Total newb, need advice on Lagunamar...

[DaveL]

Hello all,

I'm a totally newb when it comes to timeshares, and I am greatful to have found this site.

I've spent the past day combing through this site, and still want some advice.

The situtation is I'm thinking of purchasing a timeshare at Westin Lagunamar. Deal is $28.9k, gold plus, for 1 year, 2 bedroom lockout from the developer.

I've signed the deal, and have been trying to justify this to myself, but after reading some posts on WLR, I'm considering rescinding.

My question really comes down to, is this worth it/does this make sense to do?

I've never been to Cancun, but the flexibility to use points was appealing for the relatively low intro costs. We do not plan to go to Cancun every year, but like the ability to use the SOs for other locations.

Additional questions are
- How hard is it to rent out part of this?
- How is resale value?

Any other quick tips/pointers for this newb?

Thanks in advance for any advice/thoughts!!!

 

[cdn_traveler]

Rescind!

You should rescind while you still can. Do some more research and if owning at WLR is still what you want, it will still be there for you to buy. However, once pass the rescission period, you can kiss your 28k down the drain. Some of the more experienced members will be along to help you with your other questions but they will definitely agree that you should rescind.

Good Luck.

 

[MommaBear]

A one bedroom did NOT sell for $499 and a studio did sell for about $375 on ebay this week. I really like the Lagunamar property but do not buy retail! I did buy retail at the WEstin Princeville and sure wish I had found TUG before I had!

 

[klatkiew]

DaveL - are you at lagunamar right now? My family is here this week if you would like to have an in person chat about this.

 

[DeniseM]

RESCIND - here's how - http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74493

The rental market in Mexico is flooded with cheap rentals, so the rental market is terrbile - you won't be able to even cover your maintenance fees, IF you can find a renter.

The resale market is 0-10% of retail.... That means the week you just bought is worth 0-10% of what you paid for it - right now!

There is no doubt - you should rescind, and then come back and talk to us if you are still interested in timesharing. Then you can do your homework and make a decision with no pressure, and take your time.

 

[jarta]

DaveL, ... I own 3 weeks at Lagunamar. All are Platinum plus 2-br lockoff weeks. All were bought from the developer. I own 7 Starwood weeks in Platinum plus season. The 3 Lagunamar weeks were the only ones purchased directly from Starwood. All my Starwood timeshares are at least 2-br weeks. I am quite happy with my Starwood purchases, BUT .............

If you have ANY questions now about buying at Lagunamar, please rescind now - in time, in writing and via certified mail.

Later, there will be lots of other opportunities to purchase a timeshare. Lagunamar will not be sold out by then. A whole new phase (buildings 11-14 or almost 40% of the resort) stands almost completely built-out, but unsold and not on the market due to economic conditions.

Read TUG if you are still interested in buying. Learn all about trading under the Starwood internal system and the II (mainly) external system. Learn about Starwood's Elite benefits. Learn about the other branded systems (like Marriott, Disney, Hilton and Wyndham) and their benefits, drawbacks and locations. One of the other systems may be better for your particular needs.

The best time to purchase a timeshare is after you have followed TUG for a few months and have a solid knowledge about how timesharing works. You must buy after figuring out how you will use your timeshare and learning what system works best for you.

And, keep in mind that there must be reasons beyond mere economics that will support a developer purchase (any developer) because timeshares are very, very cheap on the secondary market. There is a huge oversupply and weeks can be picked up these days for pennies on the dollar. GLTY! ... eom

 

[Kildahl]

Welcome, Dave. You discovered this community in the nick of time! Several hours spent here hours after I had signed a purchase agreement saved me thousands with my first timeshare purchase.
If you think timeshare ownership makes sense to you and or your family (the vast majority of us have come to that conclusion), then join TUG and immerse yourself in the resources and discussion available here.
As Jarta noted above, there may be a time when you decide to buy directly from the developer but it is unlikely that you know enough about timesharing at this point to make that decision.
Of course, if time is not a commodity that you have but money is, then feel free to proceed under sales agreement. I have never been to Lagunamar, but understand that it is a beautiful resort.

 

[DaveL]

Thank you all for your responses.

I will take your collective responses and rescind today and do more researching and asking questions.

I must say, I'm normally very skeptical when it comes to sales presentations, but the right of rescission made it very appealing to go ahead and sign up and figure things out later. :rofl:

Couple of questions for now:

1 - What does it actualy mean to be a "Voluntary" resort?

From the FAQ,
" If a resort is Staroption "Voluntary," it means that the Staroption value of the week DOES NOT transfer to the new owner when it is resold, and the new owner DOES NOT have the right to exchange his timeshare in the Starwood Vacation Network." Does this mean that the new owner would not be able to use the II program?

2 - In what situtation does it make sense to actually to purchas a starwood timeshare from the developer?

Thank you again for all the help!

