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Too good to be true? Grandview 49,000 RCI for $1

toansem

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I bought it on ebay : Grandview, 49,000 RIC pts for $2.

Selling agency asked for:
1. Legal name
2. Address
3. Phone number
4. email address
Agency said transaction would be a "quick deed transfer" where no signature from buyer is required. Once I provide 1-4 info, the transaction could and would take place. All fees would be paid by seller. My only fee would be the winning bid of $2. The title is said to be clean with no mortgage.

Does this sound legit? The name of the comany is KirK Marketing & Consultation in Florida. I can get a copy of the estoppel(sp?) letter with names blocked to prove mortgage paid in full. Is it common practice to need phone number and email address? The agency has (0) feedback and the TS is being sold under market value.

If anyone has used this agency, can you reassure me that they are legitimate agency to work with? Any experienced timeshare owners out there, please let me know if there's anything else I should be looking for before providing my personal information. Thank you.
 

Ty1on

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I bought it on ebay : Grandview, 49,000 RIC pts for $2.

Selling agency asked for:
1. Legal name
2. Address
3. Phone number
4. email address
Agency said transaction would be a "quick deed transfer" where no signature from buyer is required. Once I provide 1-4 info, the transaction could and would take place. All fees would be paid by seller. My only fee would be the winning bid of $2. The title is said to be clean with no mortgage.

Does this sound legit? The name of the comany is KirK Marketing & Consultation in Florida. I can get a copy of the estoppel(sp?) letter with names blocked to prove mortgage paid in full. Is it common practice to need phone number and email address? The agency has (0) feedback and the TS is being sold under market value.

If anyone has used this agency, can you reassure me that they are legitimate agency to work with? Any experienced timeshare owners out there, please let me know if there's anything else I should be looking for before providing my personal information. Thank you.

I didn't need to notarize anything, and my wife wasn't required to sign anything, but I was. (Different reseller)

$1 seems awfully low for a Grandview RCI Points contract. Is the seller
kirjoh-khnkndi5? I'm always leery of people that create a username that is impossible to remember. If it's that posting, they don't mention closing costs, and you could possibly get hit with a transfer fee?

PS the info they asked you for is standard.
 
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DeniseM

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Not all Grandview deeds are in RCI points - some are just deeds for usage at the resort, and they usually go for free.

Does the estoppel show that it's in RCI?
 
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glmyers

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Sounds reasonable to me. Buyer's signatures would very rarely be found on a deed. It is likely there should be a buyer's signature on a transfer document with the resort management and they likely have a fee. Make sure you talk with the management at the resort and fully understand what you are buying. Be sure the ongoing fees are fully disclosed and past fees are fully paid.

Why do you say it is being "sold under market value"? Given the opportunities in the Bargain Deals area of this forum, I would say it is likely within $2 of market value.
 

Ty1on

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Why do you say it is being "sold under market value"? Given the opportunities in the Bargain Deals area of this forum, I would say it is likely within $2 of market value.

"RCI Points" adds some value to the deed. Typical EBay winning bids have been $300-$500 with seller paying closing and transfer.
 

DeniseM

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Why do you say it is being "sold under market value"? Given the opportunities in the Bargain Deals area of this forum, I would say it is likely within $2 of market value.

It is expensive to convert to RCI points, so the deeds that are already enrolled, go for a little more.

Make sure you talk with the management at the resort and fully understand what you are buying.

Resort management usually has little interest in resale buyers. The OP needs to document what he's buying with the estoppel, deed, and documentation that it's enrolled in RCI.
 
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glmyers

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If you say so.

"RCI Points" adds some value to the deed. Typical EBay winning bids have been $300-$500 with seller paying closing and transfer.

I fail to see the appeal of "RCI Points" but I will take your word for it.
 

DeniseM

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glmyers - How many timeshares have you bought or sold on the resale market?
 

toansem

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Thank you all for your help but more questions regarding the sale

Thank you all Tuggers for your help.

When I gave the agency my email, this was the reply:
"I can send you the tax but we do not have an estopple.. on the tax paperwork it shows 100% owned not a shared party in which would be a finance company.it will take at least 3 weeks to get that letter. I need to get this property started sooner.
To be able to continue the process I need the information requested."

Without estoppel, would I be able to tell rci points and mortgage paid in full with tax papers? Without estoppel, what important information is missing? Can the information be revealed via 3 way conference call? What should I be asking the resort if agency agreed to 3 way conference? Sorry for asking so many questions, this will be my 1st time share if the deal ever goes through. I just don't want to do something that I might regret later.Thank you.
 

