Timeshares are Dead

[Phydeaux]

Not my words, but those of radio talk show host Clark Howard during his broadcast yesterday. I didn't listen to the entire segment, but he essentially rattled off the reasons why, and called out numerous eBay listings selling TS's for $.01 or $1.00.

I'll be the first to admit, I do indeed have buyers remorse. I've done my best to convey the win-win for both the resorts and members if my resorts would offer some incentives and some distinctions between loyal members ad casual renters, but alas, no one there seems to be listening.

Live & learn.

 

[chriskre]

Don't believe everything you hear.

 

[davemy]

I do regret buying my 2 weeks from Marriott but i do not regret the 10 years of great Family vacations our family has had. I would of never even known about this type of vacation if it wasn't for Disney and marriott. If i have to sell someday, after 10 years i feel i have already broken even no matter what i get for it when i sell.

 

[pedro47]

I do regret buying my 2 weeks from Marriott but i do not regret the 10 years of great Family vacations our family has had. I would of never even known about this type of vacation if it wasn't for Disney and marriott. If i have to sell someday, after 10 years i feel i have already broken even no matter what i get for it when i sell.

I agree with above statement 100%.
I do not regret our purchase of a timeshare either. At the time we purchased our first timeshare week in 1988 there were few timeshare resorts on the secondary market for sell and there was no e-bay selling timeshare for one dollar..

 

[chriskre]

Okay, so maybe the buy from the developer sales model is dead or maybe not. I only did one direct developer purchase for my DVC points. Yesterday I got my DVC yearly planner and I see that I can get two weeks in a studio in Animal Kingdom resort for my $700 MF's without having to trade thru RCI or II to get it. No booking fees or anything.

I think that shows me that for me at least TSing is not dead but maybe the way we use our TS's may be dead.

Buying to use is becoming the more reasonable model for me than trying to trade my expensive stuff. For those other leverage trades I've got a new acquisition.

I think if you keep your portfolio ownerships flexible or buy to use, then TSing is still very much alive and well but you've gotta be an educated consumer and not watch those crazy financial gurus on TV and spend more time on TUG.

 

[AwayWeGo]

You Typed A Mouthful.

Don't believe everything you hear.

. . . & only 1/2 of what you see.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

[chriskre]

. . . & only 1/2 of what you see.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

So true Alan.
I'm glad I sometimes actually use the brain God gave me to make my own decisions as to what is best for me instead of listening to all the noise.

 

[Phydeaux]

I can't speak for others TS's; I only have my own that I'm intimately familiar with. I can tell you this - if I had it do over again, I would most certainly NOT.

There is absolutely no benefit to membership over casual renting. There is however a distinct disadvantage of membership over renting. Initial purchase amount coupled with ever increasing yearly maintenance fees. Renters receive lock-step identical perks as members. Due to the abundance of available villas, when anyone can rent a villa for less than the cost of the member's annual maintenance fee, I must ask: why would you want to be an owner??

Apparently my resorts aren't familiar with the concept of member loyalty. Perhaps those happy with their TS purchases, this is not the case.

 

[ronparise]

The existence of TUG and all of us members is evidence that timeshares are not dead..As a financial investment, sure, as an option for developers, yes. but as a vacation alternative for lots of us..no way

 

[heathpack]

I can't speak for others TS's; I only have my own that I'm intimately familiar with. I can tell you this - if I had it do over again, I would most certainly NOT.

There is absolutely no benefit to membership over casual renting. There is however a distinct disadvantage of membership over renting. Initial purchase amount coupled with ever increasing yearly maintenance fees. Renters receive lock-step identical perks as members. Due to the abundance of available villas, when anyone can rent a villa for less than the cost of the member's annual maintenance fee, I must ask: why would you want to be an owner??

Apparently my resorts aren't familiar with the concept of member loyalty. Perhaps those happy with their TS purchases, this is not the case.

We get great value out of our Hyatt, way better than renting. It is our trader, total costs this year including MF, exchange fees, membership fees, etc was $2600. We made 5 exchanges: 2BR Grand Mayan Los Cabos (April), 2BR Royal Islander (April), 2BR Westin Lagunamar (Nov), 1BR Grand Luxxe (Dec), 1BR Planet Hollywood (Dec). These units were all booked on a timeframe that made booking FF tix possible. Except for PH, we would not have been able to rent these weeks in the $550ish range unless we were willing to wait until last minute. But then we'd have to pay for plane tickets, so the savings would be lost.

We also own Disney (to use, not trade). Right now, it would honestly be slightly cheaper for us to rent. However, once we are out 10 years from our purchase and our purchase price is fully amortized, Disney will become a good value.

