Universal Marketing...legit?

[h1-vltg]

Hi

I am new to TUGS and I believe I have fallen victim to a scam, and now there is another company calling me telling me that I have been victimized and they can help me...yeah Right!

I have a Royal Holiday Gold membership (30000 points) We were in the Bahamas and fell for the sales pitch and ended up buying the timeshare. 2 years have passed and we haven't used the membership and chances are we realistically never will. (This is lesson # 1, we got sucked in)

So this guys calls me from GTS (Global Timeshare Solutions) and explains how he runs a resort and they got my name from Royal Holiday and he can sell my membership for more than the what I bought it for...yada...yada...yada and how he doesn't make any money of my sale, rather he gets the money from the financing from the new buyer. Well I was so eager that someone wanted to buy our package I bought every lie he told me. (This is Lesson #2, so eager to sell i was blinded by the facts)

Now I get a call from another company (Universal Marketing Solutions) telling me that GTS is under investigation for their fraud. This new guy from UMS tells me his contract is different from GTS in that if he my property doesn't close within 120 days he will issue me a refund. He already has a buyer lined up and all he needs is $2192.00 upfront.

Luckily I came across this website (better late than never) I am waiting to see this new guys contract, but from everything I have read here, this seems to be nothing but another scam. I wish we could legally get even with these scammers.

I called the guy today to cancel and he tells me that I don't know what I am talking about and to wait until I see the contract, and when I get the contract he will go over every paragraph with me. These people make you feel like you're making the biggest mistake and all their lies are really convincing...but I know better now that I have seen this website.

 

[aliikai2]

Welcome to TUG

Anyone that needs their money up-front, is 99.44% sure a scammer. Tell them that they can have $3000 out of the proceeds from the sale.

Now, the really bad news is that your 30K RHC package has a resale value of around $750 including the $500 transfer fee that the resort charges.

You can take the time to learn how to use your ownership, or dump it for $1 with the buyer paying the closing and transfer fees.

I would recommend that you learn how to use it, in the points area of this bbs there is a faq for Royal Holiday. Should get you headed in the right direction.

jmho,

Greg

 

[Bill4728]

Greg has given you good advice. But be sure to read the thread "how to sell your TS" also.

 

[h1-vltg]

Thanks guys...I really do appreciate the information.

 

[theo]

"Solutions" Indeed...

So this guys calls me from GTS (Global Timeshare Solutions).........
Now I get a call from another company (Universal Marketing Solutions)....

It's so ironic that many of these upfront fee parasites, NONE of whom ever actually sell a timeshare (or really even bother to try to do so once they have their fee in hand) employ the word "solutions" in their company name (Omega Marketing Soultions, or Universal, Global, Ace, Intergalactic, Superior, etc. "Marketing Solutions").

In reality, all of these thieving parasites are nothing but PROBLEMS.
They certainly are not "solutions" of any kind to anyone at any time (...except perhaps to their own wallets when they succeed in collecting their exorbitant "advertising and marketing fee" from the unwary). :annoyed:

 

[rg891]

Oh Great!

I too have fallen victim to Universal Marketing Solutions. I am very embarassed to admit this. My questions is, are there any legal routes that may be taken to keep this company from continuing to rob people. Is there any contacts (state oriented or other) that would handle or deal with this type criminal activity?

 

[jdb0822]

thats the problem, they walk a gray line of legality. Basically, they agree to "market" your timeshare for a very high fee. So, you pay the high fee, and they in turn post your timeshare on some obscure website that no one will ever see. Therefore, they are completing their contract. Unethical? you bet. Illegal, not quite. Thats why these parasites continue to exist.

 

[rg891]

Could there be any help from the AG's Office or BBB? This too will pass, but I want to exhaust any efforts I can while my blood pressure is up!

 

[JoeMid]

I have a Royal Holiday Gold membership (30000 points) We were in the Bahamas and fell for the sales pitch and ended up buying the timeshare. 2 years have passed and we haven't used the membership and chances are we realistically never will.

