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Timeshare Law in Florida, Wyndham's view on it

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From Wyndham's site. It is true that Florida has 23% of the world's timeshares, and Florida is high on the list of timeshare fraud.

Wyndham Vacation Ownership commends Florida’s Attorney General Pam Bondi for aggressively pursuing action against timeshare resale companies that employ deceptive and fraudulent practices that prey on consumers.

"Attorney General Bondi has put timeshare resale companies on notice in the state of Florida," said Franz Hanning, President and CEO of Wyndham Vacation Ownership. "Our industry has long benefited from responsible regulations that protect consumers and ensure the integrity of products and services. Timeshare resale companies should not be exempt from these standards and we applaud Attorney General Bondi for leading this effort on behalf of Florida timeshare owners and our industry at large."

On Tuesday, Oct. 4, 2011, in Tallahassee, Attorney General Bondi, with the support of the American Resort Development Association (ARDA), and the American Association of Retired Persons (AARP), proposed legislation called The Timeshare Resale Accountability Act, requiring full and fair disclosure of the terms and conditions of services being offered by timeshare resale companies, a reasonable rescission period and penalties for those individuals and companies that engage in misleading and fraudulent practices.

Wyndham Vacation Ownership, with headquarters in Orlando and delivering the best possible vacation experiences, operates 16 resorts in the State of Florida. According to research by the ARDA International Foundation, nearly 23% of all U.S. timeshare resorts are located in the state. In 2010, Florida sales were $2.2 billion of the U.S. total of $6.4 billion.
 

rrlongwell

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Now if she could only get Wyndham Retail salesman to be honest
Am looking at the statue now. It does not appear to cover Wyndham or RCI as it relates to timeshares in their systems. Also, of interest, it appears that it does cover owners of timeshare interests bought for personal use where the owner rents over seven reservations per year (unless I misunderstood something). Not sure if the ownership counts timeshares owned in other states or if it has to be owned in Flordia. I am assuming it would cover timeshares owned anywhere in the Wyndham Vacation Resorts System under the points system because the owner has the right to use points for Resorts in Flordia as it relates to Flordia rentals or resales.

Just an observation, given the shear amount of timeshares in the Wyndham program in Flordia, this will be a major competive advantage for Wyndham in the re-sale and rental market in Flordia.
 
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It looks to me like it only targets pushy - and questionable - resale sales companies. My in-laws got a call last year from a company that wanted to buy their timeshare (they were not selling and did not advertise). How it relates to Wyndham is not having timeshare resales companies cold-calling their owners.

TS
 

JimMIA

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WOW, that's interesting!

On a scale of A to F, Wyndham earned an F for the following reasons:

"Factors that lowered Wyndham Vacation Ownership, Inc.'s rating include:

1208 complaints filed against business
Failure to respond to 4 complaints filed against business.
68 complaints filed against business that were not resolved.
15 serious complaints filed against business.

Complaints concern selling practices. The company responds to complaints explaining its cancellation policy and offers a refund when applicable. "
 

Rob&Carol Q

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Ya know, without being able to read the actual complaint and the response, the website is kind of a blank to me. Though I can picture the majority of the complaints...

1. I didn't read my contract but signed anyway.
2. Jeez, the payment is higher than they told me and just what is a MF?
3. Yeah, I completely missed the rescind period but the company should make an exception.
4. I bought something that I could have bought elswhere for pennies on the price I actually paid.
5. and the classic..."It's Not Fair"

So, how exactly can Wyndham fix those kind of complaints? Do an honest sales presentation and watch sales drop to near zero?

Truthfully, Wyndham is responding appropriately...these folks just can't handle the truth... Think about it, would you buy a car this way?
 

rrlongwell

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... So, how exactly can Wyndham fix those kind of complaints?
Sometimes Wyndham can be difficult to deal with, however, in my experience, if you go through the process, they do try and resolve the complaints. Some one once told me they are a pain but the best of the lot. In my limited experience with other timeshare providers, this appears to be true.
 

Ridewithme38

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Ya know, without being able to read the actual complaint and the response, the website is kind of a blank to me. Though I can picture the majority of the complaints...