I think in some instances it is cheaper to rent: you are traveling on short time frames, you don't fly to your destination (or you are buying plane tix anyway), you can/want to travel during low season, you are interested in locales with excellent supply of TS units.

In other instances like with our Hyatt week, it is cheaper to own- especially if you are a TS-trading hobbyist like I am.

I think anything about TS that is a sound bite in a 2 minute segment on national TV will of necessity be overly simplified/inaccurate.

H

 

[rrlongwell]

Not my words, but those of radio talk show host Clark Howard ...

I not sure that this is correct. I follow Wynhdam Timeshares on E-Bay. The recent total was 107 total. Subtracting rentals and Worldmark, left 83. That is the lowest number I have seen. I am also noticing that more and more of the Wyndham timeshares are drawing bids. Not high at this points but bids never the less. I do not following the other Timeshare firms to any great degree. Am starting to follow Marriott.

 

[Passepartout]

At some stage of our lives, we will all wish we didn't own timeshares. We will sell them, give them away, hope to will them to our progeny, donate them to charity or otherwise divest ourselves of them. Until then, the best use of them is in the use of them.

Perhaps we were fortunate in owning our timeshares when they provide an attractive way of providing great vacations for our families at reasonable cost. Maybe we will have to give them away, or perhaps some forward thinking system will provide a vehicle by which owners who have faithfully kept up their MFs, holding up the value of the resorts can deed them back so they can be resold to another generation.

Who knows?

Jim

 

[l2trade]

Timeshares are not dead. Developers still sell these things at full freight, which lets them continue to gift us just to say no.

 

[elaine]

we have 4 TS--all resale--3 bought to use, 1 as a trader. Now that the market has bottomed out, and RCI has changed trading methods (TPUs), and our vacation patterns have changed (we only actually use 1 of our TS), sure, there are a couple of our TS that I would love to "undo."
However, although I find I have to "actively" manage my TS (aka search and grab good stuff), I have gotten excellent value out of all of our TS--sometimes it's a wash vs. renting, but some of my trades have allowed us to stay at places that would have cost us at least $1K+ for the week over our annual fees. TUG has played a huge role in getting those great trades. In fact, each time I think "we should get rid of this TS, a great trade comes through!"

 

[cgeidl]

Timeshares in the distant future.

Once other forms of real estate begin to increase in price and foreclosures decrease to normal who knows what will happen to the value of timeshares.
IMHO they will begin to have increased value.The US economy will recover and we will have more satisfying years head.While we are down right now ,we are not out and recovery will come again.We have had harder periods in our history and this period will also be recovered from.

 

[pjrose]

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

How else could we vacation with two bedrooms, two baths, a living room, dining area, full kitchen, and large terrace, right on the beach, at an affordable price, not much different than being crammed into a room with two beds and that's it? Sure, there was the upfront money, but that was years ago....now there's just the MF, which divides out to slightly over $100 a night. Couldn't stay anywhere else with that kind of space - and daily maid service - for that kind of money!

And without those guaranteed weeks and guaranteed location, we wouldn't take the yearly vacations, and wouldn't have met many other families who vacation at the same time and place!

I can rent it, often for more than the MF, I've bought, sold, traded, rented others' weeks, and split up our unit and rented half while using half.

Nope, you couldn't get me to be crammed in a hotel room, even if it were less expensive than a timeshare.

 

[dioxide45]

I think the current business model used by many developers needs a major overhaul. A model where 50% of the purchase price is in marketing costs is not a good model. It can only survive so long. The company that can drive that overhead cost down as much as possible will be the most successful.

I don't really see timeshare as a a way to save money. It more or less forces vacation to great resorts in great locations. I keep track of all of our TS based travel. Since buying in 2007, we have stayed a total of 119 nights. Our cost per night is about $200/night. That cost includes the resale purchase prices that we paid. One week was at the hight of the market, the other pretty close to the bottom. I was tracking the cost per night without purchase price included, but now with our weeks only selling for a few hundred dollars each, I have quit looking at that number.

Even still, with resale purchases, $200 a night is a lot of money. That number will continue to go down over time. But still after almost 5 years of use, that isn't a huge savings over other alternatives.

 

[puppymommo]

There is absolutely no benefit to membership over casual renting.

While this is often true, it is not true in all cases. Some timeshares are simply not available on the rental market. They may be available as exchanges or even extra holidays on RCI, but you still have to own a t/s to use them.

 

[1950bing]

I don't think I will ever get over buying a timeshare from a bunch of liers. They didn't care what my vacations needs were, they wanted the sale. Oh yeah, free this free that, you will make triple when you want to sell. Maintenance fees only go up 1% every couple of years. No need for SAs because you are in the mountians. Don't want it anymore ? the place will buy it back etc. is all CRAP!
It is far better to rent from a timeshare place last minute than to enter into a contract. When I leave I'm done.