Why not? It can really be good!

Now, the really bad news is that your 30K RHC package has a resale value of around $750 including the $500 transfer fee that the resort charges.

You can take the time to learn how to use your ownership, or dump it for $1 with the buyer paying the closing and transfer fees.

I would recommend that you learn how to use it, in the points area of this bbs there is a faq for Royal Holiday. Should get you headed in the right direction.

jmho, Greg

The value is $1 and you're really luck if you don't have to pay the xfer fee to rid yourself of it. To really get headed in the right direction go to this RHC Forum.

 

[theo]

Unfortunate and expensive lesson...

Could there be any help from the AG's Office or BBB? This too will pass, but I want to exhaust any efforts I can while my blood pressure is up!

As mentioned previously by another poster, there is no illegality here. Consequently, no AG office in any state can really do much of any substance for you, beyond merely fielding a "consumer complaint".

Unfortunately, you voluntarily chose to pay an exorbitant fee to an obscure "marketing" entity for "advertising" of little or no real value. While I'm rendering no personal judgement, with all due respect I'm not at all sure that having freely and voluntarily made that particular choice really makes you a "victim" --- you may instead simply be a willing volunteer...

The upfront fee parasite companies are most certainly unethical, parasitic scourges on the timeshare landscape, but they have not actually violated any law --- and violation of a law is clearly a prerequisite to eliciting AG interest or involvement. The "advertiser" fulfills its contractual obligation by placing your timeshare on an obscure web site. At that point, from their perspective, it's "contract terms have been met; this deal is now done."
You'll never hear from them again.

BBB is, unfortunately, completely devoid of any power or legal authority of any kind. Some might even say that BBB borders on being nearly useless. However, if you wish to jump through the BBB hoops to file a complaint, the venting may help lower your blood pressure. It will also create a statistic (i.e., that of a "filed complaint") but absolutely nothing more.

Someday, legislation may offer some protection from these thieving upfront fee parasites. Until then, however, they will continure to operate deceitfully and unethically --- but not actually illegally...

 

[esk444]

As mentioned previously by another poster, there is no illegality here. Consequently, no AG office in any state can really do much of any substance for you, beyond merely fielding a "consumer complaint".

Unfortunately, you voluntarily chose to pay an exorbitant fee to an obscure "marketing" entity for "advertising" of little or no real value. While I'm rendering no personal judgement, with all due respect I'm not at all sure that having freely and voluntarily made that particular choice really makes you a "victim" --- you may instead simply be a willing volunteer...

The upfront fee parasite companies are most certainly unethical, parasitic scourges on the timeshare landscape, but they have not actually violated any law --- and violation of a law is clearly a prerequisite to eliciting AG interest or involvement. The "advertiser" fulfills its contractual obligation by placing your timeshare on an obscure web site. At that point, from their perspective, it's "contract terms have been met; this deal is now done."
You'll never hear from them again.

BBB is, unfortunately, completely devoid of any power or legal authority of any kind. Some might say they border on being nearly useless. However, if you wish to jump through the BBB hoops and hurdles to file a complaint, the venting may help lower your blood pressure. It will also create a statistic (i.e., that of a "filed complaint") but absolutely nothing more.

Someday, legislation may offer some protection from these thieving upfront fee parasites. Until then, however, they will continure to operate deceitfully and unethically --- but not actually illegally...

I'm a former prosecutor. Most anti-fraud statutes are written very broadly and are liberally construed by the courts. That is why they don't need to be rewritten every time a con artist invents a new scam. The key element is deceitfulness. If a prosecutor can prove that the waiting buyer never existed and was part of the scam, there is a very good chance it can be established that they acted with the requisite deceitfulness to bring an anti fraud action or criminal complaint.

