,487
Points
499
Location
Fort Worth, Texas
Looks to me like Sellers signed the Deed with a blank Grantee a long time ago but Sumday wasn't able to find Buyer until OP came along when they filled in Buyer's name and recorded it. Question Number One - is there any requirement that a Deed has to be recorded within "x" days of the date on it? Question Number Two - did Sumday keep MFs current? If answer to Question Number One is "No" and answer to Question Number Two is "Yes", what is the problem...

George
As an individual I'm not concerned if answers are "No" and "Yes". You feel being a party to this transaction may have implications on you as a member of the bar. If I read this correctly I would call Sumday and tell them why you can be no part of the transaction and ask them to undo it. I suspect they will resolve the problem...

George
 

RX8

TUG Member
Joined
May 5, 2011
Messages
2,260
Reaction score
1,222
Points
274
Sorry you have to deal with this dilemma.

Just as you are bound by ethical rules pertaining to backdating so would a notary. Surprised a notary would validate “signatures” on a document that doesn’t include all signatures.
 
Top