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unfair rci vacations

sevilla

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I am a rci member and recently i have been trying to exchage for a vacation in april.none to be had,but when i go to instant vacation that i have to pay for there are many listed for that week.what gives????
 

lprstn

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Welcome to the club... we all have made that complaint. RCI claims that those weeks are not traded weeks :mad: yeah right.
 

AwayWeGo

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[triennial - points]
Like-For-Like Trade Policy Limits Availability Of Good Timeshare Exchanges.

I am a rci member and recently i have been trying to exchage for a vacation in april.none to be had,but when i go to instant vacation that i have to pay for there are many listed for that week.what gives?
You have tapped into people's No. 1 source of dissatisfaction with RCI.

I'm no expert, but I take it that in the old days RCI would let people get exchange reservations into top timeshares using so-so timeshares as trade bait.

Then in more recent years, RCI started getting hard core about its Like For Like timeshare exchange policy -- i.e., I deposit a so-so timeshare, & all I can get in exchange is somebody else's so-so timeshare.

Where the outrage comes in is over what RCI does with its stock of banked timeshare weeks that are better quality than anything they'll let me have for my so-so timeshare. That is, they'll rent those out for cash at the same time they tell me they don't have anything available for me to get using my so-so timeshare as trade bait.

Some people are so grumped off by this state of affairs that they've joined in an expensive Class Action Lawsuit designed to force RCI to go back to the way the plaintiffs say it used to be & that it ought to be once again now & forever.

Others shrug & try to learn how to go with the flow according to today's RCI policies.

One way of going with the flow is switching to points-based timeshare exchanges instead of conventional week-for-week timeshare trades. Points requirements -- what you get for your timeshare, what it takes to reserve somebody else's -- are out there in the open for everybody to see ahead of time.

Straight-weeks trades, by contrast, always depend on hidden "trade power" valuations that are concealed from all us timeshare owners & known only to the Gnomes Of RCI toiling away in the murky back rooms of RCI Command Central's underground bunkers.

The way "trade power" works is that any timeshare week I deposit is never quite good enough to get me an exchange into somebody else's timeshare that I'd actually like to go to. Rather than just letting those weeks which are "too good" for exchange go to waste, RCI rents'm out for big bux.

So it goes.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​


 

Laurie

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You have tapped into people's No. 1 source of dissatisfaction with RCI.


Alan, I think you're speaking to the inability of folks to "trade up". Actually, the #1 source of dissatisfaction for many - including myself - is that as the OP wrote, there are many weeks deposited by members as spacebanks that are completely not available as exchange weeks for anyone - no matter whether your trade power is a 1 or a 10 or somewhere inbetween. Instead these spacebank deposits are siphoned off as "extra vacations", and sold for cash.

There's plenty of evidence that these come from members' spacebanks. These "extra vacations" seem to represent the whole trade power range from 1 to 10, as well.

I'm a weeks member with some great traders, and the extra vacations I see are often not available to me as exchanges. Are you saying you can get them with points?
 

e.bram

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AwayWeGo:
Points don't help. Remember the required points for a week span over a group of weeks, some pink, some bright red. The developer aka points exchange system controls the computer keyboard and availabilty charts. Since the developer aka points exchanger owns points(unsold and repoed),what to stop them from allocating the prime redweeks to themselves to rent and making the pink weeks(which have the same point cost sa the prime reds)available to the points owners(suckers). Best to have choice week in a choice unit which can be rented(if not used) and funds used to rerent a prime TS at a prime time.
 

krmlaw

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We have to have been pretty lucky so far then. We have one good timeshare, a good week, good resort, gold crown. And we have one not so good time share, a floating "bad" week, at a so-so resort, silver crown.

We have been able to trade both of them for really good units. I always try to see whats available on each. I even recently used by silver crown so-so unit to trade into an amazing gold crown top of the line unit. Maybe we trade them off season? Not sure.

But so far Ive been pretty happy with RCI.

We have an interval account as well, and what I dont like is that once you begin a search, you cant cancel it yourself. Just add or remove places to search.

But I wonder about this class action suit?

And I too have seen all those extra weeks available, some at really nice resorts that dont show up when I try to trade, even with the good week.
 

theo

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Settlement MAY be faintly visible on the horizon...

But I wonder about this class action suit?

Settlement discussions in Murillo vs. RCI have reportedly been taking place in (and out of) Federal Court in Newark, NJ on and off since mid-July, 2008.
I have no idea of the outcome-to-be, but the matter would seem to be closer to its end than to its beginning (which was in April, 2006). :shrug:
 
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geekette

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I am a rci member and recently i have been trying to exchage for a vacation in april.none to be had,but when i go to instant vacation that i have to pay for there are many listed for that week.what gives????

OP, where are you looking for April, and are you confined to one week or any in April? Could be you're seeking a very popular spring destination and all the goodies are gone. Oh, I mean, the "deposited weeks for exchange", not the "surplus rental inventory." :annoyed:

Generally, tho, you're too late - once you've passed the one year mark, pickins get slim.
 