So I wouldn't be so dismissive that this behaviour isn't illegal. But then again it wouldn't be the easiest case to bring and loss to the victims is relatively small in the greater scheme of things.

 

[theo]

Clarification...

I wouldn't be so dismissive that this behaviour isn't illegal. But then again it wouldn't be the easiest case to bring and loss to the victims is relatively small in the greater scheme of things.

It certainly wasn't my intention to be "dismissive", but the simple reality is that these upfront fee outfits have existed for many years, consistently using the exact same m.o. They continue to exist --- proliferate, actually. It's my view that their practices continue unabated and flourish, even in a weak economy, largely because the "deceit" element that you correctly reference is too pale a shade of grey and too fuzzy. For example, there is a world of difference between "we may have a buyer" and "we have a buyer". The fact that neither claim is ever recorded or ever made in writing as an offer doesn't help. Later recollections about phone conversations invariably "differ", further muddying the (already murky) waters.

Many people have tried, without much success, to enlist the involvement of the Florida AG office for years now in such matters. First hand accounts of their efforts abound, even in a brief Internet search (Florida seems to be where most, but not all, of these upfront fee parasites are based). I certainly don't disparage the lack of prosecutorial effort; I believe they simply don't have the statutory tools with which to work effectively.
No prosecutor anywhere has time for "maybe we could..." cases.

 

[theo]

Clarification...

Inadvertent duplication of previous post voluntarily deleted here. Sorry!

 

[Tia]

It's the old theory if it sounds too good to be true it probably is. There are still so many people who do not use the internet, or not to it's full potential, this stuff still works to fool them into parting with their $.

 

[gottook2]

Hi

I am new to TUGS and I believe I have fallen victim to a scam, and now there is another company calling me telling me that I have been victimized and they can help me...yeah Right!

I have a Royal Holiday Gold membership (30000 points) We were in the Bahamas and fell for the sales pitch and ended up buying the timeshare. 2 years have passed and we haven't used the membership and chances are we realistically never will. (This is lesson # 1, we got sucked in)

So this guys calls me from GTS (Global Timeshare Solutions) and explains how he runs a resort and they got my name from Royal Holiday and he can sell my membership for more than the what I bought it for...yada...yada...yada and how he doesn't make any money of my sale, rather he gets the money from the financing from the new buyer. Well I was so eager that someone wanted to buy our package I bought every lie he told me. (This is Lesson #2, so eager to sell i was blinded by the facts)

Now I get a call from another company (Universal Marketing Solutions) telling me that GTS is under investigation for their fraud. This new guy from UMS tells me his contract is different from GTS in that if he my property doesn't close within 120 days he will issue me a refund. He already has a buyer lined up and all he needs is $2192.00 upfront.

Luckily I came across this website (better late than never) I am waiting to see this new guys contract, but from everything I have read here, this seems to be nothing but another scam. I wish we could legally get even with these scammers.

I called the guy today to cancel and he tells me that I don't know what I am talking about and to wait until I see the contract, and when I get the contract he will go over every paragraph with me. These people make you feel like you're making the biggest mistake and all their lies are really convincing...but I know better now that I have seen this website.

I too was suckered in by Universal Marketing Solutions. Matt Hicks, the owner himself, signed my contract. I, also tried to back out the next day and was told they had a buyer right then and just needed to get the financing approved. What a crock! I never heard from them again, except that their telemarketers keep calling to sign me up again.

Please turn in complaints to the AG, BBB, Div. of Consumer Affairs, the Governor, FTC, and everyone else you can think of.

 

[h1-vltg]

Sorry I have been out of the loop for a while.

Here is what finally happened. I received the contract, looked it over, and wrote VOID with a sharpe on the contract and attached a letter stating "I do not authorize Universal Marketing Solutions to charge my credit card and to issue a refund for amount that was previously charged".

I called my credit card company prior and notified them of my decision and what actions I plan on taking. I also cc'ied the credit card company with a photocopy of my letter and of the voided contract.