1. I didn't read my contract but signed anyway.
2. Jeez, the payment is higher than they told me and just what is a MF?
3. Yeah, I completely missed the rescind period but the company should make an exception.
4. I bought something that I could have bought elswhere for pennies on the price I actually paid.
5. and the classic..."It's Not Fair"

So, how exactly can Wyndham fix those kind of complaints? Do an honest sales presentation and watch sales drop to near zero?

Truthfully, Wyndham is responding appropriately...these folks just can't handle the truth... Think about it, would you buy a car this way?
Let me guess, your a member of an HOA/POA? If the seller misrepresented the product that's fraud...Plus, most of the information in the contract only states to refer to other documents...that aren't always provided and if provided are hundreds upon hundreds of pages
 

rickandcindy23

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Wyndham's billing issues are probably a huge number of those complaints. Wyndham has occasionally accused us of not paying our fees on time, and these are automatic payments, so I call: "Your fees are due on this date and don't get auto-paid until they are late by a few days." I tell them, "Move the date to a few days before the billing date then." Their answer, "We cannot move the charge date." What?

Send me a form, do something, but stop being stupid. Wyndham's people are generally just there to make their hourly pay, and then they go home.

Wyndham also changes rules, adds fees, takes away benefits, and those are legitimate complaints. I am surprised the numbers aren't 10X what you report here. That just goes to show how few people complain to the BBB.
 

melschey

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Ya know, without being able to read the actual complaint and the response, the website is kind of a blank to me. Though I can picture the majority of the complaints...

1. I didn't read my contract but signed anyway.
2. Jeez, the payment is higher than they told me and just what is a MF?
3. Yeah, I completely missed the rescind period but the company should make an exception.
4. I bought something that I could have bought elswhere for pennies on the price I actually paid.
5. and the classic..."It's Not Fair"

So, how exactly can Wyndham fix those kind of complaints? Do an honest sales presentation and watch sales drop to near zero?

Truthfully, Wyndham is responding appropriately...these folks just can't handle the truth... Think about it, would you buy a car this way?
Seriously how many companies get a F rating with the BBB and knowing that they have a F rating with the BBB would you still want to buy anything from them? Why do people continue to defend Wyndham? The only TS that has a worse reputation than Wyndham is Westgate in my opinion.
 

mrpickle

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I agree wit Rob&Carolq

Ya know, without being able to read the actual complaint and the response, the website is kind of a blank to me. Though I can picture the majority of the complaints...

1. I didn't read my contract but signed anyway.
2. Jeez, the payment is higher than they told me and just what is a MF?
3. Yeah, I completely missed the rescind period but the company should make an exception.
4. I bought something that I could have bought elswhere for pennies on the price I actually paid.
5. and the classic..."It's Not Fair"

So, how exactly can Wyndham fix those kind of complaints? Do an honest sales presentation and watch sales drop to near zero?

Truthfully, Wyndham is responding appropriately...these folks just can't handle the truth... Think about it, would you buy a car this way?
Wyndham has 140+ resorts and yes it has terrible sales staff, but only receives 1200 complaints over three years.
That's 400 complaints per year!
That's less than 3 complaints per resort per year!
Or one complaint ever four months per resort!
Not bad considering the horrible sales staff! :clap:

Even when there are people like Barry Bolduc out there!
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=161756
 

JimMIA

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Wyndham has 140+ resorts and yes it has terrible sales staff, but only receives 1200 complaints over three years.
That's 400 complaints per year!
That's less than 3 complaints per resort per year!
Or one complaint ever four months per resort!
Not bad considering the horrible sales staff! :clap:

Even when there are people like Barry Bolduc out there!
http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=161756
Actually, the link is just to the local BBB in Orlando. Wyndham doesn't have anything like 140 resorts (you must be counting hotels or affiliates/associates), and these complaints are either about the local resort sales personnel in Orlando or about Wyndham HQ's performance.

1208 complaints in three years is a little more than one per day or about 1.7 per business day. That's a lot of complaints by any rational standard.

Sure, some of the complaints were probably nonsensical, self-inflicted, etc, and some probably complained first to BBB without making any attempt to get resolution from Wyndham. But not 1200.

I don't think any of us are really surprised that Wyndham's sales weasels get complaints...are we? :rolleyes:
 

rickandcindy23

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You can pretty much multiply the complainers by 100, because 99% of people don't go to the BBB. How many people don't have valid complaints? BBB won't even accept a complaint about a pushy sales tour (because you didn't buy anything, where is the money lost?).