 

[DaveL]

DaveL - are you at lagunamar right now? My family is here this week if you would like to have an in person chat about this.

I'm actually in Maui right now. We sat through a presentation for the WKORV and they brought up WLR as an option.

 

[DeniseM]

Thank you all for your responses.

I will take your collective responses and rescind today and do more researching and asking questions.

I must say, I'm normally very skeptical when it comes to sales presentations, but the right of rescission made it very appealing to go ahead and sign up and figure things out later. :rofl:

Couple of questions for now:

1 - What does it actualy mean to be a "Voluntary" resort?

From the FAQ,
" If a resort is Staroption "Voluntary," it means that the Staroption value of the week DOES NOT transfer to the new owner when it is resold, and the new owner DOES NOT have the right to exchange his timeshare in the Starwood Vacation Network." Does this mean that the new owner would not be able to use the II program?

II = Interval International = an exchange company and a completely separate entity from Starwood - ALL Starwood owners can trade in II.

Voluntary means that a resale owner will not have Staroptions, and cannot trade their week in the Starwood Vacation Network (SVN.)

2 - In what situtation does it make sense to actually to purchas a starwood timeshare from the developer?

In my opinion there is no reason to buy from the developer, unless you are requalifying resale weeks to go all the way to 5 Star Elite.

 

[Ken555]

Congrats on rescinding. You'll be glad you did!

 

[JudyS]

Yes, you will be glad you rescinded. You can always buy the same thing later (and probably much, much cheaper) if you decide you really want it.

 

[jarta]

"What does it actualy mean to be a "Voluntary" resort?"

It means that if you try to resell a week at a "voluntary" resort which you purchased from Starwood, you will take a bath financially.

Weeks at "mandatory" resorts, because they transfer StarOptions for easy, internal Starwood trading 8 months from arrival (always depending on availability), sell at much higher general resale prices on the secondary market than weeks at "voluntary" resorts. But, mandatory weeks do not sell for anywhere near developer pricing. (No timeshare does.)

For a resale week at a "voluntary" resort you are limited to use of the week in the season you purchased or to II trading. Or, you can "volunteer" to purchase something else from the developer at Starwood prices and requalify your "voluntary" week back into the SVN at the same time as the new developer purchase.

However, when you sell the requalified "voluntary" week, you cannot pass on the membership in the SVN, the StarOption rights are not transferred and the week will sell for as little as "voluntary" weeks at that resort will then sell for.

The Starwood system is set up to benefit (at a very large cost) those who buy and hold Starwood weeks - it is not user friendly to those who buy and sell or buy resale on the secondary market. However, the flexibility of using the II external trading system takes quite a bit of sting out of buying resale voluntary weeks. But, you have to learn how to use II and then look for good trades.

So, before you buy, resale or developer, figure out what the relative advantages and disadvantages are and how you intend to use any week you buy. It is not an easy process. ... eom

 

[DaveL]

Thank you all for the replies!

I rescinded the agreement and saved myself a bunch of money. Time to do more research...

 

[PatrickHB]

Another Newbie here ..Great discussion, I just made the same purchase mistake and am heading back to the WKV Maui sales office to rescind tomorrow.

Dave, are you still in Maui and can we chat in person if that is?

 

[DaveL]

Another Newbie here ..Great discussion, I just made the same purchase mistake and am heading back to the WKV Maui sales office to rescind tomorrow.

Dave, are you still in Maui and can we chat in person if that is?

Patrick, I am no longer in Maui, but you have a PM!

 

[VacationForever]

I went to the owners' update today. I was offered $22,900 (sales person indicated price was same for existing Starwood owner or non-owner.) Looks like they dropped 6K from the Op's post and today. The price is quite attractive and and I told the sales person that I would want to buy a resale first so that it can get retro'ed before buying from developer. Something I would consider when I retire in a few years' time.

 

[okwiater]

I went to the owners' update today. I was offered $22,900 (sales person indicated price was same for existing Starwood owner or non-owner.) Looks like they dropped 6K from the Op's post and today. The price is quite attractive and and I told the sales person that I would want to buy a resale first so that it can get retro'ed before buying from developer. Something I would consider when I retire in a few years' time.

sptung -- what was the price of $22,900 for? Was it Cancun (Plat or Gold)? I was offered $24,900 in Cancun for EOY (owners pricing) but I believe it was for ocean front Plat.

For an EY WLR, I was offered $44,900 + 180,000 Starpoints and 4 certificates to buy 80,000 Starpoints for $1,550 per. They also offered to retro my WKV EY Plat as part of the transaction. I know most here don't think it makes sense, but I see the value in potentially achieving 4-star elite primarily because of the 10% SP bonus and the waitlist feature. The waitlist seems like it would make it much easier to go to St. John if one wanted to do so.

 

[VacationForever]

Cancun. Gold: 22900, Platinum 33500 - 2 BR LO EY (Annual). He did give me the associated "freebie" Starpoints on purchase but since I was not going to pursue it this round, I did not retain those numbers.