AwayWeGo

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[triennial - points]
I Am A Savvy Timeshare Exchanger. ( -- Notttt ! ! -- )

Generally, tho, you're too late - once you've passed the one year mark, pickins get slim.
After spending way too much time mouse-clicking around on TUG-BBS, I have pretty much concluded that the savvy timeshare crowd snags the top exchange reservations as far ahead as possible -- 2+ years off optimally, because only 1 year into the future is too late.

With the top timeshare exchanges available already snagged by the savvy types, mainly just the dogs & cats are left for the choosing for us savvy-challenged timeshare doofuses.

The saving grace, if there is 1, is in waiting so late to reserve a timeshare on exchange that RCI is virtually begging people to take'm & practically giving'm away via Last Call & Instant Exchange.

See, the thing is that some of the leftover dogs & cats actually turn out to be pretty nice timeshares in vacation spots where we like to go. Off-season seems to be the key.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

Kozman

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OP, where are you looking for April, and are you confined to one week or any in April? Could be you're seeking a very popular spring destination and all the goodies are gone. Oh, I mean, the "deposited weeks for exchange", not the "surplus rental inventory." :annoyed:

Generally, tho, you're too late - once you've passed the one year mark, pickins get slim.

That may be so, but why are they then showing up in Extra Vacations but not available for trade?
 

Carolinian

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As has been well documented, many of these rental weeks are from sold out resorts, so they are NOT developer inventory. They are exchange deposits.

Some years ago, we had an RCI employee who posted here regularly, Bootleg, and he was able to trace some of the prime inventory showing up in RCI rentals through his RCI computer and found that the weeks were indeed exchange deposits unrelated to cruises, points for deposits, points partners or anything else. There have also been some posts from RCI employees over at www.timesharetalk.co.uk to the same effect. The RCI employees say that RCI has a rental pool and these exchange deposits are immediately placed in it as soon as they are depositied. The thread is at www.timesharetalk.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7761 The RCI employee uses the handle ''anon'' When he first started posting as an RCI employee, the site owner checked his bona fides by asking some specific questions from his own RCI account that only someone with access to RCI computers could answer and anon came back with all of the correct answers.
 
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geekette

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That may be so, but why are they then showing up in Extra Vacations but not available for trade?

Because no one else will pay EV prices either, but would have grabbed them up for an exchange fee. Then we wouldn't see those weeks anywhere.
 

timeos2

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Fading fast from all I can find out (very little)

How do we get involved in this class actions lawsuit?

BigTom

From everything that can be found out - which is not much - the thing is dead and all that is going to happen is some pay outs to a bunch of lawyers. It has no future and isn't going to change a thing (as was widely predicted way back in 2006 when it was filed). Most of it was gutted and whats left is virtually moot in any case. Nothing to "join".
 

famy27

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How do we get involved in this class actions lawsuit?

BigTom

From a review of the docket sheet, it appears that they are still finalizing the settlement agreement and notice to class members. In general, if you are part of a class as defined (which I didn't see on the docket), you don't need to do anything to be added to a case. You are added automatically. You normally would have the chance to opt out of the settlement and pursue your own case or to file objections to the settlement agreement.

There is another hearing set for October 1st, so we may know more at that time.

As usual, the individual members of the class probably won't get much.

I'm not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice (just my two cents!)
 

Carolinian

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That has been your wishfull thinking from the very beginning, and while some issues that were in one of the two suits are no longer in the merged suit, the most critical issue still is. Your predictions in 2006 I don't necessarily consider ''wide''.

In any class action suit there is a danger of the plantiff's attorneys and defendant doing what is in their interest while putting a bandaid on a cancer for the plaintiff class. Plaintiffs counsel walks away with a big fee while they agree on minor cosmetic changes in defendant's operation that don't come close to curing the real problem. The main things that would work against such an insider deal are 1) plaintiff's attorneys really bent on genuine reform, and 2) a lead plaintiff who will speak up to his attorneys and if necessary the court against such a backroom deal. From what I have learned from a Tugger personally close to some of those involved, at least one of the principle attorneys is a timesharer himself with a genuine concern about these issues, which gives hope that the plaintiff class will not be sold down the river. Also, I am personally aware that one of the two lead plaintiffs is an extremely strong advocate of reform of these horrid RCI practices, and I would have a hard time believing that he/she would sit still for the class to be sold out.

That said, I have always preferred that these issues be raised by a state AG in a consumer protections suit, which as a public official would not have the temptation of selling out his clients for a big payout to himself. Many state consumer protection laws also give state AG's powerful pre-litigation tools that could likely have made RCI cry uncle without an actual lawsuit having to be filed.


From everything that can be found out - which is not much - the thing is dead and all that is going to happen is some pay outs to a bunch of lawyers. It has no future and isn't going to change a thing (as was widely predicted way back in 2006 when it was filed). Most of it was gutted and whats left is virtually moot in any case. Nothing to "join".
 

Carolinian

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The important thing in any class action lawsuit is not monetary compensation, but injunctive relief; what acts the defendant is prohibited from doing in the future. Weak injuctive relief is where the plaintiff class can get sold down the river by unscrupulous attorneys.