Ty1on

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Thank you all Tuggers for your help.

When I gave the agency my email, this was the reply:
"I can send you the tax but we do not have an estopple.. on the tax paperwork it shows 100% owned not a shared party in which would be a finance company.it will take at least 3 weeks to get that letter. I need to get this property started sooner.
To be able to continue the process I need the information requested."

Without estoppel, would I be able to tell rci points and mortgage paid in full with tax papers? Without estoppel, what important information is missing? Can the information be revealed via 3 way conference call? What should I be asking the resort if agency agreed to 3 way conference? Sorry for asking so many questions, this will be my 1st time share if the deal ever goes through. I just don't want to do something that I might regret later.Thank you.

To tell you the truth, this guy seems like an amateur, and may not be worth dealing with. Without an estoppel, he could be selling you a pointless week #34, which is worth $2 if they pay all closing and transfer, but not what you are looking for. I don't know what Grandview's transfer policy is, but xome companies will also transfer delinquent (MF) accounts. You could get stuck with a delinquency coming out of the gate.
 

DeniseM

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I agree - when someone won't provide documentation, and puts pressure on you to proceed without it, that is a bad sign.
 

gmarine

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I agree, pass on this. The seller doesnt want to provide an estoppel and is in a rush to get you to pay for it. Red flags all over this one.
 

glmyers

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glmyers - How many timeshares have you bought or sold on the resale market?

I freely admit I have never bought a timeshare either new or resale, but I have owned two weeks for nearly 25 years. I would like to reduce that to one week and have done significant research on what is required to for a transaction to safely be conducted.

I have purchased and sold many other types of real estate and worked as a real estate professional for more than a few years. Fundamentally the value in a timeshare is the difference between the ongoing costs of ownership and the cost of renting similar properties over similar time periods. Cost to purchase a week, convert to points, or buy points is irrelevant to value. The key to value is maintenance fee, likelihood of a special assessment, and any other costs.

The maximum value is achieved when one utilizes the time owned at the home resort and avoids the extra cost of exchanging. RCI Points is a very flexible ownership, but I fail to see where that translates to more value given it demands extra expense.
 

DeniseM

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The maximum value is achieved when one utilizes the time owned at the home resort and avoids the extra cost of exchanging. RCI Points is a very flexible ownership, but I fail to see where that translates to more value given it demands extra expense.

With the right timeshare, when you convert it to RCI points, you get enough points for 2-4 weeks of vacation, instead of one at your home resort.

For example, for around $600 in RCI fees, you can have 3 vacations, instead of one.

So, if you can find the right timeshare with a reasonable maintenance fee, and a lot of points, it can be a very good value.
 
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toansem

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Still more questions

Wow, thank you everyone for your quick response and insight. I will definitely ask the seller to provide the "estoppel" letter before moving forward. On the off chance the letter was provided, can anyone let me know the answers to the following questions:

1. Since I won the auction, does this mean I have legally entered contract to buy the unit regardless of the letter? (No payment made yet but the seller went ahead and marked the payment as paid. He said since ebay didn't allow paypal and he wanted the transaction to be smoother, he marked it paid. He said I can make a donation of $2 to a nonprofit site and considered payment made.) Do I need to "rescind" if that's the case?

2. If the estoppel letter was provided without the owner's info, how can I verify if the letter is legit and not forged?

3. Would a contract be necessary to proceed with the purchase? The agency is in Florida. I felt pressured to provide my personal info (#1-4 listed in the 1st posting). I was told with the above info, they can do a "quick claim deed for transfer", (what is a quick claim deed transfer?) ***Does this mean they can transfer any timeshare to my name as long as I give them my address, phone number, name and email?*** Even though I haven't given them my info officially, they probably can piece all the information via my contacts with them through email and phone. I worry they can gather my name and address from ebay winning bid.

The agency gave me the following info regarding the unit:

The Inventory Control Number is : xxxxxxxx
APN# xxxxxxxxxxxxx

1 Bedroom Unit
Week #34
Annual

Recorded in Clark County

Can any of the above provide useful info toward the purchase (again will only purchase if agency provided clean estoppel letter).

Sorry for such a lengthy post. The fact that they can transfer any timeshare to me without my signature but just my personal info really worries me.

Thank you all again for any input.
 