 

[MOXJO7282]

I can honestly say I wouldn't change a thing. When we bought the first 4 Marriotts direct from 2001 - 2004 we scored literally millions of MAR points that translated into numerous priceless family memories.

We then found the resale market and went in that direction to score some great deals on some very marketable Marriott TSs. Sure our resale value has gone down but hasn't gone to zero like the no-name resorts, and the rental market remains very strong.

From the very beginning we saw Marriott as the way to go and had so many opportunities to buy no-names in Maui, Aruba and the US for dirt cheap and knew they wouldn't rent the way Marriotts do and wouldn't be very sellable in a pinch and we were right, so we're still very happy with our TS ownership.

 

[MichaelColey]

I don't really see timeshare as a a way to save money. It more or less forces vacation to great resorts in great locations. I keep track of all of our TS based travel. Since buying in 2007, we have stayed a total of 119 nights. Our cost per night is about $200/night. That cost includes the resale purchase prices that we paid.

It really depends on where you own and how you use it. Our costs have averaged under $50/night. Before we discovered timeshares, we were averaging about double that for hotels.

 

[dioxide45]

It really depends on where you own and how you use it. Our costs have averaged under $50/night. Before we discovered timeshares, we were averaging about double that for hotels.

If you bought weeks for $1 and have super cheap MFs, then it is possible to achieve $50 a night. Even if I were to exclude purchase price from our cost per night, it still works out to be about $125 per night. Marriott MFs aren't cheap, when you add in exchange fees and exchange company annual fees it really adds up. Luckily we own two lockoff units, so our cost per night could have been much higher.

 

[chriskre]

If you bought weeks for $1 and have super cheap MFs, then it is possible to achieve $50 a night. Even if I were to exclude purchase price from our cost per night, it still works out to be about $125 per night. Marriott MFs aren't cheap, when you add in exchange fees and exchange company annual fees it really adds up. Luckily we own two lockoff units, so our cost per night could have been much higher.

It's possible even with the brand names.
Owning DVC with a $700 MF can get me 2 weeks in a studio off season at Animal Kingdom. That's $50 a night to stay in a deluxe resort. You cannot rent that from Disney for that price and I doubt you'd be able to get that from an owner renting their points either. You'd need to own DVC to take advantage of these deals.

You could trade the heck out of RCI to get that, but considering that I might even be able to recoup some of my DVC investment, I'm a happy camper that my developer direct purchase was DVC. I'm sure that it works out similarly with some of the other systems that I don't own like Marriott. So it's all relative to your travel habits and flexibility in using what you own. Now if you gotta go with the school calendar then yeah, it's probably cheaper to just forget the whole thing and rent from desperate owners.

 

[pjrose]

I don't think I will ever get over buying a timeshare from a bunch of liers. They didn't care what my vacations needs were, they wanted the sale. Oh yeah, free this free that, you will make triple when you want to sell. Maintenance fees only go up 1% every couple of years. No need for SAs because you are in the mountians. Don't want it anymore ? the place will buy it back etc. is all CRAP!
It is far better to rent from a timeshare place last minute than to enter into a contract. When I leave I'm done.

Unfortunately many places use that model. Not all, though. We didn't have any lies or promises that weren't kept, and we've done all the trading/renting/selling/buying/splitting etc that they said, and it all worked out fine.

I can honestly say I wouldn't change a thing. When we bought the first 4 Marriotts direct from 2001 - 2004 we scored literally millions of MAR points that translated into numerous priceless family memories.

We then found the resale market and went in that direction to score some great deals on some very marketable Marriott TSs. Sure our resale value has gone down but hasn't gone to zero like the no-name resorts, and the rental market remains very strong.

From the very beginning we saw Marriott as the way to go and had so many opportunities to buy no-names in Maui, Aruba and the US for dirt cheap and knew they wouldn't rent the way Marriotts do and wouldn't be very sellable in a pinch and we were right, so we're still very happy with our TS ownership.

We feel the same way with the Royal Resorts.

 

[Janette]

I just paid all my maintenance fees and don't regret a one. We leave for 3 weeks at Marriott's Frenchman's Cove on Jan 13. We will be joined by our son's family for one week and my SIL and her hubby the other two weeks. We go to Oceana Palms and then Crystal Shores in April. In May we have a week at Bonnet Creek followed by 12 nights on Disney property. In June we have a week at Grande Ocean and have reserved Coral Sands for my older son's family. Memories were made in timeshares while my kids were young and all their grandparents were living and these are invaluable. It works for us!