I received a letter from the credit card company last week and the full amount was refunded back to my card. I am still going to monitor my account as I don't trust any of these parasites.

Thank You to all on this website, you guys really saved me!!!

 

[davlee4]

universal marketing solutions inc.

I read the threads here the day I talked to universal marketing solutions and had given them my credit card for payment. I immediately asked for a refund and told them I had some unexpected expenses come up and that I could not afford to go through the sale right now. It took some talking and finally I got a full refund yesterday! I am really glad to have found this forum. I also filed a complaint with the Florida attorney generals office. I doubt that will go anywhere now, but it is worth a try. The thing that helped the most is not signing the papers and sending them back.
David

 

[gottook2]

Universal Marketing Solutions

I am so glad you turned these people in the Attorney General's office. I did too. Too late for me but if I saved one person from making the same mistake I did then I'm happy I helped a little. I still haven't given up. I am going to turn them in to Federal Communications for violating the National Do Not Call List. I've been on the list for 4 years and they totally ignore that. There is no one regulating what these people do. I guess the laws are way behind the times.

This company is definitely a con game and total scam. I imagine they operate out of a hole in the wall with just a bank of phones. They do no advertising and they probably never actually sell anything. They just scam the public with a bunch of lies, get their credit card numbers and then you never hear from them again. I'm sure they change their names often. If you check public records you will see that these are relatively new company names. They are not rated by BBB. It shows an "F" but that wasn't listed when I was scammed. Matt Hicks told me they had an "A" rating.

Please do everything you can to stop this.

 

[CAVAMV]

Almost Taken By Universal Marketing Solutions Too

I have been contacted (over the past week-non stop) by these same people on the same scam to sell our timeshare with us posting a fee of $1396.24 for a one week timeshare that we own in Desert Springs, CA. I asked them to send me the paperwork first before any credit cards charges were transacted but they say that's not how they do business. They charge first and then FedX out the paperwork. I call my American Express rep. and asked if they have ever heard of them,but of course because of legal issues of Confidenialty, etc. they could share anything. They did say, that for them to charge my account they would have to have been approved by American Express as a "legal and on-going business" but it I didn't get what I expected, I then could ask for a fraud charge investigation to be started. That, of course takes time and why even bother dealing with this type of company.

My questions, can those who have been scammed, go after the credit card companies if they continue dealing with companies who are being deceitful? Maybe this is another approach to putting them out of business.

For your Iinf. the name of the people calling me are:

Nikki Vecchio


Hope this might help someone

 

[DeniseM]

My questions, can those who have been scammed, go after the credit card companies if they continue dealing with companies who are being deceitful? Maybe this is another approach to putting them out of business.

I don't think it is reasonable to expect a credit card company to do your due diligence for you or to prosecute them when they don't.

 

[richardm]

They contacted a listing of ours with their "offer" of $21,000 for a Vistana week.. When I called and offered to split the $16,000 commission at closing (seller would have been thrilled with $5k)- I was told that they don't make offers for timeshares- they just advertise them.. When I offered to send him a copy of the fax with the offer- he simply hung up!

Guess I lost that sale!!!! I hope I'm just having an off day....

:hysterical:

 

[calgarygary]

They contacted a listing of ours with their "offer" of $21,000 for a Vistana week.. When I called and offered to split the $16,000 commission at closing (seller would have been thrilled with $5k)- I was told that they don't make offers for timeshares- they just advertise them.. When I offered to send him a copy of the fax with the offer- he simply hung up!

Guess I lost that sale!!!! I hope I'm just having an off day....

:hysterical:

You not only lost that sale but think of all the others that would have sought you out to be their "middle" man. I was already trying to jump the line that was forming.

 

[richardm]

At least I got a laugh out of it to end my day... By the way in case anyone wonders- Vistana would sell the same week to you today for $6,500.. (High season at Fountains)..