If I were to buy from developer, I would want to retro a unit. I am more than 50% certain at this point that I would want to buy a resale in the next 6 months or so before attending another owner's update ;-).

 

[okwiater]

Cancun. Gold: 22900, Platinum 33500 - 2 BR LO EY (Annual). He did give me the associated "freebie" Starpoints on purchase but since I was not going to pursue it this round, I did not retain those numbers.

If I were to buy from developer, I would want to retro a unit. I am more than 50% certain at this point that I would want to buy a resale in the next 6 months or so before attending another owner's update ;-).

Are you sure those numbers are correct? They are far more favorable than the developer pricing posted in the September 2008 thread: http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh119/DeniseMM/WLORPricing_September2008.jpg

 

[VacationForever]

The numbers are correct. The sales guy, Gabriel, said the numbers are on "special offer" and that they are trying to clear phase 1 inventory before selling phase 2.

I was offered the explorer package to come back and the price will remain the same as quoted while I was there. I declined.

I doubt very much they use 2 different sets of prices, other than for EOY, he quote 2 different prices for current owners and new owners. I did tell him upfront I am on TUG.

 

[jayp]

I wanted to bump this thread as my wife and I are essentially in the same boat as the OP. We bought over the weekend at WLR and absolutely love the resort/Westin brand and saw this as a great oppurtunity to visit WLR on a semi regular basis as well as check out some of the other properties within SVO.

We used an explorer package that we had purchased the last time we stayed at the WLR and as part of that deal we were able to apply the price to the timeshare that we just bought. We ended up paying $12900 for a 2 bedroom lockoff during gold season on an everyother year basis, which worked out to 81,000 SVO(???) pts.

After making the purchase I intially had no regrets until coming across this website earlier today. I have taken the time to read through a number of posts and the most consistent message that keeps emerging is that we should not have bought directly from the developer.

Based on my very limited understanding of starwood timeshare ownership if I did buy the same property in the resale market I would lose the ability to trade to another starwood property through their internal channels but I could have the option to trade through II which I have zero experience doing. We also lose the capability to convert the SVO options into SPG pts which we also use quite frequently.

My main questions/concerns have to do with the difference between trading options via starwood directly vs using II. Is it worth the premium price to maintain that capability along with having the secondary option to convert to SPG pts.

I have also looked online for examples of WLR timeshares selling at 60-70% off of retail price and I couldn't find any, can anyone please point me in the direction of some of these properties as I would really like to see them with my own eyes.

Honestly after spending pretty much all day on TUG I still do not regret having purchased directly from the Westin but I also don't want to flush a bunch of money down the drain if that is unecessary. Any help or guidance would be greatly appreaciated. As of right now I have until this Friday to rescind.

 

[Karen G]

Honestly after spending pretty much all day on TUG I still do not regret having purchased directly from the Westin but I also don't want to flush a bunch of money down the drain if that is unecessary. Any help or guidance would be greatly appreaciated. As of right now I have until this Friday to rescind.

If you don't want to flush a bunch of money down the drain, rescind now while you still can. Do some more research. The deal will still be there any time you want to buy from the developer, no matter what the salesman wants you to believe. But, if you miss this one chance to rescind, you never get another. Rescind, take your time to understand exactly how the system works and then make an informed decision once you are ready to buy.

 

[Ken555]

It sounds as though you understand the variables involved. The one you don't control is time, and that's running out quickly. Rescind immediately, save your money, and buy later.

The sales staff uses the staroption to StarPoints conversion as a sales benefit, but it's almost always a bad use of your timeshare. Just convert the maintenance fee (per use, which in your case is two years) and figure out how much those points are costing you. Remember that they sell direct for about 3.5 cents (and sometimes have them for less). And, then add in your initial expense for the ownership.

Check completed auctions on eBay for an idea of what they're selling for these days. Of course that's just one indicator on market price. But, this board is consistent with the opinion that lagunamar is not worth much for a variety of reasons, including that it's a voluntary resort (those staroptions will not pass to a buyer should you sell it), cancun is overbuilt and readily available, etc.

For comparison, you can buy an every year 2-bed Kierland unit with 148,100 staroptions for not much more than you spent on Lagunamar. And, since Kierland includes options upon resale, it appears to be holding some value. This is enough for a 2-bed at any Starwood resort. Your maintenance might be more each year as compared to an eoy unit, though. This is just one example of what you can buy if you want the flexibility of options with a deed that should retain some value over the years. Note that all resale purchases (unless you requalify, but don't get confused by that just yet) do not include the ability to convert to starpoints. Besides, if you want StarPoints, just get an American Express for it (that's how lots of us get our StarPoints and it works out well).

Good luck!

 

[Ken555]

Just checked eBay completed auctions. A 2-bed platinum annual unit sold a few days ago for $7,800.