The fact that so many people went to the trouble to contact BBB, and so many complaints were accepted, is an indication of how truly horrible they are. By the way, what about all of the satellite BBB's out there in large metro areas? Are those complaints separate? I would bet there are more complaints than the Florida BBB has listed.
 

rrlongwell

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You can pretty much multiply the complainers by 100, because 99% of people don't go to the BBB. How many people don't have valid complaints? BBB won't even accept a complaint about a pushy sales tour (because you didn't buy anything, where is the money lost?).

The fact that so many people went to the trouble to contact BBB, and so many complaints were accepted, is an indication of how truly horrible they are. By the way, what about all of the satellite BBB's out there in large metro areas? Are those complaints separate? I would bet there are more complaints than the Florida BBB has listed.
It is my understanding that all Complaints against Wyndham Vacation Resorts go to the Flordia location. Actually, that is not a bad thing, they do a good job. I have filed a complaint or so against Wyndham Resort(s) not in Flordia and they were referred to the Flordia group to handle.
 
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JimMIA

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You can pretty much multiply the complainers by 100, because 99% of people don't go to the BBB.
I don't know about the math, but I'm one of those people who would probably never waste my time unless it was a pretty trivial matter that ticked me off. BBB's have no authority or power. All they can really do is try to encourage a merchant to respond to the complainant.

By the way, what about all of the satellite BBB's out there in large metro areas? Are those complaints separate? I would bet there are more complaints than the Florida BBB has listed.
All BBB's are locally-owned non-for-profit businesses. There is no one big FLORIDA BBB, or anything like that. Even complaints against Wyndham resorts in Kissimmee would not be handled by the Orange County BBB because Kissimmee is in Osceola County.

So yeah, I would consider the numbers quoted by that one BBB to be only a small portion of the overall picture.
 

timeos2

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Cindy is correct. The vast majority of issues with Wyndham do revolve around collections, sales & general customer service. If all you had to deal with were the resorts, employees and the system itself Wyndham is one of the best. It is unfortunate that the bad gets highlighted - and rightfully so - and tends to overshadow the excellent and location rich resort system that really counts.

While they deserve an "F" for customer service and sales once you're past that and learn the system there is a vast system in many more urban areas not served by others (such as Hilton that are far too concentrated in just a few areas) that represent a unique opportunity for great vacations.
 

rrlongwell

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.. Even complaints against Wyndham resorts in Kissimmee would not be handled by the Orange County BBB because Kissimmee is in Osceola County.
http://www.bbb.org/central-florida/business-reviews/vacation-time-share/wyndham-vacation-ownership-in-orlando-fl-20000283

Oh, I am not going to debate issues of fact. However, please note the link was for the BBB of Central Florda. Also, by the way, I checked the Internet and it is showing both counties you mentioned are under the BBB of Central Flordia.

For those that are interested, here is the National BBB link.

http://www.bbb.org/us/Contact-BBB/
 
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The reason Wyndham Resorts' BBB is in Central Florida is because their headquarters/mailing address is in Orlando. If it's a complaint about Wyndham Hotels, their HQ is in New Jersey.

TS
 

GTStone

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Sales staff

Ya know, without being able to read the actual complaint and the response, the website is kind of a blank to me. Though I can picture the majority of the complaints...

1. I didn't read my contract but signed anyway.
2. Jeez, the payment is higher than they told me and just what is a MF?
3. Yeah, I completely missed the rescind period but the company should make an exception.
4. I bought something that I could have bought elswhere for pennies on the price I actually paid.
5. and the classic..."It's Not Fair"

So, how exactly can Wyndham fix those kind of complaints? Do an honest sales presentation and watch sales drop to near zero?

Truthfully, Wyndham is responding appropriately...these folks just can't handle the truth... Think about it, would you buy a car this way?
I am NOT a Wyndham / Worldmark owner, but I have a friend who is and she is very happy with her investments.

I do want to share that I have stayed at several of the Worldmark properties, and approached the sales staff with questions. My interests were specific, and they answered each question openly. There was never any pressure, and they were very respectful. Although I didn't buy anything, it did help me better understand what they offer and how it works. Nothing I have seen posted here contradicts any of the representations they made to me. I'm not in the market right now, but may consider resale points in the future with this group.
 
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