I personally, it doesn't matter to me if I don't get a cent in monetary relief as long as RCI is stopped dead in its tracks from renting out exchange deposits to the general public. How some timesharers think that fraudulent practice is okay is beyond me.


From a review of the docket sheet, it appears that they are still finalizing the settlement agreement and notice to class members. In general, if you are part of a class as defined (which I didn't see on the docket), you don't need to do anything to be added to a case. You are added automatically. You normally would have the chance to opt out of the settlement and pursue your own case or to file objections to the settlement agreement.

There is another hearing set for October 1st, so we may know more at that time.

As usual, the individual members of the class probably won't get much.

I'm not a lawyer, and this is not legal advice (just my two cents!)
 

crazyhorse

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I hope that if the class action court suspects that fraud has occurred, that the details are referred to the appropriate authority.
 

bnoble

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RCI tells you, right up front in the disclosure documents, that they can do anything they want with your deposit. Paragraph 5e of the Weeks agreement states:

A Member relinquishes all rights to the use
of Vacation Time to the benefit of RCI when it is
Deposited.

It ain't fraud if they don't promise anything.
 

davidvel

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Not true. If you read the agreement in its entirety (its available from the link at the bottom of RCI's homepage), it states that the weeks deposited become vacation time from which participants can request in exchange for their deposit. There are other provisions that also state that the vacation time deposited goes in the pool of weeks to be exchanged.

Reading the document as a whole, the system is as everyone thinks it is: weeks deposited are (should be) the weeks available for exchange based upon the relative strength of those weeks (which is a whole different issue).

When you deposit your week you certainly relinquish your right to the time. But no one can (reasonably) argue that under the Agreement , this that RCi can take in all exchange weeks, rent them out for cash in their pocket, then tell people from whom they took a fee and their weeks that there are simply no weeks to exchange into because we can "do what ever we want" with the deposited weeks.
 

timeos2

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Nope. Won't fly

Not true. If you read the agreement in its entirety (its available from the link at the bottom of RCI's homepage), it states that the weeks deposited become vacation time from which participants can request in exchange for their deposit. There are other provisions that also state that the vacation time deposited goes in the pool of weeks to be exchanged.

Reading the document as a whole, the system is as everyone thinks it is: weeks deposited are (should be) the weeks available for exchange based upon the relative strength of those weeks (which is a whole different issue).

When you deposit your week you certainly relinquish your right to the time. But no one can (reasonably) argue that under the Agreement , this that RCi can take in all exchange weeks, rent them out for cash in their pocket, then tell people from whom they took a fee and their weeks that there are simply no weeks to exchange into because we can "do what ever we want" with the deposited weeks.

There is NEVER a time where you can 't get a week for your week - the problem is many don't think its an EQUAL (or better) week which is what they want. The court isn't about to decide if a January beach week is or isn't equal to a week in Bermuda. If RCI shows a week in PA or VA in exchange the requirement is met. No fraud or mis-appropriation. There are NO guarantees of value anywhere in that document.
 

AwayWeGo

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Settlement Terms Demand New Name For R. C. I.

There is NEVER a time where you can 't get a week for your week - the problem is many don't think its an EQUAL (or better) week which is what they want. The court isn't about to decide if a January beach week is or isn't equal to a week in Bermuda. If RCI shows a week in PA or VA in exchange the requirement is met. No fraud or mis-appropriation. There are NO guarantees of value anywhere in that document.
The Forrest Gump Timeshare Exchange Company.

Slogan = You Never Know What Timeshare Exchange You're Gonna Get.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​
 

davidvel

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The court isn't about to decide if a January beach week is or isn't equal to a week in Bermuda. If RCI shows a week in PA or VA in exchange the requirement is met. No fraud or mis-appropriation. There are NO guarantees of value anywhere in that document.
Couldn't agree with you more. So long as all the deposited weeks are in the pool, the weighting is so subjective that it would be next to impossible for a court/jury to decide...

BUT (yes there is always a BUT in the law), if those weeks all go unused because the "weighting" system says people don't have a good enough week to get it (even after all the good weeks have exchanged), and RCI decides it will then rent them out before allowing those poor weeks to get them, "Houston there is a problem."

In other words, so long as all weeks stay in the pool and can be utilized by even poor traders after all others pass, and not for RCI's independent gain, then let the weighting arguments begin.
 

Carolinian

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There is NEVER a time where you can 't get a week for your week - the problem is many don't think its an EQUAL (or better) week which is what they want. The court isn't about to decide if a January beach week is or isn't equal to a week in Bermuda. If RCI shows a week in PA or VA in exchange the requirement is met. No fraud or mis-appropriation. There are NO guarantees of value anywhere in that document.

Wrong - RCI itself establishes that weeks have different values by the very fact of setting up the color coded seasons, as well as all of their statements about trading power. Your argument would be a loser in court.

Also, would you mind explaining why you always seem to be supportive of RCI, no matter what they do to their members? Some of RCI's own employees, at least, like Bootleg and Anon, are supportive of fair treatment of members. The Anon posts in the TimeshareTalk link above are very revealing.
 
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