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DeniseM

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Per ebay rules, timeshare auctions on ebay are not binding - you can back out with no penalties.

The estoppel should be prepared by resort management on their form or letterhead.
 

toansem

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Update: I asked the seller for an estoppel letter.

I requested the seller for an estoppel letter. If he declined, I'd pass on this sale.

Thank you all again for the great info. Thank you Denise....again and again for your help!!!
 

glmyers

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Nice Theory.

With the right timeshare, when you convert it to RCI points, you get enough points for 2-4 weeks of vacation, instead of one at your home resort.

For example, for around $600 in RCI fees, you can have 3 vacations, instead of one.

So, if you can find the right timeshare with a reasonable maintenance fee, and a lot of points, it can be a very good value.

I am familiar with the sales pitch, but the reality is those vacations will need to be at inferior properties. (The point cost is low because nobody wants to go there.)

Note that for $600 one can have a nice week of vacation in many places, though not the best places.
 

taterhed

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It's not a theory, its a common practice. There's actually quite a following for people who buy tri/bi/annual <$500/1ct/pt RCI points accounts for the purpose of having a low-budget RCI points (weeks) trading accounts. Renting RCI points into the account is also a tactic. YMMV

Also common is misrepresenting a 1$ timeshare as "RCI points" without disclosing the outrageous enrollment/transfer fee(s). A classic bait-n-switch.

I certainly understand you opinion of RCI-conversion. The tactics and results of high-pressure RCI-points conversions are well regaled by disgruntled owners. I hear you echoing that sentiment.

BTW, I've read all of this on the internet, so it must be true!
 

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theo

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Unclear unknowns...

It is expensive to convert to RCI points, so the deeds that are already enrolled, go for a little more.

The OP needs to document what he's buying with the estoppel, deed, and documentation that it's enrolled in RCI.

Excellent points, all. I know nothing about this resort, but at some facilities a previous RCI Points "conversion" does not transfer but instead "dissolves" and reverts back to only the underlying deeded week (i.e., without any RCI Points) upon subsequent resale. Could that be the case here? :shrug:

If that is the case here, resort policy will not be disclosed or revealed anywhere in the parcel i.d. info in County property records. Unless the RCI Points remain firmly attached upon resale, I suspect that the week has little or no value on its' own, without the associated RCI Points. That particular detail needs to be conclusively verified directly (and only) by and with the resort itself, not by guesswork or assumptions.
 
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glmyers

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Love the quote.

BTW, I've read all of this on the internet, so it must be true!
That is one of my favorite quotes by Lincoln. :clap: My primary employment is in K-12 education and I often utilize that and others like it in lessons on research.

Whether one owns a fixed-time, float-time, or points of some type, the value must be evaluated in terms of the costs of ownership. I accept that points are popular with some and I am glad that works for them. I'm going to abandon this thread now and I apologize, moving well beyond the boundaries of the questions posed by the original post. I did not intend to hijack the thread with a debate on the value of points.
 

DeniseM

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I am familiar with the sales pitch, but the reality is those vacations will need to be at inferior properties. (The point cost is low because nobody wants to go there.)

Note that for $600 one can have a nice week of vacation in many places, though not the best places.

You are mistaken. Buying one week and using the points for multiple vacations is a popular strategy.

You are incorrect when you say that they are using the points for inferior properties, where no one wants to go.

I know you are trying to help, but you should get more experience under your own belt before you try to give advice.
 
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Sandy

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Denise is absolutely correct.

An RCI points account will allow the user to get some fabulous places as last minute calls: somewhere in the 9000-15,000 point range. This is how an owner can turn 49,000 points into multiple vacation weeks. Not to mention that these points can be used for partial weeks, or multiple weeks.

If you have an RCI points account, you can take a look to see what is available on short notice, at the reduced points rate.
 

Passepartout

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Glymers, speaking of 'inferior properties' where nobody wants to go, just today, a sighting of availability for Disney, with multiple move-in dates, in RCI Points. They aren't cheap, but if one has a significant pile of RCI Points, banked and/or borrow-able, it can be done.

I won't post the link to the thread, because it's in the Members Only area, but since you're a member, you can go to Sightings and see it.

I regularly get 2-to 3 weeks in very nice quality TS weeks for my annual RCI Points deposit, and seldom stoop to those inferior properties if which you speak in the Last Calls catalog.

Jim
 

taterhed

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And, I think, officially--that is one dead:

deadhorse.gif
 
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